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Lesbian MSP Ruth Davidson tipped to lead Scottish Tories

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  1. James Incer 4 Jul 2011, 2:52pm

    The Tories are so homophobic. They haven’t changed. They’re a disgrace.

    Oh wait, sorry, I’d forgotten that they have more LGBT MPs than every other party put together, are looking at making Civil Partnerships closer to equality by allowing them to be religious, quashing convictions for homosexuality pre-decriminilisation, have continued the annual reception at Number 10 to celebrate the LGBT community, and now they have a lesbian as a prospective Scottish leader.

    I am shocked and appalled at their blatant hatred for the gay community.

    1. Chuckster 4 Jul 2011, 2:55pm

      Heh! Won’t stop the usual suspects trotting out their intolerant anti-Tory bigotry JI!

    2. Stuart Neyton 4 Jul 2011, 3:07pm

      they may well have more LGBT MPs than any other party but they also have more homophobic MPs than any other party. That’s not the reason i despise them though. But good luck to her anyway

    3. …the only legal change to CPs is that they may be registered in a church and will actually only be taken up by a few gay couples. There’s no new move to making them more equal to marriage if that’s what you mean and the actual change was done by the last govt anyway and this govt will take over 2 yrs to implement that change (due Feb 2012). Isn’t Cameron the only leader who hasn’t come out in favour of marriage equality. I’m not sure whether it really matter how many gay folk they have in their party if they ignore the wishes of 98% of the people who want marriage equality. I personally have little faith in a consultation process with no end date and no timetable for a bill to be written and passed prior to the next election. Who are you and the tories trying to kid?

      1. It’s the LibDems not the Conservatives who have promised equality in marriage by 2015 John. We should trust them. They can use their bargaining power in the coalition to make certain demands and they’ve obviously decided to do it over this issue.

        1. Have the Lib Dems really promised marriage equality by 2015 like you say? Where is your evidence? I know it was voted on at their party conference last year but is it actually party policy now and have they set a time table by 2015, like you suggest?

          1. @Luke

            Not sure about it being party policy – although I doubt you would get many Lib Dems against it

            Lynne Featherstone is on the record as stating she intends to have equal marriage by 2015

        2. @Stu,

          When did Lynne Featherstone say that?

          I would imagine majority of Lib Dem MPs would be in favour of marriage equality although there are a few that probably would vote against equal rights, Bob Russel MP for example.

          1. @Luke

            I think most Lib Dems (MPs and otherwise) would support equal marriage. Although there would be a very small minority may well fail to support.

            Lynne Featherstones comments can be seen here:
            http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2011/02/14/gay-campaigners-welcome-gay-marriage-equality-plans/

          2. @Stu,

            To be fair, that article doesn’t say Lynne Featherstone has promised anything concrete on marriage equality or any timetable. Stonewall mentions they would like marriage equality by 2015 but they are not part of the government, as we know.

          3. @Luke

            To be fair, no minister can promise anything particularly on issues where free votes will be given as it a matter of conscience.

            She has promised to bring forward legislation that will seek to ensure equality.

            Thats more than has happened in the past

        3. Sister Mary Clarence 4 Jul 2011, 10:33pm

          Unfortunately they’ve only got about two and a half votes between them, so if it goes through we can thank the Tories for it

        4. Yes, I know that, but without Labour or the Tories then they simply don’t have the numbers and neither of these major parties have come out in favour of a marriage equality policy. It’s only lib dems policy, the coalition govt policy is simply to set up a consultation process with no definite timetable. That’s all that’s been promised by the govt at the moment, NOT marriage equality. Don’t get mixed up with govt policy and party plicy..The lib dems aren’t in the process of wrting a private bill on marriage equality to be implemented by 2015, are they? I agree withLuke below I wasn’t aware of any timetable set by the lib dems when the passed their policy in their conf.

  2. @James

    I remain suspicious about some Tories …

    I have to say, so far, so good with the coalition – and we need to remember it is a coalition, and that in the event the Tories were solely in power they would have to demonstrate such equality and fairness on a continuing basis

    I am very surprised and pleased to see the potential of a lesbian leader of the Scottish Conservatives, however.

    1. Chuckster 4 Jul 2011, 2:58pm

      Coalition or not, Stu, irrespective of the coalition the Tory party itself has more LGBT MPs than every other party put together. And what’s more, those MPs represent every sort of constituency from coastal retirement resorts full of old biddies to metropolitan urban constituencies vie rural farming ones.

