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Scottish Catholic Church steps up attack on gay marriage

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  1. So marriage equality would be a grotesque subversion of a universally accepted human right.

    What about the abuse of children entrusted into an organisation’s care. Surely a more vivid example of a grotesque subversion of a universally accepted human right would be difficult to find.

    Hate filled hypocrites….

    1. Hmm how about that recent scandal of Catholic Care in Headingley, Leeds that appealed a fourth time to over rule them from excluding gay adoptive parents?

      Its not like there hasn’t been ‘strange goings on behind closed doors’ in the church is there?

    2. Interesting letter in the Scotsman
      .
      “Christianity has no single claim to marriage rights”
      .
      http://news.scotsman.com/opinion/Letter-Christianity-has-no-single.6834606.jp
      .

      1. But that does that mean that at least half of all gays want to get marry… or at least planning to get married to their partners for life?

        Yeah they don’t have a claim to marriage rights… so what? Are you now saying that certain groups can now be excluded from marriage rights? If so why then is it “bad” to deny any claim to marriage rights by gays and okay to deny them to the christians? I thought you people say that these rights are “fundamental” hence no person should be denied their right to claim marriage rights, but you here you are doing just that.

        1. He’s saying they have no single claim, as in they can’t claim it as there’s and only there’s.

        2. Do you even read anything anyone say’s or just look at the first word and spout ridiculous arguments.

          1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:24am

            Yeah, that would be a no!

    3. What about the abuse of children entrusted into an organisation’s care.

      Yeah right, what an argument… Alan just to let you know many people here do not care about child abuse, they would rather protect and demand that pedophile enablers run for president of Ireland, so from now on this argument is going to fall on deaf ears…

      Sorry.

      1. “Alan just to let you know many people here do not care about child abuse, they would rather protect and demand that pedophile enablers run for president of Ireland”

        Histrionic. Uninformed. Ignorant. Offensive. Untrue.

        Yep, its a pepa-line. Who need accuracy when you have insanity, eh, Pepa?

        1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:22am

          What else would you expect? It’s pepa.

      2. “Alan just to let you know many people here do not care about child abuse”

        Speak for yourself.

        You really are not a nice person are you.

        1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:22am

          Yep, that just about sums him up!!

  2. Dr Robin Guthrie 12 Sep 2011, 12:56pm

    What O’Brien sitting in his cloistered fug of ignorance fails to understand is that the entire population of Scotland is NOT catholic or indeed religious at all.

    Therefore what gives him and his child abusing cult the right to prevent gay people from the CIVIL state of marriage.

    And by his churches own definition, marriage is NOT a human right as he and his club prevents the divorced from re-marrying.

    Whilst I’m at it, gays and lesbians do successfully raise children, and indeed studies show that lesbians make better parents than straight couples.

    Ignorant old bigot.

    1. Hush now, good Doctor – you’re bringing facts to a hyperbole fight, how unfair.

      Seriously though, that is all people like this religious loon have – hyperbole and hate filled rhetoric. And the people are starting to see through it.

    2. In addtion, what O’Brien also fails to understand, remember or even acknowledge is the Scots Enlightenment in the 18th century, Which instead of relgion, firmly established the noble pursits of science, the arts, medicine and the secular in the Scottish Psyche.

    3. What O’Brien sitting in his cloistered fug of ignorance fails to understand is that the entire population of Scotland is NOT catholic or indeed religious at all.

      So what?

      The majority of Scots are not gay either… so then why have gay marriage?

      This argument is pathetic… the argument shouldn’t be about who is in the majority and in the minority, besides that logic has been used against us… the question is whether he is right or wrong, his argument reasonable and logical…

      rethink this through once more.

      1. “The majority of Scots are not gay either… so then why have gay marriage?”

        LOL! “Gay Marriage”? Who wants Gay Marriage? We just want marriage equality. What a really, really stupid argument.

        Moron.

        “rethink this through once more.”

        You think….?

      2. Dr Robin Guthrie 13 Sep 2011, 9:41am

        Perhaps it is reasonable and logical in your small mind, however those of us with a modicum of intelligence think otherwise.

        Therefore Fvck off.

        1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:25am

          Well put Dr. Robin!!

  3. Oh we should definitely ask crusty celibate cloistered old men for proper advice on how to raise children…. Honestly, who takes these silly old fools seriously? Marriage is a civil contract, the nature of the ceremony is nothing more than the icing on the cake. We don’t need the anachronistic frock-wearing followers of bronze age desert cults telling us what the law of the land should be. As for accusations of “cultural vandalism”. Really? Shall we go over the churches foul history of brutality, murder, blood-shed, hatred, cruelty, viciousness…. shall I continue? We know who the vandals really are.

