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David Cameron: ‘Gay marriage is something I believe we can be proud of as a country’

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  1. Bill Cameron 17 Jul 2013, 9:50pm

    Well done to all who brought this about. With all its flaws, the new law for England and Wales is a huge step in the right direction.

    I just hope the Scottish Parliament won’t dither too long and pass its own legislation pretty quickly.

    1. When the UK marriage bill was mooted, it appears that the cisGLB movement stopped beating around the bush and just openly said “We’re going to take something away from trans people when we advance our own rights.” Because this bill takes away trans people’s agency in attaining a GRC (never mind that the GRC is a step down from actually amending the birth certificate) and places full veto power in the hands of their spouse.

      A spouse who may well be hostile to the idea of them transitioning. This isn’t just a passive-aggressive way to get a divorce, I’m sure there are legal tricks that can be pulled to stretch out a divorce for years in the UK just as there are in the US, so a hostile spouse could theoretically prevent a trans woman (let’s be realistic here, most of those affected are trans women) from having her documentation in order for *years.*

      Thanks, cissexuals. It’s really nice to know how much you care about making our lives really, really miserable.

      1. Well a couple of things. First of all it isn’t a divorce, it is an annulment, and there is a time limit in which is must be completed.

        If the trans spouse thinks the other person is taking too long then they can initiate the annulment themselves at any time.

        And secondly I think it is right that someone gets a choice whether they want to carry on a marriage with someone of a different gender. Personally I would never, ever, want to be married to a woman and if my husband decided to transition I would want that annulment first so that I could go my grave never having been married to a person of the opposite sex.

      2. I’m confused. I’m a transwoman in a loving and happy marriage. Would I get legal status as female and remaining married or would I still have to divorce to get the Gender Certificate?

        1. Jock S. Trap 18 Jul 2013, 8:03am

          You can now remain married.

        2. You no longer get a divorce. What Kate is complaining about is that your spouse would be able to annul your marriage, if they wanted to, before you could get your gender certificate.

          If they both refused to annul it or say they were happy not to annul it then you could annul it yourself and get the certificate.

  2. I am not a Tory, have never voted Tory in my life, but I salute Cameron for doing this and I thank his party for standing behind him in making Britain a better place.
    Thank you.

    1. You mean you thank the Labour and LibDems for making this happen.

      Only a minority of Tory MPs think we deserve equality.

      We have equality in spite of, and not because of the Tory Party.

      We must remember this at the next election.

      Find out how your MP voted, If they voted against equality then help in the effort to get rid of them from their seat.

      1. Peter & Michael 18 Jul 2013, 5:49am

        And indeed those that abstained, including our Conservative MP, he also voted against giving same-sex information in schools. He will not have our vote at the next election, nor ukip.

      2. Jock S. Trap 18 Jul 2013, 6:26am

        OK but let’s not ever forget that this was given to us Thanks to a Tory Prime Minister. You may not agree with the party but without it we may not be here now as Gordon Brown didn’t agree with Marriage Equality.

        It’s very important to make sure David Cameron goes down in History as the Tory leader that gave us this equality and fought against those in his party (and others) to make sure it went through.

        A lot of other leaders may have crumbled and given in to it’s own bigots but Mr Cameron showed true leadership and it the reason we stand proud today.

        1. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 9:01am

          Well put.

          Please readers….Think about this.

          Without David Cameron this would not have happened…..Honestly.

          To me the man stood firm when his party gave him stick. Other parties rallied around so that we were fairly sure marriage would happen.

          That takes leadership, politics, parnershipping, reading public sentiment and to me STATESMANSHIP.

          Who would you have at your side in our hour of need Mr Cameron or another. He made this happen…..others helped but he alone put marriage on the agenda.

          1. Indeed.

            WHat a pity David Cameron is the leader of such a monstrously hateful, disgusting and bigoted party though.

            Cameron’s qualities do not negate the monstrous bigotry of the Tory Party.

