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Comment: We must stop apologising for being like everybody else

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  1. Oh get over yourself! Nobody but nobody is saying that lesbian women are promiscuous but that gay men are. That tells you everything you need to know: it’s not being homosexual that makes people promiscuous: it’s being male.
    I have nothing against gay men; but all this ‘we’re so unpromiscuous’ nonsense grates. You’re no different from heterosexual men in that you’re into no-strings sex. WOMEN-lesbians or straight-are the ones who are into monogamy.

    1. Actually some of my female friends are in polygamous relationships. So check your facts.

      Let people be people and use things like grinds and such. Not my cup of tea but c’est la vie.

    2. Seriously? ALL women are into monogamy?

      I can tell you for a fact that MANY women are into swinging, non-monogamy, polyamory, threesomes, foursomes, BDSM, experimental sex, hiring prostitutes, one-night stands and adultery (I include this as it is mistakenly considered a male preserve). To insist that ALL women are into monogamy (and are thus always into ‘love’ and ‘companionship’ over ‘sex’) is to feed into the slut-shaming and rape culture we currently live in. As well as being incredibly insulting to men, some of whom are quite capable of both monogamy and deep love.

      1. Rape culture?! What has rape got to do with any of this?! All I’ve said is that men, as a rule, are more into no strings sex than woman are. An obvious and universal truth one would have thought.

      2. Robert in S. Kensington 24 Sep 2012, 8:18pm

        You need to get out more. There are millions of straight women who also sleep around, I happen to know several. For every straight male serial adulterer there is a woman doing the same. Yes, there are many gay men and women who aren’t monogamous but that’s not the majority of us, just as it isn’t all straights doing it.

        1. Not to the same level as gay men and you must know that. Women, as a rule, are nowhere near as promiscuous-and I include lesbian women here, so nothing anti-gay about my view at all. Only men-of all sexuality- would be so easy about promiscuity. There may be women who behave the same, but simply nowhere near the same numbers. Not that there’s inherently anything wrong with promiscuity in itself, of course.

          1. I agree with sjr. I’m sure we all know some promiscuous women but, generally, men are driven to be more polygamous. Gay men, without the restraint of female partners, are able to indulge in frequent sex with strangers IF THEY WISH TO. I’m surprised that the original comment has been so thumbed down. This, in my view, is down to political correctness rather than good sense. Go on, thumb me down too – you know you want to.

    3. How about this. Instead of making silly generalisations we just acknowledge that some PEOPLE prefer monogamy, some PEOPLE prefer promiscuity, and some PEOPLE fall somewhere inbetween, or have a complex attitude that is not easy to categorise. These people may be of any gender.

      Then we can start relating to people as individuals, rather than assuming they are merely the reified embodiments of a stereotype.

    4. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 8:44am

      “Nobody but nobody is saying that lesbian women are promiscuous but that gay men are.”

      No… Nobody is saying that women are not promiscuous but that men are.
      It’s called “nature”. Now go sit down and have a nice cup of tea, dear.

      1. Men are always more into no strings sex than women-this applies equally to gay or heterosexual men. So all I am saying is that if a group of men who happen to be gay are together the chances are that no-strings sex will arise more so than with a group of lesbian women. Or do you disagree?
        Far from being anti-gay, I am actually offering an explanation as to why gay men behave as they do; they are most definitely not inherently more promiscuous it’s just that they have more opportunity. So I am not gay bashing (not that you have said that I am) merely pointing out that heterosexual men are no different but lack the chance owing to women’s natural monogamous tendencies (generally speaking, of course, but, then, having to say ‘generally speaking’ all the time is tiresome).

        1. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 5:03pm

          I totally agree.
          I think you have to break it down into two areas here, one is about having sex, and the other is about having a relationship: the two are not mutually exclusive as some people have open relationships, and others have sexless ones.

          I think the thing to note is that women prefer relationships, and are choosy about their partners because in real terms, it is they that are going to carry the child for 9 months and bring it up, whereas the potentially dodgy Father could simply disappear to new pastures after the dirty deed is done; men on the other hand, wish to spread their seed as far and wide as possible, with as many partners as possible in order to increase the probability of offspring.

          It is really all about propagation and protection of the genes, rather than children, relationships or even sex.

  2. This whole argument is absurd. Promiscuity in simply not good for your health. Masturbation can work wonders if you simply must get off. Wait till you find the person that you truly want to give yourself to before you have sex. I’m not saying wait for marriage. I’m simply saying that you should not have sex with strangers. Grindr is gross.

    1. Promiscuity is no worse for your health than driving a car, or going climbing. If you always use condoms and get a regular, 6 monthly sexual health check as a sensible and precautionary measure, there is no reason you shouldn’t have casual sex if that appeals to you. If it doesn’t, fine, don’t do it, but don’t get all judgemental at people who have casual sex and yet take a responsible attitude to their own sexual health.

