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London: Police urge ‘extreme care’ to gay club drug users after death in Vauxhall

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  1. perhaps its time for proper advice instead of “extreme care” which isn’t stopping anyone from overdosing – such as to only take half an XTC, not to mix drugs, to make sure to stay hydrated etc…

    1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 1:44pm

      Only take half?
      You really are a cretin of the worst order.
      For all you know, you could be swallowing rat poison, you don’t know what the hell is in that crap.

      For “proper advice” read: Don’t take drugs. Simples.

      1. your not going to stop people that want to take drugs from doing so, they know all of this, they are preached to about it constantly and it hasn’t done anything. My main concern is allow them their personal liberty but keep them out of our hospitals for being stupid.

        1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 2:49pm

          Well telling them to take half a tab is not going to help is it?
          With any luck, that way it will only half kill you.

          1. not really, taking half a tablet has half the content of a whole tablet. The same way that taking only 1 painkiller is not as strong as taking 2 painkillers. Illegal drugs will never have a mg listed so its all about minimising risk. People need to stop the whole “drugs are bad don’t do it” preachy attitude because that evidently doesn’t work,

          2. Yes Spanner, just as driving with double the amount of alcohol in your blood stream as is allowed is most likely going to cause damage, where half that amount most probably won’t.

          3. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 6:47pm

            I was being facetious.
            Like digging half a hole.

      2. Legalise them, purify them, control them…simples

  2. In other news: police warn pedestrians to look both ways before crossing the road and NHS advises washing out a cut to avoid infection.

    And anyway, if cause of death is not known, how to the police know it’s the drugs anyway?

    1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 1:46pm

      They don’t, but if they make statements like that you have a pretty bloody good idea it wasn’t from a dodgy bag of pork scratchings.

    2. Its standard protocol where there are a number of incidents that appear to be linked (particularly where at least one of them is a fatality) to issue warnings via police, health and other agencies to potential recreational users. Toxicology confirmatory tests can take as long as 14 days – so warnings of potentially toxic/contaminated or other concerns re an ongoing supply will be made early in an effort to protect.

    3. And in further news: Man plays game of Russian Roulette & is shot in the head – how on earth did that happen?

  3. i agree james, but intelligent discussion of drug use is impossible because of out of date laws. spanner your attitude is unhelpfui.. humans have always used substances to shift their levels of consciousness. telling people not to take drugs will never work. people want to explore and experience, the process should be respected not criminalised

    1. It is difficult to get legislation correct on this. There are areas which are legitimately restricted (and criminalised – usually supply etc) – however, protection and minimising harm should be the priority.

      Portugal appear to have had success by their change in approach over the past couple of years.

    2. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 2:54pm

      Why should I respect people that go around the law, help justify other crimes such as theft, robbery, burglary and even murder, force our police force and courts to spend all their time and resources on these people instead of enforcing other crimes and generally cause mayhem, upset, death and destruction everywhere they go just so they can “shift their levels of fcking conciousness!!??”

      You dippy-hippy types need to fcking wake up. There is one man dead, and two in hospital due to this crap and you want people to ‘explore and experience’ at the detriment of every other law-abiding person?
      Types like you make me puke.

      1. I wouldn’t say it should be “respected” but acknowledged that it does happen and will happen, just like a child with an overbearing parent pushing away their children telling them that they can’t do this or that if they are not harming anyone else then let them get on with it. I wouldn’t say one person who occassionally takes drugs or experiments = junkie or criminal. There is no evidence that every single person that takes drugs is detrimenting every single other “law abiding” person.

        1. Id disagree as it had a huge detriment to my social life when I lived in central London, I got so tired of being around the junkies in clubs around Vauxhall, there ended up being nothing social about being around a group of zombies chewing the insides of their mouths, looking vacant and patting their chests to the music all while talking shyte with their ‘best’ friends they didnt even know the first name of, eventually either passing out or filling the toilets areas with diarrhea ….. MMmm great night out to be had.

