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Coalition for Marriage: ‘Quakers, Unitarians and Liberal Jews have unfairly dominated the equal marriage debate’

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  1. Is this a joke? The Church of England has members in the House of Lords who can ACTUALLY VOTE on the bill… Do any other religions? No.

    1. She is either deluded or dishonest and I don’t know which is worse.

      “The major concern of Coalition for Marriage, which as you know stands for people of all different faiths and of no faith”

      Facts please Sharon? How many atheist members do you actually have? We want the number. You must know this mustn’t you or you wouldn’t be able to make that claim?

      1. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 1:22pm

        I’d like to know who the gay opponents are too. if they’re so against it, why haven’t they revealed themselves. I strongly suspect most of them are straights pretending to be gay to give her hate group more credibility, although I do know of one, Andrew Pierce who signed their petition and probably those 10 dinner guests he had over recently. We still don’t know who they are either. Cowards always run for cover.

  2. My dear Dr Jones, take your religion and shove it where the sun doesn’t shine!

    I think too that you would find that most people in the UK actually support same sex marriage, irrespective of their religious belief. So put that fact in your pipe and smoke it while moving along out of the way of progress.

    1. .....Paddyswurds 24 Jun 2013, 1:20pm

      Dr Jones??

      1. “Doctor Sharon James. She isn’t a medical doctor: she has degrees in history (Cambridge University) and theology (Toronto Baptist Seminary) and is the author of several useful books on Christian womanhood such as God’s Design for Women, In Trouble and in Joy, and Gentle Rain on Tender Grass: Daily Readings from the Pentateuch. She and her husband Bill James work together at the Emmanuel Church in Leamington Spa where Bill is the pastor: Sharon James has been particularly involved in teaching Focus on the Family’s “Truth Project”. Focus on the Family has spent millions on anti-gay campaigns in the US.”

        http://lgbt.co.uk/blog/233-marriage-minutes-01

        1. CH Brighton 24 Jun 2013, 2:33pm

          Except that the Toronto Baptist Seminary doesn’t offer study at doctorate level. It’s highest degree is a Master of Theology (www.tbs.edu/graduate_programs) which is described as a stepping stone to a doctoral degree.

      2. I thought that having a doctorate meant certain capacity to reason and certain commitment to ethical behaviour. This is not the case with “Dr” Jones

  3. ‘this has been rushed’

    I have waited 47 years for this.

    I would not call that rushed.

    Enough with the victim complex luv.

  4. “Certain issues.”
    “Serious unintended consequences.”
    “Political process.”
    “Legitimacy.”

    So many abstract nouns and meaningless nonsense. Why doesn’t she quantify what she means? (Answer: Because she can’t, and her concerns are groundless.)

  5. The Coalition for Marriage are anti democracy and they have no time for views that don’t fall into line with their own. You only have to look to their facebook page to see that, anyone who posts a conflicting viewpoint is blocked from commenting on the page, it’s a sham.

  6. “..the Quakers, the Unitarians, and the Liberal Jews, who between them represent only one percent,” she added: “a legitimate one percent, but only one percent of the Christian population.”

    I didn’t realise Liberal Jews were considered part of the Christian population.

    1. She probably thinks Jesus was a Christian too.

      1. Ha hahahahaha – I had a ‘discussion’ with a so called christian not 24 hours ago who insisted – ‘Of course Jesus wasn’t a Jew – he was the First Christian’

        hahahahahahahaha….

      2. Mumbo Jumbo 24 Jun 2013, 12:03pm

        Lol.

  7. So not only do these fools hate us they are intolerant of other religions – why? because they disagree with their bigotry – another nail in the coffin of Christian superstition -

  8. A) I haven’t heard much about them at all! I’ve heard endless homophobic rants proving the Christian “love” of bigots from the Anglican church and Catholic church, I’ve heard the chief Rabbi weasel around pretending not to be a homophobe – but these churches I’ve hardly heard from

    And we SHOULD hear more about them – after all, if you’re debating religious freedom, surely the religions whose beliefs ARE being restricted should be the ones we’re talking about – not the ones whose practice will not change one iota, but arrogantly want to impose on everyone whether they’re a believer or not

  9. Mumbo Jumbo 24 Jun 2013, 12:02pm

    Quite remarkable. Everything she says is an inversion of actuality.

