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Comment: Why Christian Concern should be ejected from the University of Oxford

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  1. I agree, It is time to stand up to a militant homosexual lobby. They are becoming bullying and greedy.

    Why should Christian Concern not voice their opions and what they believe? The homosexuals do and are becoming a bullying agenda now, and they wonder why people are turning against them and being hostile.

    1. I agree, it is time to stand up to the militant Christianist agenda. It is beoming bullying and greedy.

      Indeed it has been so for some time, many centruries in fact.

    2. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 12:55pm

      “The homosexuals”, even your grammar betrays your cloak of reason and reveals your prejudice. If you did respect us as equals your sentence would have begun “Homosexuals do …”.

      Now for a couple of corrections to your claims

      I want you to voice your opinions and beliefs.
      Where I come from Freedom of Speech is paramount. What you fail to realize and may never realize is that part of Freedom of Speech is the Right of Reply.
      Just as Harvey Milk did, we follow in his example. When your voice your opinions, beliefs, unsupported claims (and I might add claims completely at odds with evidence and reality ) that we are “less than” you and yours, We will be there, to shine light on what is you are really doing, to exposed you claims for the lies they are, to inform those who you have misinformed, to provided counter arguments & statements to those who have listened to you.

      We will fight this prejudice in our homes, in our streets, in our churches, our governments & our institutions

    3. This is exactly the kind of slippage that makes these right-wing extremists so annoying. Who has said that Christian Concern should not not voice their opinions and what they believe? The issue here is about Oxford University wining and dining them at a private event, offering them prestigious branding for their bigotry, making it look to the world as if they have their institutional support.

  2. The belief and treatment of an another as less than equal, less than human, and the hated, prejudice & intolerance that goes with this can never be tolerated.

    We will not apologize for this.

    “He is different, yes. But that does not make him expendable, or any less significant. No being is so important that he can usurp the rights of another.” -Jean-Luc Picard, 2365

    1. +1 for quoting my favourite captain :)

      1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 2:33pm

        “Yeah, some guys at M.I.T. are sending us reasons why Captain Kirk is better than Captain Picard., Hah! They’re out of their minds!” :)

  3. Pass the O2 30 Mar 2012, 12:32pm

    Just my opinion, but, particularly after the NOM disclosures, I have the distinct impression that in this country the CI/ CC are to sexual orientation what the BNP are to race.

    They seem to exist primarily to oppose equal rights for gay people.

    1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 1:04pm

      I’d go further, I would consider the Christian Concern are to sexual orientation as the Ku Klux Klan are to race.

      1. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 1:11pm

        I think that is going too far. There is no suggestion that they want to hang us of burn crosses on our lawns.

        I am assuming there are no indirect connections to Uganda via any ADF clients.

        1. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 1:20pm

          However if they are biblical literalists, technically they should be in favour of stoning us. The New Testament does not repeal the Old, technically.

        2. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 2:10pm

          I don’t think so. These groups may have attached many admirable deeds to themselves; faith, charity, community, these deeds conceals their prejudice & hatred under a statement of family values.
          “Villains who twirl their mustaches are easy to spot. Those who clothe themselves in good deeds are well camouflaged.” – Jean-Luc Picard, 2367

          These statements/attacks may even sound benign, but the denial of rights to marry in favor of civil partnerships still says we are ‘less than’ human. Our children are treated as ‘less than’. They are shown respect for their family, they are denied the protection of adoption rights from both their parents. This is not benign.

          And that’s how it starts. But the road from seemingly legitimate view point to rampant homophobia, prison sentences and execution is very much shorter than we think.

          “Why are you so surprised? Whenever a group of people start believing they’re better than everyone else, the results are always the same.” – Jonathan Archer, 215

          1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 2:11pm

            – Jonathan Archer, 2154

          2. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 3:08pm

            From BoxTurtle: “Alliance Defense Fund…posted this alert on their web site :

            Nigeria: Citizens Celebrate Ban of Same-Sex Marriage
            All Africa Global Media: Nigerians have continued to celebrate the banning of same-sex marriage by the Senate, commending senators for outlawing what they regard as abnormality and a licence for immorality.

