Comments on: Gay Bishop says God called him http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/ PinkNews.co.uk Gay News (UK and world) from Pink News - all the gay news for the lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgendered community in the UK and beyond- thegaynews from Pink News Wed, 25 Nov 2009 19:10:31 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.8.6 hourly 1 By: Tigger http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-452 Tigger Thu, 27 Sep 2007 10:03:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-452 Hi Nick - like you I have given up the C of E. I have joined the local Buddhists and advance my spirituality by meditating with them. This does not mean that I have stopped believing in Christianity - I am completely orthodox in the real theological issues - it is just that I cannot believe that the God whom I know and love does not also love me and continues to bless me through my friends and partners.I feel deeply distrustful of church-going christians; it seems to me that they try to present themselves as caring and responsible people, yet passively accept the homophobic principles of their leaders. Here in the UK homophobia has receded since the thatcherite years, and secular society seems to be moving in the direction of greater acceptance, equality and justice. Even the neo-fascists seem to be decaying; only the churches remain as proponents of homophobia. Hi Nick – like you I have given up the C of E. I have joined the local Buddhists and advance my spirituality by meditating with them. This does not mean that I have stopped believing in Christianity – I am completely orthodox in the real theological issues – it is just that I cannot believe that the God whom I know and love does not also love me and continues to bless me through my friends and partners.I feel deeply distrustful of church-going christians; it seems to me that they try to present themselves as caring and responsible people, yet passively accept the homophobic principles of their leaders. Here in the UK homophobia has receded since the thatcherite years, and secular society seems to be moving in the direction of greater acceptance, equality and justice. Even the neo-fascists seem to be decaying; only the churches remain as proponents of homophobia.

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]]> By: Robert, ex-pat Brit http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-453 Robert, ex-pat Brit Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:29:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-453 For Ciaran and others who are interested, I've posted a link from the U.S. regarding the ex-gay ministries and what they are doing. It will give you a better idea just how sinister they are and how much damage they are doing. Link is below. For Ciaran and others who are interested, I've posted a link from the U.S. regarding the ex-gay ministries and what they are doing. It will give you a better idea just how sinister they are and how much damage they are doing. Link is below.

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]]> By: Dave http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-454 Dave Wed, 26 Sep 2007 18:20:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-454 As I have struggled to find a way of expressing my spirituality and faith, and having tried many ways of so doing, I have come to one simple conclusion: that a majority of organised religion is not about spirituality; or faith; or exploring humanity and the depths of human experience.In essence, it is about one thing - power. It is obsessed with power, particularly over the control of women. A few months ago, the scientist and author, Richard Dawkins, presented a television series about religion and its conflicts with scientific enquiry. One of the interviews that had been recorded was between Dawkins and an Israeli Jew who had converted to Islam and who had adopted a particularly fundamentalist attitude to his new faith. When questioned about the liberal nature of British society, he spoke in insulting terms about British women asking (and I paraphrase a little here, since I am recalling from memory):"what is it with your women, showing their bodies and sleeping around like whores?". He then asked:"what is wrong with them and your society?"Well, I have a simple answer. Those "whores", as he describes them have simply taken ownership of their own bodies and their own sexuality, in the same way that gay men and women have already done.This has nothing to do with morality, the fight between good and evil, right or wrong. It is about power. And until we can face these bigots down on this basis, they will continue to hound us and restrict our civil and human rights. As I have struggled to find a way of expressing my spirituality and faith, and having tried many ways of so doing, I have come to one simple conclusion: that a majority of organised religion is not about spirituality; or faith; or exploring humanity and the depths of human experience.In essence, it is about one thing – power. It is obsessed with power, particularly over the control of women. A few months ago, the scientist and author, Richard Dawkins, presented a television series about religion and its conflicts with scientific enquiry. One of the interviews that had been recorded was between Dawkins and an Israeli Jew who had converted to Islam and who had adopted a particularly fundamentalist attitude to his new faith. When questioned about the liberal nature of British society, he spoke in insulting terms about British women asking (and I paraphrase a little here, since I am recalling from memory):"what is it with your women, showing their bodies and sleeping around like whores?". He then asked:"what is wrong with them and your society?"Well, I have a simple answer. Those "whores", as he describes them have simply taken ownership of their own bodies and their own sexuality, in the same way that gay men and women have already done.This has nothing to do with morality, the fight between good and evil, right or wrong. It is about power. And until we can face these bigots down on this basis, they will continue to hound us and restrict our civil and human rights.

