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Comment: Tower Hamlets council can lead the way on tackling homophobia

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  1. This is the most pathetic response I imagined. “Quick let’s make busy doing nothing – the homos are so thick and uninformed, they’ll never notice”.

    Tower Hamlets Council already has a No Place for Hate Campaign.

    http://www.towerhamlets.gov.uk/lgsl/1101-1150/1133_hate_crime/no_place_for_hate_campaign.aspx

    The threat of an EDL demo in Tower Hamlets against The Troxy was what made that venue sign up to this already existing policy. They did not care about preventing hate speech until the EDL threatened a protest.

    http://towerhamletswatch.wordpress.com/2010/06/11/troxy-drops-islamic-conference/

    And Councillor Helal Abbas was subsequently booed by the joint ranks of the UAF and violent muslims who rioted in Whitchapel because the hate conference was cancelled.

    http://www.eastlondonlines.co.uk/2010/06/violence-at-whitechapel-protest/

    Pink News… Please get comments from someone who is not clueless. Does this tit even live in London?

    1. @James

      Thanks for posting the links

    2. Patrick Lilley 22 Mar 2011, 2:14am

      The socalled English Defence League is a violent and divisive hate mongering fringe group desperately trying to recruit on here. You lost your East End socaled Pride event front organisation he he he he..

      As has been stated on here many times ALL homophobic murders in London in last 5 years were committed by NON MUSLIMS. The number of homophobic incidents in the thee areas with most muslims, has actually declined and risen in areas with fewer muslims.

      Please dont use the word “us” as the EDL do not speak for us. We have elections in the UK and our politicians are our representatives. Stand in an election if you want to and we shall see how much support the EDL actually have.

      Hate – from the EDL of ordinary muslims is just the same of racism or homophobia. You guys know as little about Islam as you probably do about real Christianity! Why dont you guys get on your high horse about the “hang the gays” law being proposed by Christian homophobes in Uganda!

      1. I’ll admit that the EDL are ready to be violent. But they’ve yet to blow up any buses or tubes or planes. And unlike the muslims there are not thousands under surveillance by anti-terrorist police. The EDL is yet to march through the streets shouting “We are going to kill Anjem Choudary”, the way hundreds of muslims did in 1989 with regard to Salman Rushdie. EDL does not have a policy saying “kill muslims”, the way that many muslim groups have towards us homos.

        I can’t really speak for anyone but myself. But I agree hatred is wrong. Unfortunately, violence seems to be the only thing our “leaders” understand — £millions poured into muslim organisations in Britain following muslim terrorism.

        Of course the EDL do not speak for the gay community. The gay community is very ably represented by the back-stabbing Imaan (who want the caliphate and sharia law), and the back-stabbing Out East/Rainbow Hamlets. You are welcome to your representatives. You deserve what you get.

        1. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:50am

          Hi James,

          I am afraid that there is a naivety here. There are lots of EDL supporters under observation. Think this might help your naivety:

          http://faith-matters.org/resources/publicationsreports/201-the-english-defence-league-challenging-our-country-and-our-values-of-social-inclusion-fairness-and-equality

      2. EDL has no need to recruit gay people. The whole LGBT population is insignificant numerically – probably 1% of the entire population (if you’re still living in the “1 in 10″ fantasy, then you must know a lot of fairies).

        Hope Not Hate (an anodyne brand anyone can like) has been around as the cuddly front of communists for donkeys years. Yet EDL overtook them in popularity last November.

        HNH are now warning that 48% of people would support a far-right party. We should all hope that that cannot be true. And we should all hope that it will never come to pass. If EDL gets behind a political party (as The Independent claims), then I hope that it will be a progressive party that will oppose islamisation and for universal human rights.

        I’ve been told by people in EDL that they approached many “moderate” secularist muslim organisations but were rebuffed. Jewish supporters of EDL approached the Council of Ex-Muslims and were rebuffed.

        So where are EDL being pushed?

    3. yeah, there has been FIVE to get concerne d about Islamist hate in Tower hamlets. Where was this author then?

  2. Helen Wilson 21 Mar 2011, 5:29pm

    What the hell is a faith group doing setting the agenda for matters relating to sexuality?

    If the LGBT let them set the agenda then it will be softly softly gays are sinful approach in Tower Hamlets.

    1. Totally agree with you Helen and with Harry57 below.

      1. Patrick Lilley 22 Mar 2011, 2:19am

        There are many faith groups of all religions who practice and preach acceptance of all including LGBT people. These include evangelical Christians, Jews, Muslims and all the rest.

