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Thousands could leave Church of Scotland over gay clergy

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  1. Jock S. Trap 21 Apr 2011, 11:21am

    No loss, let em go.

    Count the bigots as they leave.

    1. Well said!

  2. Maybe I’m missing the point, but I thought going to church was supposed to be about faith, not the sexuality of the minister.

    1. Iz, is it about the faith in God Almighty who said that homosexuality is an abomination to Him.

      1. Oh, you mean the bible? Yeah, delightful book. Who could doubt the word of god when opposed to talking snake with an interest in apple horticulture, and a load of conflicting nonsense that are supposed to be “rules”? An idiot like you, that’s who.

        1. Jock S. Trap 21 Apr 2011, 2:46pm

          Exactly.

          God didn’t say anything – it over infalted male egos did!

      2. actually, at no point did “God Almighty” say anything of the sort. the person who translated the Bible texts from Aramaic and Ancient Greek into English, however, felt the need to add all that bullsh** about homosexuality.

        In other words, the Bible never once mentions homosexuality. None of the Aramaic or Greek words used in the Bible texts means “homosexual”.

        If you want to base your entire religion on the words of a translator, rather than on the actual Holy Text, please, feel free to do so… but do NOT try to pass that off as being the will of “God Almighty”.

        All Christian religions that preach homophobia are doing so based upon lies and fabrications. There is absolutely NOTHING in the original texts which permits the interpretation of the teachings of Christ as meaning ANYTHING remotely homophobic.

        1. Jock S. Trap 21 Apr 2011, 2:48pm

          Surely proof that religion relies on the gullible.

      3. Nikki Hatch 21 Apr 2011, 3:03pm

        Oh please! God Almighty has never spoken to humans…lol. Jesus, who I believe was a human reflection of a loving God had NOTHING to say about the subject. The other sparse Biblical comments relate to rape, promiscuity, and idol worship which have nothing to do with a loving committed relationship of two same sex people. People need to realize that the Bible, written by man, contaiins the cutural prejudice of their times and their limited scientific knowledge.
        The thing that Jesus clearly frowned on was hate and prejudice against anyone. Looks like the CXhristians missed that lesson.

        1. Dominick J. 21 Apr 2011, 7:34pm

          Right on Niki but it’s the Right Wing Nuts that missed that lesson. SO let the cretins leave! They did that here with Gene Robinson and that portion of the church is flousihing!!

      4. Dominick J. 21 Apr 2011, 7:30pm

        God never said Homsosexuality was an abomination. Man said that after misrepresenting a bible passge!

      5. darkmoonman 21 Apr 2011, 10:06pm

        Massive, you might do some actual research before spreading more heresy. By that, I mean study the original Hebrew & Aramaic writings.

      6. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 9:25am

        Massive

        Actually, I’m pretty sure like aliens, God passed by looking for intelligent life. On visiting left a sign that read, Well the lights are on but no-ones home, I’ll try another time.

      7. Jonathan and David. Lovers.
        2.Samuel 1:26
        Naomi loved her Ruth.
        Ruth 1:15-16
        It is in a Bible brother, so what is the truth?
        Love is Love.

      8. Jonathan and David.
        Naomi and Ruth.
        Love is Love.

  3. Does the Church of Scotland allaow black ministers? I wouldn’t be suprised if the didn’t. Oh, but that would be racist wouldn’t it.
    Good to see them getting their priorities of equality right! ;-)
    And do they really believe they are Christians?
    Self delusional bigots.

  4. Jennie Kermode 21 Apr 2011, 11:23am

    The church already has a festering wound, torn between Christian compassion and an infection of bigotry. The only way to heal the wound is to clean that bigotry out.

  5. Other live-action roleplay clubs, sci-fi conventions, literary fiction appreciation societies and hobby groups aren’t allowed to discriminate due to homophobia, even if they play games in homophobic settings or read homophobic books. Why is this particular hobby group even allowed to flout the law?

  6. I wonder if they realise how ridiculous they are? They have a whole Bible to play with, but they are prepared to schism about what two consenting adults do with their genitals. If you put all biblical teaching on homosexuality together, it probably wouldn’t cover more than a page and a half out of thousands. To be honest, it’s not the bigotry (which I’d expect) that annoys me, it’s the sheer lack of common sense.
    They’ve spent centuries – for good or ill – building up their church and now some people want to destroy all that on the basis of something that doesn’t warrant much comment from their own God.
    I really wish they’d step back for a moment and ask themselves ‘We’re doing all of this because of a penis?’

