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Jamaica: 17-year-old ‘chopped and stabbed’ to death in homophobic attack

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  1. Robert in S. Kensington 23 Jul 2013, 2:36pm

    About time there was a review of Commonwealth membership. Boot Jamaica out and cut off all financial aid, immediately.

    1. Denis from Ottawa 23 Jul 2013, 3:48pm

      A sad situation in Jamaica. I don’t think that would solve anything. It would be best if the Commonwealth actually had an enforceable human rights treaty that all member nations were required to adopt.

      1. Actually the Commonwealth does have a human rights treaty, but this specifically excludes LGBT people. Clearly the commonwealth does not regard us as human. In fact most commonwealth countries persecute lgbt people so this terrible act is entirely in keeping with the organisation’s values.

      2. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 8:08pm

        Unfortunately countries in the Commonwealth go to conferences and vote on these issues – the very people who don’t have LGBT rights in their country and are homophobic and don’t want LGBT rights, so until more countries become less homophobic there is a stalemate – not sufficient momentum to get LGBT rights added.

        In theory if nothing changes in the way they vote this could last indefinitely. It’s not like in Europe, where judges on the ECHR and in the Council of Europe, take a dispassionate legal view based on evidence and facts and then decide on rights issues.

        Let’s hope that cutting aid to some countries will focus their minds in the right direction. Or maybe the Commonwealth’s time is up and it should be dissolved.

    2. How about a sympathetic word for the child that was murdered?

  2. Mindless, former-colonial biblically-inspired laws have made Jamiaca one of the most homophobic places on the planet. Robert (above) is right. Hit ‘em where it hurts. In the pocket. Personally, I’ve always believed that the more homophobic someone is, the more likely it is that they are ‘in denail’ about their own sexuality. So, Jamaica – we KNOW why you’re homophobic.

    1. The sheer ignorance that surrounds Jamaica around anything they deem as a threat, specifically homosexuality for some old colonial reason, that is now enmeshed in the already problematic island. The reactions are extreme and we need to act with that same level of power to make any impact. The economy is already weak , so I’m not sure where we hit them. Perhaps tourism as that seems to be the only thriving industry there. I say we abandon the island itself and encourage the rest of the world to do so.

  3. Another anti-British (xenophobic, and faintly racist) sneer from PN about the ‘colonial past’ laws. Listen, PN staffers; if these laws are still on the statute books then these INDEPENDENT countries have so decided. If you have no respect for British people, try having some for the independence of those homophobic Commonwealth countries who have freely chosen to keep these laws. Grow up. Stop the sixth form politicking.

    1. It’s not anti-British, nor xenophobic, nor faintly racist, nor a sneer. It’s a fact, it adds a bit of historical context. Our country as an imperial force helped to foment many social problems in its then colonies. Understanding where both laws and attitudes come from in those countries helps to inform and compare strategy and progress amongst them.

    2. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 3:52pm

      If they wanted to have some self-respect they’d stop using OUR Colonial-era hate-filled religious-based laws in THEIR country. They aren’t acting independently from us, but are still colonists, living under the laws we gave them, but which we have since ditched ourselves. They are just too backward, narrow-minded and moronic to change them, despite the fact they are signed up to international agreements.

      We know these Colonial-era laws were wrong and we’ve changed – they are hundreds of years behind us in terms of their the state of advancement in their society. It’s still just a desert island that is best avoided until they reach enlightenment. It’s still has savages, as this proves. No wonder so many Jamaicans came over here – to escape a backwards nature of Jamaican society. I would certainly never dream of going to such a hell-hole. If fact, if I was Jamaican and living here I’d be ashamed to say where I came from – I’d probably lie and pick somewhere else.

      1. backward, moronic , savages ……not remotely condescending ,colonial or racist.

        1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 5:16pm

          They certainly haven’t kept up with world opinion – thus “backward”. Only “savages” do this to another human being – what word would you like me to use? You chose one you think is appropriate and I’ll consider it.