    1. Marriage is more than just a “civil contract” — the community has totally lost the argument on this one… the opposers win (here In america) as they use arguments of morality and beyond the “civil contract” caricature that many leftist want to paint marriage as.

      If all marriage is is a contract then why even fight for it? I mean you can willfully enter into contracts with your partner without the sanction or permission of the state or voters.

      No marriage is not just a civil contract, and if you want to win this debate you better understand what it is.

      1. “I mean you can willfully enter into contracts with your partner without the sanction or permission of the state or voters.”

        Stupid argument. Show me the contract that matches marriage in rights, then you ha a point. There isn’t.

        “No marriage is not just a civil contract, and if you want to win this debate you better understand what it is.”

        Typically egocentric and patronising comment from pepa – not everyone has your pseudo-christian view on this, especially gay people.

        “Marriage is more than just a “civil contract”

        Sure, but not everyone thinks so. So, what’s you point? Or do you have one. I can’t see one.

      2. Dave North 13 Sep 2011, 9:44am

        “Here in America.”

        Excuse me.

        America is owned by China. Creates just about every war on the planet. Is run by religious nutters and is universally hated.#

        Do not even dare comment until you sort out your own bankrupt Jesus ridden dirt hole.

  4. If same-sex marriage is cultural vandalism , what does that make the policies of the Vatican????? I think the word may be, an ‘ABOMINATION’

    1. Abomination means “non traditional”

      So when somebody says to me that homosexuality is an “abomination” they think that it means “immoral” which it does not. Every time I hear this I just laugh, just like how I’m laughing right now.

      1. An abomination is a crime against nature or in this case a crime against culture.

      2. Dave North 13 Sep 2011, 9:45am

        “just like how I’m laughing right now.”

        Why.

        Do you walk past a mirror?

      3. Abomination: from Latin abominari, “to deprecate as an ill omen”) is an English term used to translate the Biblical Hebrew terms shiqquwts (“shiqqûts”) and sheqets, which are derived from shâqats, or the terms תֹּועֵבָה, tōʻēḇā or to’e’va (noun) or ta’ev (verb).

        An abomination in English is that which is exceptionally loathsome, hateful, sinful, wicked, or vile. A Pepa…..

  5. Hmmm, sorry to disappoint you Tartaglia, but many heterosexual married couples can’t reproduce and some choose not to. So, do you want to ban them from marriage? Provide us with the facts that gay couples can’t raise children, prove that same sex marriage in 10 countries has rendered hetero marriage meaningless? We’re not exactly seeing straight couples refraining from marrying because some of us can. What a bigot.

    1. Its not that gay couples cannot raise children, its a fact that the majority of gays do not raise children, nor show any personal interest in doing so.

      1. “its a fact that the majority of gays do not raise children, nor show any personal interest in doing so.”

        Any proof of this lunatic “fact”?

        Nope.

        Sure, why do you need proof, you never did before?

      2. So do Straight couples we don’t stop them from getting married.

  6. I think it’s time that legally binding marriages/unions/partnerships should only be performed by state employed registrars.

    The religious could then perform whatever rituals/magic incantations they choose, for anyone they choose.

    1. I think that in terms of state recognised marriages, they should only be performed by a registrar who only considers legal (not diversity issues) – although if those who are engaging in the marriage process wish to have a religious element to their celebration (whether or not that be simultaneous with the registration) then that should be for the couple to make that decision

    2. Agree Matt provded that the state reserves the word “marriage”, which is what it is registering. The religions can incant as they please.

    3. Agreed. This is what happens in Germany – friends of mine got the legal side done at the registry office on the Thursday and then they had a fairly mad religious wedding on the Saturday which we all went to!

    4. Ah so a gay person that wants a religious wedding ceremony can go screw themselves…

      Am I the only person on here that actually looks at things on all angles? Seriously some of you need to stop and think about the arguments/points you want to present to us… not all of us live in PN jonestown cult bubble. Some of us actually demand good logical SOUND arguments and logical presentation of points, not the same leftist talking points that only satisfies one segment of the community.

      1. Well you seem to be doing brilliantly on the whole sound logical arguments front so we thought we’d leave it all to you, we’ll just waste our time messing around with silly things like facts and studies and the like, you know that crazy science thing!