      1. Nothing is STD Proof. Period. A condom won’t prevent crabs, it doesn’t always prevent herpes, syphilis, etc…It’s not acceptable and we shouldn’t excuse stupid and dangerous behavior. This isn’t the 70s. Free love is dead. Nothing in life is free. Period.

        1. Presumably you don’t drink alcohol? Or smoke? Or drive? Or engage in sport? If you wish to consistently moralise on the grounds of health, as you did before, presumably you oppose all those things and moralise on them too?

          Everything has a risk associated with it. I don’t excuse their behaviour because it’s not my place to make a judgement in the first place. It’s their business, not mine. The risk they take is minimal, particularly as the STIs you’ve cited are all either curable or typically are symptomatic/infectious only once. To suggest that crabs is a legitimate reason to pursue an outraged moral crusade against somebody’s right to do whatever they want with whichever consenting adult they want is beyond absurd.

          1. Very well said!

          2. Shockingly I don’t drink, smoke, I don’t drive, and I don’t engage in contact sport. I do moralize on them, but they weren’t the subject of the discussion.

            So since it’s curable it’s fine? We should encourage destructive behavior that can leave people infertile, etc… because we can just take an antibiotic and all is better? That’s absurd logic.

          3. Everything in life has a risk attached to it – we all have differing perceptions about risk verses benefit, surely it is up to the individual to decide on the risks they are prepared to take in life?

            The only sure way of how to avoid risk is not to live!

          4. You moralise on sport? Really?

        2. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 8:45am

          A man after my own heart! LOL!

      2. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 4:47pm

        There is the law of averages involved here:
        If you drive 1000 miles a month, you are more likely to have an accident against somebody that only drives 100 miles a month, no matter how good a driver you are.

    2. Masturbation is cool but it is not the same as sexual intimacy between two people. However both can be good for the health and particularly stress rediction.

      Promiscuity is not quantified so it is hard to comment on. Nevertheless many gay men who enjoy multiple sexual partners manage any additional health risks totally appropriately by utilizing safer sex methods and having regular health checks. Just like heterosexuals … many are incredibly responsible men who are both confident about their sexuality and mature in their sexual behavior.

      Of course there is, like heterosexuals, those who make poor decisions because of inexperience or immaturity, lack of confidence, feelings of low self, reduced control via substance abuse or lack of safe sex education.

  3. Zak – if you don;t want to sleep aropund, then don’t. No one cares what you do or don’t do but you. You are just as bad as the people that infer that str8s are “prim and proper” by saying that Grindr is “gross”. Live your life YOUR way – no one is stopping you. Your opinions about sex with new people is moot when it comes to how I may choose to live MY life.

    Get a driver’s license. It’s time.

    1. Why….to destroy our environment. I live in NYC. it’s silly to drive here. Period.

  4. Hmm I had a chat about this to my flatmate the other day (he gay man, I gay woman), about Grindr and the perceived promiscuity of gay men… I think, in the absence of such software for lesbians (apparently it’s never taken off) and lesser used heterosexual apps, it is just easier and, dare I say it, more common for men to be sexually promiscuous (I don’t think promiscuity is necessarily bad, if you’re keeping safe and healthy). An app like that is always going to be seen as more dangerous for women to use, and I don’t think many women have the same want for causal sex in that way. It is not a matter of gay people being more promiscuous than heterosexuals, but men generally being more promiscuous than women, so by logic gay men are going to be sleeping around more than straight men. I notice the article doesn’t mention lesbians? This is not me taking a moral high-ground, sex is sex if you’re safe but I do think men and women have different attitudes and approaches to sex.

  5. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 8:52am

    I really wish people would simply recognise a few simple facts:
    Men are hunters, women are hunted. That’s the way it works. Men shag anything with a pulse, and women are the picky ones that decide which ones they want.

    Once you transpose that fact into homosexual society, that is why gay men shag like rabbits and Lesbians don’t. It is also why gay men have problems with long -term relationships because of their need to “impregnate” as many as possible, whereas lesbians are picky, but once settled with a partner often bond for life.

    OK, socio-biology lesson over. Double history period next.

    1. Aw come on surely you don’t believe that binary crap? Men are A and women are B and that’s the way it works. I would suggest that the mere existence of a “homosexual society” rather puts paid to that suggestion doesn’t it?

      1. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 4:41pm

        However you like to put a spin on it, that is the way nature works.
        I’m not even going to suggest how alternative sexuality works; all I can say is it is not the ‘norm’ (not to say there is anything wrong in it, but if we were all gay, there wouldn’t be anybody at all).

