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UKIP approves internal LGBT campaign group

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  1. Can anyone say Damage Control??? Unless this is genuine then they can use it to educate MPs and potential MPs about the issues and disperse prejudice (something LGBT Tory should be doing but aren’t)

  2. Much of the LGBT equality we have in this country has come from Europe.
    The UK’s equality and Human rights legislation is very much based on the European model, and on several occasions, the government reluctantly embraced equality only when forced to do so by European courts.

    1. You know that the european convention of Human Rights was actually drafted by British Lawyers right?

      1. And it took European judges to make this country stick to it.
        Homosexual service personnel could be dismissed for being open about their sexuality. Every time it was taken to a UK court, the status quo was upheld. It took the European court to say othersise.
        UKIP’s aim is to take us away from anything European. And as far as I see it, that means taking away the chance for some people to serve their country. Which is simply unfair.

        1. The European Convention of Human Rights – makes NO reference to gays at all.

  3. What a cynical ploy by UKIP. We wouldn’t have an equal age of consent or civil partnerships in this country if past governments hadn’t lost in the European Court.

    1. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 9:18am

      European Courts have nothing to do with the European Union.

  4. I wonder if UKIP has a particular electoral interest in getting LGBT votes? Given the behavior of some of their members, past and present, I’m guessing it will be very difficult for them anyway.

    That said, I imagine it’s difficult for any party seen as being single-issue to appeal to a particular section of the electorate, so instead they just throw their net as widely as possible.

    Anyway, it’s still progress of a kind! :)

    1. They probably only did it so they could gather all the LGBT voices within their party and send them into a corner where they can be ignored.

  5. nice try ukip. what next, an internal eu campaign group?

  6. Gawain Towler 25 Sep 2012, 9:58pm

    It’s pretty simple really, there have always been a fairly large number of LGBT types in UKIP (as there are in all political and other organisations). The party, until recently, didn’t have any real internal pressure groups, a couple were set up and, as the party gets bigger then, as a natural consequence groups coalesce. Others I know of include a Friends of Israel and Friends of Palestine Group, Its a function of maturing as a political party. From all accounts the fringe meeting mentioned here was well attended, and pretty vibrant. Good, and long may it last.

    1. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 9:17am

      Please note that Gawain Towler is the Press Officer for UKIP.

      Like I said earlier, if UKIP want to change a lot of people’s minds, they need to start supporting Same Sex marriage equality, or get the hell out with their wishy-washy compromises.

      1. “they need to start supporting Same Sex Marriage equality, or get the hell out with their wishy-washy compromises”..?

        What a load of rubbish! I’m gay, a member of UKIP, and – like others including Sir Derek Jacobi – have absolutely no problems with, and in fact wholeheartedly support, my party’s current policy.

        I’ve asked and asked the question, for someone, ANYBODY to tell me exactly what the difference is between Civil partnership and ‘gay marriage’ apart from the obvious bit about the word itself and religious elements, and in every case people simply get abusive, accuse me of being a traitor, or similar. But actual considered, well-thought out, compelling arguments there come none.

        Far too many lesbians and gay men really need to stop trying to have their cake (i.e. their ‘differences’ respected when it suits them including cottaging and so on) while at the same time demanding ‘extra’ in addition to those everybody else has, such as so-called gay marriage ‘rights’.

    2. Mr Towler – seeing as you work for UKIP perhaps you can tell us what the policies of this new group are.

      How is this group going to respond to homophobic neo-fascists within your party?

      Is it going to condemn them?
      Or is the group going to be as useless as LGBTory, never expressing an opinion unless it has been approved by party HQ first?

  7. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 10:37pm

    I was actually pretty pro UKIP, mainly for their anti EU stance, but I seriously lost interest and they lost my vote when it came to their anti-SSM manifesto.

    I’m afraid they are going to have to do a lot better than this to win my vote back.

    1. My thoughts exactly.

      1. Peter, Leicester 19 Oct 2012, 3:06pm

        And mine!

  8. That There Other David 25 Sep 2012, 10:47pm

    Dear UKIP

    Sod off.