      2. My god your thick.

        1. It usually gets a lot worse with pepa. Next stage is histrionics.

          1. Its when it gets beyond the unreasonable histrionics that I get frustrated …

  7. Scandinavian studies have shown that far from destroying the institution of marriage, bring equality into civil marriage actively promotes the institution of marriage and increases the incidence of both same sex and heterosexual marriage.
    The morality of bringing equality and fairness to the institution of marriage is clear. The immorality and bigoted degradation of human rights from the leadership of the church in this issue is evident in their outdated and inadequate approach to supporting all in society.

    1. Jock S. Trap 12 Sep 2011, 2:32pm

      Exactly. They can’t seem to work out that society works better in stable enviroments and that also means Equality in marriage.

    2. An interesting idea, which logically follows. If you esteem LGBT marriage, in what way would you not be are promoting the importance of marriage.

  8. It’s rather strange that the RCC chooses Scotland to take a stand on any issue. Apparently they know their main stronghold,off continent is lost(Ireland), is this an attempt at retreat to find less opposition. Knowing them as I do, the warped logic fits

  9. Mumbo Jumbo 12 Sep 2011, 1:15pm

    Don’t get mad – get even.

    Join the Campaign for a Secular Europe march on Saturday.

    http://secular-europe-campaign.org/march-rally/

    If last year’s Protest the Pope march (this is the follow up) is anything to go by, then teh ghey will be there in their thousands.

  10. Yeah right, like someone who believes that invisible ghosts get teenage virgins pregnant have the authority to lecture on parenthood! Purrrrlease!

    1. Well there some of you that believe that humans came from monkeys…

      Crazy beliefs ARE crazy beliefs.

      (and no I’m not a creationist, I know the jonestown cult will say this, okay fine, but for the record I find that darwin is as much of a leap of faith as it is like any other religious belief, I know Will, the scientist fascist who wants to destroy any other person’s curiosity, will have a pantie twist over this, well go FVCK yourself Will, you intolerant bigot)

      1. So called “intellegent design” is merely creationism in fancy waistcoats. Read Dawkins for the full breakdown.
        Evolution is about as proven as gravity, and most genetic research rests on it.

      2. Are you the best The Ulcerated Sphincter of Anus ( USA )
        can come up with.

        You are stupid beyond belief.

      3. Are you actually going to try debate creationism then because evolutions is a proven fact, creationism is a lazy mans theory for life on earth.

      4. “Humans come from monkeys”? Really? Try to actually learn something about evolution instead of just displaying your obvious ignorance of it.

  11. Charles Gormley 12 Sep 2011, 1:17pm

    Most Catholics choose to ignore what the church hierarchy say; we should do the same.

    1. good advice that will mostly fall on deaf ears… Charles did you know about the “secular march” that is planned… you see many gay leftist on here think it is a better idea to fight for secularism/atheism and have a war with this invisible character called the god of the bible than it is to fight for gay marriage, or gay rights.

      Yeah, total different priorities here.

      1. “many gay leftist on here think it is a better idea to fight for secularism/atheism”

        One doesn’t fight for secularism, you fool, its not a belief system. Its the desire to live in a society where reason trumps dogma. You’re typical of the type of fool that we need to push aside, the poor little gay boy who goes crying to the right wing religions begging them for their pity and acceptance. Its pathetic.

      2. Charles Gormley 13 Sep 2011, 2:43pm

        I think that a march against religion is no bad thing to be honest. I do think, however, that there is no point in getting out knickers in a knot about what a bishop has said. Is anyone surprised that this is what he thinks? We didn’t expect him, or his ilk, to suddenly change their minds, so it is no shock to me. Most catholics don’t marry in church, don’t GO to church, have children out of wedlock, divorce, etc etc etc. Cathoilics, in my experience, are pretty tolerant – they have to be. It is just their church that isn’t, but, i say again, they ignore their church, we should ignore their church, and i am pretty confident that the Scottish Government will politely listen, and then ignore their church.

  12. Too many hole in their argument to even bother…but I am a Gay father of a very wonderful; 26yo man who’s mother is Lesbian and we are very much a loving, successful family unit… though in 2 different homes. WE are great parents, how dare these bigoted self serving old men lecture us from their thrones of abuse. Its my opinion that there is virtually no relation now days between religion and God.

  13. And if Christ returned Tartaglia,Conti, O’Brien and their clique would be in one hell of a hurry to line up with the Scribes and the Pharisees in a frenzied bit to force the secular authority the crucify him again!!! They have long ago forgotten that Man is created in God’s image … they’ve been too busy creating a God in their own image!!!

