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National AIDS Trust: New HIV risks for gay men who inject steroids and tanning agents

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  1. Samuel B. 8 Jul 2013, 6:09pm

    All this outfit ever does each and every time is spout the blooming obvious:- yet it never lobbies hard enough or with the required passion and vigour to facilitate the very changes in policies and behaviour it advocates for.

    In short it does the minimum required to justify its funding, but what difference has the NAT ever made to improving gay men’s health as opposed to commenting on it?

    A bunch of talking heads without legs:- and a flagrant waste of our tax payer pounds.

    1. factsandfigures 8 Jul 2013, 6:33pm

      This is not the only report, PN should also spread it catchment of information to include such reports as http://www.hsj.co.uk/Journals/2013/04/05/h/k/o/PH-Report-on-Commissioning-of-HCV-Services-for-PWID-April13.pdf

      1. factsandfigures 8 Jul 2013, 7:06pm

        Also should include NHS costs of around £6,000 per person for the treatment of HCV (12 months) and a treatment cost of HIV per peson around £8,000 per person/year.

  2. Diva Doll 8 Jul 2013, 6:22pm

    NAT is focused on policy, advocacy and prejudice across all institutions on the UK.

    Wrong battle Samuel B.

    1. Samuel B. 8 Jul 2013, 8:47pm

      Yes but what does NAT actually achieve?

      Why not have the guts to discuss the influences within the gay community that have actively and zealously been pushing weaker willed gay men into the loveless hard sex scene?

      But of course they wouldn’t dare suggest that THT’s hardcell.org.uk and its advocacy of bareback club nights at venues like Play Pit have been prime instigators for extreme and debased HIV-facilitating behaviours.

      Wrong battle indeed!

      The HIV sector has wantonly colluded in creating the very problems for which they then wantonly fail to deliver the solutions.

  3. Whilst it may be “blooming obvious” dear Samuel, the NHS & Local Authorities do not commission services based on anecdotal evidence. In the evidence based, health outcomes world we now live in hard data & statistics are required to justify expenditure.

    I have been saying for at least 2 yrs that the “silo” mentality we have between commissioners & service providers needs to stop – we need an holistic approach to tackle injecting drug use in MSM.

    Whilst I believe it is only a problem for a relatively small number of MSM, the surveillance evidence suggests the majority of new HIV infections are fueled by a small minority of undiagnosed MSM or those who do not remain virologically suppressed whilst using hard core drugs.

    The whole public health sector needs to work together to crack this one – funding is scarce, lets use it to it’s best advantage & target those most at risk.

    The worried well (Samuel B) do not need to be told to wear a condom or to be safe when injecting drugs!

    1. To clarify my last comment regarding the “worried well” (before anyone takes issue with it) the majority of MSM use condoms & do not inject drugs – I would estimate 80% of MSM consistently practice safer sex with casual sexual partners, if they didn’t we would have seen a far greater rise in new infections over time.

      We need to return to targeted risk reduction strategies that are intelligently focused on those most at risk – the majority of the population (including MSM) know that wearing a condom will keep them safe, what they don’t always appreciate is that an individual who consistently achieves viral suppression are the safer bet than those who have undiagnosed HIV, sero-sorting is a risky business in my view!

      Test regularly, get treatment (if necessary) & always play safe, that is the way to reduce new HIV infection rates.

      1. factsandfigures 8 Jul 2013, 7:09pm

        of interest http://hepatitiscnews.com/blog/2013/01/31/the-cost-of-hcv-in-the-uk/ and “The cost-effectiveness of testing for hepatitis C in former injecting drug users … The prevalence of HCV is thought to be around 0.4% in England and Wales.”

  4. It’s not the drugs, but the safe practice of not sharing needles…

    1. I agree with what you say about safe practice, but crystal meth, mephadrone & G are known to be much more potent than other street drugs & are more likely to be used during sex. Other street drugs such as E, K or Cocaine do not necessarily enhance sexual appetite (quite the reverse in fact) so the drugs have changed as have behaviours so I think we have to acknowledge this when looking at drug safety in the wider context.

  5. UglyGeezer 8 Jul 2013, 6:52pm

    At the risk (oh OK, flagrantly) being flippant.. The idea of a gaggle of orange gayers huddled around sharing needles has a touch of the comic about it (albeit a dreadfully dark comic).

