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Poland: Teaching materials for nurses ‘calls gays socially dangerous’

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  1. Cardinal Capone 8 Jun 2012, 3:35pm

    If they are that inaccurate in one aspect of their training, how reliable is the rest of it. The rest of Europe should consider an embargo of Polish-trained nurses until a full review of their training methods is completed.

    1. That There Other David 8 Jun 2012, 5:08pm

      100% agreed. How can anyone trust any diagnosis from Polish trained health professionals?

      1. I have to say the Polish Anaesthetist who trained me to intubate was an amazing mentor and highly proficient at his clinicial skills.

        That said his role is rarely going to encounter issues of orientation!

    2. GingerlyColors 9 Jun 2012, 2:32pm

      And yet we are quite happy to play football there.

  2. Shake Spear 8 Jun 2012, 3:41pm

    Meh. It’s Poland, What did anyone expect?

    1. Racist much?? Have you ever even been to the country? You should pay attention to the last paragraph about the Polish Parliament having the world’s only trans MP- obviously the general population aren’t as discriminating as you would like to believe if they vote for GLBTI persons.

      1. Shake Spear 9 Jun 2012, 4:19am

        You’ve just proved my point, moron. You don’t need the whole population to vote in one MP.

        Racism has nothing to do with it. But nice try.

        1. WTF?! I’ve just proven your point?! Geez mister, you are thoroughly stupid aren’t you? The negative rating of your comment speaks for itself…

          1. Shake Spear 9 Jun 2012, 2:43pm

            To be fair, the people on this site are not the brightest, and unlike you I’m not angling to be Miss Popularity. Poland is a very homophobic country – I know first hand. Citing the incumbency of one MP as evidence that it is not (and especially on the back of THIS particular news story) is just dumb. Really, really dumb.

  3. Knowing Telegraph readers, they probably think the textbooks weren’t sufficiently clear that homosexuals were perverts.

    1. Actually it’s probably the Barclay brothers and some editorial contributors that are the real problem.

      The readers are often more enlightened and consistently vote massively in favour of equal marriage by around 80-20 whenever the Telegraph runs a poll.

      As the published stats show the Telegraph’s readership is almost exclusively comprised of over 55s (and therefore likely to be much more homophobic than the average), their poll results are actually quite encouraging.

  4. Another Hannah 8 Jun 2012, 4:08pm

    They need to understand that witch-hunting is not acceptable in modern europe and that they and their nurses will be rejected and looked down upon in modern european countries as unsuitable for first world work. Some very thick people in positions of power!

    1. You got that one right. There is no government in Poland it is merely a politcal club and nothing else.

  5. An exam paper on gynaecology asked: “Homosexuals are particularly dangerous socially and seduce individuals by …”. Multiple-choice answers included “abnormal sexual drive” and “prostitution”.

    So bad that it’s funny. Like something from a “League of Gentlemen” or “Monty Python” sketch, or perhaps a 1940s text book.

  6. Alessandro 8 Jun 2012, 4:41pm

    Vladimir Luxuria was elected in Italy and sat in the Chamber of Deputees from 2006 to 2008.

  7. This kind of tripe used to be in British Nursing teaching materials when I was in training. None of it was substantiated, nothing about it was academic, and all of it had to do with the warped, mainly middle-class, beliefs of the nurses who wrote them. It was never challenged either. Gay people were portrayed as something akin to repulsive slugs. Doctors weren’t any better either. It has, of course, changed greatly since then. But it wasn’t because any of the old crew changed their minds, but either because they retired and lost influence or died off.
    I am now glad to say that the whole thing about gay people has now been turned around 360 degrees.

    1. “360 degrees”

      Hoping you mean “180 degrees” or some equivalent metaphor for a positive change in course :)

      I think your point about the natural wastage of the ‘old crew’ is worryingly accurate in many professions. There seems to have been a closed-minded, closed-ranks generation who wouldn’t allow themselves to be questioned and resisted the concept of accountability and transparency.

  8. Sure, they can’t remove a text book because some people disagree with it.

    They must remove a book when it contradicts international expert opinion.

    The WHO International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems does not regard homosexuality as an illness or condition – it has no pathology.

    The longstanding consensus of research and clinical literature demonstrates that same-sex sexual and romantic attractions, feelings, and behaviors are normal and positive variations of human sexuality.

    Even the Chinese Society of Psychiatry removed homosexuality from its Chinese Classification of Mental Disorders in 2001 after five years of study by the association.

    The Royal College of Psychiatrists state “Evidence would suggest that there is no scientific or rational reason for treating LGB people any differently to their heterosexual counterparts.”

    They must edit or remove this book.

  9. Obviously this is inappropriate material to be used in training nurses.

    I’m not overly worried though – Poland has come on in leaps and bounds in very recent years on LGBT issues attitudes (still some way to go of course), so I expect this drivel will be removed from training materials pretty quickly.

  10. LGBT people were, and many still wrongly are, regarded as being ill or suffering from a disease. Only in 1990 did the WHO remove homosexuality from the International Statistical Classification of Diseases and Related Health Problems. The American Psychiatric Association removed homosexuality (which had been defined as a mental disorder) from their diagnostic and statistical manual of mental disorders in 1973. Despite the removal of homosexuality from the list of diseases, the Hammarberg Report of the Council of Europe published a report in early 2012 that gave evidence that in some EU member states health practitioners, official health policies and some textbooks in schools or colleges still apply the outdated classifications leading to factually and morally incorrect information on homosexuality. This is compounded by the fact that public opinion in many EU member states still consider homosexuality as a biological disorder or an illness that needs to be cured.

    While the

    1. scientific research of medicine, psychiatry and psychology clearly states that a homosexual orientation is not a disease, many people ignore this scientific evidence and knowledge and believe ideological prejudices spread by the media.

