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London mayoral candidate Ken Livingstone on ‘ex-gay’ buses, policing and the White Swan

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  1. So where’s Boris’ amazing LGBT manifesto then?!

    1. Who knows? I doubt that he ever had one

    2. Craig Nelson 2 May 2012, 4:15pm

      Let’s hope it comes out before the actual election….

      1. does he know that the election is actually tomorrow?

  2. Some interesting comments there from Ken.

    Boris has ridden rough shod over a lot of ground work Ken had done.

    1. Ken Livingstone’s so-called ‘work’ for the LGBT community consisted mainly of finding a few small pet groups run by his Socialist Action friends to attack other gay groups as ‘racists’ and ‘islamphobes’ for criticising Islamic hate preachers (some guests at City Hall) and murder musicians from Jamaica. Peter Tatchell was relentlessly attacked by Livingstone’s minions.

      1. Stuart Neyton 2 May 2012, 1:01pm

        When did any of that happen? He created the register that gave way to civil partnerships?

        1. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 7:14pm

          Like that did any good whatsoever.
          It wasn’t even legal. It was simply a token symbol to keep gays happy. He might as well have handed out Green Shield Stamps for what that register was worth.

      2. Against Boris who was oposed to the repealing of Section 28, would not have banned that CORE advert had it not been for the public outcry and he knew he needed to keep his gay voters sweet and whenever he attends London Pride, he looks bored by it all!

      3. Staircase2 2 May 2012, 5:46pm

        @Fred – that is party political bollocks…

  3. Will you commit to de-twin the London and Tehran, the capital city of Iran, a country whose penalty for being gay is death?
    TALKING of Tehran, lets just remind everyone that Livingstone is a former employee of Press TV which is run and funded by the Iranian govt who kill gay people !

    1. Staircase2 2 May 2012, 5:50pm

      @Mark Thats also bollocks – I wish you EDL/Tory Party supporting commentsboarders would at the very least have to declare your own vested interests when posting your thinly veiled right-wing propaganda.

      Disinformation and misinformation are not the stuff of proper debate – they’re designed to skew the debate in order to plant seeds of doubt in voters minds – so that you lot can hope to harvest the votes instead.


      1. yes we get few people who only post on PN around the elections

      2. I don’t understand why you think Mark is a member of the EDL or Tory party? I hope you’re not jumping to conclusions just because he doesn’t support Ken. Talk about disinformation. Mirror.

      3. Staircase – He who cast the first stone….

  4. Robert in S. Kensington 2 May 2012, 3:23pm

    The only thing that Boris could present as amazing would be a list of the majority of Tory MPs who support equal marriage which we all know they do NOT. Even if they did, why aren’t they coming forward to show support?

  5. He seemed to answer every question BUT ONE directly.

    Question number three was very straight forward and clear but in his two paragraph response he completely failed to answer the simple question asked. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt and assume that his lack of direct answer to the direct question was an unintentional oversight. We’ll give him another swing at it. So here’s the question again Mr. Livingstone:

    When the StraightWay Foundation congratulated you on your meeting with Yusuf Al-Qaradawi and you thanked them for their letter, WERE YOU AWARE THEY WERE A GAY CURE GROUP?

    1. Staircase2 2 May 2012, 5:53pm

      I cant believe this:

      he made his opposition to their work very clear (which bit is it you have problems understanding?)
      “My record on opposing organisations that attempt to ‘cure’ homosexuality is unequivocal: so called ‘ex-gay’ movements are fronts for deeply-held homophobic beliefs and their existence only serves to harm LGBT people and the wider community.”

      And by the way – its question #4 – not 3…

      1. Question:

        When the StraightWay Foundation congratulated you on your meeting with Yusuf Al-Qaradawi and you thanked them for their letter, WERE YOU AWARE THEY WERE A GAY CURE GROUP?

