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Catholic blogger Andrew Sullivan speculates the Pope could be gay

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  1. OH .. Was that a secret?

    1. If this is true – and I had been thinking the retirement arrangements were a bit odd to say the least – what will the so called faithful think of the hypocritical old bugger now.

      1. wonder if they’ll start a family awwwwwww

          1. MerlynHerne 28 Feb 2013, 12:12pm

            LMAO. The baby looks like “OMG! Get me outta here! Now!”

    2. Psychologist 4 Mar 2013, 5:07pm

      Elegir, actually it is NOT a “sick form of victim blaming” at all. As a psychological therapist I have counselled many men who thought they were straight, and suffering from a range of disorders from depression and anxiety disorders, to even suicidal. They all displayed very high levels of homophobia, some even carrying worryingly high levels of aggression towards gay men. However, after long periods in therapy, these men finally see that the homosexuality that they fear, is NOT that of someone else, but of their OWN. It deploys commonly used defence mechanisms such as “displacement”, “projection” and others, as way of “protecting themselves” from the truth, which they feel they won’t be able to deal with. This is classic homophobia.

  2. This tiresome old trope of “all homophobes are gay” is a sick form of victim-blaming. It’s as pernicious as saying that women in the workplace are the reason other women don’t succeed and that black people are all against affirmative action. It takes responsibility away from the bigoted bullies.

    Accept it – some people are homophobic simply because they’re rsoles. No hidden gayness and no mitigating circumstances.

    1. Oooo! Get you! Bee in our bonnet about something, haven’t we? I think history will prove those of us who have first-hand and extensive knowledge of this matter, correct.

      1. I admit it, you got me! I have never ever had sexual intercourse with that pope!

        As to the bee, yes, I get annoyed when people throw the “homophobe = gay” equation into the mix. I have a huge amount of respect for Andrew Sullivan, but this smear tactic of his is more insulting to gays than to the pope and is just a pisspoor attempt to win clicks,

        1. Not all homophobes are gay. But that doesnt mean the Pope is straight

        2. … and the latest admission by the Scottish Cardinal that he’s gay? One of the biggest anti-gay voices of recent times? If being closetted isn’t the primary driver of homophobia, what is it? If you’re going to tell me it’s ‘religion belief’ .. cobblers! Bigots will use the bible to justify their homophobia. And why are they homophobic? Because they carry their self-loathing around in their subconscious. This applies equally to young male thugs and old spinster aunts. It’s SELF-LOATHING. If it’s NOT that, kindly provide me with a better explanation. I’m all ears …. :)

    2. Elegir, I think there’s a lot of truth in what you say. But at the same time it’s absolutely possible that there’s a hidden “particular friendship” between Gaenswein and Ratzinger, and “particular friendships” are frowned upon between any two members of any religious order. Normally, when “particular friendships” are observed by a bishop, abbot, or Mother Superior, the two people involved are split up, sent to different places, or given a warning.

      1. All true – tho I recall that the people’s only boss is, um, god. :)

        1. Stupid iPad – “pope’s” only boss…

    3. Actually, I take the view that the more it becomes generally accepted that homophobes are likely to be gay themselves, the more they’ll keep quiet and moderate their homophobic abuse. There’s significant research evidence for the link in any case, and I can’t quite see you think this amounts to victim-blaming. Rather it adds to the charge of homophobia the sin of hypocrisy. The psychodynamics of the homophobe=gay equation suggest an unbearable conflict between the nature (being born gay) and nurture (being taught gay=bad) of the individual which is resolved by displacement, destroying the perceived ‘badness’ of the self by destroying it in others. There needs to be a reasonable explanation as to why certain individuals become so angrily obsessed about single issues of this kind, just calling them ‘rsoles’ doesn’t quite do it for me:-)…

      1. ABSOLUTELY RIGHT, Mark N! Well said. If the root cause of homophobia isn’t self-loathing, what is it? This applies equally to thuggy lads and nasty old spinsters … (mentioning no names but how is Anne Widdicombe these days?). I agree totally with what you say …”I take the view that the more it becomes generally accepted that homophobes are likely to be gay themselves, the more they’ll keep quiet and moderate their homophobic abuse”. Let’s get that message out there ..”Show me a homophobe; I’ll show you a closet case”.

