That such people of complete ignorance can be in positions of power is worrying.
Absolutely! This is beyond stupid.
I agree, outstanding ignorance
the ultimate patriarchal concern… with no women around… where will more males come from… gasp!
haha .. should we even take such a retard seriously? But then again, in a society of hierarchical democracy one often has no choice.
Haha, I needed a laugh today, these comments are just beyond ridiculous, and this individual is in a high position? Jeez …
And maybe this guy should spend more time talking about why there could be a gender imbalance in favour of males.
India has a history of “eliminating” female babies in favour of male. Is this the truth to which he infers, or is he stupider than even he appears.
Exactly what I thought. It seems strange that after a history of favour males more than females now they want to question it.
Exactly my thoughts as well.
Extradordinary coming from a country which has a reputation for routinely aborting female foetuses, and for no other reason but they will grow up to be women.
……”and for no other reason but they will grow up to be women.”
Well yes and more probably no. The main reason for the behaviour you chronicle is security in old age rather than, as you assert, misogyny. Because daughters marry and become members of another family, sons, even though they also marry, tend not to move on and the ageing parents tend to become members of his extended family and household, thus ensuring security in the parents old age.
Female infanticide and female foeticide are long practices in India. Among the myriad reasons, one is dowry. A girl is objectified to the extent that her family has to pay huge (often beyond means) dowry to get rid of her .. oops .. i mean marry her off.
A girl is more “expensive” to bring up than a boy who, in financially downtrodden families, can begin working sooner than a girl and in a culture of unequal payment, can earn more.
Clearly a girl stands no chance of survival against prejudices and repelling customs of years.
Oh and let us not forget, “witches” and “spirits” invariably haunt more women than men. Despite our urban advancement, Indian villages still suffer the same misogynistic beliefs that they did for over hundreds of years.
I don’t even think he’s inferring this. His comment is too silly. In my opinion he’s not stopped to think, just opened his mouth and made a stupid homophobic comment. If pressed, I doubt he’d admit that any cultural ideas had led to this gender imbalance. I feel he simply took this opportunity to get a dig in at gay people without thinking any further.
I agree, I don’t think he is referring to that but nevertheless this is why there is a problem. I believe there was a scandal here in the UK a couple of years ago among the Indian community highlighting again the problem that JohnK referres to. Either way when it mostly seems males are favour and many females treated badly for being so I think it’s then very low to suddenly come up with this lame uneducated excuse.
They weedle out females in favour of males then complain there isn’t enough females. It’s just ridiulous. It’s dangerous and it supports that nasty claim that females are worth less. It’s just plain wrong. They can hardly carry on with this then make these wild claims.
It sadly shows that even here in the 21st Century humanity I think can be it’s own worst enemy, to treat people so unequality.
Quite right, Jock. The problem is of their own making (after all, I’m sure it wasn’t women who first had the idea to treat female babies as worth less than male) yet they can’t even see that.
So doubly stupid – complaining about a situation that society encouraged, then making a spectacularly stupid deduction because of the circumstances that have been created.
You’re justified in your remarks.
However, very often it is the females who are as much to blame as the men.
Mothers-in-law treat their daughters-in-law demeaningly and with scathing words for producing a girl instead of a boy. There are enough and more cases where both parents conspired to get rid of a female baby whom they saw as nothing but a burden. Dowry, despite being banned, continues to haunt women’s lives in both rural and urban Indian societies.
For a hand-to-mouth family, the prospect of a bride’s jewelery compared to the income that a son will bring home once he’s 8 or 10 is enough to decide a girl child’s fate.
These are inherent prejudices which will require years, perhaps generations of education to eradicate.
Oh and as far as homophobia is concerned, Abdullah who is openly religious would obviously be anti-gay. But this is a pestilence (that is, intolerance towards non-normative sexuality) across the world and should be battled keeping its wide horizon in mind.
….and it may not even be that. Here in Ireland we have a saying in reference to futility that goes “you may as well be whistling jigs to a Milestone”
It is possible and now we really have no way of knowing what he really meant or the way he meant it, but i could possibly have been along the lines , “If we dont have women we will all end up shagging each other” which in my humble opinion isn’t quite as homophobic as is it’s being made out to be. While it sounds to you and me, homophobic, it is more likely homosexuality never entered his head.
Likewise I don’t think homosexuality or gay ever enters the head of a long term prisoner who takes his “bitch” in the dark of night.
I am in no way excusing throwaway homophobic abuse when it occours, but i think this isn’t really homophobic abuse, as it referred to the entire Indian male population
…..then again if he actually used the “Gay” word maybe he really is a creep who thinks it’s possible to “turn gay”
I have during my lifetime come across ane or two guys who professed to be straight and certainly did have lots of girlfriends but who and one in particular, had a gay fumble as a teen and “liked” it so went looking for it every now and then.
I guess it takes all sorts as they say……
it beggers belief that an adult would make such comments… it sounds like something from “Kid’s say the funniest things!”
Although we can laugh at this as stupidity it reveals a very serious and dangerous mind set. The idea that our sexual orientation is something we can choose from convenience is what leads directly to “corrective rape” of lesbians and these awful “ex-gay” therapies.
