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Ireland: Dublin prepares for LGBT Noise’s 5th Annual March for Marriage

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  1. Ireland will deserve utter condemnation and contempt if equal civil rights are put to a vote.

    Only SOME legal scholars think a vote is required.

    Others think legislation is enough.

    Considering the campaign of sheer evil that will be unleashed in Ireland, there is no guarantee that a referendum will succeed.

    In which case we will be 2nd class citizens for another 25 years.

    And we will be in grave danger of violence considering how extremism will have been normalized during the campaign.

    Do the right thing Ireland.

    Legislate.

    1. Unfortunatley they really cant. the prohibition on equal marriage is in the constitution. it is disgraceful but it would set a worrying and illegal precident if the constitution is legsislated away. on the plus side if the yes vote(quite likely) comes through then we will never have to worry about it again. and lets face it the church is ruined in the republic, it can never recover from the scandels so any campaign they have will most likely fail in all aspects. Im from the north btw, and i really hope it passes, it may force the hand of stormont and nothing else will bring it about here except if all surrounding countries adopt it.

      1. That is untrue.

        Nowhere in the Irish constitution is marriage defined as being .1 man, 1 woman.

        Case law in the court interprets it that way but with equality legislation this can be overcome.

        And considering the viciously evil campaign of slander and lies that the anti equality brigade (funded by US groups) then it is very likely the referendum will be lost.

        What is the Plan B for this scenario?

        1. Under Article 41, Section 3, subsection 1 the state guards the institution of marriage. This has been interpreted by the Supreme Court as between one man and one woman as was intended at the time the constitution was created.

          Legislation will be struck out as incompatible with the constitution. Not because the judges disagree with equal marriage but because their job is to uphold the constitution.

          This will set back the cause for equal marriage another 5 – 10 years. I do not believe you have a sufficient knowledge of Irish law. I am involved with LGBT Lawyers and practice EU and constitutional Law. I can assure you the only way to set equal marriage in stone in Ireland is through a referendum.

          1. Well OK then.

            If as a result of the disgustingly slanderous and hate-filled anti-equality campaign that will be launched when the referendum is announced (funded by evangelical churches in the US) the referendum is defeated, what is Plan B for equality in Ireland.

            There is a Plan B right?

            Does the government promise to hold a referendum every 3 months thereafter until equality is achieved?

            If not then why not?

            Surely LGBT groups in Ireland are absolutely horrified at the notion of equality being dependent on a vote.

            What is their Plan B?

          2. Actually Steve lgbt org’s are not horrified as they are aware of how all this works. The referendum will take place with votes on other articles of the constitution. You are giving too much credit to lobby groups such as the Iona institute and the church. They simply do not have the influence they once had. Almost the opposite, many people will vote against them because they are part of the church.

            You seem to know what way its all going to go without having a clue what the situation is like here in reality.

          3. Stop making excuses.

            It is appalling beyond measure that equal rights should be subject to popular vote, irrespective of what the constitution says.

            Which other minority’s rights have now or have in the past been decided by referendum in Ireland, or are the gays the only ones whose rights get determined by mob rule?

            Have ANY pro-equality groups expressed horror at this.

            It will be a dark day for Ireland when a minority’s equal

          4. And you never answered my question.

            WHAT IS PLAN B IN CASE THIS APPALLING REFERENDUM FAILS?

            (I’ve capitalised it in case you miss it again)

        2. You clearly have absolutely no idea what you are talking about SteveC. What is more infuriating is that when people give their expert opinion you ignore it. Blind ignorance is not going to help the cause for equal marriage in Ireland.

          1. What is the Plan B for marriage equality in Ireland in case the referendum fails then?

            You do accept that the anti-equality campaign will launch a smear campaign (focusing on the ‘danger’ to children of equality) that will make victory far from certain.

            Quite frankly I don’t regard the idea that the Irish constitution requires a referendum as ‘expert opinion’ – it merely shows what a deeply flawed, anti-democratic document the Irish Constitution is.

          2. Waiting.

            What is plan B for equality, if this disgusting referendum fails.?

      2. Steve, you assuming many things with no basis in reality. You seem to have an impression of 1970′s Ireland,choking on the clutches of the catholic church.

        All signs point to a good result on the referendum but if not there are several options open to the government. What you cannot seem to grasp is a very simple concept. If legislation were put through now then the supreme court would strike it down, the government want to leave the religious right no leave to appeal and deny equal marriage.

        Contrary to your ramblings, this will make equal marriage in Ireland stronger than many countries as it will be protected by our constitution.

        1. So what are these options then in case the referendum fails?

          It’s a very reasonable question that no-one seems to be able to answer.

          1. Steve, I see you ignored every other response to your original post and still focus on ‘PLAN B’.

            It also is quite simple, in the unlikely event the referendum fails then take it from there. If it happened it is only a short delay and not the 20 year hell you seem to think.

          2. But all you are doing is defending the disgraceful referendum.

            I accept that Ireland needs a vote (appalling as that is) to introduce equality.

            Now what specifically is this Plan B.

            You are being naive and short sighted in the extreme if tou think the result is a foregone conclusion.

        2. I am defending the right to our constitution only being changed by a referendum of the people. It is their to protect the people. If, for example, a far right party ever gained power in the future then it would be the amended constitution protecting lgbt people in marriages.

          I am not naive and there probably will be some nasty lies spread by ultra conservatives but here on the ground the support is there.

          1. SteveC no one is defending this “disgraceful referendum”. We are just saying Ireland cant introduce equal marriage without one. There is a massive difference!

    2. Ireland never had minority rights in our constitution. I presume you mean black rights etc. I take offence to ‘Mob Rule’. Irish people support it more than the UK and ‘mob rule’ the likes of the bnp, edl and ukip dont hold power in our country.

      Pro equality groups are not happy it cannot be legislated for but UNDERSTAND a referendum is the safest and only way forward. Something you can’t get your head around for some reason.

      ”It will be a dark day for Ireland when a minority’s equal…”?

      Want to finish that sentence?

  2. And even if this appalling referendum goes ahead and is successful, what do Irish LGBT groups plan to say to other EU countries who will use the Irish precedent to decide on equality matters in their countries.

    A referendum on marriage equality in Ireland could set back the equality movement in countries like Poland, Latvia, Italy, Greece, Romania, by DECADES.

    1. Steve there will be no ‘precedent’ as they can introduce legislation. I will repeat again and maybe you will get it: Ireland HAS to have a referendum. Simple as. Stop scare mongering.

      1. So you acknowledge that if the referendum fails then gay people will be 2nd class citizens for about 20 years more?

        1. No. That is simply not true. Steve you seem to have taken the tactics that the religious right used in the UK. Lies and scare mongering.

          There are actually a lot of us working on making sure this referendum passes. Give us and the Irish people a bit of credit. We support it more than the UK does.

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