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Guyana: Public consultation on removal of anti-gay laws

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  1. I guess this is a positive step. However, they should not take ‘advice ‘ from religious leaders under any circumstances as we all know what their ‘advice’ will be.

  2. I bet the deluded usual trolls like Aiden will say this will “never happen”.

    Didnt the same sort of thing they used to say maybe 10 years ago when gay rights started to be seriously accepted across South America, it would never happen – now the last country to be left needing to decriminalise is considering it.

    The outdated will be shown for their ignorance and their inhumanity.

    Good luck Guyana.

    1. No mention of the British colonial influence. Stu is still in deep denial of the reasons why Guyana has homophobic laws in its books. Before the British arrived, homossexuality was accepted in South America darling, you shouldn’t blame South America for the homophobic culture Europeans brought with them into the continent. Good luck Guyana? You coudn’t be more patronising …

      1. @Beberts

        What do you have to offer Guyana?

        I at least wish them the best.

        You seem obsessed with colonial interest. I prefer to look to the future, rather than immerse myself in the past (your obvious preference). I prefer understanding the here and now, rather than the fantasy world of the past.

        This story is not about my thoughts, or your thought – neither matter.

        What does matter is that the Guyanese people are seeking to make decisions and demonstrate self determination. Thats positive strong and something I celebrate (you may call that patronising, but to be frank, I don’t care less – I think your obsession with historic events which are largely irrelevant in the story (and certainly I had no hand in as a 37 year old) are the patronising comments that demonstrate you care more for rhetoric and personal vilification than for securing LGBT rights whether in Guyana, UK or elsewhere).

        I say again, with no intention of patronising and every sense of support – Good luck Guyana!

        1. One can see right through you darling. You “prefer” to “look into the future” in complete denial of past colonialism only for your patriotic convenience. When it’s convenient, you are more than willing to indulge in the past. In fact, you’ve been the first to mention the past many more times than once. How condescending and patronising for denying the Guyanese colonial past and its central role on today’s mess … and you still have the nerves to blame South America for homophobia, as if “gay rights started to be seriously accepted in South America” 10 years ago…. That sentence alone couldn’t be more off the truth… and you have only your own sense of detachment from reality to blame for your lack of knowledge. Or perhaps you do that on purpose, which appears to suit your personality. Can you promote “self-determination” when you decide unilateraly to erase the people’s past for your own convenience?

          1. @Beberts

            I prefer to look to the future and build success.

            As I have said I find colonialism of any kind abhorrent. No matter how many times you try and state that I feel different does not make your lies real.

            So, unlike you, what have I done to try and help further in this matter.

            I have contacted the Guyanese Society Against Sexual Orientation Discrimination (http://www.sasod.org.gy/) and offered them any support they need. They have thanked me for my offer, and offered a few practical steps that I can make.

            One of them you (and other readers of PN may like to take up), emailling the local guyanese embassy to help encourage decriminalisation.

            For your assistance I have even looked up the UK embassy email address for you:

            guyanahc1@btconnect.com

            Now, you can continue patronsiing me and insinuating things about me or you can choose to help Guyanese people in the practical ways they personally suggest – which is it to be?

            My email has gone and I am working on other help.

          2. @Beberts

            So I say again, what are YOU doing to help the Guyanese people?

            Or are they less important to you than trying to insinuate untruths about me?

            How are you helping?

            How are you making the future better for Guyana?

            How are you ensuring LGBT people have human rights in Guyana?

            How are your actions improving things for LGBT in Guyana?

            Please tell us, Beberts …

          3. Ok, you are offering support to the Guyanese, so you cannot overlook and ignore the colonial past and its central role on the actual situation. You need to denounce it before anything else. Contact the UK government to ask them to stop patronising Guyana and South America and instead recognise its wrongdoings in the region. Let the chickens come home to roost darling. Don’t be afraid.

          4. Contact the UK government to ask them to stop patronising Guyana and South America

            So (darling) you’re suggesting Guyana is incapable of achieving anything without an apology from the British government (darling)? How patronising is that (darling)?

          5. @Beberts

            Darling, sweetie …

            (said in as non-patronising a tone as possible)

            But what are YOU doing, Beberts?

