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Trans woman speaks out about Baltimore McDonald’s beating

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  1. Maybe kickin’ the crap out of someone isn’t the best reaction, but… men go to the men’s room and women to the women’s…regardless of how they are dressed. If my wife told me there was a man in the ladies room while she was in there…I probably wouldn’t clobber him if he was dressed as a lady but I wouldn’t be too happy about it.

    1. When transgender people go through the process of becoming the other sex. They ARE the other sex. This lady was in the correct bathroom. She is a she.

    2. Hodge Podge 27 Apr 2011, 5:38pm

      Why do we segregate toilets in the first place? Not for old fashioned morality, but because of the necessity of women only spaces.

      And there has never been an incident of a man crossdressing to attack women in the toilets, ever.

    3. Helen Wilson 27 Apr 2011, 5:58pm

      Chrissy Lee Polis has a transsexual history, she is post-operative and legally a woman. Are you really saying someone with a vagina should use a male bathroom Tim? The older of the two women who attacked Chrissy was arrested a year earlier for attacking a CIS gendered woman in the very same restaurant. I doubt she was in the slightest bit concerned a woman with a transsexual history was using the single stall bathroom that only has one user at a time. The attacker thought that person is different and a easy victim for her to attack.

      The attack happened outside the toilet as the video of the attack proves.

      Not one case has ever been reported of a trans person attacking a woman in a toilet, but we have plenty of cases of trans people being attacked themselves. We only have to look at what happened at London Pride in 2009 to see what happens when a trans women is forced to use a male toilet.

      1. Helen Wilson 27 Apr 2011, 6:06pm

        When Westminster councils contractors illegally forced trans women to use the male toilets, two ended up being sexually assaulted.

        What the hell do people expect trans people to do? pee in the street outside or never leave the house! We need to pee, try on clothes, use sports centre changing facilities just like any other person needs to.

      2. “…The older of the two women who attacked Chrissy was arrested a year earlier for attacking a CIS gendered woman in the very same restaurant…”

        Proof? A posted assertion without a link is hearsay.

        1. Helen Wilson 27 Apr 2011, 11:04pm

          Reported in the daily mail on Apr 26, under the headline:

          “Woman charged for brutal McDonald’s beating was arrested for assault last year at the SAME restaurant”

          In a handwritten police statement seen by the Smoking Gun, mother-of-two Danielle Dower, 38, described how Brown allegedly followed her out of the restaurant yelling : ‘Did you call me ugly?’

          She said Brown ‘kept trying to badger us’ after she said no and tried to move away with her two daughters.

          Mrs Dower claims Brown pushed her, but when she pushed back she ‘took her fist and threw a punch to my face.’

          In an attempt to get her children to safety, Mrs Dower went into a nearby shopping centre, but claims Brown and two friends followed them inside.

          As she called 911, the two friends allegedly seized her daughter by the hair and dragged her across the floor.

          1. Thanks for that, Helen. Proof, if proof were needed, that this girl is a potential danger to everyone. Like all bullies, these attackers must suffer from very low self-esteem which shows itself as uncontrollable outbursts of anger. If all that has been reported is correct, these girls need more than punishment – they need some kind of psychological help.

      3. Almost, Helen. Almost.

        I discussed this with a lawyer friend at the weekend. She had to do some research, but she did turn up ONE case in recent years of a guy who dressed as a mannequin whilst perving in UK loos.

        But mostly its about hiding in stalls, drilling holes, or planting cameras (or mirrors).

        And if you think about it a) a bloke wearing a dress is actually much MORE conspicuous than one wearing, say, a boiler suit and carrying a mop and b)blokes take their kids all the time into open plan male changing rooms.

        Its a total straw man argument that bigots just love to hide behind.


        1. Helen Wilson 28 Apr 2011, 12:12am

          Well last week in my local paper we had the story of a man dressed as a plumber going into women’s toilets sealing himself into one of the cubicles for hours on end, doing goodness knows what! As he was doing it in the toilets at at the Tescos store I use, I could of well of used that toilet while he was in residence.

          1. xactly. i think we agree the main point, which is that if a bloke wants to do this sort of thing, he is unlikely to dress as a woman to do it…and all the froth about allowingtrans women into the ladies is just code for “i’m a bigot but i’d better not say so publically”.


    4. And what is a man with a wife doing on Pink News? Closet case? Or just a fictional story to try and justify your transphobia?

      1. Isn’t anyone free to read Pink?

    5. Tim – really, your ignorance and bigotry are astounding.

    6. theotherone 27 Apr 2011, 9:14pm

      Nice to know I have to watch my back when you’re around Tim.

