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Man, 18, arrested over east London anti-gay stickers

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  1. musclelad23 21 Apr 2011, 4:26pm

    I hope whoever they find whoever got this lad and made him put these up. *cough* east london mosque *cough*

    1. musclelad23 21 Apr 2011, 4:27pm

      I hope they find*

    2. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 2:42pm

      When two men from the EDL climbed upon a deserted warehouse in Dudley to protest about it being turned into a mega-mosque, they were arrested and held on remand for 6 weeks. They were beaten by armed police who took them off the roof (one suffered a broken arm) – the police responded to the local muslims (egged on by the SWP) who threatened “a race riot”. The two men from EDL were charged with incitement of religious hatred – yet all they did was play the call to prayer and fly the Israeli flag.

      We’ve already heard how one of the muslims arrested for these Homos Heraus stickers has had charges dropped (even though found in possession of the stickers). Now let’s see if this one gets charged with incitement to hatred (there are already 2 muslims from Derby awaiting trial on that charge).

      1. whatever

      2. Sister Maray Clarence 24 Apr 2011, 12:37pm

        “When two men from the EDL climbed upon a deserted warehouse in Dudley to protest about it being turned into a mega-mosque, they were arrested and held on remand for 6 weeks. They were beaten by armed police who took them off the roof (one suffered a broken arm)….”


        In truth there is a lot of concern in this country about people coming here from abroad to live, when we are in such an adverse economic climate. I’ll be writing to my MP asking if these two can maybe be deported in order that we can try to balance things out a little bit, and any other EDL scum the authorities can get their hands on while they’re at it. These people are so stupid, no one can seriously tell me that any of them have actually got jobs, or can contribute anything of value to our society, so lets kick them out. Show them the same tolerance of other people that they themselves show

        1. The above post quoted from a website called Casuals United (I doubt they would be so gay friendly in their football environment). If you want to see why the EDL deserves their reputation, then look no further than this page and the unremoved comments underneath it:

          Political islamists, the EDL and the far left cranks all feed off one another.

          1. “Political islamists, the EDL and the far left cranks all feed off one another.”

            Well, political homosexuals are nothing but parrots of political heterosexuals in relation to Muslims. There no “islamists” in Islam. That’s what you don’t understand. Your stupidity is obvious. Sorry, but that’s the truth….

    3. Ian Townson 24 Apr 2011, 8:43am

      The EDL are playing a clever, deceitful game to gain membership of their movement and they are using what they imagine is a popular prejudice caused by a relentless attack on Islamic extremism and muslims by politicians and the media. They use Islamic extremism and the fear of enforced sharia law as a scare tactic in the hope that they can gain converts to their brand of English Nationalism. The likelihood of Islamist extremism and sharia law gaining significant ground here is Nil and to say so is an insult to the vast majority of muslims who reject both.
      The EDL’s demonstrations in Stoke, Reading, Bradford, Luton, and Blackburn have always been an occasion for intimidating muslim communities. In Blackburn EDL members couldn’t even wait to do that – they attacked each other. Their fake interest in defending women against the burqa and niqab and gays against homophobia is just another way of darkening the name of Islam to gain converts to their movement.

      1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 10:47am

        Yeah, you’d already copied and pasted that at the end.

  2. Jock S. Trap 21 Apr 2011, 4:29pm

    Trouble is I doubt these posters are the work of one individual. I think the one arrest is the start and while I pleased to see action I doubt it will stop the homophobia within Tower Hamlets.

    1. concerned resident E3 24 Apr 2011, 8:36am

      possibly there was more than one but, if so, I doubt there were more than a small number of sad iidiots. Scratch a little below the surface in LBTH and you find there are few in any of the various communities that actively hate gay people. I have lived in the ward with the highest concentration of moslems (mainly Sylhetti from Bangladesh) for over a decade and have never once encountered any homophobia from them. The only neighbour who has been persistently hostile in word and action is actually an Irish Catholic lady.

      1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 11:37am

        I’m sure you’d agree then that whoever throws homophobia shouldn’t be just let off the hook then.

        We don’t change things but sitting back and hoping someone else does it for us.

        I have said before my dislike of religion comes from homophobia from both Christian and Muslim. Where I lived in Tower Hamlets it was a case of once a certain Christian saw the load of Muslims using homophobia against me then she did too. It kinda triggers an “well if it’s alright for them to do it” attitude.

        All need sorting.

        1. concerned resident E3 24 Apr 2011, 5:28pm

          I agree that, if found guilty, whoever is responsible should face commensurate punishment. If anything the mosques round where I live I even more gungho against these extremists than woolly old liberals like me – they are acutely aware that this sort of thing gives them a very bad press.

          I also think a distinction needs to be made from the east and west of the borough. In the east, Sylhetti mountain people from northern Bangladesh predominate. They were deeply impoverished and discriminated against in Bangladesh but have tended to have nothing to do with the extremists – who predominate mainly in the West of the borough among the urban Bangla Dakkar moslems who dominate that area and a minority of which are in the thrall of rightwing neoislamic groups with funding sources from the Saudis.

          I think we therefore need to be very specific about who we are pointing our fingers at since a broadbrush approach would hit groups that have little or no beef with us as gay people.

          1. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 6:49am

            Prehaps this would be the perfect opportunity for those who don’t wish to be tied in with the guilty to protest against those Muslims who they wish not to be associated with. A united group of Muslims and the wider community to show their opposition to this posters of hate within the borough and campaign for a peaceful respectful community.

            Somehow I doubt that’ll happen, esp if it means showing support for theLGBT community.

          2. concerned resident E3 25 Apr 2011, 2:05pm

            actually the love walks (still ongoing) were supposed to do precisely that

          3. concerned resident E3 25 Apr 2011, 2:07pm

            as for mass marches in favour of minority rights: our own history should show that it is unusual for non-gay people to march with us let alone FOR us. That is frankly no different for moslems and non-moslems.

          4. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 2:41pm

            In my experience there is a lot of difference but that aside. As I said a protest from Muslims and the wider community, ie not just Muslims.
            If they don’t want to protest to send a message of ‘Stop the Hate’ then they cannot complain if the Gay community do it instead. Oh hang on we can’t because the likes of Rainbow Hamlets and Out East don’t profite from it, therefore do all they can to stop it.
            Is it right that while these posters go up the lot in the community turn a blind eye. Would that be the same for any other group though? No it wouldn’t.
            I must admit I get a little p!ssed off because when I say a protest against hate, people seem to assume just on Gay issues. Hate affects all and I mean a protest Including LGBT people campaigning against hate but using these posters as a main focus point.
            Unless Tower Hamlets are seen doing something against homophobia and hate then we can not expect it to get better.

  3. Yeah he’s not just some closet case out to impress his mates but one of many tools for aforementioned place of worship.

  4. Also on an unrelated note i wish to apologise to Jock, a few weeks back I attacked him for backing boris johnson over ken livingstone.

    While I could never vote for Boris after he compared being gay to bestiality, it is clear that he has less truck with homophobes than ken does.

    Sorry jock, i sniped at you before knowing the facts!

    Also, why on earth dont places preaching murder of gays get shut down?

    1. Jock S. Trap 21 Apr 2011, 5:06pm

      Appreciated Scott but no need, thats the beauti of debate. It would be dull if we agreed with everything.

      Thank you though. :)

      1. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 10:23pm

        You’d know all about debate i’m sure. how anyone could agree with any of your claptrap is beyond me, whoosh!

  5. Why is he not being charged with incitement to hatred? Had this been so done posting anti Muslim stickers I’m sure the chargecwould be of a more serious nature


  6. dean ismail 21 Apr 2011, 5:20pm

    Some people think these stickers are the right of people to exercise their freedom of speech: I think you are wrong. In my book, freedom of speech should NEVER take priority over freedom to exist. Secondly, it should not have been made anonymously, as freedom of speech must always come with accountability, and responsibility.

  7. Dan Filson 21 Apr 2011, 5:23pm

    Is the arrested guy the fall guy for some larger group? I cannot believe all this was the work of one person. But let’s see what the trial reveals (if he gets charged)

  8. Helen Wilson 21 Apr 2011, 7:03pm

    The posters are so unsophisticated its obviously knocked up on a home computer by someone with very basic IT skills.

    Most people walking past them will only see the Peace and warn and the and fear allah bits. The gay free zone gets lost because of the poor design. Its got all the design savy of a 1960’s Christian anti gay leaflet people like Mr Green still hands out.

    Even WBC can do better than this. I’ve seen 12 year olds do better.

    1. I agree. The homophobic message is lost in the subtext.
      They should have given a larger margin are, reduced the logo and enhanced the surround and crossbar in red, as an international warning symbol.

      To tell gays to stay out of an area is bad enough, but shoddy graphic design is just unforgivable.

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 8:37am

        No matter how unsophisticated it doesn’t hide the homophobia, or the fear of LGBT people in those areas.

      2. From what I hear the composition is so bad, it could have been produced by one or two of the commentators on these threads.
        Now there’s a thought eh,cmyb?

        1. btw , the above comment is not by me but an imposter , probably paddy .

    2. I disagree – the stickers did exactly what the designer hoped they would do – terrorise the life out of the local community.

      Given what has happened to the (admittedly idiotic) guy who burned a koran, I expect a very lengthy prison sentence for this thug. And let’s not pretend this is isolated, given the constant campaigns of intimidation in the area, not just against LGBTs but other Asians and muslims – the Asian pharmacist this week, the campaigns against Bollywood adverts, the attack on Gary Smith the RE teacher and so on. Homophobia is but one of many manifestations of Islamist extremism in the area – and that is the view of other muslims, such as Quilliam Foundation.

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 10:59am

        Don’t bank on it when those that burned he Poppies got fine £50!

        Your right though, it seems the area is getting worse and less and less tolerant. Esp when that pharmacist who was threatened for not wearing a headscarf wasn’t even muslim.

        Not forgetting the pasting black paint over H&M posters showing women in bikinis.