          Carrying on like this is “moronic” given the state of understanding and knowledge the world possesses, it’s as if they don’t want to understand and don’t want to learn. Do they even have computers and the Internet? Ofcourse they do, but they aren’t willing to explore knowledge and understand other people. Makes me wonder why I bother trying to fathom religious people or other cultures and ethnic groups – why should I bother when you have a whole island of Jamaicans who don’t bother.

          My comment was meant to be condescending, although my ex Black Jamaican-born boyfriend might have something to say about me being a racist :-p Mind you, I didn’t know Malcolm was a Jamaican name ! :D He has a plot of land in Saint Lucia but I would be surprised if he ever went back.

          1. again …condescending colonial and racist !!!!

          2. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 5:53pm

            stepol, you mean you lost the argument and weren’t man enough to fess up. You could have suggested using the word “barbaric” instead of “savages”, although when I checked the dictionary “savages” was the correct term.

            I would use the same term black or white people doing this to a black or white LGBT kid, anywhere in the world.

            If you check my other posts today you’ll see that I asked whether the UK government would ever apologise for Section 377 of the Penal Code in the many countries where it was inserted in to their laws – this was an egregious act against LGBT people across the planet – so I’m for apologising for our colonial past, not in trying to defend it – it’s indefensible.

          3. That was a bizzarre little comment which seemed to end with you can’t be a racist because you have slept with a black Jamaican called Malcolm, smiley face!

          4. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 6:37pm

            Joss, my point is I find men attractive irrespective of what their skin colour is, where they come from — I really don’t care about any of those things.

            I didn’t just sleep with Malcolm, we were lovers, and it lasted about 2-3 years (it was long ago). I was just thinking whilst I was preparing tea that if Civil Partnerships (or equal marriage) had been available back in 1995 would I have asked him to marry me? At the time I’m pretty sure I would have.

            I was just pointing out the fact that calling me “racist” is pretty wide of the mark. I don’t mind being called that, I’m not getting all upset and indignant, it is simply an opinion, and one which is incorrect.

          5. Gulliveruk , im not interested in your other posts ..all im doing is commenting on your posts on this thread….which are condescending colonial and racist .
            I would suggest you read some Steve Biko, his teachings about the use of language as a form of oppression might just make you think !!

          6. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 7:29pm

            stepol, what I find oppressive is when an anti-gay mob chops and stabs a 17 year old to death because they disagree with his innate sexual orientation.

            That strikes fear in the LGBT community not only in Jamaica, but further afield. It’s akin to terrorism.

            You haven’t listened or absorbed anything from my posts, I don’t know if that’s because you’re being deliberately obtuse, but I can’t waste any more effort on you. So far you’re been wrong on every count. If you make a claim you should be prepared to prove it, thus far you have totally failed to prove either of your offensive assertions about me.

        2. Jamaican society is backward. You are desperately and Inappropriately Playing the race card(hoping this will shut down criticism of this country’s human rights abuses)

    3. JackAlison 24 Jul 2013, 2:15am

      Its not just about laws
      Its the culture of violence, brutality and vigilantisim that is unacceptable in these backwater countires.
      Cameroon zimbabwe and others use LGBTI ppl. as wedge politics to deflect there own inadequacies as lawful law abiding governments
      watch the war criminal Blair interviewed by tamisin in the Guardian
      Jt is sickining that this homophobe he is supporting wion a nobel peace prize
      at least president Obama is speaking out

      http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012/mar/19/nobel-peace-prize-law-homosexuality

    4. I think it’s fundamentally a matter of effective human rights standards. People have a right not to be lynched for being gay. People have a right to be openly gay, and not face violence or discrimination for it.

  4. Anti_fascist_ 23 Jul 2013, 3:13pm

    Boycot Jamaica !

  5. In a few decades, countries from the commonwealth will be called forward to explain why they didn’t do more to stop this genocide. I look forward to their answer.

    1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 3:53pm

      I look forward to their leaders being tried for crimes against humanity.