Yeah, I agree. His views are certainly odd, given the background of prizing male babies over females, but the idea that we choose to be gay is, in my view, just plain wrong. Now I’m the age I am, have the confidence that I do and have experienced all the things that I have I wouldn’t change a thing – my gayness is as much a part of me as my opposable thumbs, but it wasn’t always this way and isn’t for a lot of people – I didn’t want to be gay, but also I knew I couldn’t change the fact that I was. Coming to terms with being gay and coming out is a very big deal indeed, so the idea that someone would choose to put themselves through the anguish and heartache that so many people go through is bizarre and, as you say David, dangerous.
I think a person’s religious inclination has a lot to do with his/her acceptance of multiple sexuality. Those who are dictated that being heterosexual is the only natural way would certainly think that homosexuality arises not from nature but due to incidents/circumstances. A wrong belief but one that millions (or should I say billions) adhere to. Society and culture are as responsible.
And if one was given correct education rather than dogma to learn and blab, made aware of the existence of homosexuality since ancient times, I suppose that could bring about some change in orthodox (intolerant) mindsets.
Then again, I’m not particularly hopeful.
Homophobes will say absolutely anything to try and drive us back underground:
A few things caused by gays:
Earthquakes, Tsunamis, Floods, End of the human race…
Blah, blah, blah.
While his comments are an exaggeration, what Farooq Abdullah says does underscore the fact that ridiculous Indian beliefs about the value of women is eventually going to cause an unacceptable population imbalance over there.
It’s a global thing. Ridiculous and utterly baseless as it may seem to the educated, many societies and cultures across Asia, Africa, Europe and America (yes despite their outward show of progress) suffer from prejudices regarding the value, conduct and proper “use” of women. And education as we consider it to be is itself not proof against such dogmatic, orthodox beliefs.
…..The whole i child per couple in China has created a similar imbalance but so far no politician has been stupid enough to make a similar comment. THe one child policy has created a vast army of young men mostly under 35 who now have noone to marry but the incidence of homosexuality has stayed constant as on e would expect it to. The one child policy along with the similar problem India has of consideribg females worth less and unable to look after parents in their dotage makes the problem even worse. The Communist Party of China considers this problem to be probably the top most pressing for China’s and more importantly The communists security.
1 child*….The*….no one*… one*… considering*… doteage*… the Communist Party’s* Sheesh…….. whens editing gonna be allowed PN ??
Ha ha! I knew what you meant!
What I like about the minister’s comments is the inherent suggestion that it’s not SUCH a huge leap from current domestic arrangements to a “gay lifestyle”. If needs must, I think he’s saying, they’ll just get on with it. :-)
Chill Paddyswurds – I didn’t notice these until I saw your list of errata cos i scan these messages. Anyways, if the front and the end are right, and the middle looks something like the same shape it doesn’t matter too much that some letters were wrong or ended up in the wrong place :)
…..I know, i know but it bothers me seeing the mess and while you possess the intellect to see the bigger pic, it is usually a bit of a problem with some of the other posters on here if you see what i mean. Maybe i have that impulsive thingy, whatchamaycallit….lol
I think what this story does do is continue to highlight the complete inequality between genders. Can’t help feeling that with such intolerance at the basic level of male and female there is not hope of a better society in that area for equality for all.
Far from this man blaming the lack of females on everyone going ‘Gay’ I think he needs to look much closer to see he is part of the problem and unless he is will to stop and sort out the real issue he cannot expect things to get better.
I thought what he is saying is not the outlandish. It seems to me he is talking about a gender imbalance which has occured through the greater value placed on sons and the gender choosing, infanticide and abortion of female children which has led to it. There is such a thing as situational homosexuality where ostensibly men or women who if they had a choice available would choose the opposite gender but because of availability engage in homosexual behaviour. (insitutional setting largely like military prisons etc). While it might not be their preference a lot of Indian men will find that they may have to turn to sex with men if they want sex or a relationship. While he’s exaggerating all indians will not become gays, there will be more men having sex with men both out of preference with increasing acceptance of homosexuality and out of necessity.
….. i know this to be true after spending 5 years in the Merchant Navy. My boyfriend was gay while we were at sea, but had a wife and child back in Grimsby. He used to say i was his port in a storm. We always made sure we were on the same ship.
“My boyfriend was gay while we were at sea”
Either you are gay or you are not.
Just because a man has sex with another man does not make him gay.
You cannot switch sexuality on and off like a tap.
(and please don’t give me all this bisexual crap, he was simply hard up)
….Dont you have anything to say of your own other than the odd one or two word snide remarks?
….perhaps i should have said he was “gay” while we were at sea similar lads who are “gay for pay”. He cartainly always asserted that he wasn’t bisexual as he thought there was no such thing. I think he really was “gay while we were at sea” and quite possibly closeted while at home with his wife an child, as so many men are even today. looking at his pic even today my “gaydar” seems to suggest that he was deffo gay. Bleached high lights etc even in 1970 would have been a road too far for most able bodied seamen. So i hope you will excuse the omission of the quotation marks i should have inserted in the first place.Obviously i, as a gay man , know that it’s not domething one switches of and on. By the way i also don’t think ” hard up” was his problem as there were plenty of women aboard as passangers and crew.
