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Peter Tatchell becomes a patron of anti-hate crime Muslim campaign group

  • Pablo

    How dare they compare Homophobia and Islamophobia. Religion and sexuality are not comparable. One is a choice.

    50% of young British muslims do not agree with homosexuality, how much do you think the figure is for adult muslims? Never mind the murder and abuse they face in Islamic countries.

    I also cannot find any information regarding them fighting homophobia online. Anyone else?
    Not every Muslim is a homophobe, but don’t EVER compare the two.

    • lalocura

      Why not compare them?

      Some people believe in perpetrating violence against queer people just because they’re queer.

      Some people believe in perpetrating violence against muslims just because they’re muslims.

      That doesn’t mean that all aspects of homophobia and islamophobia are the same, and that the challenges we face are the same. But there are commonalities.

      • Caramel Abdul Jizzbar

        Muslims choose to be the way they are (ultra-conservative, generally). It’s a belief system. Muslims can and do lose their faith every day (thank the heavens). That’s a pretty major difference between the two groups, I would say.

        • lalocura

          Pablo wasn’t comparing islam and homosexuality (which are patently different for the reason you state), he was comparing islamophobia and homophobia (which are not as different since both can be and frequently are manifested in unprovoked violence against others).

          • Caramel Abdul Jizzbar

            Well, maybe it’s a question of semantics, but I have no problem with islamophobia if by that you mean a fear of the belief system that is islam. This would differ from muslim-ophobia, or whatever word you’d want to use. In my opinion, homophobia is wrong, but islamophobia (in the sense I have used above, not the way it is bandied about in the media) is wholly justified.

          • lalocura

            Criticism, dislike, anger, opposition etc. towards islam is fine and dandy as far as I’m concerned. But islamophobia is widely understood (or “bandied about”, whatever) to mean the incitement of hatred or violence against muslims as individuals or as a group which is no more acceptable than it would be towards gay people. I expect this is also roughly similar to Tell Mama’s definition. If you want to push to redefine this kind of thing then go ahead but I think most people are on the same page with these definitions.

          • lalocura

            From Tell MAMA’s page:

            “TELL MAMA classifies an anti-Muslim incident as any malicious act aimed at Muslims, their material property or Islamic organisations and where there is evidence that the act has anti-Muslim motivation or content, or that the victim was targeted because of their Muslim identity. This also includes incidents where the victim was perceived to be a Muslim.”

          • Caramel Abdul Jizzbar

            Please forgive. http://casualsunited.wordpress.com/2013/06/09/tellmama-gets-caught-chatting-shit-and-intimidating-critics-and-loses-his-funding-lol-edl/

            If I had more time, I’d find you better sources. But this will at least draw your attention to the issues.

          • lalocura

            Thanks for the link. I will have a look at the related newspaper articles in more detail later as there’s quite a bit of reading between them and the blog itself appears to be an EDL/sympathiser blog.

          • Traveller_23

            Their methodologies have been criticised in the past by mainstream media, and quite fairly from what I recall. However, they now seem to quote Metropolitan Police figures instead of their own, which would hopefully be more reliable: http://tellmamauk.org/metropolitan-police-service-islamophobia-hate-crime-figures-february-2014/

          • itbeso

            Without a breakdown those figures are absolutely useless.

          • James Lovelace

            “they now seem to quote Metropolitan Police figures instead of their own, which would hopefully be more reliable:”

            As Andrew Gilligan has demonstrated in The Telegraph, the scale of homophobic attacks in east London is far worse than the scale of the attacks on muslims.

            http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/andrewgilligan/100066569/islamic-extremism-is-this-the-years-most-embarrassing-academic-report/

            Has Fiyaz Mughal sought £375,000 from the government to record attacks on gay people, or only attacks on muslims?

            It’s come to something, when it’s The Torygraph that speaks out about the attacks on gay people.

          • Traveller_23

            Er, that’s an EDL sympathiser blog – hardly a quotable source! They don’t just hate Muslims either, they have a few racist articles there as well, i.e. regarding Stephen Lawrence.

          • James Lovelace

            Fiyaz Mughal/Tell Mama recently got the police to prosecute a man for sending 3 tweets to Fiyaz Mughal, where the man disputed the honesty of Fiyaz Mughal. The man ended up being prosecuted for RACIAL harrassment, just for sending a couple of tweets! Apparently, at no point was race ever brought into the tweets. Thankfully, the court threw out the case, but only after the non-muslim had spent months awaiting possible imprisonment.

            http://www.newenglishreview.org/custpage.cfm/frm/142382/sec_id/142382

            The British media didn’t even think it significant to report on this outrageous prosecution. Some respectable man could have ended up being branded a criminal and a racist, just for criticising a muslim (admittedly in more robust language than I would use).

            And Peter Tatchell supposedly believes in freedom of speech. Yet this is muslim is the man he chooses to embrace.