        Animal sex drive is one of the most basic and primeval forces in all of us, and the desire to propagate the species, (even if somewhat misdirected in our case), still exists.

        The simple fact is, men will poke any hole they can find, but it is usually the women that act as a brake; with gay men there is no restriction, so we just do what comes naturally.

  6. I have always felt that there are two fundamental differences between heterosexual and gay promiscuity –
    1 – gays are more honest about it; and
    2 – straights actually have a lot more access to it.

    1. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 4:44pm

      I disagree.
      Straight men only have sex as long as women allow it, and although I think they have become more promiscuous, they still don’t hold a candle to many gay men.

      The average straight man has 15 sexual partners in a lifetime. I know many gay men, (including myself), who have had that many in a month.

      1. And when the women do not allow it as you put it Spanner what do “straight men” do………………………go and find another woman to have sex with or in some cases find another man! So my money is with Riondo on this one!

        1. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 10:43pm

          Straight men know which side their bread is buttered on.
          sorry, but as gay men,we are spoilt for choice – most straight men would rather hang onto what they have rather than risk losing it by looking elsewhere, and you flatter yourself if you think they would be so desperate to go with a guy, any more than most of us would look for an opposite sex partner just for a shag.

          1. Do you have to always use guttural terms (cobblers), in f your posting? Why do you so often feel the need to make your postings “colourful” in the language you use??? It strikes me that as most of your comments are & predictably negative you have to use such guttural terms to draw attention to them…………..

            “and you flatter yourself if you think they would be so desperate to go with a guy” there are many guys that have a wife & family that frequent bars, clubs & online dating sites, surely you know this from when you lived in London??? Identifying as Bi Sexual is the new gay, one only has to look at Gaydar pages to realise this!

            For a man of your years you really do come out with some very “odd” comments!

  7. If straight women, on the whole, were as promiscuous as men, on the whole, you’d see this kind of thing a lot more in the hetero community.

    However, this isn’t the case, and the fact we’re a minority highlights the promiscuity more in our community.

    That about sums it up.

    1. Spanner1960 25 Sep 2012, 4:45pm

      It doesn’t say gay men are more promiscuous than straight ones, it simply says we have more opportunity.

  8. Oh dear, let’s hope none of the anti-equal marriage rights brigade chance upon this debate.

    If men per se are hot-wired to be sexual hunters and predators, that hardly bodes well for us to swear undying loyalty and faithfulness “Till death to us part” to one another at the altar, does it?

    Could also explain why out of four civil ceremonies I have witnessed in recent years, three quickly fell by the wayside despite two of these couples having cohabited together for many years prior to being hitched.

    It does seem that once men are pair-bonded in the eyes of the law, panic and a feeling of suffocation sets in and the impulse to do what men do becomes stiflingly overwhelming…

    1. Spanner1960 26 Sep 2012, 6:51pm

      I don’t think the pair-bonding, official or otherwise has anything to do with it.
      Men will sleep around at any opportunity. The difference is, gay men would probably get more chance to have a bit on the side.

      The point is good relationships require true commitment, if you can’t guarantee that, stay single.

      1. Your views just about sum up all my thoughts on this issue.
        It would actually be better to admit that it is natural male sexuality that is behind gay male promiscuity for two reasons:
        1, It is the truth.
        2, It shows that gay men are no more inherently promiscuous than their heterosexual counterparts. This is surely a good thing as it would prevent demonisation of gay men as being naturally more promiscuous.
        All this ‘we’re just the same’ is rubbish. It’s sweeping it all under the carpet when the irony is that honesty would actually work in favour of gay men in showing that they are no different to heterosexual men.

        I honestly believe that lesbians are not demonised to the same extent because heterosexual men -who seem to run the world- have no jealousy or inbuilt aversion to lesbianism. Jealousy is a lot of it.

        1. Spot on, sjr.

          If women were sexually hot-wired like men, heterosexual culture would also be highly sexualised.

          All straight men are as capable as we are of frequenting cruising grounds and using apps like Grindr, but they don’t because those are not the kind of pursuits that women generally want to indulge in.

    2. Yes and no. I absolutely believe that gay men can be as loyal and committed to one another as it is possible to be. Do I think that sexual faithfulness is included to the same extent that it is with heterosexual people? No I don’t. Yes, I do think that a gay man will give up his life to defend his partner, but I don’t think that sexual faithfulness is seen as being so important. Is it for any man-gay or heterosexual? Yes, perhaps it is as it risks his wife getting pregnant by another man. His sexual behaviour must be held in check should he impregnate another female, too.
      Why should it be? Heterosexuals need sexual faithfulness as they produce children and sleeping around may jeopardise that.
      What is needed is a system that offers the same legal and financial rights as marriage that omits stuff about adultery and consummation.

      Whoops. It appears we have that already.

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