        As years go by the longer they leave it the worse it’ll get.

        1. I totally agree. It seems one rule for us, and one for them.
          Somebody really needs to come down hard on this guy and make a point that racial and homophobic hatred will not be tolerated from anybody.

          1. ‘Us and them’ eh?

            ‘and make a point that racial and homophobic hatred will not be tolerated from anybody’ Does that count for you too? It’s ‘us and them’ after all. rather than just a few homophobes that did it, you want to blame over 2 billion people for their actions. You really are a transparent bigot.

          2. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 7:35am


            Your right it’s not all, however I don’t see liberal muslims standing up and making a noise. Most won’t because of fear. What does that tell you?

        2. Yes, what I am trying to get at is that if a white guy calls a black guy names, he often gets nicked for it, but it is never viewed the other way round. Anybody can be racist or homophobic, it’s not just majorities over minorities, and frankly, where I live in East London, as a white guy, I AM a minority anyway.

      2. Terry Stewart 23 Apr 2011, 7:49pm

        Here we go more gobbledy gook! What was your argument on Jan Moir “Her right to exercise freedom of speech”, regardless of who she offended. Nothing but contradictions.

        Who are all the people who fled the East End because of these stickers and do tell, where did they go? You make it sound like some biblical epic, waters separate and Moses leads his people into Islington and Camden.

        It’s not your lack of faith which worries me, it’s your complete hatred for faith groups which is more of a concern. For the majority of us reality is some what different from your flights of fancy. We all still live in the East End and are happy to do so.

        Of course we didn’t like the stickers, but we dealt with it in a constructive and positive manner, which didn’t include scaring the horses.

        1. It is clear from the vacuous post above, that you are either illiterate or a calculating liar. How dare you suggest I have a ‘complete hatred’ of faith groups? Where do you get this information from? A cursory glance at my post, referring also to Muslim victims of Islamist fanatics is enough to dismiss that libelous, wicked statement out of hand. Of course, a nasty little unelected demagogue like you thrives on shouting down and intimidating your opponents by labeling them as ‘racists’ or ‘Muslim haters’.

          50 years of gay liberation activism has taught us that the best way to enhance and protect our rights is to call out and expose hatred wherever we see it. And to confront it with uncompromising determination. We look our opponents in the eye and say: ‘We are here, we are queer, and if you don’t like it, tough.’ Your apprach meanwhile, is nothing but denial, compliance with extremists and cowardice.

        2. And it needs emphasising – the way you have dealt with Islamist extremist hate has been a cringe-worthy example of compliance, denial and cowardice. You, and the idiotic Rainbow Hamlets (Rebecca Shaw lives in GRAYS, 25 miles away, nothing to do with Tower Hamlets) pat yourselves on the back for issuing joint statements with a mosque that has hosted numerous hate-preachers, making the most revolting statements about gays, Jews and non-Muslims. Without even asking for an apology. You promoted the nonsensical idea of an EDL plot – even after the police told you in a meeting they knew who the culprit was and they had CCTV evidence of Asian youths with stickers.
          If anyone is in doubt about how the Sharia cloak is strangling the community, visit Vallance road and look at the yellow Islam4UK stickers – vandalism – which the police have no wherewithal to remove.

          If you can’t tell the difference between an odious Daily Mail writer and people who call for gays to be murdered… no surprise!

        3. So, when a gay pride event happens in Tower Hamlets – there won’t be any kowtowing to unelected, unrepresentative religious leaders. We don’t need their approval, and we don’t care two hoots for their opinion. The solution is a secular Pride, and a party, where all are free to fall in love without fear of what others think, or the need to worry about ‘honour’ (it’s an essential message for straignt, as well as LGBT, people)

          Incidentally, on September 4th, if you are honest with yourself, you’ll admit that the participation of members of the Bengali community was extremely low. There were lots of Unite Against Fascism goons there (the same sick rag-tag mob that protested ALONGSIDE Anjem Choudary’s hate group last year). And SWP lunatics. The gay pride message was completely watered down: ultimately, you failed to challenge prejudice.

          1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 7:57am

            Well said Adrian!!

        4. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 7:43am

          Thank you Terry Stewart. From that comment I can see Exactly the problem and why you fail to help LGBT in the community.

          If you have to ask about people who have left the East End, not because of the sticker but because of homophobic abuse, discrimination and violence then you have already shown you are not best at serving the LGBT community. Instead you actually sound like you are mocking us. THT (those people who serve the LGBT community AND actually help) and the police would disagree with you. But then it’s ‘put up and shut up with you lot isn’t it?!

          Then I guess you have just shown why you prefer to make excuses for homophobia instead of dealing with the problem.

          As long as you keep making excuses you CANNOT represent the LGBT community. You really are a lousy piece of work. It’s clearly LGBT people are bottom of your help list and why you made such a fuss towards anyone else standing up to hatred, the hatred you clearly sponsor.

        5. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 7:51am

          My ‘lack of faith’ has nothing to do with religion. No my ‘lack of faith’ has everything to do with you and your lot helping the LGBT community within Tower Hamlets. If you feel the need to mock those who have suffered violence and abuse and feel forced out of the area then that is enough to show you have no interest other than your own.
          I feel for those many others trapped in Tower Hamlets who desperately need you help not your mocking and condemnation for moving to another area to feel safe.
          I’m glad I did what I did without your help. I am frightened for those who you leave on the scrap heap, suicidal at best like I was. Thankfully I found the strength to get proper help, from people who listen and DIDN’T make up excuses.

        6. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 7:51am

          You serve no-one. Rainbow Hamlets and Out East clearly represent anyone but the LGBT community and you should spend time to tell people that.
          Disband and move over. Let someone else actually try and help the victims of abuse you happily leave in there unfortunate surroundings.

        7. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 7:53am

          “it’s your complete hatred for faith groups which is more of a concern”

          Shouldn’t your concern be with the LGBT community you ignore because of religion?

          1. Hahaha, it’s interesting that, even if Raymond Berry were not involved in the EDL – he would have campaigned to the bitter end to stop another gay pride emerging in the East End: see this incoherent argument against gay pride OutEast’s website:

            – “Therefore, the politics to march through an area that is a home to many marginalised communities will be a political act of re-enforcing white gay visibility through pointing the finger towards the large Muslim community living in the area, hence continuing the racist idea that all Muslims (and through the same extent, dispossessed communities) are intrinsically more homophobic and ‘less civilised’”

            Not only is this full of non-sequiturs, it tells LGBT people to live in silence. A warning to any organiser in the area: expect to be smeared as a racist for speaking out against a tiny minority of extremists.

          2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 9:38am


            As for “re-enforcing white gay visibility” erm is that not a racist and homophobic comment?

            Do Out East think that old chestnut being Gay is a White Western problem? Aren’t Black, Asian and Muslims also Gay? or are they not allowed.

            I think we see the problem with Rainbow Hamlets, Out East and Terry friggin Stewart and quite frankly I fear for any LGBT residents in Tower Hamlets who may mistake these groups as Gay help when they clearly mean anything but Gay help.

            So a ‘supposed’ LGBT help group that is infact racist AND homophobic?! Hmmmm Be afraid.

          3. Well, they are welcome to their crackpot opinions, that’s all I can say. Asserting the freedom to fall in love, freedom of self-determination and the freedom OF AND FROM religion, is not finger-wagging. Unless your mission is to bully others into submission.

        8. Well, I for one am getting out of the East End, not because of the stickers though. It’s just expensive, rude, dirty, noisy and frankly, full of foreigners.

          That may seem racist, but frankly, after a while, you just get sick of waving your arms at shopkeepers to try and buy a bottle of milk because they don’t understand English.

          I’m moving 300 miles to a nice house in the country, and they can stick their 24 hour shops where the sun don’t shine.

  9. marco genovesi 21 Apr 2011, 8:24pm

    There is a difference between male and man. At 18 years of age one is not a man. The press lately calls children of 12 years old men. I believe PinkNews should know better than calling 18 years old prats men.

    1. At eighteen, you are old enough to vote, drive, drink, smoke, get married, have sex, and in the US get drafted or get executed. (Although advisably not all at the same time.)

      If you are old enough to do these things, you are also old enough to bear the responsibility.

      The press love to mix ‘n’ match terms: A 16 yo rapist is a “youth”, but if he is a victim, he is a “teen” or even a “boy”.

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 8:39am

        Exactly. At 18 people know right from wrong and their responsiblities.

        1. I like that. “continued illegal occupation of the Malvinas”
          It shows where your loyalties lie. Well I can assure you when the Falklands conflict erupted, many people were getting seriously worried that we would be called up. It was definitely an option on the cards.

          1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 10:03am

            …. I would have assumed you would expect no different from me as an Irishman, living as i do in a British occupied area of Ireland.
            Being Irish conscription would not have been an issue for me . Even Irish people under the British administered part of Ireland are not included as you will know from WW2, altho quite a few voluteered to fight fascism. We were not conscripted and wont be as most of us hold Irish Passports.

      2. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 2:06am

        ……..and in the US get drafted…..Actually the Us done away with the draft in the 70s and in most of the States where the death penalty still exists the minimum age is 21

        1. OK, but many other countries still do National Service at 18, and if there was a war on in UK, the conscription age would also be 18

          1. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 10:59pm

            “and in the US get drafted or get executed.”
            …My comment was in response to the above line in your comment. The UK went to war with Argentina over the UK’s continued illegal occupation of the Malvinas Islands and you didn’t have conscription, so I cant see it ever being an issue there

          2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 8:02am

            You mean the Island that asked for British help?

            Paddys… you can ignore the facts but don’t ignore the people.

          3. Spanner1960 26 Apr 2011, 5:58pm

            To be specific, the British protectorate that asked for help.
            That’s why we protected it.

          4. Jock S. Trap 27 Apr 2011, 12:13pm

            Indeed, Spanner, Indeed.
            Guess I was hoping Paddys.. would have been intelligent enough to work that out but then he seems to hate anything British so…
            Ironically a hypocrite.