          • Caramel Abdul Jizzbar

            I am against any of the discrimination you describe, against any demographic. My issue is how, in the public sphere, there is zero distinction between criticism of a religion and “islamophobia”. Attack the institution of islam and its backward values, and you are instantly branded an islamophobe. Dawkins is a good example of this.

            And I would argue that much of the conflation and confusion surrounding the terms has been intentional on the part of the Muslim community, to deflect justified criticism of cultural and social practices that are incompatible with Western values and stem directly from their beliefs.

            And just an aside, Tell Mama is an organisation of very questionable integrity. I think Tatchell is making a mistake in associating himself with them.

          • lalocura

            I don’t doubt that some of the conflation you describe goes on – I’ve experienced something similar when I’ve been accused of being anti-semitic for criticising Israel. This sort of thing really has to be challenged in situ to try to nip it in the bud.

            Nevertheless there’s considerable and mainstream opposition to many conservative practices within islam, the idea that you can’t get away with criticising it without being called islamophobic is untrue in my experience.

            I’m interested to know about TELL MAMA’s questionable integrity. A quick look at their website shows vocal expressions of solidarity for gays and jews – exactly the kind of things I’m often told muslims don’t do – so I’d be grateful for your info.

        • James Lovelace

          “Muslims choose to be the way they are (ultra-conservative, generally). It’s a belief system. Muslims can and do lose their faith every day (thank the heavens).”

          It’s a bit more complex than that. Children are forced into becoming muslims. And once they are indoctrinated over a period of 16 years or so, it’s hard for them to leave. Especially when the koran demands that they are killed if they leave islam. http://www.usc.edu/org/cmje/religious-texts/quran/verses/004-qmt.php#004.089 And especially when around 40% of young British muslims agree that those who leave islam should be killed.

          We should be spending money protecting those who leave islam, rather wasting it on divisive projects like Tell Mama. I know an ex-muslim who is in hiding in Britain, because his family are out to kill him. He despairs because there is no organisation he can go to for help and financial support. Muslims are known to have “bounty hunters” i.e. taxi drivers who scour the country looking for muslims who have displeased their parents.

    • Traveller_23

      Another one of their patrons is Imaan, a Muslim LGBTQI support group: http://www.imaan.org.uk. The work they do involves countering anti-Muslim hate like this: thebisexualbangladeshi.tumblr.com/post/80154089046/in-a-recent-bbc-report-on-homosexual-muslims-in

      I’ve seen them send out supportive tweets, calling out homophobia in Muslim communities etc. Maybe their site’s blog has more, I don’t know.

      • James Lovelace

        ” Imaan, a Muslim LGBTQI support group:”

        A few years ago, at a public talk at London University, the speaker from IMAAN said “I welcome the Caliphate”. The restoration of the Caliphate is the same policy supported by the 20 islamo-nazi groups in Britain – they plan to have sharia law apply to muslims and non-muslims alike. As Tatchell well knows, the islamic nazi party in Britain sees the execution of gay people as part of sharia law.

        When this was pointed out to the speaker from IMAAN, he said “we think we can persuade the Caliph not to kill gay people”. Never mind that under the rest of sharia law, non-muslims are 3rd class citizens who must never hold a position of authority over any muslim.

  • saintlaw

    They’ve displayed good sense in appointing Peter Tatchell for such a role.

    He is a very great man indeed: smart, brave, kind – a true moral exemplar in an era sorely in need of them.

  • Mike

    Agree about Peter but he keeps insisting of offering an olive branch to this homophobic religion that continues to murder and imprison gay people across the world and given their way would wipe us from the face of the earth!

    • PHILBY

      Totally true Mike! How can we reach out to Islam that on the whole wants us to convert or cut our throats. It’s not a religion but a dangerous & totalitarian ideology.

    • lalocura

      Fiyaz Mughal said of Tatchell:

      “He campaigns wholeheartedly against all forms of intolerance and discrimination, as do we, including anti-Muslim prejudice, homophobia, and anti-Semitism.

      “He is an outstanding excellent addition to the Tell Mama fold and we are proud to be associated with him.”

      Isn’t this an example of a muslim insisting on offering an olive branch to a gay person? Or are we all going to carry on pretending like usual that because there is a serious problem with general muslim attitudes towards homosexuality then that means we mustn’t engage with any muslims full stop?

      • Newt

        You are the Devil incarnate.

        • Newt

          And of course, as a Muslim, you have a mandate to lie.

      • James Lovelace

        “Isn’t this an example of a muslim insisting on offering an olive branch to a gay person?”