            The bill which ADF is so keen on celebrating criminalizes all LGBT advocacy by organizations or individuals with ten years imprisonment. It also demands ten years in a Nigerian prison for anyone caught in a “public show of same-sex amorous relationships directly or indirectly.” That’s in addition to the provisions for fourteen years’ imprisonment for entering into a same-sex marriage or ten years for witnessing, performing, or “aiding/abetting” one.

            Remember, these are the same guys who are fighting with everything they have to strip Californians of their right to marry.”

            ADF allegedly has links to various hate groups. I guess you were right.

        3. @Scandalous

          There are links between Christian Concern and American Groups who are linked to the the Ugandan militant evangelical “Christianity” which supports the death penalty for “aggravated homosexuality” which includes in the definition “repeat offenses” (ie being seen holding hands with a same sex partner on two separate occasions could lead to a charge of aggravated homosexuality and thus the death penality, should the law be passed). The influence of these American groups on Christian Concern is unclear but is there.

          I would argue that organisations such as Christian Concern are the “publically respectable face” of the extreme Christian militants, but that many of the members support more subvertive and inhumane groups. For example, BNP are relatively palatable compared to other right wing extreme groups but there are links or Sinn Fein were (and are) more palatable than the IRA. Whilst the BNP may be a reasonable comparator for Christian Concern, they are nastier than that

      2. The KKK and other right wing extremists (well to the right of the BNP) like to brandish their christianity, while hating Jews and LGBT? Can’t help wondering if there are any links in view of their obsessive pre occupation?

    2. Totally correct!

  4. Robert in S. Kensington 30 Mar 2012, 12:37pm

    I agree, it is time to stand up to the militancy of right wing religionists who seek nothing more but to impose their belief system on society as a whole. In another time, it would be called oppression. The UK is not a theocracy and never will be.

    The problem with people like Aiden is that they are incapable of discerning the difference between religious and civil.

    Indeed, Rehan. The CoE in it’s oppressive history, like its predecessor the roman cult, saw nothing wrong with slavery or putting people to death for not accepting their belief system. The reformation is a prime example of oppression, bullying, denigration, demonisation and dehumanisation of gay people. Just look at the lies and misinformation they’re spreading with their spurious claims for which they can’t even produce one shred of factual evidence (bearing false witness against gay people), the marriage equality debate comes to mind. Not even remotely “christian”.

    1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 1:06pm

      “Religious beliefs are not a basis upon which to affirm or deny civil rights.”

      1. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 1:13pm

        Says who?

        1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 1:23pm

          The Dallas Principles c.f. http://www.thedallasprinciples.org/

          1. Pass the O2 30 Mar 2012, 2:08pm

            I think the High Court said something similar here recently during one of the CI cases.

          2. Spanner1960 30 Mar 2012, 3:55pm

            For a minute there I thought you were going to quote Wesley Crusher.

    2. Just bear in mind that even baiting trolls like Aiden (who spends so much time posting here but isn’t obsessed with gayness, oh no no no no no) becomes rather boring after a while. Best not to feed ‘em, all they want is attention, poor things.

  5. Polly Conroy 30 Mar 2012, 12:49pm

    ““It is time to stand up to a militant homosexual lobby who are unable to tolerate difference of opinion…”

    I think we can tolerate difference of opinion. What we will not tolerate is the imposition of that different opinion on our lives. Stop trying to interfere in our lives. It is much more the case that it is religion that is entirely intolerant of difference of opinion. We do not use the law to tell people that they should be gay. Religion uses its power to kill and maim gay people.

  6. The Wilberforce website does currently dissociate itself from Exeter College, under the “about” section.

    On the face of it, the thing appears to be about empowering biblical literalists to do their thing in all walks of public life, including political and legal internships. I have absolutely no problem with that, if it is about the true Christian values of serving the poor and the sick.