    4. I agree with you, Elegir. Certainly often the most rabid homophobes are repressed homosexuals, but much or even most of the time – particularly when religion is thrown into the mix – it can be nothing more than tribalism and ignorance.

      Having said that, the precipitate exits of both Ratzi and O’Brien make me suspect there’s some gigantic scandal they’re trying desperately to avoid.

      1. My thoughts exactly. The first pope in 600 years to resign …. ? Stinks of a huge scandal coming ….

    5. Psychologist 5 Mar 2013, 9:32am

      Elegir, actually it is NOT a “sick form of victim blaming” at all. As a psychological therapist I have counselled many men who thought they were straight, and suffering from a range of disorders from depression and anxiety disorders, to even suicidal. They all displayed very high levels of homophobia, some even carrying worryingly high levels of aggression towards gay men. However, after long periods in therapy, these men finally see that the homosexuality that they fear, is NOT that of someone else, but of their OWN. It deploys commonly used defence mechanisms such as “displacement”, “projection” and others, as way of “protecting themselves” from the truth, which they feel they won’t be able to deal with. This is classic homophobia.

  3. Is the Pope a Catholic?

  4. Robert (Kettering) 28 Feb 2013, 12:03pm

    This isn’t really news. Roman Catholic friends of mine have openly talked about this “affair” between the Pope and the Archbishop for years. It’s been an open secret within RC circles even when he was plain old Cardinal Ratzinger.

    1. Yes, it’s pretty old news. There’s even a book been written about it! It’s just sad that he’s been a closet-case like Cardinal Keith and thus been so anti-gay.

  5. I heard he’s secretly Jewish. That’s why he joined the Hilter Youth …. :)

    1. Sorry – meant to press “thumbs up” but screwed it!

    2. Christopher Hobe Morrison 6 Mar 2013, 9:32pm

      Very good!

  6. “Georg, honey, I’ve had enough. I’m throwing in the towel!”

    “Oh, but Benny, sweetie, what about me! I don’t want to retire just yet!”

    “Oh, well, you don’t have to retire as well, honey! How about we stay here, organize a nice little pad somewhere in the grounds, you continue to live with me, we’ll still be a couple, and you can keep working! Howzat?”

    “Oh, Benny, that would be just great. But you know, I sorta, like, enjoy assisting “The Pope”, and you won’t be Pope anymore!” (looks crestfallen)

    “No problem, honey! Now let’s see my little Gorgy smiling again! I’ll fix it so you stay the assistant of whoever becomes the NEXT Pope! Ok? Now! Where’s my din-dins?”

    1. Now! Where’s my dildo more like!!

      1. and Georg sweetie of course I’ll make sure the next Pope is one of us. Can’t have you working with a nasty man can we now.

    2. and of course Georg sweetie I’ll make sure that the next Pope is one of us – don’t want diddums working for a nasty man and coming home crabby.

  7. “Are we supposed to think that’s, well, a normal arrangement?”

    I doubt there is anything “normal” at the Vatican.

    1. Tim Chapman 28 Feb 2013, 4:56pm

      Two men living together seems pretty normal to me. It’s what happens in our house!

  8. This is a re-post. The most dreadful thing is that the Pope is most probably Gay, I would REALLY like to be wrong here….What I do know first hand is that Pope B 16 has a very old & close Gay friend back in Germany, a Catholic Monk whos a rather shocking old queen….This Monk happens to be a very old friend with my partners family who live & have a hotel in Capri….Not long before B 16 became Pope he came as a guest of the Monk to the family hotel a couple of times….We’ve caught the Monk spying on us having sex from outside our bedroom window, hes fond of fixing tricks for his friends back home in Germany & knows well & uses the infamous cruising grounds in Capri going down to the piccola marina….OK I know this dose not necessarily prove the Pope is Gay but surely he must know about his friends double & very Queer life, perhaps hes part of it?….Frankly both of them revolt me….I now wish at the time I challenged the Monk over his faith, his sexuality & his choice of friends.