          1. such a true and sorry tale of gay party life! but ultimately its not the drugs causing this.. .its the fears, phobias, hangups, wounds, scars and general poor self esteem and spiritual awareness of most gay men! im not trying to argue drugs are good, but they are part of life, one little discussed and understood

          2. people are like that after alcohol – a legal drug.

      2. Being a non-dippy-hippy type (whatever that may be), what do you recommend doing about staggering number of alcohol-related deaths in the UK? Or are they all right because alcohol is legal?

        1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 6:33pm

          I’m not condoning alcohol misuse, but the point is a) it is legal, and b) it is quantifiable.
          If you drop a litre of vodka, you know the possible risks.
          When somebody gives you a little white tablet, you don’t know what is in it, what it could do, what strength the active ingredient is or what laws were broken getting it to you. It is wrong in so many ways.

          1. Agreed it is incumbent on you to be extra-cautious, though the same could be said for noxious substances like alcopops.

            But what you say is really the perfect argument for legalising recreational drugs.

          2. Spanner1960 7 Aug 2012, 9:53am

            @Rehan: I agree.
            The biggest problems with many drugs are not knowing what the drug is and how powerful it is, and consequently either being poisoned or overdosing. That tied to the fact the whole thing is linked to the criminal underworld makes it certainly worth considering legalising. Like I said about alcohol and tobacco, they are both dangerous, but they are legal, controlled and taxed – if people wish to take risks, that is then their choice.

      3. Spanner1960 – please get down off that high horse before you fall and hurt yourself sweetie. It has been proven time and time again that alchol (which is perfectly legal) does more damage than illegal drugs to people’s lives and our economy. These law-abiding people you speak off also include raging alcoholics who might be potential destroying their families emtional – but that’s OK because they are law-abiding, right? You sir, are a pompus idiot. And types like YOU make ME puke.

      4. Hodge Podge 12 Aug 2012, 12:54pm

        So bloody legalise and regulate it, instead of keeping it illegal just so you have someone to feel superior to.

  4. Screw being “extremely careful”.
    If you do illegal drugs you’re stupid and deserve everything you get.

    1. why? because they are illegal? not so long ago it was illegal to have sex with another man, so you would have said we deserved punishment for doing it?

      1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 6:36pm

        Why do you think they are illegal?
        Don’t you think the government would love to sell it and make tax on it?
        Don’t be so fcking naive. Every civilised country in the world has outlawed hard drugs for the simple reason they are trying to protect their populace. Drugs destroy lives; is that simple enough for you?

        1. You should read up about the historical struggles to get tobacco and gin regulated and taxed: the story of gin in the first half of the 18c is particularly fascinating (look up the case of Judith Dufour). It might make you see things in a slightly less black-and-white way.

        2. Robert Brown 6 Aug 2012, 8:02pm

          Actually . . . Holland and Portugal have the best laws and the lowest deaths / effects on ‘illegal drugs / highs’ . . .

          1. Portugals approach has been shown to seriously reduce deaths.

        3. Isn’t this then further proof that keeping drugs illegal is not working? Each time a new so called legal high comes on the market, people buy will buy it not knowing what is in it.

          If they were legal, the Govt. could sell them and use the tax to go to the NHS for example. Look at the drug wars that are happening in some south American countries.

          Remember alcohol and tobacco used to be illegal and now the actually have more effect on the NHS than those who take illegal drugs.

      2. Gay sex doesn’t do any harm. Drugs lead to high crime rates and people living on the streets and making theirs and others lives hell

        1. the far right would disagree with you there they would generalise that gay sex causes AIDS the same way you generalised that drugs lead to crime, homelessness and and anti-social behaviour.

    2. But addictive legal drugs like tobacco or alcohol are OK?

      1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 6:38pm

        Yes, because we know what they are, what amounts we are taking, and what the possible effects are. I smoke 2 packs of Marlboro a day. That’s my choice, and my funeral – I know the risks – many of these kids out there on cheap highs haven’t got a clue what they might be getting themselves into.