    What I would like to see more of in the article is evidence that there is more to it than that. The involvement of such political, anti gay organisations as the American ADF, and the CC suggests there may be.

    What would be helpful would be to hear from people, particularly any gay Christians who have attended the conference.

    Then it is entirely a matter for OU/ the college whether they want to lend their brand name to such an event, and members of the college and university have every right to object if they wish.

    1. “On the face of it, the thing appears to be about empowering biblical literalists to do their thing in all walks of public life, including political and legal internships. I have absolutely no problem with that, if it is about the true Christian values of serving the poor and the sick.”

      . . . . .

      And when Christian values are about promoting the idea that gay people can be cured of their sexual orientaion?

      Christian Concern is a well known advocate of reparative therapy for homosexuals . . .

    2. Unforch, OU has no say in college’s individual business affairs :(

  7. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 1:00pm

    “It is time to stand up to a militant homosexual lobby who are unable to tolerate difference of opinion”.

    Now for a couple of corrections to their claims

    I want them to voice your opinions and beliefs.
    Where I come from Freedom of Speech is paramount. What they fail to realize and may never realize is that part of Freedom of Speech is the Right of Reply.
    Just as Harvey Milk did, we follow in his example. When they voice there opinions, beliefs, unsupported claims (and I might add claims completely at odds with evidence and reality ) that we are “less than” them, We will be there, to shine light on what is they are really doing, to exposed their claims for the lies they are, to inform those who they have misinformed, to provided counter arguments & statements to those who have listened to them.

    We will fight this prejudice in our homes, in our streets, in our churches, our governments & our institutions

    1. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 1:16pm

      And on the beaches ;)

      1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 1:33pm

        Christian Concern, Joseph Ratzinger (aka Pope Benedict), Rowan Williams(Archbishop of Canterbury), the Westboro Baptist Church, or any other like minded group, dressed in their full gear for protesting at the beaches I visit during Summer in 27 degrees Celsius heat. I would like to see that. I would love to see that.

        1. Scandalous 30 Mar 2012, 2:16pm

          It’s the British way. We call it the Dunkirk spirit. I think you were quoting/ paraphrasing Churchill.

          1. theGentleWarrior 30 Mar 2012, 2:42pm

            Oh I acknowledge it paraphrases Churchill and I do admire Churchill greatly. But I my statement was more intended to remind everyone to fight homophobia and prejudice in the places that we find it. Regrettable not all us fight this, especially when it comes to our homes and churches.

            c.f. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programmes/andrew_marr_show/7504077.stm

            I am always inspired by Ian McKellen (and Gene Robinson too) and I just love his comments
            “Well as an atheist I, I, it would be tempting to say let the church get on with its internal arguments. But it spreads beyond that.”
            and “The particular problem they’ve all got and share is homophobia. “

  8. I like this – it really shows up the ‘militant homosexual lobbysits’ lie that these right-wingers always make as if we’re all clones of activists like Peter Tatchell. Keep it up oxford LGBTs (& friends)and students everywhere!

  9. How much are they paying? I’ve a feeling that’s a big consideration for Oxford colleges, especially in the summer.

  10. Professor Andrew Hamilton, Vice-Chancellor of Oxford since autumn 2009, should be held personally accountable for the presence of these dangerous extremists at Oxford.

    He has massively damaged the reputation of Oxford.

    He needs to be fired for his complete incompetence.

    He supports extremist bigotry.

    Get him out. Now!

    1. the guy’s suposed to be a chemist – how come he didn’t know that such a noxious substance as this christian concern would blow up in his face?

  11. Spanner1960 30 Mar 2012, 3:58pm

    Who exactly are these “militant homosexual lobbyists”? What do they do? Break into your house and rearrange the furniture and leave a fresh quiche in your fridge?

