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New Senegalese president called on to protect gay rights

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  1. Nice gesture, but it’ll get nowhere. West Africa is lost to us for at least another 100 years.

  2. Good luck – they’ll need it.

    Incidentally, a couple of people on another thread last week were claiming that French colonies didn’t have anti-gay legislation as former British colonies did (and do): so what happened with Senegal?

    1. @Rehan

      How do they explain DRC Congo and Algeria (both former French Colonies and both with current or formerly repressive anti LGBT approaches)

      1. Also Mauritania, which currently has the death penalty for homosexuality – I did ask last week, but surprisingly (not) no-one replied.

        1. Colonial oppression introduced Christianity and anti gay laws to Africa. Colonial oppressors left leaving behind Christianity and anti gay laws so they could continue oppression of African gay people

          1. True, but not just British Colonial powers …

            French, Belgian, German, Dutch and Portuguese too!

  3. Good opportunity to urge improvements in human rights.

    Macky Sall in his election campaigning did comment on the need to ensure that Senegal is seen to be fair, honest and humane. Whilst, this does not necessarily mean he endorses LGBT rights improvements – it would be a great way of demonstrating that he matches his words supporting huamn rights – with action.

    I remain skeptical that he will change things, but we shiould urge him on.

  4. Even if he does do anything, they still have a very long way to go in terms of LGBT rights and equality

    1. There is a great deal to do. He has to start somewhere though!

    2. That’s probably what people said in the UK before 1967, especially after the publication of the Wolfenden Report a full 10 years before.

  5. Paddyswurds 3 Apr 2012, 12:50pm

    Does anyone know what particular strain of the Abrahamic cult infection Senegal suffers from. Not that it really matters, all of them are vile homophobic abusers of human beings for their own ends, mostly money and power

    1. Surprisingly, according to Wikipedia it’s Sufism, one of the least militant and aggressive sects.

    2. According to the CIA factbook I just checked, 85.4% Muslim (predominantly of Sufist origin which is liberal), 10% Christian (mostly Catholic although with a small number of United Reformed, Methodist and Unitarians), 1% Animist and a number of others who are a mix of Jewish, Buddhist, Bah’ai and unknown or none.

  6. Paddyswurds 3 Apr 2012, 1:10pm

    Wher is my bl**dy post, Pink News. Please get to grips with this disappearing comment thing………

  7. In today’s Africa homosexuality is seen as immoral, un-African and a product of colonialism. Religions have a strong role in making sure it stays that way

    1. Homosexuality existed long before colonialism.

      Colonialism brought homophobia to Africa.

      Religion seeks to subjugate people – homophobia is one of the tools of some corrupt religious leaders to control and demean people to their control.

      Thats precisely why we need to demonstrate the lies and untruths of some religious leaders (and others) who prevent freedom of individuals in Africa (not just LGBT people – but some of them LGBT).

      It is a lie that colonialism brought homosexuality to Africa.

    2. Sad, isn’t it? Thereby confirming in the minds of many prejudiced people that Africans are somewhat backward.

      1. I don’t think it’s prejudiced to see African nations as backward when so much evidence proving it is easily at hand. The endemic corruption, the inability of many governments to hold their countries together, the widespread violence that frequently breaks out between tribal, religious or ethnic groups, the regular collapse of the supply chain for even the most basic of commodities despite the resource being available, and of course discriminatory social policies and practices that their leaders are actually proud of. As a continent it’s completely messed up.

        1. I see your point but as a general rule I think it’s best not to think in such generalised terms about whole continents – after all, think of the corruption in Italy today or, worse, what happened when Yugoslavia broke up less than 20 years ago: is that how we like to see ‘Europe’?

          1. But you have to admit, it’s pretty sad that a continent with so many countries has so few shining stars amongst them, and so many failed or failing states instead. If half of Europe was like 90s Yugoslavia I’d expect us to be generalised in the same way. Africa can’t be given a free pass. That’s akin to pretending the problems aren’t there.

          2. Well, half or more of Europe a mere 70 years ago (‘mere’ in historical terms) was in a much worse state than most of Africa today, so again I’d say it’s best not to generalise about continents. Save your ire for specific instances where it’s justifiable, it’s better than lumping a billion people of different ethinicities and nationalities together.