  6. ..this isn’t surprising at all, Jamaica is one of the most uptight, nasty and fascists countries in the World–I damn those men who committed this heinous crime to hell, literally…

  7. How are they going to explain this genocide to their grand-children, I wonder…

  8. That child deserves justice!!! He didn’t attack anyone, he was attacked and brutally murdered by a group. If the police and courts don’t find the murderers and prosecute them we will cancel our trip there. We will also create a public campaign to boycott the country. Guaranteed!!

    1. Why would you need to cancel your trip over there?surely you were`nt thinking of going there in the first place?

    2. johnny33308 24 Jul 2013, 3:38pm

      Why in the world would you spend LGBT money in a place so detrimental to Our People? WTF is wrong with you? You’re like a Jew for Hitler! Wake up! You should have already started such a boycott, long ago! Stop providing financial support to those who murder YOUR OWN people!!! DUH!
      If LGBT people do not stop funding the very people who would murder us all, then we deserve to perish for our utter stupidity! So go ahead, take your ‘holiday’ in Jamaica then!

  9. Where is the condemnation of this barbaric act from Messrs. Welby and Semtanu?

    They are keen to condemn homosexuals but not their murderers.

    What kind of ‘christians’ are they?

    1. Robert in S. Kensington 23 Jul 2013, 4:53pm

      Don’t hold your breath. Sentamu had the gall to acknowledge that we’ve been on the receiving end of their discrimination during second reading of the Marriage Bill in the Lords, yet none of them have suggested an official apology to gay people in England and Wales. The CoE was a fervent supporter and player in the criminalisation of homosexuality as well as the infamous Section 28 led by Baroness Knight who went on a tirade in the Lords against the Marriage Bill with tacit support of her comments by six Anglican bishops sitting on the front benches two of whom happened to be Sentamu and Welby.

  10. A violent and pointless death – so sad. I really don’t understand why anyone would feel threatened by this young person. The killers and those who pointed him out must be grossly insecure.

  11. I don’t know why anyone would ever want to go on holiday in Jamaica, yet lots of people see it as this ‘island paradise’. I know people from Jamaica who’ve been raised in Britain, they still have their Jamaican accents. Even they say that when they visit Jamaica everyone knows they’re English, their accent sounds English to them, even though it sounds Jamaican to us. They also say that this noticeable difference with their accent makes them far more likely to get mugged or beat up. These are Jamaicans speaking about their own island.

    1. Yes visit Jamaica you DONT go off the complex without an escort and all complexes are protected by armed security.

      I dont understand why 3 generation people talk as if they are Jamaican.

  12. no one will do anything -to spineless and scared of being called racist.

    What a really sad story -poor guy.

    Here in the Uk there is an issue with Jamaicans abusing gay people and everyone looks the other way for the same reason scared of being called racist.

    1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 6:23pm

      If some people are abusing gay people here;
      - if it’s in school that should be reported to the school and action taken. If they take no action report them to the DfE and police and Stonewall.
      - if it happens in the workplace that should be dealt with by HR
      - if it happens in the street, contact the police, tell Stonewall, report it

      Homophobic abuse is a crime in this country – this isn’t Jamaica.

      If I saw homophobic abuse occurring anywhere I intervene faster than a speeding bullet, regardless. I don’t tolerate bullying anywhere.

      Abuse of gay people is as abhorrent as abuse of people of a different skin colour – both are wrong – I tolerant neither. But we should never be concerned about criticising someone’s abusive behavior – their skin colour is irrelevant. In this case this is a black on black hate crime – while in this country most crime is white on white.

      1. I didn’t mention colour anywhere – there IS a issue with Jamaicans who have an issue with gay people just look at all eh dance hall artist not so long ago – who uses the term batty man.

  13. John in Toronto Canada 23 Jul 2013, 5:41pm

    Christianity has a hold on Jamaica like nobody’s business. You can’t question “tribalistic dogma”… they don’t “think”. It’s not a matter of “am I being Christ-like”. It’s a matter of self-righteous indignation that deludes them into thinking they’re fighting against evil. They don’t know that they ARE the evil.