        This muslim, Fiyaz Mughal, has been involved in British politics for about 10 years. Apart from his singular utterance around the Gay Free Zone episode in 2011 when else has he spoken out about the murderous homophobia being spouted by muslim preachers and practiced by muslims on the streets of London? In 2011, Mughal sought to blame “church, synagogue, mosque or temple” (note where “mosque” comes in that that flurry of blame for muslims plastering east London as a Gay Free Zone). http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2011/03/21/comment-tower-hamlets-can-lead-the-way-on-tackling-homophobia/

        If you know of any previous public utterances of this muslim against homophobia, please share them. Because I can’t find any.

        Back in 2005, Tatchell was complaining bitterly about the homophobia from the Muslim Council of Britain and the Left’s support for that homophobia. Where was Mughal’s support then? http://www.petertatchell.net/politics/sacranie.htm

        Where was Mughal’s support for gay rights when Tatchell was attacked by muslims in 2011 (Tatchell joined muslims on an anti-EDL demo)? http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2011/09/05/comment-peter-tatchell-on-saturdays-anti-english-defence-league-protest/

        There was no sign then of Mughal putting his arm round Tatchell, and offering to use some of the £375,000 Mughal got for recording attacks on muslims, in order to record muslim attacks on gays. Some of that money could have been used to record the many incidents of homophobic violence from muslims expressed in the comments on Pink News.

        In 2008 Oliver Hemsley was attacked outside a gay bar in Tower Hamlets and left paralysed. The British media didn’t even record that he was gay and the vicious attack by 8 muslims happened outside a gay bar. Perhaps Mughal thinks that it’s only attacks against muslims that should be recorded? If he’s so concerned about homophobia, why does his organisation only record attacks against muslims?

  • qv

    Why is it called “Tell Mama”?

    • lalocura

      MAMA stands for Measuring Anti Muslim Attacks.

      • Newt

        LOL! Evidently, they don’t have much to do, hence ‘making it up!’
        Maybe they should re-focus?
        How about becoming the MMA?
        They’d be overwhelmed with things to do, and injustices to fight then!

  • Mohamhead

    If Tatchell, the professional agitator, was in any number of islamic countries – he’d be hanged. The tell Mama people know this – but for political reasons (increasing their sympathy vote) they apply that very Middle Eastern philosophy of ‘the enemy of my enemy is my friend’. Until sharia is introduced – and then it’s ‘bye, bye Mr Tatchell’.

  • Glen Hague

    Well done Peter! Ignore the bitter remarks of the unhappy few who will always try to criticise anything you do. They are just negative, do-nothing idiots. You are a real example to everyone and what is so impressive is that you have admirers on every side of the political spectrum, even people who disagree with most of what you believe. You have always stayed true to your ideals and you have integrity. Congratulations!

    • Coastliner

      No – he’s just another leftard imbecile, for some totally unfathomable reason that defies logic, sucking up to a wicked ideology that would see him dead in the blink of an eye. A total moron.

    • James Lovelace

      “You have always stayed true to your ideals and you have integrity.”

      During the 1990s, Tatchell was regularly protesting against islamo-nazi groups. In the last 10 years he has barely ever protested against them, when the islamo-nazi groups now have control of 20 major muslim organisations in Britain. These days Tatchell’s more often to be found cosying-up to muslims, like with Tell Mama, rather than protesting against the vastly more widespread islamo-nazism in Britain. If you think that’s someone with integrity, I’ve got a bridge to sell you.

      99.5% of British muslims are openly homophobic. And the younger muslims are, the more homophobic they are. http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/may/07/muslims-britain-france-germany-homosexuality

      Go and look at Tatchell’s “human rights foundation” campaigns. http://www.petertatchellfoundation.org/campaigns Not one campaign against islamic homophobia, despite the fact that there are regular muslims preachers in Britain saying that gay people should be killed.

  • itbeso

    Another useful idiot for Islam.

  • Newt

    Peter, you have it so very wrong. You are in the arms of the Devil. I’m sure you will have the wherewithal to come to see that by championing Islam, you are championing intolerance in it’s gravest form.

  • James Lovelace

    According to the 2009 Gallup Poll, 99.5% of British muslims are homophobic. When this poll was published in The Guardian, the gay media swarmed around arguing the poll was conducted by “islamophobes”, when it was conducted by a specialist all-muslim team at Gallup (one of that team is now Obama’s principal advisor on islam).

    http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2009/may/07/muslims-britain-france-germany-homosexuality

    Another poll, this time conducted by other British muslims, muslims with the Peter Tatchell Stamp of Approval, concluded that between 61% to 70% of British muslims wanted homosexuals criminalised and “punished” (moreover, the younger the muslims were, the more homophobic they were). The poll did not ask what kind of punishment they want for us, but the same poll showed that 30% to 40% thought any muslim who leaves islam should be killed, so it seems quite likely that the majority of British muslims want us gays killed.

    http://www.policyexchange.org.uk/publications/category/item/living-apart-together-british-muslims-and-the-paradox-of-multiculturalism

    Peter Tatchell claims he has the support of the gay community. He is a self-appointed busybody, who represents no-one but himself.

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