        “Very clear” Answer (according to Staircase2):

        “My record on opposing organisations that attempt to ‘cure’ homosexuality is unequivocal: so called ‘ex-gay’ movements are fronts for deeply-held homophobic beliefs and their existence only serves to harm LGBT people and the wider community.”

        I’m sorry Staircase2, perhaps poor reading comprehension or basic daftness might explain why I “have problems understanding”, but I STILL haven’t found the answer to the question in that statement. Perhaps you, with your superior intelligence and reading skills can show me where he said that he was aware that the group he thanked was a gay cure group.

        I’ll be happy to wait for your response.

        And don’t rehash that he said he was against gay cures. That’s a red herring THAT WASN’T THE QUESTION ASKED.

        1. And NO, it was question 3. The first question had two parts.

  6. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 3:44pm

    The man is slipperier than a bucket of eels.
    I still wouldn’t trust him as far as I can spit.

    1. Rashid Karapiet 2 May 2012, 4:36pm

      Slippery as a bucketful of eels? With the range of third-rate but powerful elements against Mr.Livingstone how else could he survive? Londoners will decide, of course, but personally – and I have spoken to Mr.Livingstone – I’d prefer eels to stale non-vintage champagne.

      1. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 6:02pm

        Let me guess. A Muslim resident of Tower Hamlets?

        1. let me guess, islamophobe?

          1. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 7:10pm

            Let me guess. Politically correct fckwit?

          2. if you are such a fan of political incorrectness why would you then have a problem with homophobic muslim hate preachers? or are you just a fan of selective political incorrectness

  7. Lumi Bast 2 May 2012, 4:03pm

    The majority of people that follow Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Baha’i, Mormonism, Jehovah’s Witnesses ARE homophobic, don’t care about homophobia and in fact wish it was more rampant, and don’t care about laws protecting LGB people and in fact would rather have more laws against them.

    I still wouldn’t trust this guy since he’s “hung out” with a homophobic “gay curing” Muslim

    1. Lumi Bast 2 May 2012, 4:08pm

      To me it sounds like he’s saying what the thinks people want to hear, he doesn’t sound genuine
      I’d also like a direct answer to the question about the gay cure group

    2. Lumi, your point is a totally overreactionary and unhelpful comment. You may say the majority of people YOU KNOW that follow… ARE homophobic but in no way are you in a position to statistically back your statement up with hard facts. And to make statements like that serve no purpose other than to stoke up anti-religious sentiments. I have no religion but I have no issue with those who do, THAT I KNOW, who have no issue whatsoever with LGB and T people.

      1. Well. Lumi does have a point in regard to religion and homophobia. Various studies have proven that the majority of practicing muslims and christians throughout the world….. are homophobic. She’s not making that up, it’s a fact.

        1. Staircase2 2 May 2012, 5:57pm

          And how does that compare with the majority of people in much of the (previously British Empire dominated) world though? Unless you have something to compare it to then it means nothing…

          …Aside from propaganda and disinformation that is…

          1. It compares because now, the majority of people in the western world are not as homophobic as they were – which is why we have some freedom and equality – and this is due to the mono faiths mentioned not having as much power as they once did. And most of the worlds population that are homophobic are governed by the monotheistic faiths that Lumi mentions. Take islam for example; in the majority of muslim countries, where islam has power over the way in which the countries are governed, we are criminals, and are imprisoned and executed. Whereas in this country and throughout europe, where christianity has no direct control over government, we have equality. So I think your suggestion that blaming mono faiths for homophobia means nothing, and is propaganda and disinformation is exactly what you accuse me of.

    3. Sue Brown 2 May 2012, 5:09pm

      The doctrines are homophobic. I don’t speak for the majority because I don’t know them, but those I do know are more apathetic than actively homophobic. They are more interested in their own lives than pursuing a hate campaign against people they don’t know. Even the fundamentalists I have met were more interesting in not discussing the subject than spewing out the formulaic hatred.