    Love and hugs


    1. How juvenile and low-intellect.

      So much for the argument about gay men being on the whole better-educated and more cultured and intelligent…

      Every generation has its throwbacks I suppose!

  9. Well, you have to start somewhere I suppose, so this new group should be given a cautious welcome.

    However, they have a long way to go because there are some very nasty people indeed in UKIP. That said, they tend to be the older ones in the House of Lords so perhaps that’s not unduly surprising.

    At least the presence of the ‘LGBTQ in UKIP’ group will make the bigots think twice before sounding off !

    Currently their equal marriage policy is totally opposed to what LGBTQ in UKIP presumably stand for:-

    It would be interesting to see whether Nigel Farage ‘evolves’ on this issue. He’s still relatively young, so he might well be pragmatic enough to see which way the wind is blowing.

    1. Why does this group deserve a cautious welcome.

      We have seen through the example of LGBTory that these groups are utterly useless and ineffective and whose sole purpose is as PR window-dressing.

      They do not campaign for LGBT equality; they do not express opinions (unless cleared by party HQ first).

      Their sole function is so that when the neo-fascist bigots in the Tories or UKIP start spouting their bile, then party HQ can say ‘Oh but we have a gay group’.

      1. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 3:00pm

        Nice of you to meet people halfway as usual. (not)
        I, and I am sure many others, would be willing to see what exactly UKIP have to offer besides some little group, rather than dismissing them outright like the neo-Marxist idealist idiot you are.

        If these people want to convince us that they are Pro-LGBT rights, then they need to tell us exactly how.

        1. And how have the UKIP LGBT group shown us they are pro-equality.

          I understand that neo-fascist idealist extremists like yourself don’t require evidence for claims made by neo-fascist extremist parties because you WANT to believe they are good.

          The rest of us require some evidence.

          Didn’t you also once support the BNP, Spanner1960?

          1. And accusing someone else of being BNP simply because they disagree with you or have, in your clear view, the ‘temerity’ to hold their own view and one with which you disagree makes you any better than the “neo-fascist idealist extremists” that you attack?

            The answer is that no, it simply makes you one of the people you claim to hate.

            The definition of ‘bigot’, according to the Oxford English Dictionary, is “having or revealing an obstinate belief in the superiority of one’s own opinions and a prejudiced intolerance of the opinions of others”.

            By that definition alone, and given a number of your comments in this post alone, the “bigot” here is actually you.

      2. @dAVID

        In the fullness of time you may be proven right or you may be proven wrong. However, at the moment it’s just far too early to know how ‘LGBTQ in UKIP’ will perform.

        They deserve a cautious welcome because they MAY help to bring about a change in policy. Half a loaf is better than no bread. Would you rather that there was no voice at all within UKIP to challenge the bigots?

        Let’s wait and see what happens and then we can make an informed decision. UKIP won’t make a U-turn overnight, but change has to start somewhere. In the meantime you may expect the worst, but the rest of us should be reasonably optimistic and hope for the best.

  10. GingerlyColors 26 Sep 2012, 7:05am

    A lot of correspondents here fear that we will lose the benefit of the European Court Of Human Rights (ECHR) if we leave the European Union (EU). I would like to point out that the EU and the EHCR are two, totally separate entities. The EHCR which is based in Strasbourg, France is administered by the Council OF Europe which was founded in 1949 and consists of some 47 countries, including all 27 EU members. The European Union on the other hand administers the European Court Of Justice which is based in Brussels and often rules on matters relating to EU law such as trade and employment. The United Kingdom Independence Party (UKIP) policy is independence from the EU but not from the Council Of Europe. A post-EU Britain will still be subject to ECHR jurisdiction. Homosexuality was decriminalized in England and Wales six years before we joined the Common Market which later evolved into the EU . . .more to come:

    1. GingerlyColors 26 Sep 2012, 7:15am

      Norway and Iceland both enjoy full LGBT rights including marriage equality without the need for EU membership. Azerbaijan, Albania and Kosovo all decriminialised homosexuality in order to join the CofE even though they are Muslim majority countries. The Turkish Republic of Northern Cyprus which is not internationally recognised still retains it’s outdated laws as the ECHR has no jurisdiction in a country that is not supposed to exist.
      What UKIP and many people want is an end to the moribund Euro and we would like to see the European gravy train, currently being ridden by many of our political rejects from across the spectrum hit the buffers. Coming out of the EU shouldn’t mean that we have to go back in the closet. With UKIP now becoming a viable third party in British politics I think that it is right that they should start engaging with LGBT people and hopefully they will drop their opposition to marriage equality from their manifesto which currently allows for the status quo.