….”at sea, similar to lads who are”..* Looking…*, something..* off..* passengers..* Editing facility after post, please, PN.
I agree with this entirely. It’s one reason why I am reluctant to adopt entirely the ‘born gay’ position.
For many of us, we probably have had no choice in our sexual desire. However, others may have greater desire for particular activity rather than the attraction to gender itself.
Disagree. Hetero-normative societies and cultures very often decide what our sexuality should be. And anything against their established notions is deemed unnatural. A gay person is gay not because of lack of choice but because of a natural tendency that way. Why must we look for a “reason” for everything? If one doesn’t need to give reasons for having two hands, legs etc. other than evolution then I don’t think homosexuality needs to be defined within trajectories of reason either.
Twins studies show it’s 70/30 genes/not-genes. I don’t say environment, because we just don’t know. The fact is though, that it doesn’t matter. And the more experience with people I get as life goes on the more these labels (even gay/lesbian/straight/bi) are just not sufficient. Sexuality is not within our control, nor is it measurable, nor is it harmful. It’s a non-issue; but it is still interesting to wonder at what that other 30% is…
Maybe with a lower rate of females the country will no longer be able to cook either and everyone will starve to death. And then there is the risk of knitting circles becoming extinct.
Some people are stupid.
“….“And the truth is the population is growing at a much faster rate and FORTUNATELY male sex is growing faster …”
‘FORTUNATELY’, indeed Mr. Abdullah, couldn’t agree more
Errrr… WHat about the lesbians???
…..errr, if women die out where will lesbians come from. Just the same as if women die out there eventually won’t be any Indian males. Unfortunately….
I read it as Dromio referring to the implicit assumption that all the women are just gagging for a man when, in reality, a number of them will actually have no interest in men at all. (Apologies if I read that wrong, Dromio).
That’s another thing that pissed me off about his comment – the idea that all men have to do is share out the available women and make sure every man has one, as though women have no minds of their own.
Perhaps even with equal numbers of straight women and straight men, some men will be so unappealing that they’ll forever remain unpartnered? It’s not simply a matter of matching numbers.
This interpretation of his statement didn’t strike me till I read your comment. Regardless to say, it just pissed me off further.
Oh and in arranged marriages, very often this is exactly what happens. However loathsome a man is, whatever be his age, manners etc. so long as he’s considered able to provide for a family and has a respectable (don’t ask me how they define this term) background, he can have the youngest, prettiest girl for a wife. Sickening? I think so too.
Udita, your comments are very enlightening – thank you.
A possible solution to the gender imbalance in India:
How fruit trees in Indian village save girls’ lives
Interesting, John. Thank you for the link.
Interesting solution to the problem of dowry payments, and the finanical pressure which is put on the the brides family.
Maybe this is the saddest way for women to be appreciated in India.
The Minister is wrong of course. A far more likely solution is that a vast army of female sex workers will arise. So no need to worry there then eh?
I notice that he said “women are getting eliminated”. Does that have anything to do with the hushed-up custom of eliminating female babies and aborting female embryos? Apart from the failure to address that issue, it’s the usual ignorant tosh.
That is exactly what is happening. Dowry, female foeticide, female infanticide are alll illegal. The minister’s statement is an obvious proof that the State is aware of laws being broken every day but is unwilling to take up preventive action.
Really, is it any wonder that people despair of politicians sometimes? Even if he didn’t mean his statement to come out the way he did, he should know how to communicate in public without making an ass of himself.
In any case, I think India’s main problem with be (is) overpopulation in general, not the gender balance.
I love the photo that goes with this article… Are all gays born with a tiny little foot in place of a middle finger?
killing child girls is the reason for boys in high numbers in nature women are .03% more than men
but macho society wants women inslaved or dead . gays and lesbians are same percent 10 to 20% of the population regardless
Other than this being the typically absurd comment by a narrow minded imbecile, the likes of which there are too many of in public office in every country these days….
Perhaps it might also be considered that nature is trying to help what humans are too vain and stupid to do on their own and that is control the over-population of the planet. Everywhere another idiot too poor to support themselves is bringing yet another child into a world that already has massive unemployment and few, if any, viable solutions for the future.
I am older and I find it both absurd, and disturbing, that back in the 70′s we were actively trying to reign in a population already out of control, now it is far, far, worse, and there are strollers everywhere.
Gay people used to be proud we were not contributing to the problem, now gay people are at it too. The world has gone even more mad than it already was.
I feel very sorry for kids being born now, there will likely be very few opportunities for most of them.
So to rephrase, if this brain dead moron were right, it might be a huge blessing. Assuming all those gays do not find surrogates and keep all the problems going….
hopefully he is right. Stop the population explosion and make more gay epople = a couble wammy against the creeps of the right wing churches.
straight guys wouldnt become gay they’d just buy alot more tissues & handle it themselves…
It’s the Gaypocalypse!
OMG it was my thought too, we must be tweens seperated at birth, init
Well if you do, make sure you use a spell checker first. ;)