  14. Same old sh*t, different old sissy.

    Thank goodness the extreme irony of it all is not lost on the judiciary nowadays.

  15. ‘Thou shalt not bear false witness’ is one of the Ten Commandments. The Catholic Church in Scotland has lied repeatedly about this issue.

    1) Children do better with opposite-sex parents LIE. Numerous studies have shown that children do just as well with same-sex parents, as all leading psychological and paediatric associations accepts.
    2) Churches will come under legal pressure to marry same-sex couples: LIE. If the Catholic Church had to obey anti-discrimination law, they’d be forced to offer marriages to divorced people, as the Catholic bishops know perfectly well. Moreover the Scottish government has stated that both churches and individual ministers will be specifically protected from anti-discrimination claims.
    3) Marriage cannot be redefined by government: LIE. During Britain’s imperial past, colonial governments came under pressure to ban polygamy – particularly from the churches. They didn’t have a problem with government redefining marriage so long as it suited them.

    1. Charles Gormley 12 Sep 2011, 3:22pm

      What part of anti-discrimination law covers discrimination on the basis of divorced status? I am not aware of it, and would appreciate you pointing me in its direction if possible. Thanks.

      1. Marital status was initially included in the Sex Discrimination Act 1975, now repealed and replaced by the Equality Act 2010.

        It’s not well phrased in the Equality Act, but this is usually taken to include having been previously married as well as being currently married. Religious bodies have specific exemptions.

      2. I take it back. Although it is widely believed that divorcees are protected in law, many lawyers think that in fact they are not protected by the 2010 Act. I’m not sure this issue has been properly tested by the courts however – and the fact remains that noone has tried to see if the Catholic Church could be forced to provide marriage services to divorcees, precisely because the religious exemptions are so clear.

        1. Tim Chapman 12 Sep 2011, 8:45pm

          The EHRC told me recently that marital staus is not a protected characteristic under the Eqality Act. (This after I contacted them about a bank who is discriminating against me on the basis of my status od civil partner)

          1. Surely that could just come into Discrimination based on sexual orientation though.

          2. Tim

            Have a look at this document below, it tends to suggest that marriage is a protected characteristic

            http://www.mcgrigors.com/pdfdocs/insight_equalitybill.pdf

            Also, section 8 of the Equality Act 2010 states:

            “(1)A person has the protected characteristic of marriage and civil partnership if the person is married or is a civil partner.

            (2)In relation to the protected characteristic of marriage and civil partnership—

            (a)a reference to a person who has a particular protected characteristic is a reference to a person who is married or is a civil partner;

            (b)a reference to persons who share a protected characteristic is a reference to persons who are married or are civil partners.”

            Not quite sure why the EHRC are suggesting it is not a protected characteristic – I would take this further if I were you, Tim

  16. Does anyone else tire of the ‘I can no sooner marry two people of the same sex than put a hamburger on a hotdog bun’ argument. It is all rather silly.

  17. Good on Cardinal Keith O’Brien.

  18. Tim Hopkins 12 Sep 2011, 2:12pm

    It’s clear that the hierarchy of the Catholic Church in Scotland will try to do everything they can to impose the Vatican’s rules, on the law, all the people, and the other religious bodies of Scotland.

    if you disagree with them and want Scotland to be a free and equal country, make sure you respond to the Scottish Govt’s consultation on same sex marriage, which you can find here:

    http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2011/09/05153328/0

  19. His opinion is nearest to the last anyone should take note of.

  20. What happened to the separation of church and state? Why don’t these people stop interfering in the state?

    1. Sorry to say that in the UK there is no separation of church and state, – these hypocritical old Druids even get special status representation in Parliament (I know that these ones are “catholic” but its the same deranged mob). Everyone is entitled to interfere in the public state – that’s the point – but just because you put a velvet robe on and insist that people kneel to you shouldn’t make your words more valuable than those of the rest of us.

    2. What happened indeed, so to speak – to the separation if church and state?

  21. Jock S. Trap 12 Sep 2011, 2:29pm

    As usual the Church gets nasty, bigotted and discriminating in ways they would cause Hell fire about if it was aimed at them. They show how uneducated they truely are and how vile they wish society to be. No surprise there then I guess.

    What I do ask of PinkNews is, as this is a consultation can we have a balanced report. I know only discrimintory news sells but I personally would like to see a balanced arguement. We seem to have all the bigots being reported. What about those being supportive? What are they saying? Are there any saying anything?

    It must be important to hear the positive as well as see those negative. To see who is fighting our corner as well as not. Both from personal account and other religions as we know not all within religion are as bigotted.