    1. actually, if you put all of the biblical teachings about homosexuality together, you would not even need a single sheet of paper at all. there is NOTHING in the Aramaic or Greek texts which refers in any way, shape or form, to homosexuality.

      All reference to homosexuality were added at a much later date when the Bible texts were (mis)translated into Latin and other languages.

  7. What is neglected in this report is the fact that the only church in Aberdeen to report an increase in membership is the one lead by Scott Rennie. Or should that be openly gay minister Scott Rennie.

    As Jock says let them go, they’re on the way out anyway!

    1. Dominick J. 21 Apr 2011, 7:38pm

      Right Alana and I will give a BIG Amen to that!!! Let them split, this way we’ll have another church to profess to be Open and Affirming and in that part of the world the Congreagtion will ONLY GROW!!! Making them stronger!!

  8. Depressing. This reminds me of the Scotland I left over 40 years ago. But on visits back I detect that the place has moved on considerably, particulalry Edinburgh. The REALLY depressing bit will be if they continue with the ban. If not then how many would actually leave the church? They are the type that always threaten to throw their toys out of the pram if they don’t get their own way, and I suspect are fewer in number than they think they are.

  9. Good riddance

    Anything that damages organised religion should be celebrated.

    Organised religion is toxicly bigotted as a rule.

  10. Of course, this is all stems from the infamous verse in Leviticus that religious bigots use with impunity against us. Yet….they blatantly dismiss other verses which condone killing one’s wife for adultery or children for insolence, among many other disgusting references. Truly amazing how they cherry-pick this or that to suit their own comfort zone or agenda. They are masters of hypocrisy and bigotry as well as the double-standard. Hardly what one would call “christian” by any stretch of the imagination.

  11. johnny33308 21 Apr 2011, 1:51pm

    And those that leave will be known for the bigots that they truly are-and no loss will be felt by those remaining, since bigotry is hardly a Christian value….. or is it?

  12. Here’s a thought – why not wait until the Report is actually published? Criticism is fine, but perhaps wait until the facts are known?

  13. Frankly, WHO CARES???

    Churches are [or damned well should be] in the business of Faith and Service …. not about numbers!!!!!! If half leave, let them and good riddance – better to concentrate on the half who stay, the half that show Christian tolerance, the half that actually follow Christ’s instruction to NOT judge others ………

    1. Tim Chapman 21 Apr 2011, 8:43pm

      I don’t want their tolerance, I want their indifference.

  14. 2 champers sips to being a diva 21 Apr 2011, 2:21pm

    spell check Pinknews

  15. Maybe if the Bible were updated to reflect the simple FACT that every single instance of anti-gay wording in it is in fact abusive mistranslation of the original Aramaic and Greek texts?

  16. Oh well… this headline should read “Organisation that believes in mythical creature in the sky loses bigots”.

    Can’t say I’m surprised to be honest.

  17. Wish I could find the link, but I remember a newspaper cartoon a few months back when the pope was trying to boost his numbers by inviting defecting anglican bishops to join up. It featured the pope stood on St Peter’s square with a placard reading [to paraphrase] “homophobic, sexist reactionary throwback Anglican bigots, have I got a religion for you!”
    It’s good to keep all the bigots in one place, it makes them easier to avoid.

    1. he may as well recruit defecating bishops.

    2. A pity that Flapjack doesn’t appear to be aware – or perhaps even care – that the Church of Scotland is PRESBYTERIAN – i.e. no bishops. Criticise by all means, but try to be accurate!

      1. that’s also why he mentions “anglican” bishops in his post.

        1. Tim Chapman 21 Apr 2011, 8:48pm

          Who cares if they have bishops or not? They’re all Cristians so they’re all bonkers.

  18. Similar attitudes were expressed 50 years ago when the CofS ordained women ministers (one of the first Churches to do so). Undoubtedly a few left (and probably returned), the same will be true with the ordination of gay ministers. Interestingly, the most recent Social Attitudes Survey shows the majority of CofS members support gay relationships. Time the Church just got on with it and stopped pandering to The Daily Hate Mail.