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]]> By: Robert, ex-pat Brit http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-455 Robert, ex-pat Brit Wed, 26 Sep 2007 16:50:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-455 Nick, the compromise definitely is a sell-out, but its not going to be permanent. The Episcopal church will eventually break away from the Anglican community, as it should. The majority of American episcopalians are fairly liberal and not against ordaining gay clergy so its inevitable, a split will come. I welcome it because it will also diminish the C of E's reliance on American wealth that funds its backward, regressive branch in the third world. This is what its all about, money and power. If gay Anglican clergy had any sense, they'd leave the church and go join the United Church of Christ. Nick, the compromise definitely is a sell-out, but its not going to be permanent. The Episcopal church will eventually break away from the Anglican community, as it should. The majority of American episcopalians are fairly liberal and not against ordaining gay clergy so its inevitable, a split will come. I welcome it because it will also diminish the C of E's reliance on American wealth that funds its backward, regressive branch in the third world. This is what its all about, money and power. If gay Anglican clergy had any sense, they'd leave the church and go join the United Church of Christ.

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]]> By: Robert, ex-pat Brit http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-456 Robert, ex-pat Brit Wed, 26 Sep 2007 16:45:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-456 Ciaran, I concur with your statement. Also, many of the right wing fundamentalists come from an underprivileged socio-economic background or they've been abused or damaged in some other way. They are fertile ground for exploitation by the right wing bigots and ex-gay ministries alike. They claim high success rates but they can never produce the figures or back it up with documentation in any of the scientific or medical literature. They've never had any controlled studies conducted by an independent, legitimate scientific authority. Many even conduct their socalled research over the phone which is questionable at best. Ex-gay ministries are the biggest cons out there, they extort large sums of money from their victims while assuring them they can be "normal" by praying away the gay and other means of aversion therapy. Most of them who claim conversion, don't marry and have families as they claim, and those who've emerged from it by claiming celibacy are still gay. If I had it in my power, these organisations would be banned. Shills like Hank et al are products of these ministries, its a last desperate attempt to agitate because they know they're losing the cultural war and they're seeing LGBT people winning more equality all across the globe on a daily basis. The tide has turned in our favour, not theirs, hence their desperation to rant here. They're a dying breed. Ciaran, I concur with your statement. Also, many of the right wing fundamentalists come from an underprivileged socio-economic background or they've been abused or damaged in some other way. They are fertile ground for exploitation by the right wing bigots and ex-gay ministries alike. They claim high success rates but they can never produce the figures or back it up with documentation in any of the scientific or medical literature. They've never had any controlled studies conducted by an independent, legitimate scientific authority. Many even conduct their socalled research over the phone which is questionable at best. Ex-gay ministries are the biggest cons out there, they extort large sums of money from their victims while assuring them they can be "normal" by praying away the gay and other means of aversion therapy. Most of them who claim conversion, don't marry and have families as they claim, and those who've emerged from it by claiming celibacy are still gay. If I had it in my power, these organisations would be banned. Shills like Hank et al are products of these ministries, its a last desperate attempt to agitate because they know they're losing the cultural war and they're seeing LGBT people winning more equality all across the globe on a daily basis. The tide has turned in our favour, not theirs, hence their desperation to rant here. They're a dying breed.

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]]> By: Gene Touchet http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-457 Gene Touchet Wed, 26 Sep 2007 15:32:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-457 The story is being played here with an emphasis on "exercise restraint," and most definitely not with the implication in your headline of "to stop ordaining."Perhaps the Episcopalians bought some time? The story is being played here with an emphasis on "exercise restraint," and most definitely not with the implication in your headline of "to stop ordaining."Perhaps the Episcopalians bought some time?

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]]> By: Nick Weeks http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-458 Nick Weeks Wed, 26 Sep 2007 14:17:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-458 For me, the "compromise" that has been agreed represents a sell-out. I no longer feel able, even nominally, to be part of the Church of England. It's National Quaker week this week in the UK : I'll be taking this opportunity to find out more about the Society of Friends as a place where it may be possible for both spirituality and sexuality to find a home. For me, the "compromise" that has been agreed represents a sell-out. I no longer feel able, even nominally, to be part of the Church of England. It's National Quaker week this week in the UK : I'll be taking this opportunity to find out more about the Society of Friends as a place where it may be possible for both spirituality and sexuality to find a home.