      1. at last elections, with government’s popularity in gutter, even monkey would win seat for conservatives

      2. @Chuckster

        I don’t deny that they have more LGBT MPs than any other party in Westminster – they also have by far the vast majority of homophobes.

        Take for example, the Stonewall review of MP voting in the last parliament on LGBT issues. Of those that scored 14% or less of potential voting points (2 points in favour, 1 for not attending, 0 for against) – if you remove those MPs who are no longer in post as an MP – of all the MPs left (and there were over 45) only 2 were not Conservative (one Labour and one DUP).

        I do support the government and some of the efforts to improve LGBT issues. It needs to sustain this to gain credibility after its horrendous acts in 1980s. Having a reasonable number of LGBT MPs is otherwise just window dressing.

        1. Most of the new intake of Conservative MPs (half of Conservative MPs) are ‘gay friendly’ and are not homophobic in the sense they dislike us, they respect us. I hope this translates into them supporting marriage equality and other measures. Watch Democracylive on the BBC, particularly equality and women’s questions, it is usually Conservative back benchers that ask anything to do with LGBT issues, often about homophobic and transphobic bullying, blood ban etc, positive things that will help the lives of LGBT people.

          Many previous Conservative MPs of the past with bad records on LGBT equality have changed too. Although looking at past voting records is probably the best indicator of the way an MP thinks, I think it can get outdated pretty quickly because many MPs have changed their views for the better. The party is moving forward on LGBT equality, quicker than many people would think.

          1. @Luke

            I suspect your commentary on the movement of the Conservative party and its movement on LGBT issues may be accurate (only time will tell for sure).

            However, given a history of horrific attitudes including very poor voting records in just the last parliament – it is easy to understand why there is cautiousness to trust on this issue.

      3. The Tories have 307 seats out of 620. The fact that they have more gay members than the rest is not so statistically unlikely that it can be used to suggest that they are particularly gay friendly in candidate selection.

        Do you have anything other than a statisitical anomaly to suggest they’ve improved their position on gays? Their recent history would suggest otherwise. Remember Cameron never actually voted for the repeal of section 28, he voted for an amendment that (very slightly) watered it down.

  3. Stuart Neyton 4 Jul 2011, 3:06pm

    I despise the tories and everything they stand for and, even with a lesbian leader, wouldn’t vote for them in a million years, but good luck to her. All parties need more women and LGBT people (as well as disabled, ethnic and other minorities) in higher positions.

    1. James Incer 4 Jul 2011, 3:12pm

      I assure you, Stuart, that the feeling is mutual with your Green party.

      1. Here, here!!!

  4. PS – The Tory party still have the likes of Tebitt in the house of lords and he very recently stated his utter contempt at equality for gay people and marriage equality

    Lord Tebbit May 2011 – To ask Her Majesty’s Government…. whether they will refrain from using in answers to parliamentary questions expressions such as “equal civil marriage and partnerships” for which they have no definition.

    1. James Incer 4 Jul 2011, 3:26pm

      Having Lord Tebbitt in the HoL isn’t really a choice, John. It’s sort of a thing for life :-p

      1. James…If only you could show me a few question asked to the govt or even off the cuff statements from chosen MPs that have come out categorically in favour of marriage equality and full equality for gays from the Tory party then I’d be ever so more convinced…..wouldn’t you?

    2. Saying Lord Tebbit represents the Conservative Party’s view on LGBT issues is like saying Lord Ahmed represents Labour’s stance on LGBT issues. Check his voting record on LGBT issues, not good, not representative of Labour either. Lord Tebbit’s view on homosexuality is also not the view of the Conservative party as a whole either.

      1. Luke – look if you want to quote a Tory MP or several of them that have come out in favour of equality in the form of marriage equality then I’d be convinced. If Tebbit is no longer in the “spirit” of the Tory party then I’m all for LGBTory demanding a “ban” on him from the Tory party. I don’t think I did say Tebbit represents the cons party , I simply said they have the likes of him in their party and quite frankly the Tories haven’t come out in favour of equal marriage ie equality for gays, have they Luke?

        1. I don’t think it would be a good idea to ban Lord Tebbit from the Conservative party. I profoundly disagree with him on gay rights and I would rather challenge him than ban him. Admittedly, it would prove controversial to ban him now (because of his role in the cabinet etc), just like if Labour tried to ban Lord Ahmed, for instance.