      Discourse which concentrates on homosexuality being a “disorder” ensure that dangerous prejudice is continued.

      The pathological discourse is dangerous for LGBT people because it is a means to deny dignity and human rights by treating LGBT people as infectious, dangerous or irrational. Pathological discourse almost automatically leads to the conclusion that the disease must be cured.

      The discourse of homosexuality as a disease can have many other facets e.g. seeing it as an addiction, mental illness, gender disorder, contagious disease, demonic possession, result of seduction, perversity, abnormality, being against nature or causing or degeneration etc

      It is none of these things, of course.

      The Polish government must act both to protect LGBT

    2. people and the integrity of their clinical services and clinical education.

  11. Poland must be using text books form 1840. Maybe we could all chip in and get help bring the country somewhere near 2012?

  12. I suggest recall the books and strike out the homophobic bit with a permanent heavy black marker.
    Catholics at their nefarious anti-gay hate-work again no doubt.

  13. This anti-gay propaganda is most likely the work of anti-gay Christian psychiatrist who use electric shock as “gay therapy” to make gays straight and pray the gay away.

  14. That’s just unspeakably awful.
    Don’t they vet their “experts”? It is way past time for the whole process to be challenged.

  15. Such views still prevail in the NHS – not in the text books by staff!!

    1. I don’t think they do when I was sexually assualted by my ex who then started to taunt me over claims that he was HIV+ the staff at the clinic where exremely helpful and caring

      1. Not necessarily the GUM clinics but other departments – also where a person lives may depend how lgbt are treated. Some areas/hospitals are better than others.

        1. As an NHS clinician, I object to any suggestion that the NHS are homophobic – sure, like any large organisation there will be some who are homophobic (if identified they should be dealt with appropriately by either employers, regulators or both).

          I hope my clinical practice and that of the vast majority of my colleagues acts in an impartial and caring manner regardless of sex, gender, orientation, race, age, ability, social background, religion etc etc

      2. Sorry to hear of your experience, penfold. Good to hear you got good support from the clinicians you were in contact with.
        Moving on from sexual assault is a difficult process – I wish you well.

  16. Jock S. Trap 9 Jun 2012, 11:34am

    Absolutely disgusting….

    Why does the European Parliament not act to stop countries abusing human rights?

    1. GingerlyColors 9 Jun 2012, 2:34pm

      As I have said before and some of my fellow correspondents have disagreed strongly with me over it, the European Court of Human Rights is about as much use as a pogo stick in a swamp.

      1. The European Court of Human Rights has no connection to the European Parliament.

        1. GingerlyColors 10 Jun 2012, 8:05pm

          I am aware the the ECHR is part of the Council of Europe which is a separate entity from the European Union. The European Court of Justice rules on EU matters but has no jurisdiction outside the 27 EU countries. Poland, as well as being an EU country is a member of the Council of Europe and therefore the European Court of Justice as well as the ECHR can rule on matters there. Euro 2012 co-hosts, the Ukraine is not in the EU, however and therefore the ECoJ has no power there but they are still subject to the Council of Europe and the ECHR. Having said all that it seems that the European Court of Justice is also as much use as a pogo stick in a swamp.

          1. The ECHR is a supra-national court established by the European Convention on Human Rights and hears complaints that a contracting state has violated the human rights enshrined in the Convention and its protocols. Complaints can be brought by individuals or other contracting states, and the Court can also issue advisory opinions. The Convention was adopted under the auspices of the Council of Europe and all of its 47 member states are parties to the Convention. The court is not part of the European Union. The jurisdiction of the Court has been recognised by 47 European states. Under Protocol no.11 of the Convention, effective since 1 November 1998, the Court became full-time and the European Commission of Human Rights was abolished. The Court of Justice of the European Union (ECJ) is not related to the European Court of Human Rights.
            Russia and Ukraine are signatories of the Hague Convention and as such accept the jurisdiction of the ECHR.

  17. GingerlyColors 9 Jun 2012, 2:33pm

    Florence Nightengale would be turning in her grave at such homophobic poison.

  18. Keith Farrell 10 Jun 2012, 11:45am

    This is always what we have to put up with, Lip service.
    Sometime we are going to have to take a very stand against this sort thing. We are people and deserve equal rights and equal respect. being gay is not something you can choose being homophobic is something you can choose

  19. The Polish Government’s atitude is that the people of Poland voted them in and therefore the people accept that the present government has done nothing in the past and so why should anything change now. One of the 10 year olds that I teach told me even if i try to change anything nothing will change. Out of the mouths of babes and suckling etc….That text book will not change as there is total indifference by the Polish Government to the needs of others. It is more of a political club than a government and is one of the best TV reality shows on Polish TV at the moment. There has not been an effective government in Poland for the past 60 years. The Polish people do not have many choices and a choice of which politcal party to vote for is one such non choice.

  20. Dennis Velco 11 Jun 2012, 12:35am

    Thanks for your reporting on this.
    I posted it to my LGBT Group on LinkedIn and also made a comment there to spur members to read your article and to make comment. I also scooped it at Scoop.It on my LGBT Times news mashup.

    Link to group >>

    All LGBT+ and community allies…. please come join me and 14,000 of your soon to be great friends on LinkedIn. The member base represents 80% of the world’s countries.

    It is strictly professional office friendly dialog, posting and profiles / profile images. I’ve been told by many that it may well be one of the best run / managed groups on LinkedIn. It even has several LinkedIn top executives as members.

    You can be as out or private as you like and I provide instructions on how to set those preferences (In the Manager’s Choice area).
    EVERY new member is placed automatically and systematically on a temporary 100% moderation.

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