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BNP furious after Church of England bans clergy from having party membership

  • Truth

    Ah yes: the BNP. I remember them. UKIP with a less-charismatic leader ….

    • Barry Scarfe

      The BNP isn’t an ultra-Thatcherite and globalist party like UKIP so that is one major difference between them.

      • Oliver

        And the BNP is fanatical in it’s hatred and fear of Jews.

        • Barry Scarfe

          That isn’t true. The BNP is only against the Zionist/Jewish Supremacist ones that want to bend British foreign policy so that it benefits a foreign country ie Israel instead of serving our national interest etc. The BNP did have an elected Jewish councillor and had Jewish members.

          • gingerlycolors

            Turkeys and Christmas comes to mind here.

          • Barry Scarfe

            No, not really. The Jewish councillor was obviously a very well-integrated Jew who saw herself as no different to non-Jewish Britons as if she hadn’t seen herself in that way she would not have joined the BNP.

            Other Jews like Gerry Gable of Searchlight are not assimilated into British society because if they were they wouldn’t be so against alleged British ‘racism’ ie a desire to maintain our country for ourselves when this is the EXACT SAME THING that his fellow Jews do in Israel. Why is nationalism and national feeling ok for Jews in Israel but not ok for white Britons in Britain?

          • chrisdbarnett

            Steady on Barry. You’re in danger of winning the argument here! You have to drag it out a bit, otherwise they’ll go back to script and call you a racist Nazi a bit too early.

        • chrisdbarnett

          Really. I’m not to good at debating this kind of stuff, perhaps I should get the Jew who recruited me into being a BNP activist, to try and talk some truth into you.

    • Oliver

      Ukip isn’t racialist. They just don’t like having our country flooded with cheap labour, Africans and Asians.

      • Barry Scarfe

        The Left call them racist and we all know that ONLY the left get to define this term but then that should come as no surprise as it was invented by Leon Troksky.

      • Truth

        That’s what Hitler said … at first. Then he started on the Jews. Then the Romany gypsies. Then the gays. Starting to sound familiar, Oliver ….?

        • chrisdbarnett

          That’s what Hitler said … at first. Then they started on the BNP. Then
          the Working class British Whites. Then the Christians. Then the gays, Starting to sound familiar, “Truth”
          ….?

      • chrisdbarnett

        What? UKIP believes in net migration – 1 man enter, 1 man leaves!

        So….that being the case, by pulling out of the EU but still retaining net migration, UKIP will wave through millions of Africans and Asians!

        Cheap labour, you bet, but that’s exactly what a bunch bankers want!!

        Moral of the story, is you don’t vote for a party backed by rich bankers.

        • Barry Scarfe

          UKIP is a party of globalist values (particularly with regard to economics). A few weeks ago, the fanatically pro-UKIP Daily Express even allowed a writer to its letters pages to point this out to its mostly ill-informed Tory readership.

          UKIP is fundamentally flawed as a political party and its globalist approach to economics is their biggest. Their economic approach basically entails ‘Thatcherism on steroids’ and this limits the appeal of the party to the most well-heeled sub-sections of Tory support.

          If they don’t change this approach, they will be limiting their potential for growth and some of the more well-informed parts of the electorate have begun to notice this aspect of UKIP.

          I believe this may account for the fact the Tories retained Newark by quite some margin when it was expected that either UKIP would win the seat or the Tories would have their majority cut much more substantially.

          Basically, UKIP is the Atlanticist, EU-hating, Thatcherite
          wing of the Tory Party in seemingly permanent exile:

          http://durotrigan.blogspot.co.uk/2012/02/beyond-fringe-building-credible.html

          I think both UKIP and the BNP are flawed parties and that limits their potential for growth.

          I also think that UKIP will not grow much further and Newark may well be their high point of public support and it is a downward slope from now on:

          http://www.eureferendum.com

  • Marc Webster

    Well at least the CoE has got something right…..

    • Barry Scarfe

      I disagree. It’s the actions of a fascist mentality. If they disagree with the BNP then they should not resort to banning but say why that is so. It’s obvious they don’t have the courage of their convictions.