    1. I think you’re expecting it bit too much from Pink News! They aim to be all Daily Mail in their news reporting so its all about getting us all shocked so we can rant on and on about how awful *they* are…

    2. Tim Hopkins 12 Sep 2011, 5:02pm

      Jock I assume you don’t live in Scotland. If you did you’d see the pro equality side well represented in the newspaper letters pages, for example two church ministers and one priest in today’s Scotsman and Herald, and in BBC radio and tv reports.

      Problem is the media think the pronouncements of Cardinals and Archbishops are automatically news, whereas in this case the story ims dog bites man stuff.

      1. Dr Robin Guthrie 13 Sep 2011, 10:16am

        I’m a Scot living in Wales, however I do try to keep abreast of the Scottish papers in order that I can, when necessary, offer an opposing view point in forums to these religious creatures.

        For far to long they have tried to screw that country with their poison.

        No more.

      2. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:29am

        No I don’t Tim. I’m please that it is balanced up their but that is what We should be seeing all over the country as well. Surely it is up to PinkNews to make sure we hear the pro equality side rather than just the negative bigotted side.

  22. Miguel Sanchez 12 Sep 2011, 2:34pm

    “A government which favours and allows for same sex ‘marriage’ does wrong. It fails in its duty to society. It undermines the common good. It commits an act of cultural vandalism. Such a government does not deserve the trust which the nation, and including many in the Catholic community, has shown in it.”

    Who does the church think elects the government? THE PEOPLE elect the politicians and it’s the will of the people the politicians carry out. The church’s thinkings and teachings are what’s old and archaic. It’s a shame the people can’t elect the church’s leaders.

    1. Dan Filson 12 Sep 2011, 8:08pm

      In some churches – not RC or CofE – the people in a parish do just that, and it is interesting that, with some exceptions, many such chuches are more liberal than top-down hierarchies.

  23. Jock S. Trap 12 Sep 2011, 2:35pm

    The thing with these bigots is they add to the arguement about separating religion from state. Surely a positive out of their own negatives?

    1. This is to cover up their record of gay priest abusing children over the years.

  24. In all country I believe marriage is a civil affair so government has plenty of right to go ahead in this process.

    Churches have to promote Jesus message of love, respect and inclusivity. As I see once again the Catholic church betray her own reason of being. Weird how all those priest, cardinals and other clergy is blind to see how they look like those who condem Jesus to the cross.

    If gay marriage can’t be perform because gay couple can’t have children, does that mean that infertile people can’t be married? I assume so if having children is the only reason to get married.

    The cultural vandalism is to bring hatred in the heart of there flock agains gay, or any people that not conform to there view. Those priest doesn’t bring forth the message of God, they work for the Devil.

  25. It is not a problem when bishops start talking like this. In Argentina, when the archbishop summoned nuns to pray against a war of the devil, people realised how stupid and medieval their justifications were and ended up helping the approval of the egalitarian marriage :)

  26. The Roman Catholic Church represents the working of evil in the world. The United Kingdom is not a Roman Catholic country, and the inhabitants of its various countries have fought long and hard to prevent that church’s pernicious influence. As I once told O’Brien, it is a pity that the Catholic Emancipation Acts were passed in the nineteenth century. Historically, the loyalty of the Roman Catholic Church to the United Kingdom has been questioned, simply because it owes its loyalty and obedience to a foreign organisaion based in Rome. The Roman Catholic Church has never had the best interests of this country at heart. The so-called prelates have a damned cheek in talking of arrogance, for it is their colossal arrogance which is now trying to deny the rights of other religious organisations to do as they wish with regard to gay marriage, O’Brien and his ilk should be reminded that we now live in a largely secular society in which religion has a less and less significant role.

    1. de Villiers 12 Sep 2011, 7:53pm

      > it is a pity that the Catholic Emancipation Acts were passed in the nineteenth century

      How ridiculous it would sound if France were to say that it was a pity that Protestants or Jews were granted religious freedom in the Republic.

    2. I rather agree that Catholic emancipation is a bad idea, we all know what comes of letting them have an inch.
      lets call them what they really are, the last sick and decaying vestiges of the Roman Empire.
      Their days are numbered and the influence and power they once wielded are waning. The RCC is exposed for what they really are and there is nothing that will stop that.

      1. de Villiers 13 Sep 2011, 9:43pm

        That is nothing other than fascist sectarianism. It is depressing to see that the only freedom some gay people want is the freedom to oppress others.