            What a pity he is not the leader of a party which respects human rights.

            Sadly the majority of his party are neo-fascist scum.

  3. Pavlos Prince of Greece 17 Jul 2013, 10:00pm

    And we can be proud on You, David. Well done indeed. Thank you, Mr Cameron !

  4. Yes, well done to all who helped pass this Act.
    It is not however a time to relax and think all is done, we need to make sure the remaining inequalities are ironed out in the reviews.
    We also need to keep our eyes wide open on their tinkering with the Equalities Act – they are trying to remove the “public sector equality duty” which ensures public authorities (that means ALL government) must have regard to how their actions affect Equality, and that includes US.
    They also want to scrap the Human Rights Act so the courts have less powers to hold them to account, what a surprise?
    Entrenching Human Rights (well as much as anyone can with our unwritten constitution) is one of the jewels done by the last government, They also did some awfull things too, like RIPA. And this present lot are enlarging the number and unaccountability of religious schools.
    Lots still to do.
    But for now i’m going to share a few beverages, Cheers.

  5. Jacob Dugan-Brause 17 Jul 2013, 10:34pm

    We left our former home because laws barred same-sex marriage. I am a citizen now in Britain; my (soon to be!} husband is Irish.

    Thank you, Mr Cameron for fighting for equality and a better life for us, for lgbt youth and for generations not yet born.

  6. Jan Bridget 17 Jul 2013, 11:04pm

    Have you seen the BBC are welcoming comments on the passing of the bill: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23338279

  7. Many thanks to Prime Minister Cameron for showing the world, especially conservatives, that marriage equality is not a narrowly-defined “left-wing” issue, but a matter of human rights to be acknowledged from across the political spectrum.

  8. Ok, from tomorrow onwards it’s ‘Marriage’, not ‘Gay Marriage’. We don’t have straight marriage or black marriage or any other such thing. If we start using separate language we’ll be snatching defeat from the jaws of victory.

    1. With any luck, as the U.K. is taking until next year to implement the actual marriages, there will be time for everyone to plan tasteful weddings in a manner comparable to other weddings and the matter will have settled into a sense of normalcy for everybody (except for the crazed bigots who lose sleep over this topic.).

      1. Tasteful weddings? No thanks.

        I want a Jordan style wedding with tiaras and go-go boys.

        In a registry office near a church.

    2. Tim Chapman 18 Jul 2013, 1:32pm

      As far as I am concerned, it’s not “marriage”, it’s “same-sex marriage”. Marriages are legalised by the Marriage Act whereas same-sex marriages are legalised by the Marriage (Same Sex Couples) Act. And it won’t be ”marriage” until the practical differences are removed – most importantly (to me) survivor pension entitlements discrimination. I will either refer to it as “marriage”, nor have one, until this is fixed.

      I take your point, though, it is not “gay marriage” and for me it never was.

      1. Tim Chapman 18 Jul 2013, 1:35pm

        … neither refer to it … – edit function, please, PN.

  9. I have to say a big thanks to Cameron for fighting for this in the face of huge opposition from his own parliamentary party and from grass roots Tories. Let us not forget that over half of Tory MP’s voted against SSM.

    Cameron has won my respect for what he has done, however I will still NEVER vote Tory. The party of the rich the privileged and the bigots.

    1. And a party where only a minority of MPs believe we are equal citizens.

      1. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 8:50am

        And a leader who made it happen. Please i do get it but struggle that we will take Marriage without a proper THANK YOU. Yes and maybe understanding what this means to us (not just a party but EQUALITY which will ripple around the planet) you could maybe just once vote for Cameron. His own party pushed back but he stood firm.

        I’d have him on my side any day. I would be honoured to meet him and shake his and many others hands to say thank you. I for one will vote Tory next time around.

        (Of course we all must do what our conscience dictates.)