    1. Entirely, believable, Daniel, thank you. I’ve seen all sorts of gay men, and at every level, in religious orders, from Abbot down to novices!

  9. Jamie Caffiera 28 Feb 2013, 12:25pm

    Ummm… duh!

  10. And in other news, the sun rose in the east.

  11. The pope is not gay – a gay man would be happy and comfortable with the person they are both in a private and public environment. He may well be a closeted old bigot but that is another matter and definitely not gay – I really dont want him in my gang!

    1. 100% agree. Many people are born with homosexual tendencies, but only a p few of us fulfill our fabulous destiny and become truly gay. :)

      1. There are self-loathing, homophobic gays too. They’re called ‘homophobes’. Yes – even someone who openly acknowledges their homosexuality, can also be homophobic – particularly from the generations who lived prior to homosexuality being legalised. If you are told often enough ‘You are a SINNER’, you will probably start to believe it. And that sort of religious or societal conditioning is VERY difficult to undo.

    2. Hysterical Screamer No. 243 28 Feb 2013, 1:06pm

      craig, there ARE sad old gays (and sad young gays), you know, besides happy and comfortabe ones!

  12. Mumbo Jumbo 28 Feb 2013, 1:17pm

    Old pope, new pope, Gorgeous George.

    Who’s “Lucky Lucy” in that threesome?

  13. Robert in S. Kensington 28 Feb 2013, 1:33pm

    The homophobia of the Catholic church is unquestionably despicable, but for Sullivan to imply that two men living together isn’t a normal arrangement is inappropriate and implies both are gay when nobody really knows. This is the sort of gutter journalism one would expect from the Mail or Telegraph. What if they are gay? All it would do would magnify the hypocrisy of their church. If there is proof, then whoever has it should come forward. This would aslo apply to outing people. Unless there is overwhelming evidence, then people should hold their tongues.

    1. I agree with you, Robert. I don’t know or even care if Sullivan’s story is true. But I want to say that I am an openly gay man who loves a straight man above all others and we have never had sex, but share a deeply intimate friendship. We do so much together and his wife and my partner say he and I should be the married couple. They say that in jest. We are all secure in ourselves to be open and feel safe with each other.

      1. How charming, and how unusual, Wotan! Thanks for telling.

    2. I completely agree, Robert.

      1. So do I.

  14. Francesco Forgione 28 Feb 2013, 2:48pm

    There’s a lot in this which is simply not true and may well be libellous. I’d invite the paper to retract it. I don’t have time to do a fact checking type commentary on it today, but will be happy to do so when I have a little more time at the weekend. Lying about people because you don’t agree with them is not an attractive past time.

  15. I appreciate that Andrew Sullivan is a well-respected and incisive commentator but I do wish he’d realise how uninteresting RC church gossip is to most of us: well, me anyway. I really do not care what happens to the pontiff emeritus or who he shacks up with. Mr Sullivan: nor should you.

  16. Wamakaskha 28 Feb 2013, 3:38pm

    @elegir – do you know why people think ‘all homophobes are gay’? it is because the Minnesota Multiphasic Personality Inventory (MMPI) once the ‘gold standard’ in personality assessement used by the American Psychological Association showed a strong positive correlation between homophobic behavior and homosexual tendency. No one ever said (at least within a scientific context) that ‘all homophobes are gay’ but when there is a strong, replicable, correlation – it gets treated as ‘fact’ and that tends to work its way into pop culture terms as ‘all of *blank* are *blank*’. Personally, I think the majority of homophobes have some homosexual tendency – but that’s not all of anything. Seems like this article might have some bases though -seemingly- however, this blog is not a medical journal and it’s all speculation until proven otherwise.

    1. Freud theorized the link between homophobia and repressed homosexuality long before the MMPI, and much more recent research that supports it too,for instance this from 2012:

  17. It isn’t just the nudge nudge element of this that should concern the new pope, it’s the politics of it. How freely will the new pope feel he is able to talk if his personal secretary goes home to the “pope emeritus” at the end of the working day?
    It will feel as if he has Bennie looking over his shoulder the whole time.

  18. God Bless our Pope…..God bless our Pope…God bless our pope…the great and the good…

    1. Christopher Hobe Morrison 6 Mar 2013, 9:38pm

      Pay no attention to the man in the closet!