  10. I may be wrong about the Unitarians, and as the article says the Jews don’t happen to be Christians…but I can say as a Quaker that some Quakers are Christian and some are not. While Quakerism evolved from Christian belief, in the US and England most Quakers believe they are free to accept or reject Jesus as divine. Most I know value his teachings as being very much aligned with Quaker practice and testimonies; but I first attended Quaker meeting 34 years ago and I could count on one hand the number of times anyone has referred to Jesus in spoken testimony. Some are very Christocentric and the African Quakers are pretty traditional Christian. But in most first world countries strictly Christian belief is relatively rare.

    1. Same for the Unitarians.

    2. Jacky Herty 29 Jun 2013, 11:27pm

      You’re right -some Unitarians are Christian (in a non-Trinitarian way), others are not.
      I’m a Pagan Unitarian, and whole-heartedly support equality, in marriage and elsewhere.

  11. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 12:06pm

    This harridan constantly repeats herself. This Bill has never been rushed, in fact it drew the largest and longest public consultation in history. The Equalities Contract included Equal Marriage in 2010. It’s now halfway through 2013 and she thinks it’s a rush-job? Hardly!

    What she is saying is that minority denominations should not be listened to, should not have any part in Equal Marriage, that mainstream denominations, i.e. CoE and RC should have the final say who are also in the minority of worshippers out of a population of 60 million. So much for freedom of religion, nasty delusional loon.

    1. Exactly!

      I think what she fails to realise is that even if those groups were only given 1% of the time like she seems to be suggesting, the outcome would most probably still have been the same.

      It’s hilarious watching what these folks do when they’ve already lost, and all that’s left is crossing the T’s and dotting the I’s.

    2. Dr James

      If you or your followers don’t want to get married to a member of the same sex, YOU DON’T HAVE TO!

      Simple really.

  12. We need a COMPLETE separation of religion and state. That way, legislation which is proposed and passed by our ELECTED representatives will not be up for discussion or blocking by UN-ELECTED bishops and landed gentry. It is a farce that a ‘personal belief’ is deferred to in the way it is. If people want to believe in myths and fables, let them. But they must NOT be allowed to dictate policy because of their ‘beliefs’. Faith is a PERSONAL mater. Keep it at home and away from imposition on the rest of us.

    1. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 1:27pm

      Faith is also chosen, not innate, unlike our orientation which is immutable. I consider faith a hobby and in some cases, an addiction for which there is a cure….facing facts and confronting reality.

  13. I must have missed this. Could “Dr” James please direct me to the evidence for her case?

  14. Julian Morrison 24 Jun 2013, 12:16pm

    Translation: “rats, I’m losing”.

  15. Jock S. Trap 24 Jun 2013, 12:17pm

    In other words Liberal Judaism, the Unitarians and the Quakers to C4M do NOT have Religious Freedom. That clearly is Only reserved for Christians, right?

    Wrong Dr James, so Very, Very wrong.

    Of course you’ll focus and attack accepting religion. It’s what you do to try and discredit anyone you disagree with.

    Give it a rest and start to see when it comes to history, you’re loosing!

  16. These people are supported by the extremist wings of religions. The everyday person is of that faith too. and the majority of them support equal marriage. Why not let the lay person speak instead of the bigots.

  17. Jock S. Trap 24 Jun 2013, 12:27pm

    Dr James said: “No, I think a lot of people in this country genuinely don’t really understand the issues…”

    Oh I see… coz most Christians are thick right?

    Her words, not mine! Seems the dictatorship religion speaks for the people… except me that is.

    And the rest.

  18. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 12:30pm

    What I’d like to see happen is for the Quakers, Liberal Jews and Unitarians to have a go at Sharon James and her hate group at C4M, expose them for what they really are, liars, hypocrites and frauds.

    1. Zoe Bremer 1 Jul 2013, 9:02am

      I hope you can get involved in whatever Kensington Unitarians are doing to tackle the issue.