      • Oliver

        Have you ever read Orwell’s ‘Politics and the English Language?’

      • Marc Webster

        Bishops declared that both the BNP and National Front are “incompatible with the teaching of the Church of England” because of their respective stances on “equality of persons or groups of different races”.

        Not see that bit Barry? There’s your reason…..of course they are hypocrites because the Bible has slavery in it but that isn’t news to anyone…

        • Barry Scarfe

          The different races do have different abilities. We can see this in sport. For example, you hardly ever see a black swimmer in the Olympics yet they are to the forefront when it comes to athletics events. Saying this is NOT ‘racist’ – it is just taking note of the differences between different races. What is wrong with that?

          Anyway, I am not going to take any notice of religion. You would have to be pretty weak-minded to believe there is some all-powerful being up in the sky looking-down on us all. When I went on holiday to the Italian Lakes a few years ago I tried to look for God in the sky but I didn’t see him. Does anyone know where he lives? Does he have an email address or a postal address?

          • Marc Webster

            Surprisingly as a staunch atheist I agree with what you say….

          • gingerlycolors

            Santa Clause has a postal address – I know because I work in a sorting office and handle mail for him every Christmas but we all know he does not exist! He even has his own postcode: SAN TA1.

          • chrisdbarnett

            The BNP isn’t interested in the “abilities” part – we’re different. Even the government acknowledges we are different.

            If it’s politically correct to ask for rights for “Ethnic Minorities” – surely out of fairness those that are not classed as an “Ethnic Minority” can demand rights or even make the case that they don’t have rights they would like, without being dragged through the mud and branded a racist?

            The irony is, that the BNP is the ONLY party that would treat everyone the same in government.

            So how can we be racist?

          • Barry Scarfe

            I wouldn’t say the BNP was ‘racist’. The BNP acknowledges racial differences which are inherent in mankind. The Lib/Lab/CON/UKIP party doesn’t. Indeed, you could say anyone who doesn’t acknowledge racial difference are the TRUE RACISTS.

      • Dolly Digest

        There is no room for racism or homphobia in the anglican church – the church has made it’s position clear and if you read the article the decision was a democratic vote for the ban. I would say that the decision to ban this vile extremist party is extremely couragious.

        • Barry Scarfe

          It isn’t democratic at all. It is the actions of rabid fascists who can’t debate but then what do you expect from a bunch of idiots who genuinely believe there is some all-seeing being up in the sky!

          The BNP isn’t ‘racist’. Its trying to defend our nation against continual mass immigration which is perfectly right. The genocidal immigration policies of the last 6 DECADES should end.

          • gingerlycolors

            I’m sorry, Barry but the BNP are nothing more than a neo-Nazi organisation who wants to see the compulsory repatriation of all non-whites and the recriminalization of homosexuality. Nick Griffin may appear to have detoxified the party by toning down it’s rhetoric but the fact remains is that he is a Holocaust denying thug with convictions for race hate crimes.
            The BNP along with the NF and other far-right groups were established when it was almost ‘trendy’ to be part of a race-hate organisation and many people between the late 1960′s and early 1980′s got involved in those organisations only to regret their actions in later life. The late Nicky Crane is a prime example, being involved with the British Movement before coming out as gay shortly before he died from a HIV/AIDS related illness.

          • Barry Scarfe

            Well, it is pretty pointless to talk about the BNP seeing as it is effectively a dead ‘zombie’ party nowdays. The new British Democratic Party has a more tolerant line on gay and bisexual people and supports civil partnerships (hopefully, it won’t be long before they upgrade that to reflect the law as it now is ie endorse gay civil marriage).

            Yes, I do remember the case of Nicky Crane. This is why it was stupid of the BNP to be homophobic and not support the Labour government’s gay reforms as quite a few of their own members and supporters are either gay or bisexual/bicurious and ALWAYS have been.

            They have only made a rod for their own backs here and if a BNP councillor had been gay or bisexual/bicurious and the anti-nationalist hard-left had found-out they would have had a field day!