          6. Stu honey, what you must do is exactly what I’m doing, I’m constantly denouncing the wrongdoings you’re trying hopelessly to conceal. Remember: forget or ignore the wrongdoings and they’re bound to be repeated. Don’t be afraid to denounce your own nation’s wrongdoings. Do that before even considering denouncing the others, particularly when your nation is central to their problems.

          7. @Beberts

            Darling, thank you for your patronising comments agains (darling) about what i “must” do.

            What I “must” do (darling) is what I believe to be right, not what you (darling) tell me to be right.

            What are you doing to help Guyana … ah – that will be nothing.

          8. Sometimes you need to do what is right not what you believe is right. What’s the reason you’re ignoring the central role of colonialism on the actual situation? It cannot be because you “look into the future” … That phrase could come straight out of CallMeDave’s arsse. It’s as empty and vague as a “Big Society”, or “We’re all in this together”… It means nothing. If that’s the best you can offer, nothing would be better, and I’m not afraid of telling you so. I’m just pointing you to the right direction. Guyana and its rich history deserves none of your patronising attitudes. My denounciations do more to lift Guyana than your condescending emails offering “support”, or “asking” for decriminalisation to be lifted, as if it were to have any sort of effect when your own nation isn’t a beacon of equality. CallMeDave’s condescending threat to withdraw financial support had the opposite desired effect … go figure…

          9. @Beberts

            I make my judgements on what is right. I carefully weigh up the impact of what difference I can make. I have make a series of emails my contact in Guyana has suggested and am trying to work out how to do a couple of other things they suggested may help them.

            These are actions that the LGBT people in Guyana themselves asked me to consider doing when I contacted them to help them in their campaign for human rights.

            It seems right to me, it seems honourable.

            I note you constantly fail to answer the question about what YOU are doing to help the people of Guyana.

            You prefer to patronises (darling), tell other people what to do (rather than making a difference yourself) and look to history and wallow in the past (rather than look to change the future and help others build their own success).

            Making a difference is not about telling others what to do or think, it is supporting those in need and helping them achieve their goals (darling).

          10. @Beberts

            How are you helping the people of Guyana?

          11. Your attitude is screaming to be seen as well and dandy, wanting to feel good and altruistic, such energy could be used to make some good… but …. you funnel it totally in the opposite direction … What do you want me to say? Well done and give yourself a tap on your own back? Look yourself in the mirror. What you’re trying to hide from the Guyanese is more important than what you show them. You’re well intent in denying their history and ignoring the real responsibilities for what is happening. Worse still, you blame them for what is not their fault. Never brush the dirt under the rag, darling. Someone else might lift it one day and discover who is really responsible for the mess. With such friends who really needs enemies?

          12. @Beberts

            Rather than your bizarre and twisted attempts at character assassination (which I merely laugh at) …

            Try and answer the question I have posed more than sis times now and which you have refused to address each and every time:

            What are YOU doing to help the people of Guyana?

            Can you answer a simple question, and give clear examples of what you are doing and how you have ensured that it will support the Guyanese people achieving equality?

          13. Don’t thank me, you are doing the character assassination yourself darling, I’ll just make sure you can carry on laughing at yourself.

          14. @Beberts

            Thats obviously a “no” you can not answer a simple question.

            Lets, make it simple (for now over seven times)

            What are YOU (thats you Beberts), doing to help the Guyanese people achieve equality?

  3. A total overhaul is needed. Not just decriminalisation, but granting of legal rights and recognitions.

    1. I agree but at least this is a step in the right direction

      1. @D McCabe

        When all rights are suppressed, having some of the oppression being potentially released has to be a good thing.

        It could hopefully be seen as a good motivation to those who wish to ensure full rights and recognitions.

    2. You never know, it may happen that way — New Zealand went from male homosexuality being completely illegal to the laws being equalised with those for non-gay people in one swoop (in 1986).

  4. Paddyswurds 5 Apr 2012, 11:27am

    I am as always mystified as to how or why religion ever got accepted as having dominion over human sexuality, a basic animal function as important as breathing and eating.
    Every day of my life nowadays I see reasons why I hate the whole religion thing so very very much and am so sad for those suffering from and under this vile affliction….

    1. Maybe we should try to invent some relion therapy to free those tortured souls from it’s evil clutches? See how the churches like it then?