    1. UglyGeezer 8 Jul 2013, 8:11pm

      Ooops.. What I said was bad.. I meant sharing needles for tanning products, not ‘just’ needles. I will get my coat :-(

  6. The image fetishes drug use. Looks like a porn film. Just Saying.

    You should show some images of what crystal meth can do to you……

    http://www.thegooddrugsguide.com/gallery/before-and-after-drug-abuse/crystal-meth-abuse/horrible-physical-transformation-after-crystal-meth-abuse.htm

    1. Colin (London) 8 Jul 2013, 10:48pm

      Very good point…thank you..

      I live in london and have to say the weekly mags are all about sex, drugs and rock and roll.

      We gay men have responsibility to ourselves, our sexual partners and community.

      I’m rapidly comming to the conclusion gay men should pay for medical treatments and HIV drugs. And if some choose to die it’s Darwinning. (Spelling)

      This is recreational. Yip hard words indeed. I have been no angel but kept a lid on my excesses, got checked and never had unprotected sex…ever.

      1. Good for you Colin, ain’t you the wholesome gay man!

        Sadly (& thankfully) not everyone is the same as you, & people acquire HIV in a variety of circumstances, unprotected anal sex being be such route.

        Think about your statement from a public health point of view & then re-assess if you beleive making people pay for their treatment is cost effective in a humane society.

        Why not take your point of view one step further & withdraw free at the point of use NHS treatment from those who smoke, are overweight, or have liver failure through alcohol use.

        If you are sexually active there is always a risk of acquiring HIV, Hep C or other STI’s – I would think on if I were you, many people get unexpected positive HIV test results.

        1. Colin (London) 9 Jul 2013, 7:47am

          You are absolutely right and I acknowledge my comments are in many ways wrong. So thanks for bringing me to account.

          However why should the rest of society pay for a small groups excesses. You can buy drugs in almost any club in London. Yes people make mistakes but is knowing you are going out to score drugs get off your face and have unabandoned sex responsible. Surely major changes are required in
          1. The gay media
          2. Gay pubs and clubs
          3. Gay saunas
          Gay people need to take responsibility and our forgiving society is being abused. £6,000 a year for life. Who should pay??????

          This is how the NHS will end.

          Half my friends are HIV positive and I love my mates. I set up a play room at home as I noticed all the unprotected sex going on out there. The play room was about being able to control what was going on…safe fun.

          We all know what is going on and we need good brains to come together and bring a small proportion of gays to account. Emotionally and financially.

          1. I’m sure your comment was designed to develop debate (hopefully) – I totally agree that we should all try to take responsibility for our actions, but it is not helpful to go down the route of the deserving & the undeserving when it comes to health care in my view.

            London has an emerging problem with sexualised drug use & given that there is a high concentration of people living with HIV & HCV in London, there is a real problem that Pink business, those gay men who are involved in the party & play drug scene & the health organisations need to tackle head on.

            There needs to be more investment in combined services that get to grips with mental health, drug, alcohol & other social issues that impact not only MSM but the LGB&T population group – we should demand more action; health commissioners must act on these trends!

            There is just 1 dedicated LGB&T drug & alcohol service in the UK, which is based in London – it is overwhelmed by MSM with “non traditional” drug use difficulties.

  7. Christopher in Canada 8 Jul 2013, 10:07pm

    Remember when beer and disco music was enough, or was I just naive?

  8. You admit it’s pleasurable then, Keith YOU DIRTY COW!

  9. Crystal meth? Really? I don’t know what’s going on in London but in Liverpool, all of the gay men I know still think crystal meth is nasty. They do ecstasy sometimes but not very big on the drugs. Most gay guys in Liverpool are sober but safe sex might not be on the forefront of their minds unfortunately. They like to think with their dicks…

    You can never be too safe when it comes to sex and drugs. If you’re going to be stupid enough to inject yourself, don’t be even stupider and share needles! I do it like this: we can stop using the condoms if you come to the clinic with me tomorrow and we can get tested together. If we’re clean, then we can stop using protection. And no thanks, no crystal meth for me. I’ll stick to my afternoon joint or maybe some MD if I’m in the party mood. Meth is just nasty…

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