    1. Robert in S. Kensington 30 Mar 2012, 6:42pm

      As if Lord Carey, Rowan Williams, Archbishop Nichols and that entire gang of C4M and their allies aren’t militant religionists. The Christian Concern group deserve hate group status. I think we ought to refer to them as such whenever they go off on a tirade against us. I can almost hear them screaming ” freedom of religion is under attack”, the usual victim card game when they can’t get their own way.

  12. “It is time to stand up to a militant homosexual lobby who are unable to tolerate difference of opinion and who seek to coerce behaviour and thought.” So said Andrea Minichiello Williams, CEO of Christian Concern (and various other anti-LGBT lobbying organisations)

    Isn’t this the pot calling the kettle black? Isn’t it telling that in the US a number of these groups have gotten so bad that they are listed as hate groups?

  13. CHRISTIAN EXTREMISTS? AT OXFORD?

    Is Christian concern’s Wilberforce Academy a clever attempt at legitimising its extreme views, by associating it’s self with one of the top ranking universities in the world ?,
    Also, is the Wilberforce Academies choice of name merely a coincidence?

    . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .

    WHAT’S IN A NAME

    Exeter College’s chapel was first build in1623, but because of its structural unsoundness it was rebuilt in 1856. The new chapel was then consecrated on the18th October 1859 by the then Bishop of Oxford, Samuel Wilberforce.

    ARE CHRISTIAN CONCERN EXTREMISTS ?

    Christian concern’s “Wilberforce Academy” is well know for its views on the inherent sinfulness of homosexuality, and its assertion that homosexuals can be cured of their sexual orientation through prayer, and reparative therapies. Christian Concerns promotion of reparative therapies (or the gay cure) is mainly derived from the work of NARTH in the US. Reparative therapies are discredited by the BMA and all major psychotherapy registry bodies in the UK

    http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/2012/02/22/oxford-university-defends_n_1293082.html

    http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2012/03/02/mps-defend-gay-cure-event-sponsor-over-intern-funding/

    http://narth.com/docs/britmedical.html

    SHOULD EXETER COLLEGE FACE DISCIPLINARY ACTION?

    Interestingly although the Wilberforce academy has a disclaimer on its website distancing it’s self from Exeter College, this cannot be said of Exeter College.

    It is true that Exeter College has responded to the concerns of LGBT students studying at Oxford university over its associations with the Wilberforce academy.

    http://www.exeter.ox.ac.uk/news/item?gid=1329831439

    However, the Wilberforce academy was only ever present at Exeter College through the hire of its conference faculties, and so the inclusion by Exeter College of a link to the Wilberforce Academy on its website, could be seen as double edged and adding further controversy to the issue

    http://www.exeter.ox.ac.uk/

    Firstly, although the Academies inclusion on the home page at Exeter could be seen as an attempt to address the Christian concern controversy, why does a centre of excellence want to be associated with an extremist organization? Is the name of Wilberforce just a coincidence, or is Christian Concern paying Exeter College more than its going rate for the hire of its conference faculties.

  14. they wıll say anythıng do anythıng to hold on to theır hegemony over thought and behavıor. yes we are ıntolerant of racıst homophobıc hate and opınıon and coercıve about stoppıng their abuse of me. they have the moral ıntegrıty of an ameobaç

  15. I’m surprised this event was allowed to take place. Given that Exeter College were roundly criticised a considerable number of weeks ago over this, they should have taken action and cancelled the booking. Allowing this to go ahead is simply unacceptable, and the authorities at Exeter college must be held to account.

  16. The discerning cleverclogs LGBT school-leaver should certainly make it Cambridge this year . . .

    1. What’s to say that Cambridge are any better? Oxford can certainly organise a protest (in the holiday too, when student numbers are greatly reduced).

      1. Has Cambridge hosted a private conference by an anti-LGBT pressure group? Also, Cambridge is a Stonewall Diversity Champion – Oxford isn’t.

        Cambridge will win a gay-off with Oxford any day of the week!!!!

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