        1. “you could maybe just once vote for Cameron”

          If elections were popularity contests then yes, I’d certainly rather vote for Cameron than Clegg or Milliband. However, when so many of the Tory party are odious, bigoted scum, and when many of their policies are despicable, or downright disastrous, I don’t think anyone should vote to say ‘thanks’. This is not a one policy party, you cannot ask for one policy voting from the electorate.

          1. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 11:14am

            By your logic then minority rights should be off the agenda! (and marriage would never have happened)

            Life, yours and mine is about compromise.

            There are many policies of all parties I don’t agree with but I can compromise. Do you honestly believe your comments above. If so you have a fixed view of life.

            I hope I can remain flexible in life and look at the bigger picture. No party is perfect and if you are still voting because your parents voted that way then it’s time to educate yourself on current matters UK and worldwide. We do not live in a vacuum and others have viewpoints that we should listen to, understand and then make up our own minds. I’d rather not follow dogma…like religion does.

            How about writing to the Conservative head office thanking him so his party can see that the country understands what he did for a minority.

          2. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 11:44am

            “However, when so many of the Tory party are odious, bigoted scum, and when many of their policies are despicable, or downright disastrous, ”

            Ok maybe I’m wrong on this but your quote above shows a very closed mind. I don’t personalise anyone but I will find a way to thanks Mr Cameron.

            How do we as a very diverse community come together to say THANK YOU. Not just a two line note but something that will help Mr Cameron, his party (modernise) and this country.

            For he has shown the world what England / Wales can do. We yes you and I will live richer lives for this Act.

            Believe me I have paid for being gay by many labour supporters etc. but now and future generations will never know our past. They will walk equally with society.

            Now how do we say thank you properly????

            Please everyone comment!

            Joss I respect your views. i just don’t agree thats all. I wish you well.

          3. You have accused me of saying something or inferring something I did not. You either willfully misrepresented my intentions or you need to reread what I wrote.

            I do not vote the same way as my parents. You know neither myself nor my parents. My mother voted Tory in the last election. She regrets it as she is a teacher and one of the Tory parties main problems is Michael Gove.

            You should not vote for a party leader you should vote for an MP that best represents you in parliament. David Cameron is not my MP. My current Tory MP is a swivel eyed loon (I believe that’s the technical term now). If I vote for him to say thank you to David Cameron, who as I said before would win my vote if I was dumb enough to vote for the leader of any current part, I would be endorsing his homophobic voting record and general ineptitude.

            The rest of your comment seems to be a bizarre little rant about thank you letters, completely ignoring your original point, (the one to which I was replying previously)

          4. cont.

            where you said to SteveC, “you could maybe just once vote for Cameron”.

            You cannot vote for Cameron if you do not live in his constituency. I’m not prepared to move to Oxfordshire but obviously I can’t speak for Steve.

            You keep going on about Cameron showing the world what we can do blah blah blah, this is a coalition government, I’d quite honestly like to know why you don’t think we should be saying thank you to Nick Clegg or voting Lib Dem. The Liberal Democrats are traditionally more inclined to support gay and minority rights, I can’t see the Tories pursuing this policy during this government without the Lib Dems.

            *Above it should say “current party” not “current part” and I haven’t read the rest properly so it’s probably littered with errors, apologies to any pedants

        2. Colin – can I ask you a question.
          What constituency are you a member of?
          Does it have a Tory MP at the moment.
          How did your MP vote on the marriage equality vote.I
          If they voted ‘yes’ then by all means vote for them.
          If they voted ‘no’ and you vote for him/her you are rewarding neo-fascist bigotry.

          Never forget – a majority of David Cameron’s party thinks you are a 2nd class citizen unworthy of equal human rights.

          1. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 11:24am

            Thanks for above SteveC
            I am in Islington North, Labour who voted for Marriage

            I do not vote for any fixed party. I vote on policies at the time and believe in social capitalism. I come from a rough council estate in Scotland, am one of 5 kids and a disabled mum. Today all of us own our own homes, have had education, work, pay taxes and I have many next generation who are doing the same.