          • chrisdbarnett

            How long as this BDP been going? How many Councillors?

            The only thing you’ve won is the contempt of nationalists everywhere when you tried to stand in areas that you knew the BNP were standing in, just to stop the BNP from getting in.

          • Barry Scarfe

            The BDP hasn’t been going long and yes it doesn’t have any councilors yet but I am sure it won’t be long before it does have some.

            I wasn’t aware of the fact that the BDP had done this. I am sure they haven’t because their website shows they have stood in few elections so far and it appears there have been no BNP candidates and BDP ones standing against each other.

            The point is though that whilst Nick Griffin did tentatively begin to reform the BNP with regards to this gay/bisexual issue he didn’t go anywhere near far enough. He should have updated the policy to include support for civil partnerships, gays serving in the armed forces and also not supporting the restoration of Section 28 which caused a lot of damage in schools and promoted bullying in them.

            Marine Le Pen and her FN party support the French equivalent of civil partnerships, gays serving in the French military ect and as a result they have obtained a small proportion of the so-called ‘pink vote’ in France and the votes of their straight friends and relatives.

            Marine and her party have plenty of gay and bisexual members and a few even work in the FN headquarters in Paris. Also, her number two is widely-rumoured to be gay. In short, her party is more ‘gay friendly’ than the BNP is and therefore a more credible party.

            The BDP aims to be a credible non-globalist counter to UKIP which unfortunately due to its approach to this issue and others the BNP never became.

          • chrisdbarnett

            That’s libel – Nick Griffin has gone on record many times saying the Holocaust was real and that 6 million Jews died in it.

            I find it ironic that people like yourselves would actually stop the BNP from doing the decent thing.

            As a BNP activist, what breaks my heart is that 90% of the proposed CoE motion is based on fantasy and the other 10% doesn’t make sense.

            For the 329393292494929294929239392932994 time – * THE BNP HAS NEVER BELIEVED IN RACIAL SUPERIORITY AND IT NEVER WILL DO as long as I have anything to do with it.

      • Geoff McLarney

        It’s quite simple. You cannot fulfill a priest’s ordination vows and the responsibilities of BNP membership at the same time. The Church is quite right to call out the dishonesty of those who attempt to straddle their mutually exclusive ideologies. BNP should be equally adamant in deploring the same.

        • Barry Scarfe

          I wonder if they allow Marxists to join? I bet they do even though Marxist regimes like North Korea starve their people to death and Communist regimes in total have killed 100,000,000 MILLION VICTIMS. The Church seems to favour left-wing totalitarianism!

        • chrisdbarnett

          The BNP doesn’t have an ideology.

          So come on, please find me the “racist” policies that the BNP has.

          We don’t. There is no policies that endorses racial superiority or hate.

          If it did, I would tear up my membership card in an instant.

  • Robert W. Pierce

    All well and good. What about the double-standard, allowing homophobic clergy to remain?

  • Jones

    BNP being cry babies because they lost in all the recent elections.

  • james

    It’s pretty telling that, while the Church of England has been so resistant to the idea of having women and LGBT people amongst its clergy, they have only just got round to banning overt racists. And, of course, they have only done so in a largely symbolic way, by banning membership of two organisations that have declined to the point that they are practically defunct (apparently the BNP has just two councillors left, down from 2 MEPs and over 50 councillors five years ago, while the National Front has been irrelevant for decades).

    • Truth

      But then, their bible also condones slavery.

  • GulliverUK

    What would really be the difference? Too many Anglican Bishops and clergy already exhibit characteristics of the BNP and National Front as regards LGBT issues. There is no discipline in the Church of England when you compare the very homophobic remarks made by people like Carey and Ali (surely both National Front members) with the caring pastoral position that Williams and even Welby said they wanted.