  19. Dan Filson 28 Feb 2013, 4:09pm

    “Whad’ya mean there’s no pension pot and I gotta give up Georg!!” Frankly, this is pure fantasy and who knows? But there are few jobs where your morning tea is brought by a nun and you get to retire to a convent. Being gay in those circumstances is almost a necessity or they would all want to be Pope.

  20. “a monastery being converted for him” – oh my

  21. jacqui pollock 28 Feb 2013, 4:33pm

    This is a disgrace, how can these rumours go on like this . all that is said is he may be gay and the rumours get bigger by the minute. All I want to say is this let it be on the heads of each person who adds their comments on what someone thinks.

    1. Taking it a bit hard – it’s funny that’s all. If he’s gay or not we’ll never find out but either way it sure as hell not gonna make one bit of difference to either his or the Catholic Churches future. I think we all deserve to have a laugh at the old homophobe – he’s taken the piss out of us enough.

      Wonder who’s designing their monastery gaff Armani or Versace – fingers crossed Versace – no end of fabulous antiques touched in gold I’ll bet. More tea vicar.

    2. Dearest Jacqui,
      Let me explain something to you.
      It doesn’t matter a fig if he and Ganswein are, or are not, a troupe of monkeys in pink tights.
      What does matter is that anyone should say the likes of this in 1986:-

      “Although the particular inclination of the homosexual person is not a sin, it is a more or less strong tendency ordered toward an intrinsic moral evil; and thus the inclination itself must be seen as an objective disorder.”

      And then follow it up in 1992 with:-
      “Sexual orientation (is) not equivalent to race or ethnicity and (it is) not unjust discrimination to take sexual orientation into account.”
      That is why there is all the speculation that there is.
      It is necessary to know, so that those who have been throwing stones….
      Get my drift?
      And among the stone-throwers, I list Cardinal Keith O’Brien.

  22. No shit sherlock :-)

  23. This isn’t news. The international intelligence community have known this for decades.

    Also, given that 50% or so of catholic priests are gay, even if we didn’t know for sure there would be a fairly good chance.

    But it doesn’t matter. He’s an evil, deluded old protector of paedophiles and purveyor of asinine theistic nonsense.

    1. Then if it’s been known by ‘the establishment’ for so long, it is all the more despicable that the catholic church has continued to be so offensively vitriolic towards gay people. In MY book of Sins, hypocricy is number one.

  24. Richard Ammon 28 Feb 2013, 6:38pm

    The deeper sadness in all this speculation is that the artifice of religious dogma and tradition have polluted whatever love two people may have for each other. How terribly sad that Gaenswein and Ratzinger have to hide and mask whatever affection they may have for each other–gay or not, sexual or not. Such has the Church, with its anti-gay, anti-sex, rigid pro-life extremes, (not to mention extreme wealth and idolatry) distanced itself from the true nature of being human and being human on this earth. Long before the Church came along to build a profitable industry around the man Jesus there was same-gender attraction and there was prematurely ended pregnancy. The vast majority of people lived life much more in cadence with the vagaries of nature, not with proscribed rules and rituals imposed by institutional religion. As a result today we have scandalous projections, insulting insinuations and disgraceful rumors that surround two possible possible soul-mates whose hearts are linked.

  25. Richard Ammon 28 Feb 2013, 6:49pm

    How fine could have been been if Gaenswein and Ratzinger had led the world in displaying the depth and quality of male bonding and affection by being allowed to express their truth–gay or not, sexual or not. Instead of being at the heart of scandalous gossip they could be shining examples of human (divine?) love expressed openly and freely–closer to the original message of Jesus. The world is desperately in need of towering role-models of kindness, open-mindedness and inclusion that embraces differences between nations, races, tribes and religions and differences between inherent sexual orientations.

  26. Christopher in Canada 28 Feb 2013, 7:32pm

    Why am I thinking of J. Edgar Hoover??

    1. Was he the one that wore the frocks?
      The one that Sucks as it Beats as it Cleans?

  27. This is not new claim by Sullivan, who reached this conclusion some years ago. And the inseparable relationship between Ratzinger and GG has been commented on widely, in the Hoover-Tolson sense.