  19. Don Harrison 21 Apr 2011, 4:47pm

    What hypocrites.
    Jesus said in John 8:1–11 He that is without sin among you, him first cast a stone at her

  20. By sheer coincidence I had a couple of good two shows Christians hammering at my door this morning. Him in a grey suit looking like a Republican, her all simpering, and both with great big teeth. I didn’t hear what she was saying but as soon as I saw the picture of Jesus Christ being waved in my face, I told them ‘I am a HOMOSEXUAL, and THAT lot have tried to make my life a misery for YEARS. But FAILED. GOODBYE.’ The look on her face was priceless – shock doesn’t come into it.
    Probably an even bigger shock when I slammed the door in it.
    Now, I’m not a horrible person, but, since the church she was from had been one that had voted against marriage for gay people I felt damn well justified.
    Besides Easter is a PAGAN festival that Christians hijacked. And there are an increasing number of pagans festivals promoted in my city – even the council goes in for promoting for pagan traditions in a big way.
    EDINBURGH.

    1. Tim Chapman 21 Apr 2011, 9:02pm

      They knocked on my door the other day, too, but I engaged with them and took them to task. I make my living out of arguing so it was a blast. They made all sorts of nonsense claims such as God having formed a parliament on Earth in 1918! They said the enjoyed chatting with me and promised to return within the month I told them not to bother unless they brought some evidence with them to substantiate their claims and, stangely the haven’t been back.

      I listen to this sort of rubbish every Sunday in church. (No, I haven’t lost my mind – I’m the organist)

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 9:30am

        Until today!!!

  21. A,J,Mainland 21 Apr 2011, 5:05pm

    As far as I’m aware (reffering to come and I’ll make you fishermen of men) fishermen are people who use traps and catches to ensnare
    vulnerable creatures and consume them for their own gain. This is the perfect description of the scottish Kirk, however there are some people who are becoming more aware of the scandalous lies and abuse of the orriginal text and due to this may bring a well needed source of refreshing to its ugly habbit of hoarding bigots. I just thank my lucky stars I left.

  22. What will the thousands set to leave the church do with their spare time? Redirect their bigotry in other ways.

  23. I’ve not been able to find the C of S Report yet – does anyone have a link to it?

  24. OK – so there have been 41 comments (ok – 2 of those were mnie) about a Report that nobody has seen? how rational is that? As I’ve said before, criticism is fine – but base it on FACTS!!! I assume nobody has a link to the Report yet?

  25. Why does Scotland need a church? Religion is so passe!

    1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 9:32am

      I know it’s Soooo last century.

  26. This is a global issue that may disappear in time when either the homophobes die out or traditional churches disappear. In New Zealand the Presbyterian (Scottish) church has put a moratorium on ordaining more openly gay or lesbian paired ministers but hasn’t restricted the ordination or single gay or lesbian ministers. Those ministers who were ordained before the moratorium can continue in their roles. My local church has a highly respected lesbian minister who has a civil union partner who is also a lesbian minister. Their parish is very supportive. Worshippers who aren’t comfortable with inclusiveness go to another more traditional church down the road. Threatening to leave is like a online forum rage-quit, they always come back or find an equivalent space and someone else joins in their place. The Church should get over its politeness and just do the right thing. If Jesus could have a prostitute as a disciple he could have a gay or lesbian minister in the church.

    1. Tim Chapman 22 Apr 2011, 8:00am

      Do you mean to equate homosexuality with prostitution?

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 9:33am

        No, I don’t think so but I bet he pays for it!!

        boom boom!!

        1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 9:35am

          It’s nice to see while people are having their names hi-jacked PinkNews has concentrated on fonts and spacing in comments.

    2. Just to be clear here: none of the disciples were “prostitutes”.
      You are indulging in the same type of interpretive nonsense as those who (mis)quote the Bible when they attack gays.

      I am presuming your reference is to Mary Magdalene. No mention is made anywhere in any text that she was a prostitute. That is simply fanciful interpretation of the Biblical text.

      That said, Jesus DID hang out with a pretty colourful crowd, that did include actual prostitutes.

  27. Get over it people you have had gays in the church as long as there has been a church so stop acting like you don’t now know about your family members being gay and religious, they are your neighbors, remember God said love one another.

  28. Vatic*nts.

    1. while I appreciate the origin of your sentiment… the article isn’t ABOUT the Church of Rome.

  29. I hope the Church disintegrates over these issues. Because as modernity and progress continue, ultimately, these ancient and bigoted superstitious cults go into the distant past with all the other roman and greek ideologies.

  30. Unitarians (including those in Scotland) have been welcoming openly LGBT members since 1970, ordaining openly LGBT ministers since 1977, offering same-sex blessings for decades, and campaigning for same-sex weddings and religious civil partnerships. Frankly, I am amazed that other churches have yet to resolve this issue.

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