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]]> By: Dave Mitchell http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-459 Dave Mitchell Wed, 26 Sep 2007 14:12:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-459 Not bad, Ciaran, not bad at all. I never looked at it that way before, but you make a lot of sense to me. Are you SURE you're not a physiologist? Of course, there are Christians that don't fit your list, the ones who genuinely don't have any hate to others, gay or otherwise, and follow the true teachings of Jesus about loving and respecting each other. But they, unfortunately, don't have a voice as loud and as feverish as the ones that DO match your list. Nor do they seem to be as bored with life and themselves enough to come in here (a gay site) and rant like they have just lost their marbles! Not bad, Ciaran, not bad at all. I never looked at it that way before, but you make a lot of sense to me. Are you SURE you're not a physiologist? Of course, there are Christians that don't fit your list, the ones who genuinely don't have any hate to others, gay or otherwise, and follow the true teachings of Jesus about loving and respecting each other. But they, unfortunately, don't have a voice as loud and as feverish as the ones that DO match your list. Nor do they seem to be as bored with life and themselves enough to come in here (a gay site) and rant like they have just lost their marbles!

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]]> By: Ciaran McMahon http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-460 Ciaran McMahon Wed, 26 Sep 2007 14:02:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-460 Spot on Robert... my experience with these "religious faithful" has always been that they tend to follow very base "categories". Have you ever noticed that? I'm no physiologist, but these tend to be one or most of the following:(a) Full of some self loathing, possibly gay or sexually impotent, and unfounded projected outward attacks on others, like gays, avoids their judgemental gaze being turned on themselves.(b) Limited or diminished intelligence/edcuation. Unable to reason for themselves, so they will accept the leadership of anyone that promises them more than what little they have in life.(c) Are small people who find judging others given them a little taste of the power and superiority that they cannot find, but crave, in their daily lives.(d) Disturbed guilt view of their "own sins", whether sexual in nature or otherwise, to such a stage they believe forced conversion of others validates their own repentance.(e) Needing to belong: This type joins any "belief" system to ensure they are part of something, regardless of the nature of the views/beliefs. I've noticed this kind also tend to be the ones on serial fad diets or and endless stream of self help courses.Am I wrong with these observations? Perhaps one of the religious nuts here can offer a glimmer of insight, but WITHOUT referring to god, the bible, or how everyone but them will burn in hell... just once.(Personally, hell, if it exists looks infinitely more promising given heaven is *supposed* to be full of morons like Hank and his band of fools) Spot on Robert… my experience with these "religious faithful" has always been that they tend to follow very base "categories". Have you ever noticed that? I'm no physiologist, but these tend to be one or most of the following:(a) Full of some self loathing, possibly gay or sexually impotent, and unfounded projected outward attacks on others, like gays, avoids their judgemental gaze being turned on themselves.(b) Limited or diminished intelligence/edcuation. Unable to reason for themselves, so they will accept the leadership of anyone that promises them more than what little they have in life.(c) Are small people who find judging others given them a little taste of the power and superiority that they cannot find, but crave, in their daily lives.(d) Disturbed guilt view of their "own sins", whether sexual in nature or otherwise, to such a stage they believe forced conversion of others validates their own repentance.(e) Needing to belong: This type joins any "belief" system to ensure they are part of something, regardless of the nature of the views/beliefs. I've noticed this kind also tend to be the ones on serial fad diets or and endless stream of self help courses.Am I wrong with these observations? Perhaps one of the religious nuts here can offer a glimmer of insight, but WITHOUT referring to god, the bible, or how everyone but them will burn in hell… just once.(Personally, hell, if it exists looks infinitely more promising given heaven is *supposed* to be full of morons like Hank and his band of fools)