          In terms of marriage equality, I have yet to read many Tory MPs that are not gay come out in favour of marriage equality but that appears to be the case on the Labour benches too. The Conservatives official policy does not mention a firm commitment on marriage equality but Labour has no policy on it either. The Lib Dem’s policy isn’t exactly clear either. Although marriage equality is very important and I do wish to see it implemented by 2015, I do think that it is wrong to label people/organisations homophobic casually as many do on here. I know many homophobes, real homophobes that want us dead and think we are perverts.

        2. Continued….

          They are the one’s we should concentrate on too, not just politicians that appear to not back marriage equality.

  5. Jock S. Trap 4 Jul 2011, 3:21pm

    Good luck to her, I hope she succeeds!!

    1. James Incer 4 Jul 2011, 3:27pm

      Hear hear!

      1. So do I … and it will be an extra step along the way for me to not feel cautious about Conservatives re LGBT concerns.

        1. She is a great lesbian role model and we need as many as possible

    2. I say good luck to her too. If she is reading this, please go for it. You obviously have so much to give the party. If she does become leader of the Scottish Tories, the Tories would of been the party with the first lesbian leader…. another first for the Conservatives in the UK! First gay PM too? I would bet on it!

      1. Edward Heath might of been the first gay PM….. but I don’t have any proof, it is a rumour only. Let’s just say that is true…. the Tories could have the first lesbian PM in the future? Margot James is the only person that could fit that criteria at the moment and I don’t suspect she intends to be the future PM.

        1. Tim Roll-Pickering 6 Jul 2011, 2:37am

          Regarding gay PMs this is invariably contentious as none were out in the modern sense and several of the candidates’ biographers don’t agree they were. However the most commonly cited candidate for the first gay PM was William Pitt the Younger (1783-1801 & 1804-1806) whose followers became the second Tory Party which was the precursor to the Conservative Party.

  6. The day David Cameron says he categorically supports and wants to pass marriage equality will be the day I’ll trust the Tories with my vote. If it weren’t for the Liberal Democrats in the coalition, make no mistake, a marriage equality consultation would be off the table. Cameron can’t take any credit for it either way. I don’t agree with consultations. They should just draft a bill first, discuss it, fine tune it where necessary, and then bring it to a parliamentary vote.

    As for that anachronistic, undemocratic House of Lords, about time it was abolished. Why should they have a say in anything when they aren’t even elected?

    1. Conservatives were the only major party to mention a consultation on marriage equality in their manifesto. They are taking this forward right now. If it translates into marriage equality legislation, then it is a clear win for the Conservative’s as it was in their manifesto.

      Robert, judges are not elected yet I bet you would of welcomed many of their rulings in favour of LGBT rights in the UK and abroad.

      1. “Conservatives were the only major party to mention a consultation on marriage equality in their manifesto.”

        Were they? I really don’t remember this, did I miss something..?

        1. http://www.pinknews.co.uk/2010/05/03/conservative-equality-manifesto-promises-to-consider-full-gay-marriage/

          It was only mentioned pretty late on into the campaign but a consultation on marriage equality was mentioned in the equalities manifesto.

      2. I have no recollection whatsoever of a consultation on mariage equality being in anybody’s manifesto. If anybody writes a bill on marriage equality prior to 2015 then I’ll give that person and his/hers party credit. I just hope someone does it and puts the other parties in a corner as to where they actually stand on this issue. At the moment the only major party that has voted on it is the lib dems. If the lib dems write a bill then the cons or labour will have to show their true colours , if the cons refuse to support it then it’s a clear loss for the cons party and Cameron and LGBTory!

  7. Ok I may loathe the Tories greatly, but I still wish her the best of luck, It would be nice to have a second LGBT Party leader in Scotland. :)

  8. HelenWilson 4 Jul 2011, 5:38pm

    Good luck to her but lets face it, not exactly lots of Conservative MSP’s to chose from its a 1 in 15 chance. Anyone who is not the usual rabid anti anything not approved by the home counties county set Tory MP should stand a real good chance of the job.

  9. chantal chaervey 4 Jul 2011, 8:07pm

    this great news good luck to her, but i wonder is there a transgender MP yet

    1. HelenWilson 4 Jul 2011, 9:31pm

      Nope just a few councillors, we are about 20 years behind the LGB in political representation.

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