            This country have provided me with education, health care etc. I have worked all over the world and used to be critical of UK. Today i love her. Best country in the world. But unless this country earns wealth from trading with other countries all the good in this country will recede as there will be no money to pay for it. If you buy Chinese made goods you send your money, jobs etc overseas so how then can a government provide health, education. No party and certainly not Labour has a solution. We first need to give the masses a basic economics lesson.

            Talking about neo-fascist bigotry is not

          2. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 11:30am

            helpful but you are allowed your own opinion. Be assured and i listened to much of the debate in HOC and HOL. I heard stuff that made me angry again and again.

            Still and you have to give Mr Cameron this…at potentially great cost by those who live in the past he put this on the agenda and made it happen.

            Now do we just walk away…..I am not that shallow. If someone stands by me I will stand by them. However that is not blindly…How do we find a way to make our thanks real….How do we show those who stood against this Act that this man matters and they should be grateful for his leadership….

            Help me find a way to educate the masses without putting down a party. Yes what I would wish is that the Tory party would deselect some MP’s and put more open candidates forward before the next election.

            I’ve said my bit and you are free to disagree.

            i wish you well.

        3. Don’t bury your head in the sand colin, you remind me of the many gay people in the 80’s who whole heatedly gave Thatcher support, even in the face of section 28.

          They never did get it. MOST Torys are anti gay, we will have to wait for this generation of bigots to leave politics before you see real change.

          Most of what Cameron and co have done is pretty odious by anyone’s measure. If your wealthy great have a tax cut if your poor pay more tax. We are not all in it together.

          And if you actually watched the debates in Parliament. Some of the comments from Tories where outrageous.

          1. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 1:11pm

            MarkB I live in the now not the 80’s. We have all grown up since then.

            Look deeper than headlines and educate ourselves. Capitalism works on profit. It’s not perfect and is abused. However the capitalists can go to any country in the world and they take their money and jobs with them.

            So tax incentives are used to keep capital, brains and jobs here.

            Communism does not work. Socialism does not create wealth on which The NHS, Education and state benefits are paid.

            I am happy to pay my taxes. If you don’t like our system tell me of a better country who has it working your way?

            I am a futurist at heart. Yesterday is gone I can do nothing about it. I can change today slightly but boy can I create tomorrow.

            Most Tories are not anti gay. Most don’t express an opinion that’s all. Banks, the law, accountancy, the arts are full of gay people….middle class professions. We do not bleat about a party…we by our actions, our lives etc fight for change.

            Now like I did when i

          2. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 1:18pm

            was young get out there, get an education and a skill and claim your part of prosperity. I did it so why can’t most people……They are either scared to push themselves or too lazy.

            Create jobs…I did. I worked long hours 15 hour days and loved it. Today at 52 i have options to go where i please and I want that for everyone.

            It’s time for me to stop blogging here and go do productive stuff for my neighbours etc. I started with nothing and worked at 12. That job taught me the cycle of money. It was more than money…It was life skills

            Be good to yourself mate and best wishes.

  10. Why do I get the feeling PN is deleting a LOT of comments from trans people JUSTLY outraged over the fact that the marriage law was LITERALLY passed by taking ALL rights away from trans people and putting them in the hands of potentially-vengeful transphobic spouses?

    1. Paranoia?

      1. It’s not paranoia if there’s a pattern backing it up. Or did you think the trans community would forget the fact that the laughably named Equality Bill 2010 made trans people’s rights subordinate to cis people’s prejudice?

        1. Oh go suck a lemon – it might make you less bitter.

  11. Indeed same sex marriage is something we can be proud of as a country.

    Is David Cameron ashamed of the fact that over 50% of his party’s MPs are neo-fascist homophobic scum who believe that gay people should be 2nd class citizens?