    1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 6:29pm

      I always find that so ironic. Black people were treated as sub-human and only worthy as slaves due to Christian beliefs, and having managed a proud defeat of that terrible crime, many had already succumbed to religious indoctrination and taken up the very religion which subjugated their lives and those of their ancestors. Christianity never was their religion – wrong region – another colonial implant that’s supplanted their own ancient customs and beliefs.

      It would be interesting to know how faith is surviving there, i.e. is it on the decline in young people like it is everywhere else? Where is the true polling data about their opinion on equality for LGBT people?

      1. John in Toronto Canada 23 Jul 2013, 7:09pm

        I doubt that faith is on the decline unless their education system has improved. Religion fills that void too. Jamaica has more Christian faith churches per capita than any country in the world. Supernatural doctrine is a virus, and it’s epidemic.

      2. Islam is not in the decline.

        1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 8:50pm

          Religious groups all claim many more real followers than they have. Muslims claim their children, yet many children from households with Muslim parents in the UK don’t follow Islam in later life, just like those children brought up with Christian parents often ditch their ‘imposed’ religion. Catholics claim all and delete none, even if you say you’ve left the Catholic faith they’ll still count you, and Mormons are perhaps the most dishonest of all, performing fake baptisms of dead people who were never Mormons in the first place.

          If you just look at the actual real figures on church attendance in this country – it’s tiny. Look at Scotland, there are more Humanist weddings than Catholic ones.

          Young people mostly think for themselves and they have an absolutely enormous resource in The Internet, and they have no need to guidance from a 3000-year old book with authenticity and credibility issues.

        2. John in Toronto Canada 23 Jul 2013, 11:09pm

          No. Islam is a huge wave of ignorance that continues to grow and oppress masses worldwide. It’s a relatively young faith and it’s followers haven’t recognized it’s folly or it’s evil yet. As environments and habitats continue to decay and food and water become more sought-after in the future, I think Muslims are going to cause an awful lot of pain and oppression in this little world of ours. I don’t know if it’s true or not, but I have read that Muslims outnumber Christians 3:1, and they’re no-more evolved in their thinking than their Christian counterparts when it comes to progressive thought. Hopefully their misogyny will be the wedge that makes people stop and think eventually.

  14. Terrible tragedy, but i’m not shocked. I went to school with over 80% pupils who were ethnic minority or majority more like. Especially those, that were 2nd/3rd generation caribbean /African all spoke pseudo patois/jafaican . Their language was extremely homophobic/misogynistic . They revelled with delight in deaths of gay people, especially those murdered or tortured in the most grotesque way. These people are british born , but due to multiculturalism , have remained segregated and are unwilling to tolerate british values.
    Also, to give an idea of how stupidly homophobic Jamaicans are, Jamaica has a serious problem with diagnosis and treatment for prostate cancer etc as Jamaican men feel it would make them a “chi chi man” to even get checked.

    1. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 8:58pm

      Young people with an identity crisis often latch on to things which “appear” to have symbolism of strength, the strength these insecure young people lack themselves. Little men trying to be big men, and in the process hurting others, something they will later deeply regret. That’s why some children bully, trying to pretend they are strong when in fact they are insecure about themselves.

      But in this case what you describe is a total failure of our education system, and that is a failure of government, teachers, schools as a whole, and ultimately society itself. These children should have never got to the stage where they picked on this area and thought that was acceptable. Children and young people are also unaware of the exact boundary lines and constantly testing where those lines are – it’s part of growing up. They are exploring their own cultural roots, but in the process they need to know all the good and the harm of that particularly culture, and also reflect that ….

    2. GulliverUK 23 Jul 2013, 9:05pm

      … they are not living in Jamaica, they are living and were born in the UK, and their culture is actually hybrid, a mixture of ethnic originals and British culture, and more importantly that we have laws in this country which forbid incitement to hatred. If they want to end up in prison and be someone’s bitch, fine, but with an attitude like that they won’t be able to work for most UK employers.