    7. Uh, Tim, the victim IS a woman. If someone is born male and realizes that they’re transgendered later in life, and they begin to identify as female, that makes them FEMALE. It’s not rocket science. That people fail to understand this is astounding.

    8. You’re not american, are you Tim? There does seem to be some confusion in the US about the cross-over between toilets and sex. Toilets are places where you go to pee: not to have sex. And the idea that they are “dangerous” places seems to be the product of some pretty, er, anal thinking.

    9. i’d also add that it doesn’t surprise me that you’re a bloke. I was threatened a month or so back by a bloke when i went into the female changing rooms at my local leisure centre. Why? the women who used that area (all cubicled, by the way) hadn’t complained. The management had no probs.

      Just this lone guy, demonstrating how chivalrous he was by threatening to hit me.

      Sorry, lone stupid guy.

      Because, of course, in the men’s changing rooms, weekend dads were busy taking their offspring – male and female alike – into a space where they strip off in a non-cubicled open area, under the gaze of any and every passing male perv in town.

      My conclusion. First, its a control thing: men resent the fact they can’t go into “women’s spaces”…so they want to limit who can.

      Second, its a guilt thing: men know what a bunch of pervs they can be…so obviously, us trans women MUST be just as bad.



    10. Lastly Tim: i’m sick of this crap and i’m sick of bigots like you making my life a nightmare.

      After i got threatened, the Leisure Centre explained to the guy doing the threatening that if he didn’t like me in the changing rooms, he could go somewhere else. The police explained to him that if he did it again, he would be arrested.

      But that’s after.

      So, Tim. I’m not going to threaten. I’m certainly not going to hit you, because, in case you didn’t know, one of the side-effects of my hormone treatment is that i’m probably a lot less strong than you (and also a lot less sex-obsessed).

      But be aware that if you threaten me, you are the one acting unlawfully. You are the criminal.

      And if you or your bigot friends ever propose to move from threat to actual violence, well…its really not nice when you get hairspray in your eyes….


      1. And Tim I think men are the last people to have any say in who gets to use the womens toilets.
        My experience is that most women are more than capable of not being bigoted and realising that I’m as much of a women as they are. The last thing they want is a man coming along and deciding for them that I shouldn’t be there.

      2. Hear, here. Well said Jane

      3. Hi, Jane. I just want to add my voice to yours in solidarity. My life has been pretty peaceful by comparison, but that doesn’t mean I don’t live in fear. I agree with everything you’ve said. Except one. It’s my experience that, despite what the docs told me would happen, I’m just as sex-obsessed after surgery as I was before hormones. My body reacts differently, but I’m still as sexual.

        Anyway, I hope good things for you: peace, long life, health, and love.


    11. You obviously don’t understand what being transgender is about- a trans woman is legally, and after surgery, physically a woman- so she was in the right bathroom.

  2. How shocking that one of the attackers was only 14. I’d like to know all about the parents of that child. What kind of damaged person attacks another person like that for no reason at all?

    Tim, you’re wrong. This lady was in the right toilets for her. She just had the misfortune to be there at the same time as the two sad, vicious losers who attacked her.


  3. I don’t see why there aren’t more unisex toilets.. it doesn’t seem to be an issue in places like Nightingales in Birmingham which have had unisex toilets for some time without incident and that’s with plenty of drunk people both gay/bi/straight and trans

  4. Helen Wilson 27 Apr 2011, 11:54pm

    This is the sort of hell women with trans histories go through just because we need to pee!

    A woman from New York who was in Las Vegas was banned for life for using the women’s room at The Cosmopolitan’s bar

    I’m tired of this crap, just let my people pee!

  5. Jock S. Trap 28 Apr 2011, 10:27am

    Another appalling story of violence and abuse. When will it end?
    The fact people just stand around as if it’s some kind of entertainment is disgusting. I’m glad McDonalds made the statement and fired the worker but is it enough?
    As for the people standing around watching doing nothing to stop and some laughing.. they are just as guilty as the two lunatics who committed this vile crime.
    I hope for the heaviest of punishments for this.

    1. So speaketh the oracle. Except you’ve simply reiterated what everyone else has said above and so made yet another entirely pointless post.

      1. Jock S. Trap 28 Apr 2011, 11:37am

        It’s called debate. This is called an opinion.

        People do tell what you hope to achieve?

        1. It’s not a debate where you are concerned, as you comment on anything and everything, no matter if your comment duplicates to the nth degree what others have already said.

          “People do tell what you hope to achieve?” – what sort of sentence is that?

          1. Jock S. Trap 28 Apr 2011, 3:09pm

            I debate. These are my opinions. They are as valid as everyone debating here.
            You chose to read them. Your chose to respond.