    Does David Cameron accept that not a single LGBT person in their right mind can vote for any of the 128 extremist Tory scumbags at the next election?

    Does he apologise for regarding our equal civil rights as a matter of conscience.

    The good thing is that we now have a list of Tory bigots who we must try to get rid of at the next election.

  12. Thank you, Dave, for making history and standing up for what’s right. Your support as the leader of a conservative party has sent a powerful message to conservatives around the world. Well done!

  13. Kudos to David Cameron! but I do wish that people would use the term “Equal Marriage” or Marriage Equality” we are long past the term Gay Marriage! The very notion or reference of it, is what conjured and precipitated the bigoted and rebellious attitude of the church towards acceptance of this legislation by the similarly like minded.

  14. Jock S. Trap 18 Jul 2013, 6:20am

    Yes Well Done David Cameron.

    The journey wasn’t easy for Mr Cameron with too many of his backbenchers opposed but he stuck to his guns and showed true leadership.

    This country feels brighter and certainly prouder of late and I for one welcome it!

  15. GulliverUK 18 Jul 2013, 7:26am

    “next summer at the latest” – it certainly better not be. I was thinking early 2013, very early 2013. Next summer would be around 12 months away, and there is no credibility for such a delay. It prolongs the debate – which will continue on until marriages start happening. The government have misjudged here, most other places enable the bill and then a few weeks or months later are ready to start – we will not wait 12 whole months to start.

    Cameron has done a good job on this, but don’t spoil it with a not credible delay of 12 months. The Tory party need this to be fully bedded in and not be any issue at the next election – delaying it risks that.

    1. GulliverUK 18 Jul 2013, 7:28am

      Or even …. very early 2014 !!!! My mistake, but at least I’m living in 2012, not 1812 like some Tories :)

  16. I an certainly no Tory, but I admire the way that David Cameron (and the other part leaders) stood by his word on this – I’ll still be voting Green though!

  17. I’ve just read that it is going to take longer for the govt to sort out the conversion of CPs to marriages than just allowing gay couples to get married. So I’lll still be in a CP once others are allowed to get married. I’ve been “married” longer than these guys , over 25 yrs and I don’t see why I have to wait longer to get married simply becuase I’m in a CP at the moment. It’s not my fault the lab govt got it wrong in introducing CPs and not marriages and I don’t see why I have to be punished for that.

    It’s an outrageous delay. It’s going to take longer than a yr for this Act to take effect!!!! We can’t claim to be the 16th country to inroduce SSM and not actually allow people to get married for over another yr.

  18. Helge Vladimir Tiller 18 Jul 2013, 8:16am

    As a Norwegian citizen- living in Norway-My very deepest congratulations to The UK ! I’m proud of you, too. And I’m proud of all those wonderful persons making comments here in PinkNews. No one mentioned- no one forgotten ! But, there is a large BUT in my mind : I do hope that FULL RIGHTS for transgender people must be included, the sooner the better ! Something is missing here. Prejudices that needs to be worked with !

  19. Colin (London) 18 Jul 2013, 8:38am

    Dear Mr Cameron
    I wrote to you a long time ago now asking that somehow you push through a promise for a minority group who could not achieve Equality on there own.

    You and many others across the parties delivered this to us. To the day I die I will remember the last week and have joy in my heart. I hope that given a few months your party will recognise that you pulled your party and the English / Welsh public forward in a changing world. They (I hope) will realise that the world wants an inclusive society that you are a great statesman in the UK, Europe and on the world stage.

    It appears that generally society is with our Equality and that only religion lives in the past but I hope the gay community will show society we are just like them and will take our place in every way.

    I thank you from the bottom of my heart and hope the gay community will support you going forward to say THANK YOU.

  20. Helge Vladimir Tiller 18 Jul 2013, 8:54am

    Maybe I’m a bit ignorant, but in my happy mind for this New Law. And I am really happy on behalf of gay and lesbians in UK !! Can some transsexual or transgender person explain to me what they think is missing in this New situation. I consider their views to be of great importance ! Thank You !