  10. Brave youth, surely!

    1. Well, braver than you anyway, though that doesn’t take much!

  11. There will be some old coward somewhere convincing young men to do their dirty work and take the rap when it comes. That’s not to say the young men shouldn’t be punished but it’s a symptom, not the cause.

  12. Previously someone wrote that these stickers had been going up around Tower Hamlets for many years, this 18yr old person must have been a kid when he started sticking them up… if it’s just him of course.

    1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 7:43pm

      As far as I know, the stickers first appeared in Derby last July (spotted by the conspiracy theorists at Indymedia). The stickers were subsequently seen in Whitechapel in October 2010, reported by a right-wing site. The media across the country ignored both of these incidents. And when the stickers appeared across London in February this year, they still were not reported by the BBC. What they reported was days later — when they reported that “locals” were covering them with “messages of love”. And even today there are gay websites maintaining that it is EDL who has put up these stickers, when all evidence is to the contrary. I predicted that soon anti-jewish stickers would be seen, and these have now appeared in Golders Green (but since socialists are as anti-semitic as muslims, who knows who put those up).

      1. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 7:36am

        The posters appeared in Tower Hamlets long before October.

      2. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:04am

        I would be interested to see evidence of that. It means there has been more willful suppression of this campaign than I thought.

        1. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:02pm

          ……..I still think there was something very smelly about the whole sticker thing…The perpetrators are much closer to home than is being made out.

  13. It’s good that the police are doing something at least to deal with this matter.

  14. Some of these comments are very Daily Mail. Quite frankly, I’m disgusted by some of your insinuations.

    Are all minorities to blame for every one of their individual’s actions? There’s too much of ‘they’re all the same’ going on here. You should know better than to say that about minorities, seeing as we are one ourselves.

    We are not all the same are we? Neither are Muslims, or any other minority, just because of a few idiots who commit crimes.

    It’s so sad and pathetic that many of you can’t see what you’re actually suggesting here. There are no double standards. There isn’t one rule for us and another rule for other minorities.

    1. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 7:47am

      I’m muslim and I really don’t get what you are saying here.

      Nobody has got really hysterical and everyone has the right to criticise whatever religion they want. Nobody said all muslims are homophobic or evil, but even if they do say that – it’s up to them and it’s understandable how they got to that conclusion. And it’s up to muslims to prove them wrong.

      The sad thing is there is a real and obvious growth of extreme islam happening in east london and all over the world – for a myriad of different reasons… you really have to have your head firmly planted in the sand to not notice it.

      And as a gay man and a muslim I have every right to be concerned and point it out. Not tip tow around it or somehow apologise for it.

      I understand what you are getting at, when people say nasty things like “wipe them all out” or “nuke mecca”, but nobody has said that here at all, have they?

      1. marco genovesi 22 Apr 2011, 9:19am

        great comment musclelad23!

      2. ‘Chokran’ musclelad23. Unfortunately some people on the extreme lunatic left will keep on living in denial. Their only method of debate is to shout their opponents down and brand them a ‘racist’.

        1. And in the meantime lunatic right in da usa implements tory’s finest legacy, section 28. Oh and as to their method of debate, they just dont bother with one

          1. musclelad23 Sorry but I think you’re sadly deluded. Gay doesn’t make someone not racist, the same as being a Muslim doesn’t make someone homophobic.
            You could of course give all your attackers medals if you like. I won’t.
            Remember that racists always call anyone who harps on about equality, for EVERYONE, a ‘loony Left’.
            Since when was everyone a ‘loony Left’ for wanting and end to ignorance and an end to double standards?
            Don’t be fooled by some of your responders on this post either. You’ve just patted a few people on the back who despise everything about you. :?

          2. Isn’t RedDevil being a bit patronising? He’s suggesting that musclelad23 is so dense that he doesn’t understand his objective conditions — as I think the Marxist term goes — until they are explained to him.

            Furthermore, if RedDevil is white, surely there is more than an element of racism in such condescension.

          3. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 12:54pm

            Erm Reddevil, Islam isn’t a race. I am half arabic (tunisian) myself, but consider myself caucasian as thats what most people think I am, infact being arabic is caucasian anyway.

            Of course gay doesn’t make someone not racist. You only have to look at the homoeroticism of the skinhead scene or delve into Nick Griffin’s sordid past. But being critical of a religion doesn’t make you a racist either.

            Believe me, I’m no friend of the ultra right either, Our own house was attacked shortly after 911 and my mother been spat at for wearing the hijab.

            But I’m not as stupid as to think of things in rigid Black and white – Ive also seen extremists first hand calling for the “death of all kufrs” and a growth of more backward mentality wahabist islam. It is pretty loony to call anyone who points that out as “racist”

            Stop making it out to be a left/right issue, it’s not.

          4. There you go – exactly as predicted, RedDevil’s childish idea of debate is to shut anyone down who doesn’t agree with him, by shouting ‘racist’. It is a babyish, vacuous way of debating. On here, it just makes him look stupid.

            Well done MuscleLad23. RedDevil is actually the anti-muslim: he turns a blind eye to Islamist extremism, lets bullies get away with threats against liberal muslims and non-muslims.

            Hate preaching Islamists would be nowhere without hate-apologists like the idiot RedDevil.

          5. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:04pm

            …Hear, Hera!!

    2. Reddevil, islam has little power in the UK. But wherever it does have power in the world, the majority of muslims in those countries are homophobic. Thats a fact, not my opinion. And the proof of that fact lies in how gay guys are treated in islamic states. Look at saudi where they may chop off your head for being gay. Or Iran where they will hang you. Or Egypt, prison for ten years. And the list of the islamic worlds homophobia goes on and on. And I suspect if the muslims in this country got the power that some want, they too would be as homophobic as they are in the rest of the world. No one is saying that all muslims are the same. But like christianity, and Judaism, Islam is homophobic. The koran and hadith are both homophobic, and ask of muslims that they put ‘homosexuals’ to death. I wish that weren’t true, but that’s the way it is. So no, all minorities are not to blame for an individuals actions, but islam is a shared homophobic belief system, not an individuals opinion.

      1. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 1:03pm

        There is one reference to homosexuality in the quran and that is the people of lut. The same story as sodom and gomorrah in the bible. And it’s debated as to whether it was to do with male rape. There is nothing in the Quran that says “stone gays to death” or even a word for “gay”. The hadith on the other hand has some pretty terrible things in it, I don’t follow it. But then so does the Jewish Talmud.

        Personally I am a “Quranist”. Follow the quran only, but have recently become interested in sufi sect, who have a more spiritual and enlightened way of practicing, most mainstream muslims would write me off as an apostate, but I couldnt give a sh**te.

        The way all three abrahamic religions are practiced today is homophobic. But how you personally practice religion is up to you. For me religion is something you do in private. Between me and Allah.. or Buddha.. or Vishnu.. or the flying spaghetti monster.

        1. I agree, Sufi is amazing. Don’t do too much whirling tho. ;)

          1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 2:52pm

            Yeah, bless the cotton socks of those “peaceful” sufis.
            “Sufi orders led the armies that conquered lands in Central and South Asia, and in Southeastern Europe” –

            Sufis take up arms in Kashmir –\19\story_19-4-2007_pg7_34

            Sufis join Iraqi insurgents –

            Sufi vs Salafi violence in west Africa –

            Islam is not a religion of peace. It is a religion of war. The Ahmaddiya muslims are persecuted as heretics throughout the muslim world (and south London). But even the peaceful Ahmadi hate homos.

        2. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 2:33pm

          And once again MuscleLad you show you are ignorant of your professed religion. The people of Lut are mentioned many times in the Koran — 7:8, 11:89, 15:68, 21:74, 26:160, 27:54, 29:28, 54:33-34 (and that is not an exhaustive list). Here is a searchable series of korans:

          As I’ve pointed out before, you are not a muslim if you reject the Hadiths, so stop peddling that lie. You cannot know when Ramadan occurs from the koran — it is specified in the Hadiths. But since you know so little about the koran, I guess you don’t mind your self-deceit about the Hadiths.

          The koran is evil. It contains injunctions to kill non-muslims, it endorses war & slavery. And for over 1000 years muslims have put that evil into practice:

          1. Jock S. Trap 22 Apr 2011, 3:45pm

            Says he who only turns up to comment when it involves the East End and Muslims.

            It looks more like your on some recruitment drive, shame on you. I would be more convinced about you if you commented on other stories not where you can use your EDL propaganda against people and people that comment.

            Comment on the story but is the EDL ‘manifesto’ really needed?

          2. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 3:50pm

            I come out and attack extremist muslims and yet this happens again.

            Why do you never post on any other subject unless it involves islam?

            It’s like you dont care about gay rights unless it’s a muslim being homophobic.

            Where were you about the kiss at the john snow pub? or the christian b+b?

            All religions are dark.


            selling your own daughter as a sex slave (Exodus 21:1-11), child abuse (Judges 11:29-40 and Isaiah 13:16), and bashing babies against rocks (Hosea 13:16 & Psalms 137:9).

            Judaism (talmud)
            Sanhedrin 58b. If a heathen (gentile) hits a Jew, the gentile must be killed.

            Baba Kamma 113a. Jews may use lies (“subterfuges”) to circumvent a Gentile.

            (Sanh. 69a, 69b, also discussed in Yeb. 60b)
            A maiden aged three years and a day may be acquired in marriage by coition, and if her deceased husband’s brother cohabited with her she becomes his.

            Stop singling out islam. And go back to getting smashed and burning down mosques or whatever it is you people enjoy.