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]]> By: Robert, ex-pat Brit http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-461 Robert, ex-pat Brit Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:34:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-461 Lisa, you're so right on the mark. Its what I've been saying for a long time. Straights are the cause of the world's ills. They cause wars, famines, they have a monopoly on crime, the jails are more than 95% filled with them; divorce, rapists, child molesters, wife beaters, philanderers, adulterers, wife swappers, porn mongers both child and adult, prostitution pimps, sex slavery trade from the far east, corporate corruption, torture, relgious bigotry, hypocrisy, perjurors, you name it, they do it with amazing skill and accomplishment. These religious right wing nuts who come here to annoy us would do well to spend their time and energy getting their own house in order first and foremost. Very sick people indeed, mostly all psychopaths. Lisa, you're so right on the mark. Its what I've been saying for a long time. Straights are the cause of the world's ills. They cause wars, famines, they have a monopoly on crime, the jails are more than 95% filled with them; divorce, rapists, child molesters, wife beaters, philanderers, adulterers, wife swappers, porn mongers both child and adult, prostitution pimps, sex slavery trade from the far east, corporate corruption, torture, relgious bigotry, hypocrisy, perjurors, you name it, they do it with amazing skill and accomplishment. These religious right wing nuts who come here to annoy us would do well to spend their time and energy getting their own house in order first and foremost. Very sick people indeed, mostly all psychopaths.

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]]> By: Robert, ex-pat Brit http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-462 Robert, ex-pat Brit Wed, 26 Sep 2007 13:25:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-462 Message to Pink News host of this website. It looks like we're being deluged with right wing fundamentalist socalled christian agitators whose sole aim is to break up this website altogether and it looks like they will succeed if you don't ban them altogether. Freedom of speech is one thing, but the abuse thereof is quite another, clearly what these sick people are doing. If this persists, you'll end up with no website at all. I come here not expecting to be harrassed, bullied, preached to and have religion shoved down my throat. These are hateful, sick people and its turning me off coming here, fast. Message to Pink News host of this website. It looks like we're being deluged with right wing fundamentalist socalled christian agitators whose sole aim is to break up this website altogether and it looks like they will succeed if you don't ban them altogether. Freedom of speech is one thing, but the abuse thereof is quite another, clearly what these sick people are doing. If this persists, you'll end up with no website at all. I come here not expecting to be harrassed, bullied, preached to and have religion shoved down my throat. These are hateful, sick people and its turning me off coming here, fast.

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]]> By: Ciaran McMahon http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-463 Ciaran McMahon Wed, 26 Sep 2007 12:30:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-463 Oh, Lisa, that's beautifully written. Crude, but beautiful!And disturbingly so close to the truth about these so-called christians... Oh, Lisa, that's beautifully written. Crude, but beautiful!And disturbingly so close to the truth about these so-called christians…

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]]> By: Anders http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-464 Anders Wed, 26 Sep 2007 09:26:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-464 IF the "Christians" are so preoccupied by keeping gays out of their little fusty gathering called a "Church" then they should start by no longer making decisions on behalf of people who cannot yet make their own decisions, babies, and baptising them.That way those babies will grow up and be able to make their own decision feely as adults on whether to join the "Church" or not.And we will quickly see whether, in denying themselves the opportunity to indoctrinate, damage and instill people with a sense of guilt for so many things from the outset, whether they have much of a leg to stand on, whether they have anything worth surviving for. IF the "Christians" are so preoccupied by keeping gays out of their little fusty gathering called a "Church" then they should start by no longer making decisions on behalf of people who cannot yet make their own decisions, babies, and baptising them.That way those babies will grow up and be able to make their own decision feely as adults on whether to join the "Church" or not.And we will quickly see whether, in denying themselves the opportunity to indoctrinate, damage and instill people with a sense of guilt for so many things from the outset, whether they have much of a leg to stand on, whether they have anything worth surviving for.

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]]> By: Ciaran McMahon http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-465 Ciaran McMahon Wed, 26 Sep 2007 09:06:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-465 Well, let them have their rant... what are these people? The old, the insecure, the weak minded? Do we care? They're quoting "scriptures" from a badly written book with countless contradictions and inaccuracies, and not one shred of proof. Insistence of fact without proof is the domain of the foolish and stupid.Guy Flemming is right. Their influence is dying, and their cries for "salvation" are getting more feverish as their voice dwindles. Let them rant, its all these impotent bores can do now days. If there is a god, he certainly doesn't look favourably on people like this who are a few stones from climbing back into the trees to look for bananas. Well, let them have their rant… what are these people? The old, the insecure, the weak minded? Do we care? They're quoting "scriptures" from a badly written book with countless contradictions and inaccuracies, and not one shred of proof. Insistence of fact without proof is the domain of the foolish and stupid.Guy Flemming is right. Their influence is dying, and their cries for "salvation" are getting more feverish as their voice dwindles. Let them rant, its all these impotent bores can do now days. If there is a god, he certainly doesn't look favourably on people like this who are a few stones from climbing back into the trees to look for bananas.