      1. Robert in S. Kensington 5 Apr 2012, 1:27pm

        Yes, let’s have an ex-religionist ministry. How the right wing christo-fascists would squeal. I can just hear them…..”freedom of religion under attack”. I nominate Professor Richard Dawkins as founder.

        1. I will support it, provided it takes care not to ensure that its comments can not be negatively twisted by C4M and others and cause damage to the campaign for equal marriage.

          1. Robert in S. Kensington 5 Apr 2012, 3:07pm

            They’ve already twisted the facts in spite of Lord Carey’s own admission and acknowledgement that the church doesn’t own marriage and that allowing equal civil marriage wouldn’t affect them directly. If they believe CPs are sufficient, let alone equal, why aren’t any of them demanding access to one? In fact, why aren’t heterosexuals in general demanding them? I think the reason they’re not is obviously clear. I strongly believe the more they rant against it, the more they’ll be helping progress towards equal marriage. I don’t think the British public by and large take them seriously since the majority do not worship.

          2. Fair point about them appearing out of touch and lacking any sense of relevance.

            I remain concerned though that there have been examples where individuals and organisations have seized on NSS and other reports and twisted them and brought focus to what was either a non-issue or a negiligible issue and brought unnecessary negativity to the campaign for equal marriage.

            All I am saying is the NSS, supporters and other similar organisations need to take care not to give them ammunition.

          3. Robert in S. Kensington 5 Apr 2012, 6:50pm

            Stu, I do share your concern. Of all things, our side and those who support us should tread very carefully prior to equal marriage getting through Parliament. I also think that the opposition, C4M in particular, should not be allowed to get away with spurious claims that have no basis or justification. They should be rebuffed in an intelligent, constructive way but in a very firm tone. C4M are incapable of producing one shred of evidence in regard to their insinuations that equal marriage would herald polygamous and other forms of relationships. There just isn’t evidence to support such a ridiculous notion now that ten countries permit us to marry, absolutely none. I don’t feel enough has been said or done to address those assumptions which in my view is extremely offensive and insulting, in fact, disgusting. We and our supporters have to be ever vigilant to make sure those allegations don’t resonate with the population at large and C4M should be held accountable.

          4. @Robert

            100% agree with that comment.

            We need to tread carefully.

            We also need to robustly confront the lies that the C4M and others perpetuate.

  5. One of the last South American countries to decriminalise homosexuality. Of course, only men are the victims of the law! Obviously no lesbians in Guyana! lol

    1. It could be like New Zealand pre-1986, where all male homosexuality was illegal but there was no restriction on female homosexuality, the story being that when Queen Victoria asked why the proposed law included women (because, it’s said, she couldn’t imagine such a thing) no-one had the courage to explain, so she crossed all references to women out.

      1. GingerlyColors 5 Apr 2012, 3:57pm

        You will probably find that this is or was the case throughout much of the former British Empire. Queen Victoria apparantly didn’t enjoy sex and thought that women in general didn’t so she didn’t see why two women wanted to do it with each other. Many people believe that Queen Victoria’s refusal to give Royal Assent to the part of the 1885 Act decriminalising same sex acts for women is an urban myth.

        1. Actually it would seem that Queen Victoria enjoyed sex a great deal, she was from all accounts passionately into her husband and appeared to get much satisfaction from their intimacy, and was incidentally by no means averse to masculine beauty even, or especially, when undressed. The tiresomely negative creature she became in later life is more likely due to her widowhood and her feeling that no-one else should enjoy themselves while she was mourning than from any inborn lack of sensuality.

          I’m quite willing to believe the urban-myth bit, but it leaves the anomaly otherwise unexplained – ?

  6. GingerlyColors 5 Apr 2012, 3:53pm

    Guyana, please remove that nasty stain of state-homophobia from the face of South America forever!
    It is sad that the only two English speaking countrys south of the Mexican border still criminalize homosexuality, the other being Belize. There are aspects of British colonialism that belong to the past and hopefully, state sponsored homophobia will join slavery in the dustbin of history. None of the other South American countries criminalize gay sex so the presure is on you, Guyana. As for marriage equality, if it is good enough for the Argies then it is good enough for everyone else!

  7. Lumi Bast 5 Apr 2012, 9:41pm

    I hope Guyana moves forward and has completely equal LGB rights (marriage will take a long time though IMO)

  8. `Sodomy and Buggery Laws = more HIV-AIDS infections for everyone in Guyana.

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