      The religious authorities may claim to speak for their flock but we are not all the same. Some of us who are Christian (or whatever) are watching the current mouthing of the patriarchal hierarchy with despair.

  8. In any event, Ken has my backing. There is too much at stake to allow Boris to be re-elected and it is absolutely essential to send out a message against austerity and racism.

    Having said that, Ken’s answer to the question about the StraightWay Foundation is not satisfactory at all. I suspect the question might have been put to him differently than how it looks on paper, but it’s more likely this is just Ken being a typical politician failing to offer a straight answer.

    Nobody is questioning Ken’s record on Christian ex-gay groups. It just might have been good if he had taken this opportunity to account for his frankly bizarre gesture to an Islamic ex-gay group.

    It goes without saying relations between the gay community and the muslim community is a very sensitive topic with much misinformation disseminated by the likes of Andrew Gilligan among others. If Ken cannot answer these allegations, then all I can say is that what he did was worse than counterproductive.

  9. Paddyswurds 2 May 2012, 5:45pm

    Whatever Ken Livingstones faults, and we all have them, he is the better candidate for the job as far as London GLBs are concerned. He has a proven track record when it comes the the down trodden and GLBs in particular,
    On the other hand hooray Henry Boris is an ignorant boor who courts the GLB community only when he thinks it will serve his purpose. Where is this announcement that “would amaze the world” he promised on April 30.
    That day I commented ; “Is he not just being cynical in the lead up to the Mayoral election Previously he likened Gay sexual relations to bestiality?” Unless he makes his “amazing announcement in the next six hours, it looks like my opinion was well founded and he still has bestiality on his mind in regard to his GLB constituents. Frankly I think it is time to send Law and Justice Homophobic Tory twit Boris packing

    1. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 6:07pm

      So maybe he is better for LGBT people than any of the others, but do you live your life in a gay bubble? Do you have gay councils, gay police, go to gay work on a gay bus and change to a gay tube, and get attacked by gay muggers with gay knives? Send all your gay kids to gay schools and go to gay hospitals because of gay flu?

      Get bloody real. There is more to life and London than one’s fcking sexuality, and its about time people started recognising it.

      1. …and your proposed remedy to all this is the clown?!

        1. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 7:12pm

          Did I say that?|
          All I said is Red Ken is not to be trusted. He will be all things to all men to get himself in power and then drop all the pretences and promises and just feather his own nest just like he did before.

          1. so what is your choice of remedy then?

          2. Spanner1960 2 May 2012, 10:31pm

            I guess it’s all about picking lesser of a number of evils, so I guess I would hesitantly plump for Boris, as he has so far proven his worth, whereas ken has demonstrated his incompetence on many occasions, and the others are unknowns or no-hopers.

      2. Paddyswurds 2 May 2012, 7:17pm

        And you think the Law and Justice Tory twit who likens GLB to bestiality would be a better bet….get real. Nor would Paddick cause he is a fool and preening simpleton

  10. Some excellent questions. Livingstone seems to have his head screwed on with his answers. Still a bit unsure about the ‘riddled with gays’ comment he made a while ago; he obviously wasn’t thinking properly that day, but he does seem far more aware of LGBT issues than most straight politicians. I’ve visited my local MP a few times, for example, and they really don’t have the faintest idea about LGBT issues. It does feel like we seem to spend a lot of our time having to educate nearly everyone sometimes.

  11. Michael Inkpin-Leissner 2 May 2012, 9:25pm

    First of all thanks Ken, for taking the time to answer these questions. Secondly, please take the same hard stand against hatecrimes done by muslims or jews or jehovas witnesses or atheists (they are sometimes more radical than the religious people) as you do agaist the so called reborn christians. To those who criticize Ken, he is not gay, so he cannot by all means understand all of our issues, now be fair here. London is not gay there are important issues about the whole community of Londoners. Get a grip!

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