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]]> By: apYrs http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-466 apYrs Wed, 26 Sep 2007 07:54:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-466 Having read more of the thread: yep the fundies have found us, and will now swamp anything to do with gays and religion with "god loves the sinner hates the sin", Adam and Eve, not "Adam and Steve", "we're all sinners, but if you gays stop having sex you'll be OK".These people are our enemy no matter how compassionate or reasonable they sound. Our sexuality is an affront to them and they want us to deny it in order to be "saved". And they will conintue to badger us, and intrude where they're not wanted, and whinge when we tell them to STFU Having read more of the thread: yep the fundies have found us, and will now swamp anything to do with gays and religion with "god loves the sinner hates the sin", Adam and Eve, not "Adam and Steve", "we're all sinners, but if you gays stop having sex you'll be OK".These people are our enemy no matter how compassionate or reasonable they sound. Our sexuality is an affront to them and they want us to deny it in order to be "saved". And they will conintue to badger us, and intrude where they're not wanted, and whinge when we tell them to STFU

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]]> By: apYrs http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-467 apYrs Wed, 26 Sep 2007 07:47:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-467 Nike It's also the case that your church teaches that it is the only way to heaven, so effectively you're saying:"you can't nbe a member of my church if you're actively gay.""You're going to burn in hell baby"The terms "pernicious", and "evil" spring to mind. You Xians brainwash generations with your superstitions, then give condemn an entire section of your flock (LGBs), and in addition, by your implicit message of "LGB being sinners" encourage thugs to consider us fair game. Nike It's also the case that your church teaches that it is the only way to heaven, so effectively you're saying:"you can't nbe a member of my church if you're actively gay.""You're going to burn in hell baby"The terms "pernicious", and "evil" spring to mind. You Xians brainwash generations with your superstitions, then give condemn an entire section of your flock (LGBs), and in addition, by your implicit message of "LGB being sinners" encourage thugs to consider us fair game.

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]]> By: Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-468 Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi Wed, 26 Sep 2007 02:14:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-468 guy flemingSorry, but theres bad new from New Orleans. The anglican cult leaders have agreed to restrict ordinaiton of more gay bishops and to exlude gay and lesbians from marriage ceremonies. "By RACHEL ZOLL, Associated Press Religion Writer THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information.2 hours, 40 minutes agoNEW ORLEANS - Episcopal leaders, pressured to roll back their support for gays to keep the world Anglican family from crumbling, affirmed Tuesday that they will "exercise restraint" in approving another gay bishop.The bishops also pledged not to approve an official prayer for blessing same-gender couples and insisted a majority of bishops do not allow priests to bless the couples in their parishes."In keeping with an ancient christian tradition we again find ourselves being sacrificed on the altar of ignorance and superstition.I blame it on Nero, a sesterces pinching scrooge who couldn’t be bothered to buy enough lions and tigers to finish off the christians. Nero, a Caesar and a state god, ought to be able to read this wherever he is. Nero, I hope you’re blushing, you stingy jackass. guy flemingSorry, but theres bad new from New Orleans. The anglican cult leaders have agreed to restrict ordinaiton of more gay bishops and to exlude gay and lesbians from marriage ceremonies. "By RACHEL ZOLL, Associated Press Religion Writer THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information.2 hours, 40 minutes agoNEW ORLEANS – Episcopal leaders, pressured to roll back their support for gays to keep the world Anglican family from crumbling, affirmed Tuesday that they will "exercise restraint" in approving another gay bishop.The bishops also pledged not to approve an official prayer for blessing same-gender couples and insisted a majority of bishops do not allow priests to bless the couples in their parishes."In keeping with an ancient christian tradition we again find ourselves being sacrificed on the altar of ignorance and superstition.I blame it on Nero, a sesterces pinching scrooge who couldn’t be bothered to buy enough lions and tigers to finish off the christians. Nero, a Caesar and a state god, ought to be able to read this wherever he is. Nero, I hope you’re blushing, you stingy jackass.