          3. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:32pm

            Jock, you silly little man. EDL has more than doubled in size in 6 months. It has almost 10x the support of the UAF, who should have been fighting islamo-fascism for the past 10 years but have instead sided with it. The EDL gay group has grown by 35% over the past two months. I only bother to comment here when muslims like Musclelad make false claims about islam, or when stupid idiots who live in Belfast tell me what life is like in London. If I was to comment on other stories, you’d be saying I was recruiting for EDL there – when EDL has a demo somewhere like Bradford, people like you turn round and say “it’s intimidation”; when EDL has a demo somewhere like Aylesbury, people like you say “why go there – there’s no muslims there”. Stop defending your pet muslim. Let him explain how he does Ramadam when he rejects the Hadith. Let him explain why he claims there is only one mention of Lut in the koran. I’m here to point out the lies and misinformation.

          4. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:39pm

            I never said there was one mention of lut in the quran, I said homosexuality is mentioned once only in regards to the people of lut. Could you please explain EDL supporter why you fail to comment on any other news story other Islam related stories? I hate extremism it sickens me, particularly islamic extremism, it is totally perverse and barbaric.. and I have seen it first hand. But there is a very similar pattern of speech and conviction with extremists and it something you seem to share with them. Take a hard look in the mirror.

          5. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 7:53am

            EDL Supporter

            There you go again with your non-message.

            If you had read before you would have known that I was born and bred in Tower Hamlets up til 4 years ago after 4 years of homophobia, racism, abuse and violence by Muslims who eventually forced me out of my home and the area of my birth. Don’t tell me I know nothing. I also have Muslims as well as other faiths as friends who feel what I went through was wrong and gave Muslims in general a bad name. I have plenty of other friends who have been through the same thing too.

          6. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 7:56am

            I don’t question you belonging to the EDL thats your choice but people aren’t stupid and you should stop treating them as such. The internet is a big thing. People know about the EDL and can research it. I question you coming here like some dodgy salesman selling junk at the doorstep. We are led to believe, falsely clearly, that the EDL only protest extremists. Fair enough but what you have written is a flat out condemnation of All muslims which now does make the EDL sound exactly like the BNP and that I’m afraid is where you have lost me.
            And no I’m not sticking up for Muslims because as most people on here know I view Most religions as Evil.

          7. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:17am

            Jock, you say “I have a non-message” but that’s exactly what you have. Rather than deal with my argument about Lut, you attack how often I debate on here. Unlike you (who seem to spend your entire waking life on this forum), we’ve got work to do. There is a wide variety of opinion in EDL. Just like this muslim here claims he rejects the Hadith, doesn’t do Ramadam, eats pork, etc. shows there is a variety of opinion in islam. My opinion of islam is far worse than that of many people in EDL, quite simply because I know far more about what is said in islam, and far more about the history of islam than most of them do. And if you think that all that separates EDL from BNP is whether or not one believes in the fairytale of “moderate islam” then you are demonstrating your own ignorance. As for the EDL manifesto, where have I stated things like “No More Mosques”, etc? I’ve barely ever mentioned the aims of EDL.

          8. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 9:28am

            Actually, it is you ignorance and sheer arrogance alone that puts me off the EDL. Maybe you should get a less ‘discriminating’ person to speak here but frankly the fact you claim to represent the EDL is off putting enough.

            You’ll find most Gay people aren’t about hating, we get enough of that.

          9. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:45am

            I couldn’t care less if I put you off EDL. Unlike you, I haven’t run away from the racism and homophobic abuse in Tower Hamlets. I’ve lived here for 15 years, and I’m not being driven out by a bunch of violent fascists. EDL does not need people who will cut and run rather than defend this country. No wonder you spend so much time on this forum — any real world involvement such as demos and meetings would be too scary for you. If the things that drove you out carried on, then no doubt in 30 years you’d be running from England to a less muslim country. We don’t need cowards who run instead of fight.

          10. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 1:11pm

            EDL Supporter
            You don’t know the facts. If I hadn’t have moved with the help of THT and the police I wouldn’t have been alive now, so don’t really see how you can judge. My life is much more precious than your hatred. SO yes I do know about their hatred, first hand. I am not the only person either that they pushed out.
            There’s a massive difference between protesting against hate and homophobia because of being Gay being attacked and abused and clearly your way of protesting hate WITH racism and hatred for the sheer sake of it. Your way makes you just as guilty as the people you protest against and that solves nothing.
            Forgive me but I don’t see many coming to that cause. If the EDL movement is about extremist not about racism then do they know that is what YOU promote? Are they aware that you promote hatred? Maybe If I saw them visibly remove you and denounce your actions I might take them seriously.

          11. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 1:13pm

            All I see from you is they are clearly no different to the BNP something I thought I knew to be different. If it turns out your wrong in what you promote then you do them a great injustice.

          12. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:57pm

            …thats not what he said he said “homosexuality is only mentioned once , and that is the people of Lut”. How does that turn into only one mention of the people of Lut, unless it suits your fascist racist agenda to say he said it…Grow up creep!.

          13. Well, clearly, MuscleLad considers himself to be a muslim, while rejecting the hadith – so clearly, it is possible. And I hope many more follow MuscleLad’s example.
            On what authority do you make these claims, EDL supporter? How do you know God’s mind on this matter, and on the nature of the Hadith? Do you get revelations?

            If MuscleLad gains great joy from his faith, and he considers his faith to be a voluntary affair and a personal journey, then I am happy for him. And I really think you should save your hot air for extremists who really are a threat.

        3. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:06pm

          …or the pink teapot floating on the dark side of the moon….lol

    3. By your very statement you also assume that all racists and homophobes must be right wing. Many left wingers are the biggest hypocrites around. “Do as I say, not as I do”.

      1. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:05pm

        I’m just sick of people stuck in this left/right paradigm. Be objective and think critically for god’s sake, don’t stick to a belief just because if you are either a “liberal” or “conservative” and you somehow feel you have to blindly follow your party without question.

        1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:36pm

          I couldn’t agree more. The issue is not left vs. right. It is about defending universal human rights. When EDL started to discuss forming a political party, it descended into a debate about class war. That’s why EDL has to remain a single issue pressure group – because for 20 years the liberal-left have kept silent about the spread of islamo-fascism in the west. Whoever is in power, EDL will be able to exert pressure on them to curtail the spread of sharia and to stop giving muslims preferential treatment.

          1. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:42pm

            Yes. But when you attack restaurants, burn down mosques, burn qurans and spit at my mother for example for wearing a hijab while screaming EDL EDL EDL, you argument is sort of lost on me. Face it you are not against islamic extremism. You are against Islam completely.

          2. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:57pm

            Have I accused you of killing coptic christians? Have I accused you of killing thousands of buddhists in the last 7 years? Yet you want to say that all those who support the EDL are guilty for any crimes carried out by a few. That would make you responsible for the 7/7 bombings, and for 9/11. As for islamic extremism — both the muslim president of Turkey and Baroness Warsi have insisted there is no difference between islamic extremism and moderate islam — “there is only islam”. I agree with them. Unfortunately, many in EDL still think there is moderate islam. But undoubtedly opinion within EDL is hardening to agree with Erdogan and Warsi — there is only islam.

          3. musclelad23
            Saying I’m Muslim but…, I’m gay but…, I’m black but…, etc. often fails to validate the criticism of subject associated with person expressing the criticism, clearly in this case edl supporter thought that ur criticism and mea culpa didnt go far enough. Although it doesnt change the fact that a lot of people would think that edl supporter is a racist and fascist thug

          4. Musclelad23:
            Look at every world conflict in the last 30 years, and bar a few oddments like Basque separatists and the IRA, virtually EVERY conflict throughout the world has involved, and has usually been perpetrated by Muslims.

            I am not saying all Muslims are responsible, but I think the rest of us have an axe to grind and a bloody good reason to keep an eye on these people.

          5. @Spanner: Rwanda, Sri Lanka, the US invasion of Iraq, both Congos, Nicaragua, Sierra Leone, Liberia, Zimbabwe, to mention just a few. I think your bias is a little too obvious.

          6. Rehan: Ok, a few tin-pot African and South American squabbles, but look at the others:
            From Eastern Europe to the middle East and Africa to Asia, the Muslims have been there. It starts with segregation and turns into a massacre in almost every instance.

          7. @ Spanner: Rwanda was by far the worst genocide in recent decades and had nothing to do with Islam. I don’t wholly disagree with your point, but you undermine it by extreme overstatement.

          8. Rehan:
            If you would like to to a geographical land area takeover cross-referenced with a body count, I think you will find that my statement is far from extreme.

          9. However, EDL supporter, you fail to distinguish between islamist fanatics and well-meaning muslims. When MuscleLad referred to his interest in Sufi Islam, you simply retort with a list of cases of sufi extremism – which you could do for any Christian denomination too. So, you have proved nothing.

  15. one of top 10 most controversial topics on PN is back, what a shame no pic of the person in qustion added, imagine all those hilarious comments based around it, ah well

  16. It is so sad that we can’t speak to truth. We are told to be quite.

    Well, I refuse to be quite. The fact is that, by and large, Muslims, especially in this country, are horrifyingly homophobic. It’s not ‘bigoted’ or racist to point this out. It’s the truth. I am not saying all Muslims in this country are homophobic. I am sayign that ALMOST all are viciously homophobic, and that’s the truth, hony.

    1. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 2:16am

      …quiet even**

  17. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:02pm

    Also mate, even I eat pork, drink like a scot and wear a ******ng nuns habit I have the intrinsic human right to call myself a muslim. It’s none of your business or even the business of 1billion other muslims to say that I’m not… I really couldn’t care less what you think.

    The only thing “evil” around here seems to be the direction the edl is heading in. If you were just against extremism, I would join myself. But you are convinced to the point of brainwashing that 1 billion people are intrinscly evil and need to be corrected.

    the wonderful and intelligent edl, seen here attacking a bloody restaurant with women and children cause it has muslims in it.

    1. You make a good point. How can 1 billion people be characterised the same?

      Homosexuality exists in 10 per cent of those people, the same as for all other groups of people. Not everyone is a fundamentalist.

    2. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:35pm

      Yep, fundamentalism however is a very real problem in Islam today and it’s very clear to see it is spreading. More and more muslims need to wake up to it and I for one aswell as my sunni family are fed up as hell.

