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Turkey: Homosexuality to join murder as a reason for army expulsion

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  1. Yet more reasons why Turkey should not be allowed to join the EU.

    1. Bill (Scotland) 26 Nov 2012, 12:15pm

      The comment above is bigotry pure and simple, just like some of the other comments here in this thread. I think Turkey should be accepted as a member of the EU on the same basis as some other current EU members, some of which had equally abhorrent policies towards LGBT people and which still carry out homophobic polices despite the commitments they made prior to becoming members. But they are not Islamic countries, so I suppose that in the world-view of some of those commenting here that makes it acceptable. Nor of course is the US, which until a couple of years ago had similar policies to Turkey on LGBT people serving in its military. Like others I hope Turkey won’t introduce the measures they are contemplating and hope that through NATO (of which it is a long-standing and important member) they can be prevailed upon to shelve (i.e. abandon) this policy. Turkey is no more an ‘Islamic’ country that the UK is ‘Christian’ – both are secular.

      1. One wonders at what point Bill (Scotland) draws a line between “bigotry” and drawing a line in the sand on moral issues. Would Bill accept Saudia Arabia? Surely to oppose is bigotry pure & simple?

        Turkish attitudes are on some very important issues differ wildly from European countries. 40% support Honour killing.

        Whilst there was a secular government, this did not matter as the state did not seek to enforce Islamist principles.

        This is changing with Erdogan. In the current state Turkey has no chance to join the EU. However we should lay hope that the secular movement wins the argument.

      2. There is a key difference between the policies in Turkey and those in the USA. That is that in Turkey these discriminatory policies are being written into the law, whereas in the USA, the policies are being rolled back in favor of tolerance and equality. The two countries are going in opposite directions.
        Again, there is a difference between Turkey and the other European countries that had discriminatory policies before entering the Union. Turkey is a G20 country, it is richer and more powerful than places like Slovenia, and can more easily reject calls from the EU to change a policy.

      3. How exactly is my comment bigotry, please enlighten me.

        Turkey still treats being gay as some kind of disease, they also liken us to murderers.

        Turkey has a long established history or repression of its people which does not sit well with (a majority) of the rest of Europe.

        Also, I have not mentioned anything to do with the fact that Turkey is a predominantly Islamic country. You are making that assumption, not me!

        Furthermore, Turkey, like many other countries only want to be part of the EU because they know they will get out more than they put in.

        The US also abandoned their ‘don’t ask, don’t tell’ policy a few years back and yet Turkey is extending its ban on LGBT serving in the military.

    2. I’m actually more curious whether this will be among any reasons that prevent Turkey from joining the EU, rather than a question of “should” or “should not”. The UK was forced by European courts to drop its military homosexuality ban. If Turkey not only refuses to repeal but also bolsters its ban, it may create yet another practical barrier to EU admission. Turkey needs to take human rights protections more seriously than it currently does.

  2. And this is why we should take Turkey’s EU membership application, rip it up and flush it down the nearest khazi.

    1. Careful Valsky, Bill (above) might label you a bigot ;-)

  3. Turkey is more and more likely to become an Islamic state rather than a secular state. This is another reason why it should never be allowed into Europe, apart from the fact that the majority of its landmass is in Asia. Only a very small part is in Europe.

  4. But surely, Turkey is a “secular state”!

    1. ‘Rather than a secular state’ means that it is a secular state. It was established as such by Kemel Ataturk.

      1. Yes, Neville, Kemal, did indeed establish the Republic of Turkey as a secular state. However, the practices and behaviour of its current government have been strongly inclined towards Islam. While Turkey is secular officially, it functions in much the same way as an other heavily Islamic state.

      2. barriejohn 26 Nov 2012, 1:35pm

        Ataturk would be spinning in his grave if he could see the way that things are going!

        1. Laws and a formally secular state, are not enough to change people’s mentality and practices. Even if Turkey didn’t have an “islamic” government today, it still is far behind most european countries , even those out of EU.

  5. Unbelievable! The need to provide explicit photographs is bizarre and intrusive and just plain weird. Do straight soldiers have to provide proof that they’re straight?? I doubt it…

    This paranoia about homosexuality can only be down to pure ignorance or sexual repression. And what’s with the ‘we’d need separate showers’ cr*p? Offensive and prejudiced.

    1. I agree Iris, or those in charge in the military are secretly gay and like to see the images that have to be produced.

      1. They obviously haven’t figured out how to find gay porn online, the little perverts.

    2. Got to wonder if those who fret about sharing showers are indulging in either a little personal projection (they know they couldn’t help themselves having a crafty look) or, since it is first to their mind, indulging a little fantasy about steamy rooms full of hard bodies

      Frankly, I have to wonder if the people who insist on repeating the shower panic are secretly so deep in the closet they are finding next year’s christmas presents.

      …And I hope the miserable swines stay there.

    3. Because when a gay man is in a communal shower, he cannot help but jump on the nearest naked man!
      So that’s why I got banned from my Sports Centre.

  6. I don’t know why anyone would want to join the Turkish Army and fight for a country that discriminates against them anyway…

    Or is that just me? o.0

    1. I presume they don’t want to, but they are required to by law.

  7. If Turkey implements this then it is automatically stepping out of EU negotiations.

    By implementing extremist policies like this Turkey is openly stating that it is no longer interested in EU membership.

    Fair enough. Their choice.

  8. I thought it was already the case that being actively gay (that well-known “lifestyle choice”) would get you immediately discharged from the Turkish army?

  9. Christopher in Canada 26 Nov 2012, 1:44pm

    How would a Turkish soldier work alongside a gay Canadian soldier in a NATO mission? Or take orders from one in a UN mission?

  10. Garry Cassell 26 Nov 2012, 3:29pm

    As a Canadian I am appalled at this attitude of Turkey….and their treatment of gays in the military…their reasons are without merit…just fear and biggotery.Turkey belongs in the same group as Uganda….and all countries should treat them as such…

    1. That’s not really the case, Homosexuality is not criminalised in Turkey, it is in Uganda and the Ugandan govt is currently making the situation worse. It hasn’t even been confirmed that Turkey will be introducing this rule, if it does it is obviously bad, but not nearly as bad as the situation in Uganda.

  11. darkmoonman 26 Nov 2012, 3:53pm

    Maybe the “good” Christians in the USA should move to Turkey where they can buddy-up with the government. Oh, wait, Christianity isn’t anything like Islam. Uh huh, sure it’s not.

  12. A nail in the coffin for their prospective membership of the EU!

  13. Turkey is sliding away from Ataturk’s ideals and is not a suitable member of the EU. It will always affiliate itself to its Islamic neighbours rather than Western liberalism. What on earth would the EU have to gain by opening that can of worms?

  14. barriejohn 26 Nov 2012, 5:45pm

    Interestingly, there are claims that Kemal Ataturk was himself gay:

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