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]]> By: guy fleming http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-469 guy fleming Tue, 25 Sep 2007 22:33:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-469 Gene Robinson may not have to wait as long as he supposes before the Anglican Church embraces gays and lesbians.The respected New Directions journal (published by Forward in Faith)has revealed that over half of the burgeoning number of female priests back the ordination of practising homosexuals but...wait for it..so do an astonishing 74 per cent or laypeople.The tide isn` going to turn..it already is. Millions of us who are committed, born-again Christians are in active church work are Gay. So, everyone,grow up!Guy Fleming, Worthing Gene Robinson may not have to wait as long as he supposes before the Anglican Church embraces gays and lesbians.The respected New Directions journal (published by Forward in Faith)has revealed that over half of the burgeoning number of female priests back the ordination of practising homosexuals but…wait for it..so do an astonishing 74 per cent or laypeople.The tide isn` going to turn..it already is. Millions of us who are committed, born-again Christians are in active church work are Gay. So, everyone,grow up!Guy Fleming, Worthing

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]]> By: T hornby http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-470 T hornby Sat, 09 Sep 2006 10:08:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-470 The church will except society that has committed crime and done harm to others also offering forgivness. Yet if you are homosexual you are regarded to be the biggest sinner of all time. Most of which homosexuality goes on within the church ESPECIALLY the Catholic church. The difference is I am open about my sexuality (NOT BEHIND CLOSED DOORS AS SOME IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH) and only engage in a loving legal relationship with a consenting adult. I must apologise to any offence that I may have caused to anyone but feel strongly about get my point across to these so called devout christians i.e biggots. The church needs to open its eyes and get with the times. With the numbers falling in parishioners and worshippers and the numbers in homosexuality increasing as more of society comes out, at this rate the numbers of worshippers will continue to fall. I will continue from my home, between God and myself and not some judgemental biggot in a robe in the middle. The church will except society that has committed crime and done harm to others also offering forgivness. Yet if you are homosexual you are regarded to be the biggest sinner of all time. Most of which homosexuality goes on within the church ESPECIALLY the Catholic church. The difference is I am open about my sexuality (NOT BEHIND CLOSED DOORS AS SOME IN THE CATHOLIC CHURCH) and only engage in a loving legal relationship with a consenting adult. I must apologise to any offence that I may have caused to anyone but feel strongly about get my point across to these so called devout christians i.e biggots. The church needs to open its eyes and get with the times. With the numbers falling in parishioners and worshippers and the numbers in homosexuality increasing as more of society comes out, at this rate the numbers of worshippers will continue to fall. I will continue from my home, between God and myself and not some judgemental biggot in a robe in the middle.

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]]> By: Nike http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html/comment-page-1/#comment-471 Nike Tue, 08 Aug 2006 12:09:00 +0000 http://www.pinknews.co.uk/news/articles/2005-168.html#comment-471 Here is what Jesus Christ himself has to say ' Have you not heard, MALE and FEMALE he created them, Therefore shall a MAN leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his WIFE. It is therefore false to say that homosexuality was unknown at the time of Jesus Christ. If it had been unknwon, it would not even have been mentioned! That was wahy Paul, in taking about various sexual practices, including polygamy and homosexualtiy, said 'And such were some of you, but you were sanctified...' Christanity is a free society of choice with rules set out frm the outset, if you cannot abide, do not join, but it seems strange that people want to change the religion to suit their own selves. I have not yet heard it supported that meat eaters become not only members of the Vegan Society, but leaders of it! Here is what Jesus Christ himself has to say ' Have you not heard, MALE and FEMALE he created them, Therefore shall a MAN leave his father and mother and shall be joined to his WIFE. It is therefore false to say that homosexuality was unknown at the time of Jesus Christ. If it had been unknwon, it would not even have been mentioned! That was wahy Paul, in taking about various sexual practices, including polygamy and homosexualtiy, said 'And such were some of you, but you were sanctified…' Christanity is a free society of choice with rules set out frm the outset, if you cannot abide, do not join, but it seems strange that people want to change the religion to suit their own selves. I have not yet heard it supported that meat eaters become not only members of the Vegan Society, but leaders of it!

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