  27. Maybe Tartaglia should be a bit more worried about the insane amount of crime in Paisley, rather than same sex marriage.

  28. Peter Paul Fuchs 12 Sep 2011, 2:50pm

    The wonderfully first-named Bishop Paisley is adept at hyperbolic rhetoric. So let me match him: Paisley’s statements are political terrorism.

    Also, Dr. Robin Guthrie’s brilliant point that “by his church[‘]s own definition, marriage is NOT a human right as he and his club prevents the divorced from re-marrying,” really needs to be emphasized. This point of Guthrie’s really dismantles their whole logic, if you can even call it that.

  29. Johnny33308 12 Sep 2011, 2:52pm

    Civil marriage is no business of any religious entity, in any way whatsoever. Perhaps the church would be more useful if it would find and eliminate those responsible for predatory sexual practices upon helpless children within their ‘religious’ organization, and those that protected the predators as well. Now that would be of benefit to society. Preventing people who love one another from getting (civil) married, is of no benefit to society at all and is, in fact, damaging to society. Hasn’t the Catholic church damaged society enough already? Is is not time to begin to tax them like the business they truly are? The ‘church’ certainly appears to be less than kind, and in fact, appears sinister in its efforts to continue bigotry against a vulnerable section of society. The Catholic and Mormon churches are evil, promote evil, and are not at all what they claim to be. Actions speak louder than words. SHAME on them both!

  30. Ultimately one can’t debate reasonably with people who believe in very dubious tales about ghosts, benevolent and terrifying omnipotent beings and flying men.

    Treat it with the contempt it deserves and just be safe in the knowledge that putting our efforts ino achieving marriage equality instead of wasting it on these fools is a much more prudent course of action.

  31. If you think it’s unfair what the Archbishop said and you would like to express your views on gay parenting, contact me on: gay.families.uk at gmail.com for more details.

  32. Catholic Church oppose this to cover up there record of gay priest abusing children over the years.

  33. Are there any actual Scots in the upper tiers of the Catholic Church in Scotland, or are they all Italian and Irish? Not that it would make a difference in an Absolute Monarchy, the officers have to toe the political line whatever they really believe.

  34. Keith Bowker 12 Sep 2011, 4:18pm

    Didn’t know that the sole purpose of marriage was so that a man and a woman procreate. Does that also mean that couples who marry should be given a time frame within which they must have children and if they do not or cannot; their marriages are declared null and void?

  35. jamestoronto 12 Sep 2011, 4:47pm

    Fine words coming from an organisation whose claim to fame in the last century, and now this, is the terrorising of children by its abusive and abusing priesthood. The state has EVERY right to define civil marriage — it has done so throughout history and continues to do so. At various times and places blacks and whites could not marry one another; Catholics and Protestants could not marry one another; Jews could only marry Jews; marrying across class/caste lines was and sadly is forbidden. All these were state-defined. By law, the heir to the throne is forbidden from marrying a Catholic in Commonwealth realms. Again state-defined. Check your history. Check your facts.

    Perhaps the poor cleric used the wrong phrase. Equal marriage doesn’t mean “cultural vandalism” but “cultural enrichment”. There is not one example of ANY church being compelled to marry a same-sex couple in the 10 countries that have equal marriage. Check your facts, again!!

  36. A cult with almost 2 millenia of sexual abuse against boys, girls and women is hardly in a position to make any moral judgement at all. It’s subjugation of native tribes in Latin American during the middle ages and the Inquisition in Spain where Jews were tortured or executed if they did not convert to catholicism, renders the Roman Catholic cult utterly and morally bankrupt. It should have been banned and my only disappointment is that the Catholic Emancipation Act of 1829 was ever enacted. It is NOT the state religion of the UK and should stay out of politics or face repercussions.

  37. It really is encouraging to see how much bluster and puff these vile, self-important old fools muster when they are confronted with social progress and the advance of equality in the face of their antiquated bigotry.

    Clearly they’re losing, and they know it. Drink in the smell of fear and impotence and failure in their tone. Enjoy the last, poisonous gasp of the religious bigots – they’ll all be dead soon, and the world will be a much better place for it.

  38. “First they ignore you, then they ridicule you, then they fight you, then you win.” –
    — Mahatma Gandhi

  39. marriage existed for same-sex couples until the christian cult arose
    if this idiot cared about marriage then he’d fight for same-sex couples to marry,
    what happened to people marrying for love? why is it many ignore that many heteros can’t have kids or don’t actually want any

  40. soapbubblequeen 12 Sep 2011, 5:49pm

    Paisley Print Tartface can go and jump off a bridge. Stupid old fcker.