        1. I agree, and that’s why better advice – as james said in the first post – is really the key. You will admit, I think, that awareness of risk and possible effects has changed dramatically over the years – you should read about the bitter struggle to make the link between lung cancer and smoking public years ago. If you’d told people of our grandparents’ generation that smoking would be discouraged, and ultimately banned in public places, they’d have laughed you out of the room.

        2. Actually your pack of Marlboro doesn’t have an ingredient list of all the things they are cut with including:

          petrol, battery acid, arsenic (rat poison) as well as tons of other chemicals and carcinogens also not listed – the same as that XTC tablet or that bag of cannabis have no ingredient list.

          1. Spanner1960 7 Aug 2012, 3:12pm

            They also have a fcking great government health warning stating “Smoke this crap and you will die.”

          2. @spanner but with your point above you said you don’t know whats in the tablets, the same way you don’t know whats in your ciggarettes.

    3. Theres also “Legal” drugs that exist and cause harm such as one packet of painkillers is enough to kill a person or mixing it with alcohol (also legal) which can cause harm. I don’t see anyone screaming for paracetamol to be banned.

      1. Spanner1960 7 Aug 2012, 9:56am

        Sure, but they have warnings.
        Or maybe you want to legalise glue sniffing while you are at it?

        1. how many people read the full booklet included in packets of drugs they read the back that says how much to take then pop it – side effects aren’t even thought of.

          As far as I can tell glue sniffing is not illegal and theres a big warning that says “solvent abuse can kill instantly” the same one which appears on poppers which are legally sold.

  5. Spanner…you really are a wonderful non judgemental person who’s life, actions and world must be so fabulous to live in…after all you’ve never done anything wrong in your entire life! (Using words ‘cretin’ and fukwit’ to insult people is hardly polite.) People die all the time from using and misusing legal drugs such as alcohol so lets not all jump on the users of drugs just because they are illegal ones.
    BTW. I’m a recovering drug addict with more than 16 years clean, judge me if you care to cause haters always have to hate.

    1. Spanner1960 6 Aug 2012, 6:45pm

      As an ex-junkie, then I would have thought you would be the first to support me. I have had friends and acquaintances die of drugs, booze, smoking, AIDS, suicide, murder and numerous other things. That is all part of life’s (and death’s) rich tapestry.

      Everyone does stupid things at some point in our lives. Some of the unlucky ones don’t live to regret it. The point is, all life is a risk, but it really depends on what odds you are prepared to take. I’m not jumping on people because their actions are illegal; I am jumping on them because those things have been made illegal for very good reason, yet these people are still too stupid to see the writing on the wall.

      1. And why does that make it your job to be so unsympathetic and rude?

        Being a detached critical observer doesn’t make your opinion any more valid than the next person’s, yet you seem so ardently determined to be rude to those opposed to someone who disagrees withso much as a segment of one of your sentences?

        And as for “those things” being made illegal for good reason? In 2009 the most senior drugs advisor to the Government stated that ecstasy, LSD and weed were less harmful than cigarettes and alcohol. Please, by all means, have your own informed opinion on drugs and draw on your emotions from your own experiences, but you sound like a complete knob when you come out with rubbish like that. Oh, the government have made something illegal for our own wellbeing – silly us, not being able to look after ourselves! Don’t be so blind.

        1. the only reason they haven’t made baccy and alcohol illegal is because there is so much tax and duty on it (don’t believe me? go accross the channel and look at the prices in France, its why so many people go to Calle)

      2. AND, may I add, your comments aren’t exactly dissimilar to the brainwashed fools who make comments about how black and white life is when it comes to sex.

        “These people are still too stupid to see a man and a woman is a biological necessity to human life, and so homosexuality is WRONG.”

        “A man and a woman can procreate, the penis enters the vagina, it’s a no brainer.”