      1. Although offtopic I would like to add that albania is not a muslim majority country but very non-religious country(even more than the UK) and that action had nothing to do with joining the CofE

    2. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 9:13am

      That said, although the EHCR have helped LGBT causes in the past, they have also stuck their oar in and made things a whole lot worse in a lot of other cases. (The recent Abu Hamza issue as a case in point)

      On balance, I would prefer British law to be administered by British courts, not some bunch of faceless bureaucrats in The Hague. OK, so some things may not turn the way we want, but I believe justice will always rise to the surface eventually. The British have managed to sort things out in the end previously without any external influence, so I don’t see why we cannot return to that.

  11. To be welcomed, but, frankly, I don’t think it will be up to much.
    UKIP is a single-issue pressure group re. getting out of the EU. It is thus not even a political party in the usual sense.

    1. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 3:01pm

      Actually, that’s not true.
      Have you read their manifesto?
      No. I thought not.

      1. Yes, I have read it. It is recycled from the familiar hymn-sheets of the Tory Right and totally pervaded by calls to the sunlit uplands which apparently would await us did we but leave the EU.
        I think my point stands, and I suspect that the new lgbt group will supply little beyond comfort to its participants. Given their likely fellow-travellers in UKIP, they will need it.

  12. In reply to the comments above, I’d just like to point out that LGBTQ in UKIP was set up entirely by LGBTQ members who wanted a space in UKIP. It is not “cynical”, nor “damage control” and if any of you visited the facebook page you would see they are passionate about equal rights. There have been one or two homophobic morons posting on the page, who have been put in their place and shown to be stupid bigots by LGBTQ UKIP people, and I am proud to be friends with the latter group who are committed to equality and ending bigotry.

    1. Is marriage equality official policy of UKIP?

      if not then does this group condemn the homophobia of their own party?

      Or are they as worthless and spineless as LGBTory?

  13. Arron Clark 28 Sep 2012, 2:14pm

    I am a member of UKIP and yes i am also gay, the party has never had a problem with my sexuality and i am out and proud.
    A minority of fruit cakes have put UKIP in a bad light in the past.
    This group is long over due, i would like to point out it was formed and is run by gay members of UKIP.

  14. Simon Davies 28 Sep 2012, 2:19pm

    You’re all being quite unfair, think about it the UK Independence Party is a libertarian party they are all for freedom and equality. They are currently third in the polls beating the Lib Dems and I welcome such a group and will be voting UKIP next time, the sooner we’re out of the EU the better.

  15. The only way of safeguarding our hard won liberties is through continued membership of the EU.

  16. 1.) They have JUST started up. Why are some people demanding to know what impact they have had on the Party already? Give them time, and keep an eye on them.

    2.) A Party known for the ghastly homophobia of some of its candidates etc. now have a group representing the interests of gay people from within. Surely they are to be welcomed as a counter-balance and hopefully a group that will encourage UKIP members to shun the anti-gay cranks?

    Let’s keep an eye on them. If UKIP responds positively, this group will have done politics a very good service. UKIP is a party that is increasing its vote with every election – so a group like this is needed to keep it in check.

    Well done, guys!

  17. George Armstrong 14 Oct 2012, 2:49pm

    And yet does not support gay church marriage only gay civil marriage

  18. I am transgendered and I believe in the UKIP doctrine. I believe it is a party for equality. Of course there are always going to be types that are homophobic in any political party. I also believe if you want to change things you have to do it from within. You want the party to be truly for the LBGT community then you need to join and voice your opinion, and challenge homophobic stereotypes.

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