  19. She bangs on about the problems without once saying what she means and then complains that the average person dosent understand the issues. Surely while you are being interviewed is a good time to pinpoint your concerns ? She didnt refer to gods law or the bible but i’d bet thats what its based on. Religious loon. So intent on forcing her belief on everyone that she hasn’t noticed society moving on. Dinosaur

  20. That There Other David 24 Jun 2013, 12:52pm

    And in the next speech she’ll no doubt go on about how her religious freedom is being compromised, without even the slightest hint that she understands how she contradicts herself.

  21. I got as far as ““I think the majority of mainstream Christian people in this country do actually oppose gay marriage” and that was all the proof I needed that she’s just another bigot who ignores the facts and lives in a fantasy of her own devising.

    Anyone who feels they are qualified pontificate on such matters but then predicates their argument on something that is an unsupported belief is not competent to even debate the point (especially since in this case there is hard evidence to the contrary). More than incompetent, it is dishonest; she shows she is aware of this falsehood by using the term “I think” to guard the false statement.

    Lady, I KNOW you are wrong. You KNOW you are wrong. What you mean by “I think” is “I’d like it to be true that more people agreed with me, but really I KNOW they don’t.”

  22. More would-be martyrdom, and thinly disguised tyranny.

    Get down off the cross, dearie, you’re embarrassing yourself.

  23. St Sebastian 24 Jun 2013, 1:06pm

    Dear Dr James

    I am sorry but, in case you hadn’t noticed, this an issue of equality equality, not religion.

    Furthermore you have not jurisdiction over people outside your community/church.

    Your religious cohort can decide what you will allow in your Church but ONLY because membership of your church is voluntary. If a member disagrees with the rule, they can leave, however being a British citizen and subject to its laws, is not a club you can choose to leave if you disagree with the laws.

    No-one is forcing your church to conduct same sex marriages, the proposed act specifically states this. No-one is forcing you to to marry a member of the same sex. So what exactly is your problem?

    Over and out, end of story.

  24. Apparently they give titles like ‘Dr’ out flippantly, these days.

    1. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 1:28pm

      She and her husband are evangelicals. I believe they acquired their doctorates overseas in Canada I think.

    2. ” Doctor Sharon James. She isn’t a medical doctor: she has degrees in history (Cambridge University) and theology (Toronto Baptist Seminary) and is the author of several useful books on Christian womanhood such as God’s Design for Women, In Trouble and in Joy, and Gentle Rain on Tender Grass: Daily Readings from the Pentateuch. She and her husband Bill James work together at the Emmanuel Church in Leamington Spa where Bill is the pastor: Sharon James has been particularly involved in teaching Focus on the Family’s “Truth Project”. Focus on the Family has spent millions on anti-gay campaigns in the US.”

      “http://lgbt.co.uk/blog/233-marriage-minutes-01

      1. Is Focus on the Family one of those US hate groups designated by the SPLC (Southern Poverty Law Center) ?

        1. It’s a predatory fundamentalist multinational based in Colorado Springs which has repeatedly interfered in overseas marriage equality debates, such as those in Canada, Australia and New Zealand. It has also been forced to lay off staff at regular intervals. Its founder, “Dr” James Dobson, is a geriatric bigot.

    3. It’d be interesting to know whether James’ doctorate is actually recognised within the United States.

  25. “Our law defines marriage as; “the voluntary union for life, of one man and one woman, to the exclusion of all others.”
    This is a common-law definition of marriage in a judgement given by James Wilde, 1st Baron Penzance (1816-1899) in 1866 when ruling in Hyde vs Hyde on polygamous marriage.

    Lord Penzance’s definition in full was:

    What, then, is the nature of this institution as understood in Christendom?…If it be of common acceptance and existence, it must have some pervading identity and universal basis. I conceive that marriage, as understood in Christendom, may for this purpose be defined as the voluntary union for life of one man and one woman, to the exclusion of all others.
    Because Hyde vs Hyde was a decision on polygamous marriage, the key point in Lord Penzance’s judgement may be taken as

    “the voluntary union for life of one and one, to the exclusion of all others”

    http://lgbt.co.uk/blog/233-marriage-minutes-01

  26. ‘people…of no faith’ and Christian Jews? She sounds like a rather nasty piece of work, this doctor.