    The whole Church of England is a microcosm of society, racists, homophobes, misogynists, conservatives, liberals, xenophobes, socialists, atheists even ! :)

  • john

    I suspect they’ll just become members of the UKIP party instead…

  • Barry Scarfe

    Why does the Church of England ban members of the BNP yet allows Tories to join it? I suppose they would allow the simply vile Iain Duncan-Smith to one of their flock if he were not a Roman Catholic as he seems to be doing a good job of pushing many poor people towards committing suicide but that is ok according to Mr Carey who thinks the government’s so-called welfare ‘reforms’ are in accordance with Christian teachings when to most people they aren’t

    • Dolly Digest

      Well the Tories do not incite hatred an violence against minority races or orientations and those Tories who step over the line are often forced to resign and/or have their whips removed or their remits taken over by central government. The BNP is a racist and homophobic hate group.

      • Barry Scarfe

        No, it is not ‘racist’. It is a nationalist party that is attempting to defend our nation against continual mass immigration. Its polices on this subject are the same as Enoch Powell’s. Was he a ‘racist’ too? I seem to think he was a Tory MP at one time and a devoted patriot/nationalist.

        I take your point about homophobia but that is found in ALL parties including the Tories, Labour, UKIP and even the Lib Dems. That is regrettable and needs to stop but it is still a problem for all parties and in our society.

        • Bob

          I’ve been reading more of your posts on this board, Barry and I’m beginning to see a worrying pattern. You regularly berate/demean UKIP at any given opportunity and in the same breath endorse the BNP as a non-racist party? Are you kidding? It’s as bad as your belief in different racial abilities – both are illogical, but funnily enough, it’s the same ideology shared within the BNP. I dread to think what you say behind closed doors with your ‘nationalist’ friends, but like the BNP and some other fringe far-right groups, you want to appear moderate and mainstream, but it only serves as a smokescreen for your true beliefs.

          Posturing as some gay-friendly ‘straight’ bloke with the aim of promoting vile extremist groups as credible and non-prejudiced is laughable and quite insulting when we ALL know the complete opposite is true.
          If you feel so strongly about the BNP being misrepresented, why don’t you try and approach them directly to argue a case for more LGBT rights and same sex marriage across Europe? I’m sure your arguement will be accepted positively.
          Pink News isn’t the place to galvanise support for these groups.

          • Barry Scarfe

            I am a bicurious/bisexual bloke. I would guess I am probably about a 2 or at a pinch, a 3 on the Kinsey Scale.

            I can assure you I am not afraid of letting anyone know of my gay/bisexual friendly views and that includes ‘Rightwing’ nationalist people. I have always done this and always will because gay/bisexual rights are logical, fair, right and in accordance with scientific reality.

            I am not going to argue about the BNP because as we all know it is effectively a dead ‘zombie’ party now and even if Nick Griffin were replaced it isn’t coming back.

            The new British Democratic Party is in support of gay civil partnerships and if I join it I will try and get them to support gay civil marriage as that is now the law.

          • Bob

            Civil partnerships but not equal marriage, right? Oh dear, it’s the Front le Nationale all over again! No doubt this very forward thinking party will be in favour of gay people adopting children and promoting LGBT equality. No? I didn’t think so.

            BDP – Same logic, same party, but a different name.

            No far right party will EVER consider gay rights/equality a fundamental priority. If you are so concerned about our welfare as LGBT people, why don’t you support the many great charities/causes in this country helping the British LGBT community? Or is backing neo-nazism dressed up as ‘mainstream politics’ more important?

          • Barry Scarfe

            I agree that civil partnerships are not good enough not least because of the fact that the law has recently changed and we now have full civil equality for gays with respect to civil marriages.

            However, for a nationalist party in Britain to accept the need for civil partnerships is a big step forward (the BNP STILL doesn’t accept them!!) and hopefully if more gays and bisexuals join the party then the position will change still further and support gay civil marriages. The way to change organisations that still don’t accept civil equality is for gays and bisexuals is not be passive by-standers, join them and change them from within.

            I have given donations to Stonewall in the past and do so in the present too. They do an excellent job in promoting rights for LGBT people.

          • Bob

            But that’s just it – MOST LGBT people don’t want to support these groups.

