Christian charity in all its glory!
“Same sex couples should have the right to get married” is not leading anyone. If you disagree with the idea of same sex marriage then the obvious answer would be “no”. This is clear and not misleading or manipulative. Unlike the questions that the Catholics used in their poll. Their desperation is encouraging.
It doesn’t need defending. It couldn’t be more clearly-worded.
In this idiot’s supposedly holy book, there’s a line about ‘not bearing false witness’ against others. Unsurprisingly, this member of the world’s most powerful child abuse ring seems only too happy to overlook that inconvenient injunction.
He should get back to his day-dreams of scantily-clad chorus boys.
Should the Roman Cult have the right to fiddle with children? No
Seems fairly clear question to me and should be asked asap!
“Mr Kearney said of marriage and racial equality: “The danger of equating one with the other is that it demeans those who are involved in the struggle for racial equality and minimises what they achieved. It’s an outrageous slur.””
Exactly how does drawing parallels “demean” those struggling for racial rights? What an empty piece of rhetoric. This Kearney moron is obviously oblivious that the black civil rights group NAACP has endorsed equal marriage.
There is nothing to defend the questioning was appropriate and honest.
The assessment was unbiased and principled.
Unlike so many other polls or petitions that the Catholics Church and their friends at Catholic Voices or the C4M are involved with!
And will the BBC be reporting this?
They’ve inserted part of Ipsos MORI’s response into their story, but the headline is still the same:
After most people will have seen and read the article yesterday when it was visible on their main Scotland news page. Their strategy is both appalling and transparent
Raping children and covering it up is “distorted”.
The catholic church would have denounced this poll whatever the question was. The Equality Network and Mori have nothing to worry about – this poll was handled professionally and properly.
I’m really disgusted at the cathiloc church’s statement about how you can’t equate gay equality with race equality – do they even realise how hateful they sound? It’s shameful.
What they really mean is “we don’t want you to equate them” because it shines a light on their previous attitudes when it came to racial equality and we all know what those were don’t we?
Absolutely, Kris! It’s also the fact that they are saying not to discrimnate against people becuase of their race but in the same sentence that it’s okay to discrimnate against people because of their sexuality! The hypocrisy is astounding, even for the bigoted catholic church!
yes, because asking “should LGBT people have the right to marry” is FAR more misleading than asking “should marriage continue to be defined as the union of one man and one woman”.
Yes, the good ol’ Roman church (please, people, stop calling it “catholic”. I belong to the United Church of Canada, and it IS a “Catholic” church – catholic = universal. And the Roman church HATES when people specify that it is, in fact the “Roman” church).
Peter Kearney said:
“To be honest the poll that matters is the three-month-long consultation that took place at the end of last year and in that one we know that the vast majority said marriage shouldn’t be redefined.”
I really hope the Scot Gov don’t treat the consultation as a poll, and that they’re not swayed by the catholic church over this issue like they have been over catholic adoption agencies and the cervical cancer vaccinations.
It’s also a worry that Peter Kearney himself has such close links to the SNP, standing as a Parliamentary candidate for them in the past, and I understand he even stood for Deputy leader of the SNP at one point. In fact, if I remember correctly, his appointment to his post in the church co-incideed with the church beginning to change it’s traditional support for Labour to the SNP.
There is a full statement on this issue from Ipsos MORI here:
As they point out, they did a previous poll asking whether same-sex couples should be allowed to marry (that is, without using the word ‘right’) and it got the same result!
The Equality Network and Mori have nothing to be worried about – the accusation by the catholic church that the poll is flawed or distorted, or whateve it was they said, is simply malicious because it flies in the face of their own “evidence” that most people are against marriage equality.
As someone who spent the first 20-odd years of his life as a catholic, I have no hesitation telling you what a corrupt, hypocritical and hateful organisation it is.
The Roman Catholic Church is deeply flawed. Now go home and think about what that means. Run along now.
What has been consistently demonstrated (to the benefit of lgbtq people) over the course of these UK consultations is just *how* highly a few old men in pink and purple dresses think of themselves. Only the most Conservative-voting village granny would have seen this raft of tv interviews and newspaper articles and felt remotely loyal to these imbedded but outdated institutions.