      I have a feeling it’s much about growing up, testing boundaries, insecurities, etc., than genuine hatred of people who are gay.

      As for the problem with prostate cancer, let them die in ignorance if that is their wish, or … if I was their leader … I’d have mine done, televised, and show everybody there was nothing to be afraid of. THEN, I’d start on the women, I’d get them to pester their husbands and lovers endlessly until they gave in and had it checked :)

    3. You don’t need to be Jamaican (we are all talking about black men here to be honest are we not) to be scared of going to get checked for prostate cancer. There are a lot of British men (we are talking about white men here to be honest are we not?) who also do not go and get checked for prostate cancer.

      At the end of the day, most men, regardless of colour, or sexual orientation, do not like been checked for prostate cancer.

  15. I believe faith or people’s lack of faith is waning in Jamaica like many places. There is a deeply religious movement and always has been but that seems to be dying with the elderly population. I have to say those people were and are also homophobic to the core. I am not condoning any crime and I am so hoping that some justice happen to the people responsible, though I doubt it. It seems that once you have been enslaved and denigrated as a people you look to release some of the pain and insecurity you feel onto others. Some know this as internalised racism or in some cases internalised homophobia. Jamaica has a scarred history and has left scarred people. I don’t know what it will take for this to unravel , but I hope I live to see it. My heritage is Jamaican and I have not been back to visit my family for some time now. I can’t justify giving my hard earned to such a government that allows these violations and too many deaths of many beautiful LGBT people to happen.

  16. We can start by stopping any foreign aid to this wretched country. Hopefully a hurricane will wipe them all out like in Haiti.
    Secondly, we can pressure cruise companies to find other ports in places that are not homophobic., Once the money stops, you’ll see them marching in Gay Pride Parades.
    I think if the public starts complaining to cruise companies about going to these dangerous places, things will change.
    In the end, we can just vacation in Key West or South Florida where the beaches are great and LGBT people have legal protections.

    1. “A hurricane will wipe them all out like Haiti “. Come on that’s just nonsense. Don’t you think many innocents will die, not to mention many LGBT people! We are talking about homophobic culture in Jamaica, and not all Jamaicans. It’s a thin line I agree, but a line all the same.

    2. Yeah, Florida with its enlightened attitudes to race and guns, as seen in recent events. So desirable so long as us gays have our beaches, isn’t it?

      And who gives a toss about LGBT Jamaicans, after all?

      [SARCASM ALERT]

    3. I’m sure many ignorant people have hold a similar view about Trans men and women. But you don’t have a problem with that do you?

    4. Don’t bother with Key West.

      There’s a church on every corner now and the gay scene is all but chased out. I was there last year with my bf and expected to show him the fun from when I was there last (and single) but no, it’s all gone. It’s now a G-Rated religious Disneyland, just ask the local gays, the few, who have stayed.

      South Beach, on the other hand, is still thriving! But there too are the signs to a latin (homophobic) shift.

  17. Why do let these people emigrate to Canada.
    It’s said they bring a wonderful culture to Canada to share with us:–is this some of it.

    1. John in Toronto Canada 23 Jul 2013, 10:56pm

      You betcha that homophobia is some of it. : ( But truthfully, I’ve met some wonderful Jamaican people here in Toronto who aren’t full of hate for LGBT people or anyone else. Admittedly, it’s usually the women who are more accepting and empathetic.

  18. sickening. May you receive justice my sibling, RIP.

  19. johnny33308 24 Jul 2013, 3:31pm

    If you know anything about the Caribbean, then you know this is so common that it is not really ‘news’ at all, and happens quite regularly. Stay the hell away from ANY Caribbean country if you’re LGBT, and value your life, period! The Caribbean ‘countries’ are worse than Russia and rather like Uganda, Cameroon, etc.

    1. A young man dies and all you can add to the conversation is the usual thoughtless rubbish I come to expect from you on subjects like this. A hole.

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