  21. The PM seems well aware that the new law is still something of a compromise – he refers explicitly to ‘gay marriage’ rather than equal marriage, thereby maintaining a rhetorical separation between LGBTs and Everybody Else. He’s playing to the gallery there but I think we can give him that, he’s done very well to push the boundaries of equality as far as he has in the face of such venomous bigotry. Perhaps Ed Miliband will take us the whole way if he wins the next election or maybe that will be too soon for the parliamentary palate. Even if we have to wait for a bit of time to pass, there is now a clear need for a single act of parliament to tidy up all the various bits of legislation which govern marriage law in the UK, much as the Equality Act of 2010 codified all the legal paraphernalia concerned with equality which had collated over the years prior to 2010. This would provide the opportunity to go the whole way and finally provide marriage equality in the UK.

    1. What needs to happen is the implementation almost right away so there can be no doubt. Without wanting to piss on the parade giving opponents 12 months to find some twisted bizarre and sickening way to delay or block implementation is a very real concern – this is part of how they operate. This battle has been an assault on our lives, our health and well-being, and it’s intolerable not to implement it within the next few months. The battle must end now, if it’s law then we should start booking registry office ceremonies now.

      Stupidity beyond belief to come this far and then not actually “implement” the law. Let’s hope that Cameron gets the message because they said they would remove the lifetime ban on blood donations, but did nothing of the sort. By slight of hand they merely changed the wording – gay couples still cannot give blood regardless of their monogamous committed relationship – and that is a very serious betrayal.

  22. Midnighter 18 Jul 2013, 9:54am

    If this is indeed something to be proud of, why is it that coverage of the act being signed into law is distinctly absent from the BBC website since yesterday afternoon? Its not that it isn’t being featured, I can find no mention of it.

    I would have expected that they might be reporting in their usual sycophantic style on the Church’s silly statement, but even that seems absent.

    The last thing I saw on the subject was the passage through the third reading of the HoL, and even that short article was notable by a single and prominent subheading consisting entirely of the word “bulldozed”, which struck me as very misleading

    The BBC’s coverage of this has been far from “proud”, Mr Cameron.

    1. Turns out there is a short article if you can find it; currently only see a link via popular articles listing under Politics, so it seems only incidental that it is still linked. (This is the one with “bulldozed” prominently featuring, which is very similar to the HoL article).

      http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-23338279

  23. Perhaps we should thank this coalition and Mr Clegg, Mr Cameron, etc., when we see people actually getting married and marriage certificates being issued.

    A little incentive to get their arse in gear!

    1. I admit it. I want to see a gantt graph of all the steps and dependencies between now and the first marriages – I want to know what or whom is blocking this.

      Pension anomalies would be worked out separately since they are not related to same-sex marriage, but also include Civil Partnerships – and we wouldn’t suggest stopping people from getting a Civil Partnership until it was fixed would we?

      What else is there? Some forms at the registry office, staff training, very little at the HMRC since there should not be any real difference to how they treat Civil Partnerships. Religious groups can do their own thing – those that want to opt in would have already started working out the wording for the ceremonies. Oh yes, the EHRC need to give guidance to teachers. Advice to councils on the registration of premises, after which we will all be outraged because they will charge those religions that want to opt-in 10x what they charge a church to register for opposite-sex marriages.

  24. Robert in S. Kensington 18 Jul 2013, 12:17pm

    Gratitude to David Cameron for showing leadership, a rarity today in our Prime Ministers. Like him or not, he deserves an award for sticking his neck out and remaining resolute against the vicious opposition in his party by doing the decent thing. Kudos also to Nick Clegg without whom this would never have happened and to the majority in the Labour Party whose support of this Bill was crucial to its passage into law.

    Are we number 15 of 16? I see some saying 16. Last time I checked, France was the 14th.

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