      The problem with people like EDL supporter, is with his relentless copy and pasting of specially chosen facts, he creates an alternative look at the world which is essentially total propaganda. He bangs the drums of war to paint an entire group of people as evil, much like someone else did in germany many years ago. And much like abu hamza does when he calls all non believers “dirty kaffir”

      1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:37pm

        Why did you claim there was only one reference to Lut in the Koran? Why are you lying to other gay people?

      2. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:38pm

        Islam is evil. Many individual muslims are not evil. Those muslims who want to see gay people killed are evil. Those muslims who do not stand up against them are evil. Is that subtle enough for you?

        1. Like the Christians in Uganda that want to hang gay people? Christian who were given their belief in God by us? Again you try to single out Muslims as all being the world’s monsters.

          And no I’m not a Muslim, I have no religion at all, and I’m a white British female, just so you know. You probably think that makes me OK in your perfect ‘white world’. It doesn’t, because I want a world free for ALL people, regardless of colour, religion or sexuality. That world would have to forcibly re-educate bigots like you. I think a punishment for someone like you would be to force you to live and dress as a Muslim for a few months until you learn to tolerate people. Don’t worry, we can send you to EDL meetings dressed like that.

          Are you even gay, or do you just come here to chat with lesbians? Did you just get a twinge then eh? Pr*ck :/

          1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 5:11pm

            “I want a world free for ALL people, regardless of colour, religion or sexuality. That world would have to forcibly re-educate bigots”. Well, you need to learn the meaning of the word “free”, because if you are forcing people to be free, you’d better start with islam which means “submission” – islam sees freedom as evil. Thickos like you defend islam because you are so damn ignorant and ill-informed. I couldn’t care if you are white or brown — if you subscribe to islam then you support an ideology that says “kill the non-muslims”. And why do you assume I’m male? And why does someone who believes in freedom assume the world is divided into gay and straight – that’s not very free, is it? Did PinkNews put a fascist like you in charge of keeping the bisexuals and the transsexuals out of here? I thought this website was for those of us interested in news about the colour pink.

    3. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:41pm

      You have no more intrinsic right to call yourself a muslim than I do. Answer the question: how do you know when Ramadan is if you do not follow the Hadith implicitly?

      1. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:43pm

        bye bye fascist.

      2. musclelad23 22 Apr 2011, 4:49pm

        I guess it’s because i’m secretly part of a worldwide network of muslims spreading “Taqiyya” wherever we can to eventually dominate the globe and force all your women into burkas and all the men to wear beards. And smash all the crosses and kill on the swine, because EDL supporter, that is what you really want to hear, isn’t it? bye bye. x

      3. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:51pm

        hahah… pathetic. game over. You lost.

        1. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 8:00am


          Debate isn’t about winners and losers so what game are you playing?

          1. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:23am

            When someone’s answer to a question is the word “fascist” then they are not debating. They are behaving like a child. They are the one playing at debating. And FYI many debates are like games — there are public debates held a universities, debating societies and even in Parliament, where they take a vote aftewards and declare who has won. What is that if not a game (winners? losers?) If you had read anything about Wittgenstein and game-theory, you’d know that the are many processes in life that can be seen in terms of games. Maybe it’s time you got off your pompous horse and stopped looking down at the world. Many of your interventions here add nothing to a debate and just seem to be designed to stoke your own ego.

        2. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:15pm

          @edl fascist….
          …hahah… pathetic. game over. You lost.
          You met your match and lost now take your fascist racism over to the Daily Wail where you would be more welcome!!

      4. EDL – life is a journey EDL supporter. Musclelad will find out in the end that his religion does not equate with his sexuality, but he has to find that out himself. Until then let him do some sufi whirling, it might be the whirling that helps him see islam is homophobic. You know a lot about the bad side of sufi EDL, but as the mystical side of islam its not as dogmatic. there is at least hope for reform in sufi.
        EDL, you just have to live with the fact that there are 1 billion muslims in the world, and that all religions are belief systems that create war. Judaism, christianity, islam, hinduism, etc. They’re all the same. No one religion is better than another. its just that islam is more homophobic at the moment. So if you think that islam is evil because islam creates war, then you think the whole world is evil, because the majority of people on the planet are religious, and therefore evil. btw, atheists cause war too, so are they evil? AHHHH. everyone’s evil. except me. ;)

        1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 5:16pm

          Eddy, sorry but some belief systems are better than others. Buddhism does not go round saying “kill the non-buddhists”, so it is better in my opinion. Judaism and Christianity have been reformed (not enough, but it’s a start). Islam has had its reformation — it’s called whabbism/salafism. That’s the tragedy. We need to kick out all those muslims who believe that democracy should be subverted, all those muslims who want the country (and non-muslims) governed by sharia law. And we need to stop the oil states from polluting the minds of the muslims in Britain. But islam is a proseltysing miltaristic cult. We’ve been too quiet about it for too long – it was a form of racism to just let that corruption spread. The liberal-left were too scared to stand up for universal human rights, in case muslims turned round and bleated “racist”.

          1. Actually buddhist have killed loads of other people, the dalai lama owned slaves ffs. Buddhism in chinese and tibetan history has killed many people.

          2. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 6:13pm

            If buddhism was the same militaristic, genocidal, slave-owning cult as islam, it would have spread across asia minor, north africa and europe with an army — the way islam spread out from arabia. Produce some facts. Buddhism is twice as old as islam — yet there is no sign of buddhists running a slave trade to rival that of the atlantic slave trade nor the muslim african/asian/european slave trades. Please show me where in buddhist scriptures it tells followers to kill those who will not convert to buddhism. Thousands of buddhists have been murdered in Thailand in the past 5 years (and some muslims) by muslims; buddhists have not retaliated by murdering muslims across Thailand. Everywhere where muslims border non-muslims there is conflict – and that is what their religion prescribes (it divides the world into the “area of islam” and the “area of war”). The islamic fascist party in Britain had a conference last month with 1000 attendees.

          3. and if you think edl is an answer for combating all things muslim incl extremism think again, even with PR machine in overdrive the amount of support for edl is a joke.

          4. EDL, every religion has its moments. Buddhism has had its. And whilst there are some ‘nice’ things about buddha, there are some vile ideas in that religion too. All religions are man made, thought up belief systems that make human beings do both good and bad. It’s just that it is islam that is doing very bad things at the moment. but don’t forget, all the other religions have done terrible things too. You’re right to be selective about islam at the moment, because of what it is doing in the world, but don’t delude yourself that any of the others are any better. they’re not. all religions have amazing things about them, and can lead to great things, in human compassion, art, music, etc. but all religons can also lead to hate. thats the nature of humanity.
            I’ve been through the ‘hate islam’ mind set that you have, way before the twin towers came down. I’ve come out the other side, when i realised I was turning into the same hateful pig that they were. I hope you can over your hate too.

          5. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 7:35pm

            Eddy, where is your evidence that there are vile things in buddhism? There may well be vile things in countries where buddhism is the predominant religion (e.g. corruption), but those things go against buddhism. Islam ran a 1000 year slave trade that spanned Africa, Iberia, the Balkans, asia minor, and India because islam promotes war, subjugation and slavery. Sharia law endorses slavery – it is legal under sharia, which is why all 56 islamic states have rejected the UN Declaration of Human Rights (they do not recognise human rights for non-muslims). I await your evidence that buddhism has anything that is even 1% as vile as the murderous injunctions of islam. Buddhism rejects attachment; hate is an attachment; therefore hate is not part of buddhism. You are quite simply wrong. It is because islam is a war-mongering cult that it was able to wipe out buddhism in countries like Afghanistan.

          6. EDL, I don’t like Islam, I’m not defending it. But you sound like a war mongering EDL supporter to me. You go and fight hate with hate if you want to. But don’t talk about buddha and pretend you’re into peace. It’s clear from your anger that you’re not. What has buddhism got to do with your belief system? Why are you using Buddha to somehow prove something about islam? When it is clear you are not a buddhist. It may not be as vile as some of the concepts in the three abrahamic faiths, but check out the the Kalachakra Tantra, the buddhist holy war. I don’t present this as evidence, this isn’t about right and wrong for me. They’re just opinions.

          7. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 8:02am

            Here! Here! Eddy.

          8. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:35am

            I’m still waiting for any of you apologists for islam to present your factual evidence that buddhists ran a slave trade that was in any way comparable to those run by muslims. And I’m still waiting for you to provide evidence of buddhist scriptures enjoining people to kill. The Kalachakra Tantra “could also be understood to refer in part to the Islamic incursions into central Asia and India which deliberately destroyed the Buddhist religion in those regions. The prophecy includes detailed descriptions of the future invaders as well as suggested (non-violent) ways for the Buddhist teachings to survive these onslaughts.” Do you really think that is comparable to the koran explicity saying “kill the infidels wherever you find them”? Unlike the core texts of islam which demand that muslims go to war with non-muslims and take them as slaves, there is nothing like that in core texts of buddhism.

          9. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 1:16pm

            Listen to how they turn when they don’t get what they want.

          10. edl, why dont you set up, it worked for meerkats.

          11. EDL, is buddhism the official religion of the EDL? me thinks not. It’s hardly a belief system (if you could call it that) the Dalai Lama would approve of.
            You ask what’s vile about buddhism. Well for one, the idea of rebirth – that I or you are conditioned in this life by our karma from another life. So you pay in this life for something you did in another life. What a load of rubbish. Vile idea to put into people’s heads. But if true, only buddha knows what you are going to be in your next life.
            And please don’t do a quick wikipedia search if you’re going to compare belief systems, actually learn about them and think about them. But maybe you should be comparing islam to the ENGLISH (DL) religion, christianity. We all know some of the hateful things that mono faith has done to the world, or do you think all the wars that the UK have fought in the name of christ are okay? And if you are a buddhist, don’t forget, homosexuality is not okay if you are a buddhist either.