  27. It’s sort of nice to know that we in the States don’t have the only delusional right-wingers in the world.

    1. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Jun 2013, 6:35pm

      True, but I’m afraid the U.S. has far more of them than in any other western country including a considerable number of them in the republican party who are far more extreme than this harridan is who doesn’t wield much influence outside of C4M and other smaller fringe groups.

    2. Unfortunately, Hunter, your pressure groups have cravenly dependent satellites in the rest of the world. For instance, down here in New Zealand, our “Family First” cited the National Organisation for Marriage and Family Research Council from the US Christian Right during our marriage equality debate. I suspect that the “UK” Christian Right is probably parroting the same propaganda and taking the same tactical and strategic advice, correct?

  28. Barry William Teske 24 Jun 2013, 4:25pm

    Thank you Mainstream Christians for confirming what we all already know.
    Your beliefs are based on hate, intolerance, and inequality.

  29. Paul Halsall 24 Jun 2013, 7:04pm

    The United Reformed Church is likely to support gay marriage. Out local congregation has already voted so.

    And so of course will the MCC and many independent Catholic Churches

  30. How appallingly sectarian, and yet fascinating. Of course, Dr James is not a ‘mainstream’ Christian, she belongs to a tiny fundamentalist sect. So religious freedom in this context should be limited only to opponents of marriage equality, not supporters? What sinister remarks.

  31. Oh I see, as a gay man, I’m not mainstream and if any religious group doesn’t agree with her viewpoint, they’re not mainstream either.
    Must be an awful lot of non-mainstream people around!!.

  32. She’s complaining that a “disproportionate” amount of attention has been given to those religions that preach love, equality and inclusiveness. I guess that tells us quite about about Dr James’ version of Christianity.

  33. Har Davids 25 Jun 2013, 9:11am

    Isn’t it up to the representatives of the electorate to debate equal marriage? If the religious, who are already represented, are allowed to have some extra influence, who about the philatelists, kite-surfers and other groups who may feel they have special insights in the matter? And the good Dr. is very vague on the consequences, as is usual for her ilk.

  34. Actually all of the three faiths that ‘have been given too much attention’ – are not all entirely Christian. Quakers and Unitarians have members who are and members who are not. The point is that we do not want every place of worship to support same sex marriage but we want to be able to be free to practice our beliefs in our own places of worship. We are not speaking for all Christians or all faith groups just our own.

  35. Rev Eric Potts 28 Jun 2013, 12:19pm

    I’m a mainstream Christian ( a Methodist minister) and I know that Dr Jones is talking through her ….. (choose word). I fully support same-sex marriage and would be happy to officiate when it becomes legal.

  36. Zoe Bremer 28 Jun 2013, 5:15pm

    Actually, there is the Chief Rabbi in the House of Lords as well.

  37. Zoe Bremer 28 Jun 2013, 5:32pm

    I am Unitarian and all I can say about this is that if other denominations have been ‘left out’ of the debate, surely this must be due to their relatively low level of participation. Nobody has sought to exclude any religious group from discussion of this matter. I can only assume, therefore, that some groups failed to get involved at the right time and are now complaining.

  38. Mark O'Brien Sherborn Massachusetts 2 Jul 2013, 8:07am

    As an American Unitarian (Unitarian Universalists here in the US) our numbers as in the UK may be small compared to larger faiths. But our leadership on LGBT equality and other social issues and the influences far exceeds those numbers. I congratulate our liberal UK Jewish friends and Quaker allies for joining together to fight for LGBT human dignity and equality. American Unitarian Universalists were the very first religious denomination on the planet to call for LGBT equality, dignity and same sex marriages as early as 1970.

  39. Wow! I guess you guys just want to shut down debate by everyone who might disagree with you! Sounds like all the things you accuse Christians of doing, you actually do yourself. Is there no room left in society for respectful debate anymore?

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