  41. Gay couples can have children. Is he proposing all straight couples have fertility tests?

  42. So, when Philip Tartaglia refers to cultural vandalism, he is referring to vandalism of his own nasty, fascist, anti-gay, homophobic, heterosexual supremacist culture of course.

  43. Dan Filson 12 Sep 2011, 8:09pm

    “Marriage has always existed in order to bring men and women together so that the children born of those unions will have a mother and a father” You mean that without marriage this would not happen? Silly fool.

  44. Wouldn’t anyone with a genuine interest in the stability of society, let alone human happiness, want to encourage marriage?Either straight or gay marriage.

  45. As a lesbian parent of 2 boys I am deeply offended a the inference that my boys will not have been brought up to be well balanced human beings. Our sons are now 25 years old, one has a university honours degree and the other is in full-time employment, owns his one home and is getting married next year to a catholic girl whom we all love dearly. They have elected not to be married by the church given it’s non-acceptance of his mothers so instead will have a humanist service. ‘Proud to have 2 Mum’s’ was his message when he spoke to our guests at our civil partnership celebration. Live and let live was his brothers message.

    We do not tell same sex couples what they can or cannot do….we do not tell priests or ministers what to believe. So what gives them the right to dictate to us.

    Keep your narrow minded arrogant and destructive views to yourself old man. God loves us all apparently….so why can’t you?

    1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:48am

      Excellent comment Howwood4. I have to agree. It’s funny though. My son is at Uni, a well balanced young man with a lovely girlfriend.

      I wouldn’t allow religion to be taught until he was at an age to decide for himself. He studied and chose not to partake in religion to become a Human Rights lawyer. All his own choose. He has mainly lived with myself and my fella and it’s no secret that he feels had things been different and he’d remained mainly with his mother he wouldn’t have gotten where he is today. I dispute that but thats his words not mine.

      Yet I have only had one partner in his 20 years while his mother has had seven or eight men over the last 20 years. Nothing against that you understand but how come it’s still me that provided a stable,loving home, financially sound too with his step-father (my partner), given him everything and yet it’s still me thats a bad parent just because my partner of nearly 20 years just happens to also be male?
      …….

      1. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 10:51am

        ……
        Luckily many people have seen what my son has grow into the man he is today and I’ve yet to meet anyone who can question or give a creditable arguement to why LGBT people should not be parents.

        These people Scottish Catholic or whatever Catholics only say what they say out of pure assumptions not facts. Which in itself is seriously dangerous and shows them up as the true Evils of the projections they throw at others.

  46. all hate groups must be torn down, to save this nation and its families, from constant harrassment and abuses, from children to old people half of every nation us and foreingn is gay families, the hetersexual bigots had better u;nderstand that, all people are not the same no body likes the same thing , you just had better not be messing with underage children and rapping women and children and stalking women sexual harrassment , pedephilia, and rape ;and murder , racism and bigotry are all violent crimes that attack other saftey and peace, NoM has to be torn down, the testimonies of the people abused by NOM was horrific , NOMs top executive left and quit because he no longer could tolerate the evil and abuse he said he was a party to in helping aid such evil acts upon innocent families, NOM has a evil reputations just like Other militants, Iran, has to be overhauled and yes half of I ran is gay, and all other countries are gay, like prince charles and camilla , so what its simply none

  47. NOrth carolina , has to keep standing up against the bigotry as well, no town should every let and allow a few republican and bad religious bigots, to make decisions for all of their families, are concerned when you are dealing with racism , its evil its wrong, the towns people are over half of them gay families and hetersexual families with gay freinds and gay family and ;you never all racist officials mayor and governoers to remain officials as bigots in your town hurting your children and their freinds and families who are your friends and who are not harming anyone apposed to the racist and bigoted few bad officials who are the problem and the ones who keep violence and wars going in your comunities, and families ,

  48. Bill Pedue 13 Sep 2011, 1:36am

    Acts of interference by cults and megacults in civil affairs like elections, adoption, governemnt operations, marriage, taxation and education should be criminalized.

  49. He had a point that man and woman are married to give a child life so they can abandon the child to Catholic priest who have been raping them for a long time.
    The Catholic Church seems to forget that the governments are still the law of the land and until the Christians over throw the governments (which they have been working hard on for some time, in secret but the secret is now out) so the Governments are still in power and they can do the work for all people to ensure freedom for all and not just a few mad religious fanatics who think they have to destroy others in order to survive. To use Bishop O’Brien own words, the most grotesque subversion of a universally accepted human right, the right to marry and have children has been harmed by the Catholic Church and their pedophile priest who have destroyed countless children who they have raped and abused for years and still hide the fact that is still goes on today. This includes the countless family members who live with this too.