The average Briton who visits a place of worship once every 6 months/a year, has clearly felt rather uncomfortable by seeing their local faith leader effectively saying ‘we want none of that around here’ to a national media audience.
The existence of so many more out and proud non-heteros on tv and in the workplace has made Mr and Mrs Bloggs far less likely to ‘go with the flow’ when people like Mr Kearney spout such nonsense. Non-heterosexual people are no longer an abstract concept, they are a feature, big or small, of the lives of nearly every person in the UK.
I think you’re right, Max. I would like to add to what you’ve said by saying the problem is that all these church-going people may very well have been embarrassed and uncomfortable as you say, but most of them will carry on going to church and not say anything to their priest/minister or whatever. As long as they do that, then things won’t change within the church.
I’d like to see them stand up en masse and say to their church, whether it be Catholic, Church of Scotland/England or whatever, that they don’t agree with the church’s stance on gay issues. Then perhaps we’d see the beginnings of the churches changing their views on gay people.
Catholics accuse Ipsos-MORI of distortion…
…for everything else, there’s ComRes!
Basically what Mr Kearney is saying is that if you treat marriage laws as something which actually affect real people, the public supports equal rights, but if you act as if same sex couples don’t exist, then it’s easy to deny them rights.
As opposed to this reliable “survey” Scotland For Marriage are pushing –
Well, if the C4M 559,000 signatories completed the government consultation survey then that too must be deeply flawed.
The Catholic Church is so right. How disingenuous of Ipsos-MORI. Asking people straightforward questions like ‘should same sex couples be given the right to marry?’ is an all-too-familiar tactic of the Homosexual Agenda.
Loaded, meaningless questions like ‘should UNIVERSALLY accepted definition of marriage be CHANGED 4EVA???” and “SHOULD MARRIAGE AS WE KNOW IT BE DESTROYED???” and creating a fake grassroots consensus by making 10 year old schoolchildren sign your petition and ordering your congregations to do the same en masse is so much more intellectually honest and not at all perfidious or fraudulent.
“The public in general are very wary and unlikely to suggest a person shouldn’t have a right.” Why not? Your church does it all the time! What an idiot.
““When you begin your question by saying should someone have the right to same-sex marriage you automatically have distorted the result.”
Seriously? I don’t see that. Personally if people are opposed like the Catholic extremist then have the classic of making sure the word “Should” is ignored.
Hot air over trivial matters and I have to say I treat the Catholic Church with ‘scepticism’. It’s clearly they are loosing the argument to be so desperate.
The catholic cult will have a conniption when France introduces equal marriage this year or early in 2013. Apparently, in an article I read today, the first gay weddings will take place in early spring. The socialists now have a clear mandate and do not need the votes of other parties to get it passed. So it looks like France, then Scotland.
It’s more than a bit rich for the Catholic Church to accuse others of being distorted!!! Mote and Beam, Boys, Mote and Beam … look at your own gross distortions before you accuse others!!!
I do not accept the RC churches view that there is something wrong with this poll. I believe this poll has high integrity and rightly reflects the views of the Scottish population.
However, even if there were errors in its methodology etc – I would not regard the RC church, Catholic Voices or Comres as the appropriate guardians to set standards of opinion polls given their history of manipulation and deception.
Stu I suspect if the result had come out the other way we wouldn’t have heard so much as a muted peep out of the Catholic Church. It never ceases to amaze me how churches are so ready willing and able to be totally dishonest when it suits their purpose.
But then it seems it is NOT a ‘cardinal sin’ when a Cardinal commits it, or it is committed in his name!!!!
Stu less than a minute ago Report
Love this quote:
”In a democratic society, the separation of Church and State is of fundamental importance: freedom of religion means the Church should not be obliged to recognise gay marriage; democracy means that if the public want gay marriage legitimised then it is the responsibility of the State to effect that. Since couples can have a perfectly valid legal marriage without any religious involvement at all there should be no conflict between these two imperatives.”