        2. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:19pm

          I seriously cant see that there is any difference in the homophobia of any religion. They are all from the same Abrahamic fictional fantasy and need to be eradicated for the future progress and happiness of Man.

          1. Your comment displays ignorance and intolerance.

          2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:53am

            ….your comment on the other hand is a gem of insight and intellectual debate.
            Ignorant of what one wonders? Certainly intolerant of people who waste their lives in thrall to wholly fictional fantasy dreamed up by ignorant uneducated fearful tribesmen wandering the deserts of Egypt and Palestine 4000 years ago!!. I will not quibble with that.

    4. A serious question Muscelad. You are clearly sane. I doubt you are silly enough to believe in a sky fairy who allegedly created the world. I doubt you would have the idiocy to justify intellectually bans on pork or alcohol, just as I wouldn’t have the idiocy to justify some silly myth about a redemptive sacrificial victim rising from the dead. Leave religion in the intellectual garbage can which is its rightful place!

  18. @ Get real.

    Patronising? I just think Musclelad23 thinks the best of people and he’s surrounded by racist scum in here. Yourself included.

    @ Musclelad23

    I’m well aware it’s not a race, you miss the point of how brain-dead racists see Muslims. They don’t think of white Muslims, it doesn’t register in their tiny minds. They see Arabs, Pakistanis in traditional clothing in the UK, whatever stereotype they can imagine and that they hate the most, OK.

    You say yourself you’re Caucasian, they’d never see you as a Muslim unless you dressed differently, so wouldn’t attack you. Do you get it yet? Your comments are surrounded by hate-filled racists, members of the EDL in here. They’re complimenting you because you’re being tactful. Say anything positive about Muslims and they’ll pounce on you. Wake up. I was trying to help you. It’s like a lamb to the slaughter. You’re being nice and they’re taking advantage of you.

    I won’t bother doing that again lol

    1. EDL supporter 22 Apr 2011, 4:53pm

      White muslim converts are the worst. They have not got the excuse that they were indoctrinated as children. Mind you, the Nation of Islam is also a sick joke being played on black people — considering that muslims ran the trade in black africans (and enslaved millions of white europeans, and millions of asians too).

      1. You’re just a creature :/

    2. It is easy to call people racist scum, but as you have no grounds for doing so, your arguments may not be taken that seriously.

      It is more difficult to dismiss the argument that it is deeply racist to argue that gay muslims need white people to tell them what to think.

      1. What a load of old b*llocks :D You talk nothing but tripe all day long. You’re a racist, end of. Anyone who points out you’re a stone cold racist is called a ‘looney Left’ or a ‘reverse racist’. I’m against you because you’re a bigot, it’s nothing to do with your colour. You see, unlike you, colour of skin means absolutely nothing to me. You’re just nothing, a nobody, a waste of human life. There’s no more to say. Get some help before you actually anger yourself enough to act on your racism and end up in jail.

        1. Your funny outburst doesn’t alter the fact that you think that gay muslims can’t think for themselves, and need to be told by a white person like you how they should feel and think and react.

          Furthermore, you seem to be deliciously incapable of the seeing the irony in your comments.

  19. Eddy, even more revealing that there hasn’t been one islamic national leader in any of their countries who has condemned homophobia let alone the torture and/or excecution of gay people, no public outcry either, all in the name of Islam no less. Why aren’t these same leaders condeming islamic extremists who commit acts of terrorism and why aren’t the people of the islamic states not speaking out?

    1. True robert. There needs to be a lot of change in the islamic world IMO, not just for gay rights, but for women’s rights, and kids rights, and every other minority groups rights. The only people islam serves in islamic states at the moment are sadistic patriarchal men, and masochisitic women who enjoy being treated like second class citizens. Thankfully there has been a separation of religion from state in the western world, otherwise, it wouldn’t be that different over here. There is change going on at the moment in the middle east, but I’m not holding my breath that I will see the muslim world change that much in my lifetime. I think William Burroughs summed the muslim world up perfectly. He said it was like they had a thousand year writers block – things just don’t change there – but that’s the problem with all religion, reading fictional books that were written thousands of years ago as if they are facts.

  20. Another crazy religious person and they then wonder why they have problems. Hope they charge him with a hate cime.

  21. Come on Pink News. Why are you allowing someone with EDL in their name to post on a Muslim story? Why are you allowing someone with EDL in their name post on ANY story. You mustn’t be moderating the comments at all. If you are, again, WHY is that bigot still here? Free speech goes out the window when someone is as racist as they are. They should have their IP banned.

    1. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 8:07am

      Because this is a democratic country with Freedom of Speech. With Freedom of Speech comes things we like to hear and also things we don’t like to hear.

      You are worse than the EDL in that you refuse to allow anyone to simply debate this issue without jumping on them as racist or facist. It’s immature. Infactile. It serves no purpose.

    2. EDL supporter 23 Apr 2011, 9:39am

      RedDevil has admitted to being a fascist who “will force people to be free”. She is just the lesbian communist version of Pol Pot. Maybe I should be asking why does Pink News to ban anyone who says they are a muslim? “When fascism returns it will present itself as anti-fascism”. The police’s own Domestic Extremism Unit said “EDL are not far-right extremists”, but that’s not good enough for Pol Pot, is it?

      1. Jock S. Trap 23 Apr 2011, 1:20pm

        The police may say that but your not saying it your saying the EDL ARE far-right.

        That why I’d like to know if the EDL know what your saying and promoting as an EDL representative? Do they know you push for the Far-Right element?

      2. EDL man/woman, your anger is beginning to make your comments sound like garbled rants. What has Pol Pot got to do with this? If you are the buddhist you seem to suggest you are in other comments, go and do some meditation, otherwise you’re never going to reach nirvana in this lifetime, you’re going to be endlessly reborn as another fascist. The Karma police are coming to get you for your hate.

      3. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 11:43pm

        @edl far right fascist…

        “The new head of police domestic extremist units was condemned today after denying that the English Defence League was a right-wing extremist group.”
        This is the first two lines of the article you linked…. sounds to me like the new guy has some questions to answer as to his afilliations.

      4. AmericanHomo 24 Apr 2011, 12:16am

        “When fascism comes it will present itself as anti-fascism.” I’m going to use that in the U.S. Greater truth was never spoken.

        1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:45am

          …you should visit more often. That is just a tiny sample of the Intellectual insight some of the commentators on these threads call intelligent comment.

  22. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 10:47pm


    1. That’s the best thing you’ve said all year.

      1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:32pm

        Comes to something when even the Pink News software has had enough of you!

      2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:42am

        ….Thank You . One really tries too hard.

  23. Paddyswurds 23 Apr 2011, 10:48pm

    What is going on .where is my comment??

    1. Maybe it was a silent exclamation.

  24. Ian Townson 24 Apr 2011, 8:50am

    The EDL are playing a clever, deceitful game to gain membership of their movement and they are using what they imagine is a popular prejudice caused by a relentless attack on Islamic extremism and muslims by politicians and the media. They use Islamic extremism and the fear of enforced sharia law as a scare tactic in the hope that they can gain converts to their brand of English Nationalism. The likelihood of Islamist extremism and sharia law gaining significant ground here is Nil and to say so is an insult to the vast majority of muslims who reject both.
    The EDL’s demonstrations in Stoke, Reading, Bradford, Luton, and Blackburn have always been an occasion for intimidating muslim communities. In Blackburn EDL members couldn’t even wait to do that – they attacked each other. Their fake interest in defending women against the burqa and niqab and gays against homophobia is just another way of darkening the name of Islam to gain converts to their movement.

    1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 9:41am

      Maybe you should visit places like Tower Hamets to see for yourself before assuming. I am no EDL supporter but what your passing off as fear people in those areas are actually living.

      1. Ian Townson 24 Apr 2011, 10:41am

        You seem to be saying that intimidation of people in Tower Hamlets by muslim fanatics is rife. I have no way of judging whether this is true or not and I would not be persuaded of this just by one or two anecdotal accounts. I need to see evidence of this via a properly conducted enquiry. Also there is the problem of extremists exploiting young people in poverty and unemployment. We seem to have forgotten about this. It is easy for unscrupulous elements to pray upon people when they are down and out and persuade them to resentful and violent acts.

        I have several times been the victim of attacks by disaffected youths and it had nothing to do with religion. There is always a ‘thug’ element in any area plagued by unemployment and boredom and it is these underlying causes that we should also be looking at.

        Let’s have a sense of proportion. My heart goes out to the people of Pakistan whose citizens are being blown up, killed and maimed everyday by terrorist bombs and American drones.

        1. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 10:59am

          Ian Townson? Terry Stewart? Rebecca Shaw?
          Yes of course, we’re already had this argument before. Yes you think there are excuses for homophobia, poverty being the one used by Rebecca Shaw as it seems to be a popular comment from those of Rainbow Hamlets and Out East.
          Trouble is if you so happy making up excuses homophobia what are you doing for those who are suffering it?
          There is no excuse, no matter how much you say it. Rich or Poor, Black or White, Christian or Muslim, in this country we are perfectly entitled to be LGBT without any form of discrimination.
          Homophobia doesn’t come from being unemployed, poverty or boredom, it comes from ignorance plain and simple and while you too busy making excuses for it many others are seeking help because of it.
          I recommend they go to Stonewall or THT, anywhere that many actually listen to them.
          But Not Rainbow Hamlets or Out East, they’re too busy thinking of excuses to cover the criminals doing the crime.

          1. Ian Townson 24 Apr 2011, 11:20am

            I’m a volunteer, via Age Concern, for the ‘Goldies’ group of older LGBT people. Does that count? Also I am a member of Queer Resistance, a LGBT campaigning group.

            You are correct about homophobia. Wherever it exists we should fight against it. The police have arrested several people connected with the obnoxious stickers. It’s up to the police and the courts to decide what happens next.

            Where does the ignorance come from?