  50. Since these preposterous he-virgins have set themselves up as quasi guardians of marriage, redefining marriage to include gay couples will be enormously problematic for them. For example, they might be excused marrying gay couples in church, but they will be unable to maintain marriage only constitutes a man and a woman as the law would say differently. They are on the stickiest wicket ever.

  51. Niels, the hague 13 Sep 2011, 6:29am

    We are a gay couple with twins (through surrogacy). Our neighbours are a lesbian couple and they have a daughter and three houses down live another gay couple who have two kids with a lesbian couple on the other side of town. Perhaps not conventional, but these kids are not an accident from a drunken Saturday night. Nor are they conceived because an old man in Rome says we have to create as many kids as possible and indoctrinate them with his stories about the ‘right’ way. Our kids are wished for, our kids are definitely our number one priority. And according to our doctor, who is actually certified to say anything on the matter really, she could only wish that straight couples would go about raising their children like we do. Furthermore, next year we will marry and our son and daughter of then 2.5 years will carry our rings:)
    Marriage is not just for people who fill their hearts with restricted love. It’s for everybody who has found their soul partner

  52. The church needs an “enemy” to survive, it was Jews once, now that’s not acceptable, so now they think they can target gays. Catholicism only survives when its flock have something to pathologically and irrationally fear.

    Its a real pity though, their numbers are falling like a brick in Europe…. :)

  53. Perhaps the Catholic church (and others) should (were it at all possible) accept that the foundation for marriage is Love and Commitment is personal choice by those two people to celebrate their;love to each other. by making the choice to marry

    The following article might enlighten those who need to be informed there are no negatives to same sex marriage!

    http://atheism.about.com/od/gaymarriage/Gay_Rights_Gay_Marriage_Homophobia_Ethical_Political_Issues.htm

  54. Anyone would think these dirty beasts (cockney for priests) owned marriage.

    1. It’s funny that they try to claim ownership of something that existed millennia before they did.

  55. The one question that the catholic church never seems to answer is how many people are active members of your particular religion, quite possibly because they are either frightened that people will realise just how few people they actually represent.

    That is, how many people turn up regularly to your services, not how many people have passed through the doors of any establishment that you’ve run, multilpied by a figure plucked from the sky.

    I’ve seen a figure of 800,000, or approximately 15% of the Scottish population (which seems a little high, but hey!). The recent survey that says that 61% of Scottish people believe in marriage equality shows just how far behind the times this bunch of old bigots truly are.

    Adapt, or die……….

  56. V.A.T.I.C.U.N.T.

  57. Jock S. Trap 13 Sep 2011, 12:10pm

    Whether you agree with marriage or not we should all have the choice.

  58. religion is for the mentally distubed shame its going to lose to gay rights bye bye religion

  59. Father Ted 15 Sep 2011, 5:13pm

    I can’t get married so I’m going to make sure no other gay men can either, they can all be as miserable and single as me.

    Father Jack for Archbishop!

  60. Cardinal O’Brien is a dangerously deluded man!!
    Have your say where it counts….
    http://www.scotland.gov.uk/Publications/2011/09/05153328/0
    Copy and paste this link into browser, open the file and complete the consultation doc in annexe E. Email back to Scottish Government please.
    He is deluded to believe the church can exert the dictatorial influence over the political views of it’s flock, as was the case many years ago when people were less educated, informed by media, and politically aware.
    Marriage began as a social construct to facilitate patriarchial control over women and to control population and wealth within socities. Despite all religions having a ritual to celebrate marriage, it is indeed the business of governments to legislate the constructs of our society!
    Does O’Brien regard gay access to the universal right to education & healthcare grotesquely subversive??
    His attempt to blackmail the scottish government with the withdrawl of catholic votes is outrageous. Act now!!

  61. Keith Farrell 23 Sep 2011, 4:15pm

    I find this sad, SA that someone in the church that has many faults of her own can be so stupid as to denigh us our basic human rights. I was born to a straght coupla, my brothers were straigh and I am gay, I was born this way, why can I not be loved the right person. I say, ban all weddings, make it a Partnership agreement for all. let the stupid churches hold ther weddings but with them not being legal unless performed the same way as we have to have ours done, at the registars office.
    I am to ashamed to claim to be a catholic, the church as brought nothing but pain and hate into my life.

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