  28. The Pope a closeted case ? Could explain a lot. Actually could explain everything.

  29. Michael Inkpin-Leissner 1 Mar 2013, 1:35pm

    Does this blogger do us gays any favour? No. Typical gay gossip and shit stirring. As much as I disagree with the fight of the catholic official church and lots of christian taliban in the US and Africa against the LGTB community, I do as a homosexual man hate these bloggers, who are as hatful as these christian taliban. I am so annoyed. This blogger harms our cause more than it does help. Can he just shut up. I feel embarrased as a gay man to be associated with attention seeking gay men like him.

  30. This is stupid yellow journalism.

  31. This is stupid yellow journalism.

    It is counter productive.

    1. Rubbish! The more these people are shown-up for the dreadful, self-loathing hypocrites they are, the better. If you have been taught from birth that if you have gay feelings, you are a SINNER … and will BURN IN HELL …. you are going to be pretty mixed up. “Show me a homophobe; I’ll show you a closet case”. And what better realm in which to hide that inner-loathing than within an organisation which makes the denouncing of gay people its daily mission? In other words, where better to find solace for your self-loathing than within an outfit which spends its whole time being ant-gay? Psychobabble? Perhaps. But if you come up with a better explanation, do let me know.

  32. Many of the above views are worthy of Der Stürmer (the Anti-Catholic Pink News of it’s day):

  33. I have never wondered about this since the time I first saw Ganswein fluster around Ratzinger as he (R) was descending the steps of some aircraft or other and the wind whipped up the small white cape R wears, into a heap around R’s shoulders.
    G was there in a flash, straightening everything out.
    That would not have occurred to two straight men, to straighten out another bloke’s gear… even putting to one side that you just do not touch the person of the Pope other than a handshake.
    And that straightening-out of the Pope’s clothing occurred more than once in 8 years and is in the can.
    That is a two-some and good luck to them. The condemnation of the rights of others and the insistence that, by inference, I am “intrinsically morally disordered”…etc is my gripe.

  34. Yer a bit late, Mr. Sullivan…

  35. Wonder why my comments are all being deleted?
    Too near the bone?

  36. Pink News is a laughing stock 3 Mar 2013, 2:44pm

    Pink News really does continue to show how poor it really is as an online newspaper when it comes up with tripe stories like this, really this is just pure ridiculous if not libel.

  37. Psychologist 4 Mar 2013, 4:49pm

    I’m a psychological therapist, and have studied homophobia for over 15 years, I’m writing a book on it, I also lecture on it. Plus as a therapist, I’ve helped many men who were highly homophobic, as a result of being gay and in denial, to accept their true sexual orientation. (many also suffer depression & anxiety disorders too).
    I can clearly state that homophobia IS indeed caused by supressing one’s own true gay feelings and desires! Much world-wide research (as well as my own) concludes that.
    All PHOBIAS are a psychological disorder. A PHOBIA is defined as “an irrational fear of ……”
    In the case of homo-PHOBIA, the irrational fear is of homo-SEXUALITY (NOT as some think, of homo-SEXUALS) The homosexuality they are in fear of, is their OWN, if it should break through their suppression system, thus become CONSCIOUSLY KNOWN to them, thus be in CONFLICT with their social conditioning (mainly from religious homophobes themselves, such as the Pope) that being gay is somehow wrong!

  38. Psychologist 4 Mar 2013, 4:58pm

    I also have to add, that it is highly likely that the Pope IS actually gay, just as obviously is Cardinal O’Brien, who has now admitted “sexual misconduct” with male priests – where once again, we see the most homophobic men verbalising against gay equality and rights, actually desiring, or having gay sex ! This is CLASSIC homophobia ! — where someone who is actually gay, but are denying that fact, become aggressively against homosexuality. The Pope does exactly the same !

    1. Maybe they were having a relationship – which is about to be revealed, hence the hasty departure of both

      1. Psychologist 4 Mar 2013, 11:43pm

        Yes, Indeed ! There is far more to the pope’s rapid exit that we’re being told, I’m sure of that.
        Perhaps there are victims of his about to talk ??

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