            It’s unfortunate that the EDL got mixed up in all of this. As I said. We need a sense of proportion on this and not go screaming at each other. What could be more satisfying to queer bashers than the sight of us going at each others throats.

          2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 11:44am

            We need to remember that people are murdered and left paralyised, physically and mentally in London because of homophobia and I take great insult in you comparing these lives to those in another country. I’m sure the family and friends would also see it differently.

          3. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 12:15pm

            As for growing stronger after, yes it did in part although it also made me very wary of people something I never had before those 4 years. My man tells me I have changed because of it but he’s still here and happy as am I now again.


          4. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 12:17pm

            Oops wrong place.

        2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 11:06am

          As for your last comment, I am absolutely disgusted you seem to warrant some comparison as if the people here who have suffered violence, torment to the point of suicide knowing people who have been viciously attacked and maimed because of homophobia, even worse than what I had to put up with, don’t matter.
          If that last sentence is how you claim to base your handling of Rainbow Hamlets and Out East then why the hell are you allowed to call yourself a LGBT help group. You serve no purpose other than to help yourselves. All LGBT people can get stuffed right?

          1. Sister Maray Clarence 24 Apr 2011, 12:50pm

            Jock S Trap, you seem to forget that all of those things happen here and in other countries around the work for all sorts of other reasons, and all of them are wrong.

            Stephen Lawrence was beaten to death because of his colour, David Morley was beaten to death because children are allowed to grow up in this country with no sense of right or wrong, and excuses are found for their unacceptable behaviour.

            To group any section of society together and blame them for the actions of a few is wrong as well. It is the extremes of anything that cause the problems and gay people need to get over the fact that all Muslims are evil and wish us dead. Most people, Muslim of otherwise, want to keep their heads down and get on with life. The gay community isn’t building any bridges with every day Muslims by directing venom and hate towards them.

            And saying that we’ll be nice to them when they be nice to us I don’t think ever resolved any conflict situation ….

          2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:14pm

            I’m sure you mean well, if it wasn’t for one thing… Who put these poster up?
            It’s all very well defending and blaming all for hating each other but lets not go down the ‘poor souls ain’t done nothing wrong’ ploy, thats just rubbish.
            Your right those murders you mention were wrong. People in other countries dying is also wrong but to make out that those here dying is somehow less important than others is plain insulting.
            I have never disputed people dying from all sorts of reasons. I do depute the reasoning that one life is less important than another just because that person just happens to be Gay.

          3. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:19pm

            It doesn’t help anyone and for the sake of those families who have lost someone here because of ignorance, yes I am insulted.
            As for the Gay community not building bridges with every day Muslims, I don’t see every day Muslims holding their hands out to build bridges with the LGBT community, do you?
            Most LGBT people have lived in those areas all their lives only then to be turfed out of the area to please other communities who only have hatred towards us. With no-one saying “No this is wrong”.
            Your last comment is rubbish too. I went through hell because of Muslims on the estate where I lived, plus a Christian. I wasn’t alone. All of us have been forced to move. That is unfair, unjust and criminal.

          4. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:26pm

            I have reason to feel bitter with what I went through but the people I felt most sorry for were those friends of mine that are/were Muslims and how they had to see the worst of their religion. None of them were proud of what they saw.
            Am I resentful and bitter? I was, I admit. The place was the area was where I born but I don’t hold grudges despite it I now get on the best I can. Luckily my friends who are religious and know my feelings towards religion and why I have them. They also understand that.
            My biggest worry is knowing there are many in Tower Hamlets going through the same thing and I wish I could do more to help them. Sadly though it’s not just the LGBT community as has been proved again this week, what with the non-muslim lady in the pharmacy/headscarf/death threats report.
            When I’m better it may be the route I take next but for now, I’m fed up with people making excuses for homophobia instead of helping those suffering.

          5. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:26pm

            Bridges can only be built when those who wish all dead, change. I, personally don’t see that happening anytime soon.

          6. Okay, so your issue(s) seem to stem from the fact that you had a bad experience at the hands of a Muslim or possible a small group of Muslims.

            You’re clearly not stupid, so how is it you’re having difficulty in accepting that the Muslim or Muslims that you had the problems with do not necessarily represent all Muslims.

            The actions of an individual or a small group do not speak for the entire Muslim community.

            I was served by a young black guy in the supermarket the other night and it was torture. I could have read the barcodes out quicker than he scanned them.

            It doesn’t follow that a) all young people will be criminally slow on a checkout or b) all black people will be criminally slow on a checkout.

            Yes I know you’re going to be whining about me about making stupid analogies but what you are doing isn’t any better.

          7. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 9:00am


            Thank you for your response.
            My problems were not an individual nor a small group. Rather a large group and lots of other Muslim stand by watching for 4 years.

            I think you haven’t read my thread properly esp the 3rd section were I talk about my Muslim friends, two of which left the faith directly because of the way I was treated by that community. That is no easy thing to do but that is how bad things were.
            My case isn’t an isolated incident, there are many who are suffering.
            But whilst I acknowledge my view isn’t of all Muslims, anyone who knows me hear will tell you I have had problems in my younger life because of Christians too so my disbelief and annoyance of religion is equally distributed amost them all.

          8. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 9:02am

            However I have been unfortunate enough to witness the difference between the two.
            If two men hold hands in a Christian ‘area’, all few will accept, a few will result to name calling and a few tut tuts.
            With Muslims this is totally different. If two men holding hands in a Muslim ‘area’ it then become a question of personal safety, being spat at in the street and violence.
            There is a difference.

          9. musclelad23 26 Apr 2011, 9:45am

            *briefly steps back into messy thread for a minute*

            Yeah I totally understand your point Jock, but I will also add that it has something to do with nationality and culture as well as religion. I used to live in a very nigerian (christian) area of south east london, and I once made the mistake of holding someones hand there. The mildest reaction was “jesus loves you” the worst was threats of violence and being spat at. It was awful and homophobic.
            I would imagine it would be exactly the same in a pakistani area. However I held someone’s hand in edgeware road many times which is mainly people of arab or middle eastern descent, and the worst was a few odd looks. However that is not to say my experience will be everyones. I do often find pakistani and south asian muslims (second generation) tend to be more seperate and apart from mainstream society than arabs probably are (in the uk anyway, I know in france arabs are more ghettoized). I’m guessing its something cultural.

          10. musclelad23 26 Apr 2011, 9:54am

            also I am really sad and sorry to read what happened to you. Homophobic bullying is horrific. I went through it in university when I just turned 18 (ironically by flag waving football hooligans who shared my accommodation), was beaten up and blackmailed, had to pay my student loan to them so they wouldn’t tell my parents. Was over the course of a year and It was the worse thing that ever happened to me – I still have nightmares about it.. but in a way I’m glad it happened because it is what spurred me on to get into bodybuilding and learning how to look after myself. I would never let anyone treat me like that again without kicking the living crap out of them. I hope your experience made you a stronger, tougher person Jock and I really admire that it hasn’t turned you to hate all muslims. It would have probably done that to me. x

          11. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 12:12pm

            So sorry to hear what you went through. At any time is bad enough but at an important time such as education is worse I think. I agree with what you are saying though. Personally I think religion is it’s own worst enemy but in truth it’s because I have Muslim friends that wouldn’t allow me to cast everyone as the same. However, there is a part of me that hopes I would still feel like that if I hadn’t had those people around me.
            I think that is part of the problem, I’ve overheard a conversation several times over the years saying that Muslims don’t push themselves to integrate into society and whilst there is an element of truth in that, they seem to forget that there is equal amounts of Britains do exactly the same thing. I guess people from no matter what or where can equally put up barriers which denies them viewing people as different and as individuals.
            My grip is religion in general, all religion not necessarily the people, although there are a few from all faiths..

          12. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 12:18pm

            As for growing stronger after, yes it did in part although it also made me very wary of people something I never had before those 4 years. My man tells me I have changed because of it but he’s still here and happy as am I now again.


  25. The edl are rubbish but that dosent mean Muslims love us. I bought a pork joint in telco and the Muslim man who sold it to me tried to mock me for eating pork. And another ex colleague said were all Muslim some of us dont know it. They want us to change no live and let live in their world.

    1. Paddyswurds 24 Apr 2011, 1:04pm

      ….strange that a Muslim man had the pork to sell to you, and from a telephone company as well…all very strange. I presume you made a complaint to the “telco” (sic) management, which would seem to be the logical step to take. If not, why are you whinging about it now? Btw, how do you know he was a Muslim man?

      1. Paddyswurds 24 Apr 2011, 1:24pm

        …..anyone who thinks any far right fascist group, be it EDL or BNP or any other unelected group pretending to have GLB interests at heart, are not our friends. Any flirting with these groups will eventually spell the death knell for any further Gay rights and may see legislation aimed at watering down those already hard won.
        Christian groups are circulating petitions on the internet aimed at bullying the Prime Minister to do just that and calling on the Government to allow them be above laws already enacted. Rather than fighting amongst ourselves over silly self inflicted incidents like the John Snow, we should be monitoring and acting against these insidious groups who, if they get their way and or power, will do us untold harm. We must be extremely wary of strangers suddenly appearing from the undergrowth claiming to be friends like the EDL supporter setting up Pride and Shetlars thuggish Kiss-in which to me seem more like an exercise to make us look like troublemakers.

        1. Paddyswurds 24 Apr 2011, 3:57pm

          …… an exercise designed to make us look……

        2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:39am

          …..unelected group pretending to have GLB interests at heart is fooling themselves,they are not our friends.

      2. Jock S. Trap 24 Apr 2011, 1:29pm

        As usual your comment makes no sense. It ends up you just say rubbish.

        1. Paddyswurds 24 Apr 2011, 4:02pm

          ….I didn’t expect it to make sense to you as little does judging by your pitiful offerings on these pages…well maybe Ladybird Jack and Jill books….You don’t have the intellect for anything above 2nd grade.

          1. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 7:06am

            Maybe cut down on the drinking and your comments might start to make sense. I would say you might be less vile but think theres not much chance of that.