        YOU know life isn’t that simple (I assume) so why do you feel the need to stoop to the same plane of stupidity as people with a similar train of thought? I understand that the subject matter is totally different, but it’s this, “I’m right, you’re wrong, and there’s no middle ground” attitude that seems to be a mutual characteristic. Normally I would put it down to being an Internet fool who has to argue with absolutely everything, but I just think it’s crass and pathetic when you make such points on an article about a dead person. Just me perhaps?

      3. Why does anyone respond to spammer. he’s been everywhere done everything and always has a reactionary response . I don’t he’ he has to add

      4. As a Recovering Drug addict who is Irish, Gay and catholic…lol! I try my very very best not to judge the actions of others. If you wanna use drugs then thats ok by me, your choice. Wanna have unsafe sex…be my guest. I live in a glass house so I try not to throw stones. But if it goes wrong I’m not gonna say your deserved it! We all take chances, every day we smoke or drink alcohol, cross the road or take drugs, we win some, we lose some.
        I get to feel better about being me every time I forgive and not judge.

  6. Robert Brown 6 Aug 2012, 8:01pm

    Alcohol and Tobacco are drugs and are legal . . . they cause more deaths than so-called ‘illegal drugs or illegal highs’.

    More education needs to be done to ensure that the dangers are known.

    Antidote and other agencies actually do good work, including Drug Idol by Lambeth Police, to ensure that clubs, bars and users are aware of the dangers and the effects.

  7. The most damaging opinions stated here are the ones who bleat on about drug use being 100% unacceptable, ever. And unbelievably, I think I saw someone say these people deserve what they get? What an appalling and ignorant attitude. Just because you don’t do drugs doesn’t make you superior despite what you believe.

    People who smoke don’t “deserve” lung cancer, teenagers who get pissed out of their minds and jump off balconies in Ibiza don’t “deserve” to end up a squished mess on the floor.

    Similarly this story is a tragic result of drug use, but that doesn’t mean he “deserved” to die. I would put money that the number of people who did drugs the same night who woke up with nothing but a hangover (if they slept at all) ran into the hundreds. Drug use happens every single hour of every single day, in gay scenes throughout the country, and no ill effects are seen or heard of – because, I believe, on the whole, they aren’t as harmful as the government would have people believe.

  8. yousee your opinion as correct. why do you to post comments that berate ? if not taking drugs creates a dead character like yours I suggest everyone get mashed immediately.

  9. Spanners curmudgeonly finger wagging is funny coming from such a heavy smoker. I don’t know anyone who hasn’t tried recreational drugs. Illegal drugs kill around 2000 people per year. More than half of these will be from heroin or crack, rather than people just doing a bit of ecstacy or coke at the weekend. Smoking kills more than 100,000. Give up, Spanner. You know it makes sense.

    1. Spanner1960 7 Aug 2012, 10:00am

      There is far more to the whole drugs thing than simply the deaths.
      I know many current or ex drugs users that are still alive, but either drug-fcked, paralysed or in and out of mental institutions. I know a 30yo that was with sticks because he has wrecked every vein in his legs trying to get needles in them.

      These are the things that you don’t like to mention when you are dropping your K in the bogs of a club on a Saturday night, but they are often the result.

  10. It is rather ironic that the clubs where many of the patrons have taken a tab of XTC are the ones who, when they leave, may be chewing the inside of the mouth to pieces but they are all quiet, loved up and perhaps a little hyper. Yet, those who fall out of clubs where they have been consuming alcohol all night are the ones who are causing trouble and being lairy in the street.

    So now tell me which one of the two is worse and which one you would rather see at the end of the night. I know which one I would rather see and it is not the drunken f***tards!

    1. Exactly – in over 10 years of weekly clubbing I can still remember one fairly small brawl, only because it was the only one I ever saw in that sort of venue in all that time. People who’d overdone the drugs could be a tad tiresome on occasion, but they were never violent.

      1. Spanner1960 7 Aug 2012, 3:09pm

        Gay men generally don’t get as lairy when they are out and about.
        I’ve only every seen one fight in any gay bar ever.
        (and that was when I decked a straight bloke for getting nasty.)

        1. A number of the clubs and venues I went to weren’t solely for gay men.

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