          3. @David

            It is sad the state of many parts (not all of every country, and not all countries) of Africa.

            There is much to be done.

            But as Rehan rightly says, the same argument could have been used to describe Europe until relatively recently.

  8. Paddyswurds 3 Apr 2012, 9:51pm

    @Rehan, Stu et al….
    …however can any of you name one country on the entire African continent that is not either backward and Abrahamic cult infected or completely corrupt.
    Rehan…. Naming one or two countries in Europe that are corrupt doesn’t make the continent of Europe, largely Democratic, corrupt.

    1. I don’t know Paddyswurds, I’m no expert on Africa, which is precisely why I’m wary of making sweeping generalisations – Tanzania? Ghana? Namibia?

      Homosexuality was only decriminalised in the UK within my lifetime, which kind of prevents me (unlike you) from being overly smug in this respect. You might also want to consider Spain, a country which criminalised homosexuality till 1979 – look how far it’s come in 33 years before dismissing the larger part of the world that has yet to catch up.

      1. Namibia I would agree with Rehan. Tanzania is getting there in terms of dealing with corruption – although I suspect on religious grounds, Paddyswurds might not accept it. Ghana certainly has a significant religious influence – although according to the freedom of speech index by Reporters without borders both Namibia and Ghana are more free than most EU countries.

    2. It depends how you define “Abrahamic cult infected” – would Ireland or Italy fit that criteria …?

      In terms of countries in Africa that are not “backward” or completely corrupt …

      I would suggest possibilities worthy of examination (and no more corrupt than many European of Oceanic comparisons) include Botswana, Cape Verde, Rwanda and Namibia – all of which according to the Transparency International Corruption Index of 2011 are less corrupt than a number of EU countries.

  9. Paddyswurds 3 Apr 2012, 11:46pm

    …Yes I would say Ireland and Italy are infected, altho Ireland is well on the way to excising the infection. Italy however is still greatly in thrall to the Roman Cult of personality and homophobia and is showing no real attempt to ridding itself of this sad infliction. are you not grasping at straws by citing Rwanda as democratic or lacking corruption. Is this not the country where one half of the population murdered the other half recently.? As for Tanzania, Namibia and Ghana ….well if you say so but i wouldn’t say any of them are exactly Utopian. My first cousin and a couple of friends went to Namibia and built a school and grain store and when she returned several years later the school was an abandoned derelict and the grain store had been demolished completely……. They both had been donated by my cousin at a cost of almost a quarter million €uros and she had been promised by government officials they were badly needed and would be put to full use . .

    1. @Paddyswurds

      Italy certainly is heavily influenced by the RC church, probably a little less than it used to be (but only marginally).
      Ireland certainly appears to be moving into a period (as an eminent Irish politician referred to it, but I can’t recall which one) of post Catholic Ireland. There undoubtedly will be a period where there is still some influence (natural as society evolves when there has been so much influence in Ireland) but events of the last couple of years in particular have turned a corner for Ireland.
      Rwanda certainly had a horrific time around 1994 with the genocide. However since then there are reasons to be very hopeful. Transparency International said it was unable to produce a comparison of how Rwanda’s institutions fared because reports of bribery were so low – Rwanda was ranked as the fourth least corrupt nation in Africa and the 46th least in the world (less corrupt than Hungary, Italy, South Africa, Latvia or the Czech Republic). Of course nowhere

      1. is utopian in Africa (and arguably not in Europe either). Clearly you have knowledge of a bad experience in Namibia. There are also good stories.
        Personally I think Rwanda, Cape Verde, Botswana, Namibia, and South Africa (with its problems) are the most hopeful states in Africa. Ghana, Tanzania and Kenya have potential although some significant issues eg rellgious interference in Tanzania, corruption in Kenya …

  10. GingerlyColors 4 Apr 2012, 7:17am

    The trouble with Africa is that they seem to have a totally different interpretation about human rights, equality and free speech. A Tunisian minister recently said regarding gay issues that there is a limit to free speech. What tosh! There is no limit to freedom of speech – what we cannot allow though is hate speech which causes upset and incites violence.
    All I can say with Senegal is wait and see, but I am not holding my breath.

    1. I think it might be more accurate to say ‘the only limit to free speech is hate speech’, otherwise you contradict yourself.

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