          • Barry Scarfe

            I accept that people who are gay or bisexual have a huge variety of political viewpoints. Some will be Labour supporters, some will be Greens, some Lib Dems, some Tories, and yes some will be anti-EU and anti-mass immigration and nationalists too. The ‘Pink Vote’ is varied. People who are gay or bisexual shouldn’t have their sexuality made an object of derision, scorn or contempt by parties and in return gays/bisexuals should support every different party.

          • chrisdbarnett

            Is there anything out there that targets British working class folk? There isn’t, there’s nothing. There’s very few organisations that represent us or speak for us.

          • chrisdbarnett

            Well…equality for working class Brits is a higher priority for many…many…many…many people.

          • Barry Scarfe

            That is true but we have can have that and equality for gay and bisexual people at the same time.

        • David H

          Enoch Powell was a far more contradictory figure than many historians like to admit. The Enoch Powell of the 1950s was, in my opinion, one of the least racist politicians around – certainly in regard to his comments about the Mau Mau uprising.

          However, the Enoch Powell of the late-1960s was a very different figure; what most people tend to (conveniently) forget is that his (in)famous Rivers of Blood speech was NEVER about immigration, but was made in opposition to the then Labour government’s introduction of the race relations act.

          Taken in its correct context, it’s hard to consider the older-Powell as anything but a racist.

          • Barry Scarfe

            He said he was a ‘racialist’ which is the proper term for anybody who notices differences amongst the races (that DOESN’T mean any one race is ‘superior’ or ‘inferior’ merely different with different aptitudes and abilities) and who has racial awareness.

            He also said that ‘racialism’ was the basis of nationalism which it is.

            A ‘racist’ is someone who hates another race purely on account of their being from a different race.

            Enoch Powell was an English nationalist (also a British Unionist and patriot).

            He did have some unusual views for a ‘Right-winger’ ie unlike most he was a fervent opponent of capital punishment and was fairly liberal (in the context of the era in which he lived) and with regard to his fellow Tory MPs on the subject of gays/bisexuals and their rights. He was one of the few Tory MPs to vote for the Sexual Offences Act of 1967 (along with a young Margaret Thatcher)

            I think what this goes to show is that just because someone has nationalist viewpoints it doesn’t necessarily mean they are anti-gay or anti-bisexual.

          • David H

            I don’t disagree with your definitions of racialist vs racist. I pointed out his earlier, very positive, speeches in the 1950s. I was simply pointing out that he very publicly opposed the earliest bill for racial equality. That, to my mind, crosses the definition.

            There are also tales that Powell experimented with same-sex relationships in his youth (whilst it was still illegal).

            I’m not a big fan of terms like left and right (even though I use them myself as they’re easily identifiable labels). The reality is that the political spectrum more closely resembles a circle than a straight line as the only thing that divides the the extreme left and the extreme right is economic policy – both tend be just as bigoted and stuck in their ideologies and conservative (in the proper sense of the word) as the other.

      • chrisdbarnett

        You mean when the Tories are caught inciting racial hatred, they resign surely?

        Under the thin veneer of respectability lies an under-belly of racial and religious hatred in the Tory party, not to mention kiddy fiddling.

        The Tories have a murdering blood-lust. They conspired with New Labour to kill hundreds of thousands of Arabs just because they were brown and had too much oil.

        Why do you support murdering racist kiddy fiddlers?

  • Rob

    Wow the church has done something right for a change!

  • Craig Young

    And neofascism is compatible with mainstream Christianity how, exactly?! Fundamentalist Protestantism and conservative Catholicism on the other hand don’t have clean hands on this front. More like bloodstained jackboots of their own in some cases…

  • Katie

    Considering that most of the characters in the Bible are Semitic, Middle Eastern and/or African, isn’t the BNP throwing a diva about being banned from the Church akin to Bernard Manning finding himself incredulous as to why he was never invited to any feminist meetings?

  • Josh

    It’s a start. Welby has taken a good lead from Williams in modernising the Church and updating their views. The General Synod and the 460 or so members all debated this and there were views on both sides. The vote was overwhelmingly in support of the motion that membership of the BNP (among others) was incompatible with the aims, views and objectives of the Church.

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