            As for the last comment I mean you ‘Joe’ and ‘Jane’ etc as people. Wonder what you hope to achieve by your personal attacks? It’s a simple question really. You must be doing it for a reason or you won’t be so personal. So come on what are you hoping to achieve? Do tell all.

      2. de Villiers 28 Apr 2011, 9:44pm

        Joe – leave Jock alone. You’re doing no more than baiting. We are all free to post to these boards.

        1. Jock S. Trap 29 Apr 2011, 7:47am

          Thank you for your support de Villiers.

  6. I’m really glad that this story is getting the exposure it deserves. At last people seem to be realising the level of abuse that trans people undergo. These sorts of attacks are far too common.

  7. OrtharRrith 28 Apr 2011, 11:53am

    At least, thanks to the idiot employee who, instead of doing the right thing and helping; simply stood there filming and laughing, we now have a video to show that clearly highlights the dangers transpeople face when trying to get on with their own lives. Not the employee’s intention I have no doubt, and it’s nasty to watch but I think people should watch it because it’ll open their eyes.
    This is one of many such senarios that I and no doubt many other transpeople fear occuring when we go out

    1. I think we need to push home the fact that we not only fear it but incidents like this aren’t a one off. I pass well now and no one raises an eye lid when I use the toilets. Unfortunately when I was early in transition I had an incident which is was quite similar to this. The only reason it didn’t end in viloence was that I had an ally with me.
      I’m still nervous about using the toilet though.

  8. Why do we even have separate bathrooms anyway?

    Just designate some cubicles “sitting down” only to ensure that women (and men wanting a No. II) don’t have to sit in piss.

    1. seperate cos some people still don’t want to mix with the opposite sex when going to the loo

    2. de Villiers 28 Apr 2011, 9:45pm

      A matter of manners, surely?

  9. PumpkinPie 28 Apr 2011, 5:50pm

    The victim is a transwoman, so all these slack-jawed creeps watched on like it was some kind of show for their sick amusement (except for one wonderful older lady who stepped in).

    I’m betting their reactions would have been different if this were a ciswoman.

  10. This just proves what a backward hole the socalled ‘land of the free’ is!!!!!! So tired of hearing about AMERICA as though it means anything! It means hatred, discrimination and whatever else you want to throw in there! So many other countries ,especially to the south of the USA are leading the way in human rights and progressive politics! Please report those countrris ‘moving on’ and not seeping in the hatred of ‘Jesus’

    1. OrtharRrith 29 Apr 2011, 11:10am

      This is far from a solitary incident that occurs only in America. This happens to transpeople everywhere, including in the UK. Those countries to the south of the USA as you put it are where transwomen are frequently burned to death, shot and beheaded, hardly progressive!

    2. SkreeminEegal 30 Apr 2011, 11:02am

      Brenton, have you spent any time in the US? Are you aware of our rather extensive scheme of antidiscrimination laws? Are you aware that Christians played a major role in the human and civil rights movements in the US? Life, and the USA, are a tad more complicated than you seem to realize. Now go hang out with your Euro skinhead buddies and tout your bigotry with them; you’ve wasted enough time here.

      1. Great idea – complain about generalisations then make an offensive one yourselfBrenton made a strong point but he never accused any American of the false crap you’ve just written about Europe. What PARTICULAR ‘skinheads’ did you have in mind, eh? Yeah…..nice. Not.

        Perhaps it’d be helpful if you listed the ‘extensive scheme of antidiscrimination laws’ that protect LGBT people in the US – no?

        1. Would that be Skinheads Against Racial Prejudice? I too am tired of the American isolationist tendency to consider America a “leader of the free world” when, in fact, it’s Europe and South America who are much better leaders in terms of political action and domestic policy. On a global scale, America has fallen behind the curve. Even England is making progressive strides, whereas America seems to be flailing between secular libertarianism and dogmatic fundamentalism. Despite the fact that there are awesome people in the US fighting for their country to do right, the result is disappointing.

          1. Well said, Ivy.

  11. Another Hannah 29 Apr 2011, 9:29pm

    I’m sure they’ll do a bit of something or other to this criminal, but not much. Proper serious legislation is required. Given that the government won’t do this I’s say the smartest action is to stay away from the poor and very thick, and the places they frequent, like McDonalds for example. It’s about the most effective action that can be taken to avoid these problems.

    1. Sorry… the POOR are the problem? I’ve NEVER been accosted by a poor person for anything beyond aggressive panhandling. I think you must be one of the very thick people you warn us all against. Do you know who are consistently poor? TRANS PEOPLE!

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