            There not point in trying to reason with your kind of drunk.

          2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:36am

            …I am actually a tee totaler all my life and I stopped smoking blo about 8 months ago and I don’t take any medicines at the moment, and hope never to have to.
            So like it or not, everything I post is coming from a totally clear Harvard educated head.
            Like I said I really never ever expect you to understand anything I post.

        2. Cheers jock. Paddy is one contrary mf. He’s AnIta gay

    2. Tesco metor. Di. Ckhead. And Muslims sell booze too you know. I think they’re hypocrites.

    3. Most corner shops in London are run by Muslims. And booze is available 24/7.

      1. Paddyswurds 24 Apr 2011, 8:02pm

        ….make up your mind man. First you said it was pork the “Muslim” man sold you, now you are saying it was booze, altho going by the standard of your comments I think it was booze and I really do think you should cut back a little….oh ok then a lot. Either that or you are mixing it with your meds which you know you were told not to do.
        You didn’t say if you made a complaint to the management of Tesco metor (sic) or why, if you didn’t, you are whinging about it now.
        Nor did you enlighten us as to how you knew the nice man was a Muslim. He may have been Jewish or just a sheep farmer.

        1. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 6:55am

          Again you completely missed the point James! is making and instead make up totally irrelevent rubbish. Maybe drink less or are you just naturally vile, which wouldn’t surprise me one bit.

          1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 10:48am

            ….oh I entirely understood James1s racist fictional rant but couldn’t resist mocking his short sightedness. James like a few others on this and other threads of similar bent is a racist little Englander and does the GLB community no favours with his ignorant ranting.Those who manifest such racism have no right seeking human rights for themselves if they would on the otherhand deny it to others.

          2. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 2:30pm

            You mean like your blatant racism towards Black Christians and your Ever so blatant Transphobia on another thread, plain for ALL to see?

            Your the only one who has facist tendancies and like most idiots you try to project your feelings onto everyone else.
            I really can’t be bothered with ya no more you nothing but a drunk, hypocrite.

            You give nothing worthy and to be honest you’ve gotten boring.
            Enough already, you racist, hypocritrical creep.
            No more. End of.

          3. Spanner1960 25 Apr 2011, 4:29pm

            Paddyswurds: That’s all very well, but as far as I am concerned you are a foreigner in my country too.
            If yo don’t like the way we do things around here, you know what the alternative. Leave us and our “Little England” because that’s the way we like it.

          4. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 10:20pm

            ……Let anyone who can come up with a black racist remark made by me produce it …I defy you.
            As for Transphobia.I will not deny that i have said no amount of surgery will make a man a woman and if that is transphobic…so be it, i am a realist..lets see one of them get pregnant. I will perhaps change my attitude to surgically altered men when they become less Homophobic.
            You are an ignorant racist fascist and anyone who reads your pathetic cut and paste rants knows who is the racist,.You are the only one ever to call me a racist based on something ironic which others joined with, that i commented about the homophobic xtians the Johns. And you needn’t go copying and pasting from the EDL manifesto in reply to me. You dont have the intellect to debate with me.

          5. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 10:37pm

            …….I dont live in England. l ,of necessity had to spend the odd week there in the 1960s when i was in the MN. I found it to be overcrowded, dirty and its people racist uneducated and gauche.
            I live in rural idyll in the West of Ireland where i was born and raised before i went out to see the world.My politics are center left liberal, I am atheist and i am a tee totaler who smoked a little blo when I was younger. You can refuse to believe that if you like but it won’t change reality. Where btw did you get the idea i was a drunk? That is wholly laughable coming as it does from a self confessed alcoholic. But you can scream till you explode , i will be commenting tomorrow next week next month ad nauseum so suck it up Mary.

      2. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 7:02am

        I know what you mean. I’ve witness similar comments in a leading supermarket butcher department. It’s very unpleasant and yes I did complain about it. I think the person involved was removed from front line customers however I think many places fail to act.

        I lived in an area where most if not all off licences were Muslim owned and had no problem selling alcohol to anyone, including those under age.

        I do feel this is double standards.
        Yes I am aware they are not drinking it but if it goes against their religion how they happily take money for something they are opposed to?

        1. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 7:02am

          That last comment was for James!

      3. Yeah, you try and buy a pork chop round my way then.
        Virtually impossible except Sainsburys.

  26. Jock. It’s like a vegetarian selling meat and it’s extremely insidious. Where I live there are 10 off licences posing as convienece stores 2 sell booze 24/7 and some people are alcoholics and look pretty rough buying cheap cider. I saw a shopkeeper give a free sample of booze to a regular who may have been an alcoholic. It was pretty shameless.

    1. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 8:54am

      I have to equal that up though James!

      I just been to my local small supermarket at just after 8AM and there is a pub open opposite with people and their pints. I was all for 24/7 opening though most don’t but surely pubs that open that time of the morning are only opening to make money out of alcoholics?
      As an ex-alcoholic myself, I do feel more needs to be done to tackle the selling alcohol, without it penalising those who just got out to be sociable.
      It does seem now people and business weither Muslim and non-Muslim are exploiting alcoholics. I personally find that inexcusable on all parts.

  27. Spanner try buying non halal meat around here.

  28. Paddy you just want to argue you comtributenothing insightful and are tedious like mmmmmmmm used to be so you can fcuk right off il no longer respond to anything you post

    1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:11am

      ….you finally get the message…phew!

    2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:26am

      …and one supposes you posting a fictional rant about a supposed Muslim mocking you for eating pork is insightful?. Like I said how come you didn’t assume he was Jewish, they also don’t eat pork but do sell it. You are a racist plain and simple and I am glad that you finally get the message and will not be posting your intellectually bereft racism against ones comments. It was becoming tedious having to repeat myself to you all the time.
      You would be better suited to the Daily Mail comments pages….more in keeping with your brand of Little Englander racism….
      I just wish a couple of others would get the same message.

      1. Paddy, what has race got to do with anything James! has said? He never mentioned the race of anyone in any of his comments. He was talking about a muslim who sold him pork and chastised him for it. islam is not a race, it’s a religion. How does he know he’s a muslim? I don’t know, maybe he had a burkha on, oh no I forgot, it’s just the women who are forced to wear bin bags. Maybe he’s just seen him going to the local mosque, who knows?

        Paddy, for someone who thinks all religions are stupid, you sure defend muslims a lot, but then you really would argue with yourself on an empty comments page. And for someone who doesn’t even live in England, let alone London, you seem to think you know how people who live there should feel and act.

        IMO, James! has never come across as racist or like an EDL supporter, James! is black ff’s (I think), so I think he knows a bit more about racism than a white ex Navy cook who lives in a field in Ireland. Go and talk to the sheep, please.

        1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:34pm

          …i’m not defending Muslims in particular, but at the same time I wanted to know why he thought the dude was Muslim. Was he carrying a bag of stones for stoning his sister to death or what. But James couldn’t tell me why he thought the guy was Muslim. How did he know the dude wasn’t Jewish for instance… they also wear beards and don’t eat pork. No James was being racist the same way as his sort was racist against the Irish and Irish catholics during “the troubles” If you were irish you were an IRA man and probably had a bomb in your bag. Anyone who ever travelled between Englan and Ireland then knows all about it the same way people preceived to be Muslims and so terrorists do today. If it were Hindu’s were being targeted i would be just as vocal.I have no time for any religion as you know by now but i will defend anyones right to hold whatever faith the do. otherwise i can’t expect equality as agay man. It would make me a hypocrit. And by the way the only homophobia cont

          1. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 9:54pm

            cont…i have ever experienced didnt come from A Hindu, Muslim,Jane or Sikh, it came from a white English Christian when I was beaten up at 18 on my way to the docks to join a ship in 1969. for being “queer”
            James! couldn’t tell me because his “incident” was a construct in order to facilitate his racism.Don’t waste your time telling me the obvious, that Muslim isn’t a race. I clearly know that. But British racists use religion as a cover for racism because you can’t be charged with incitement to hatred when you speak of Muslim (Asian), Catholic (Irish)etc.I have 40 years experience of the nuances of racism to draw from, so unless you can equal that, well……
            and your final shot shows your a racist too. I am not an ex Navy cook, where you got that i dont know and i dont live in a field of sheep in Ireland I live outside a large town in a 361 y o Georgian house. And it’s 2011 ffs and no problem keeping up with whats going on in the world I dont read the Sun you know

          2. Paddyswurds 25 Apr 2011, 10:05pm

            …”IMO, James! has never come across as racist or like an EDL supporter, James! is black ff’s (I think),”
            That little line of gibberish says a lot about you too Eddy. What are you twelve years old for fcuk sake. What doe’s that prove.There are black english. Black people have a long and sad history in England . but there are Black racists where Asians are concerned. But you aren’t even sure of that so Your whole comment is only supposition. Unless you know James personally you can’t speak for him.

        2. Jock S. Trap 26 Apr 2011, 8:41am

          Here, Here! I second that Eddy!

    3. Jock S. Trap 25 Apr 2011, 9:41am

      I think the words your looking for are ‘pot’ and ‘kettle’

  29. Cheers Eddy

  30. Jupiterray 26 Apr 2011, 4:11pm

    To find out the truth about the cult of Islam, its’ fanatical adherents and Mohammed,its’ paedophile prophet log onto or search the name ‘Trencherbone’

    1. This one is much funnier, especially the barcode scanner picture.

      and you’ll probably like this site too.

  31. Ah! it was Mohammed! So now it seems we have had at least two Muslims charged over these offensive stickers, the first being let off! But there appears to be no responce about this blantent homophobia from the Muslim Council of Britain? Amazingly silent on the matter! I wonder why? and what does it tell us of the attitude of many Muslims towards our LGBT community, especially in the East End?

  32. Poor guy…. He should be trained how to do it right!

  33. Whole world should be gay free zone! Muslims will do the business, that’s for sure!

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