        Equally there are people of all faiths who do not.

        If you wish to speak to someone and egage it is usefull to understand the views and beliefs of all the people you seek to influence. The article above is quite helpful. They are seeking to be helpful… Why not accept the person and the groups positive intentions?

        1. Because he is an advocate of islam who only appears when the muslims are caught out promoting anti-semitism and violent homophobia. If you bothered to research his actions following the Panorama programme exposing the muslim schools indoctrinating children in anti-semitism and murderous homophobia, you would understand that his actions here are precisely the same.

          His contribution is to blame rabbis and vicars for the islamic homophobia plastered across London. He is part of the cover-up operation.

          If his absolutely nugatory contribution to this problem had appeared on the website of the Muslim Council of Britain then you might have had a point.

        2. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 12:45pm

          Patrick

          …and what part exactly do most Muslims engage in understanding the LGBT community? I’ve heard too many times, personally, their point that they think ‘Gays should be killed’ whilst living in Tower Hamlets.

          …and what part exactly do a lot of Christians engage in understanding the LGBT community. We have the likes of LU etc who come hear who have no interest in hearing anything but just displaying bigotry and discrimination.

          Equality is supposed to be their for everyone only Religion seems to think that being above it should only apply to them.

          Nothing but hypocrites.

    2. Agreed Helen and why is he commenting here? We dont have a problem they do so he can sod off to the east london mosque and tell them

    3. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 12:39pm

      Indeed this is what the like of Rainbow Hamlets and Out East SHOULD be doing not a faith group but a LGBT group. Aren’t they the ones that are supposed to best represent us?

      I guess no chance then.

  3. Faith groups cannot take the lead in combatting homophobia because they are the reason for it. I accept the bona fides of this group but the best thing that they can can do is exercise their right to practise their faith amongst consenting adults in private and leave the campaigning to the secular majority.

    1. @Harry57

      I agree, this is a complete oxymoron with regards faith groups.

  4. The name suggests that this guy is a Muslim. His heart might be in the right place, but I suggest that proactive education campaigns undertaken by him and his friends in their own faith community about Islam’s very homoerotic and now heavily suppressed past would be the most effective use of their time.

    1. Er…how can a name suggest a belief? What about, Ibn Warraq, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Maryam Namazie or Salman Rushdie? What do you think they believe…???

      Positive education about Evolution would work even better, to be honest.

      1. Fiyaz Mughal is a massive apologist for islam. He excused the Panorama programme where kids were taught to kill us by saying “there were no British-based Muslim publishing houses.”

        http://faith-matters.org/press?start=12

        What? Muslims have been here for 30, 40, 50 years, and they are still using textbooks imported from that beacon of liberalism Saudi Arabia! Their basic humanity didn’t stop them from thinking “hmm.. jew hatred, homopobhia.. these books are bad”. Nope, just carry on with the free radicali wahhabi books until the kufar notices.

        1. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:23am

          Sorry James,

          I think that you are way off the point and no-one is being an apologist for the actions of hateful people in our society. If they come from faith communities, wherever they are, they need to be challenged.

          I also have to take exception to the manner in which you have twisted my words. In my work I have not come across UK based Muslim publishing houses that advocate hate. However, where the hate is imported from Saudi ideology then this needs to be highlighted. I think hat your labelling me is unhelpful and I will continue to campaign against those people within faith communities who condemn others because of their lifetsyle of where they come from. I would hope that you mantain an open mind instead of jumping to such wild and unhelpful assumptions

      2. Quite easily. I never stated that he definitively was a Muslim, just that such a name was evidence for it. And he actually is.

  5. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 6:21pm

    FFS a moderate muslim from a moderate progressive group makes a strong and impassioned denunciation of homophobia and suggests a credible and sensible approach to the issue in LBTH . . .

    . . . . and the venomous little coterie of islamophobes can’t wait to rubbish him.

    Sheesh! First you complain that no muslims ever speak up for us and then, when they do, you dismiss it out of hand.

    Well Fiyaz, I for one appreciate what you have written and welcome it.

    Lets hope Lutfur and his acolytes take notice.

    1. I disagree. You can’t be a Muslim and gay. Fiyaz has to pick his faith, or he has to pick his bum.

      1. You are a twat. There is a big difference between a religion and a faith.
        People can have a faith, and believe what they like.
        It is only religions that tell people what they should believe in.

        1. Twat?

          Your mom.

          1. musclelad23 21 Mar 2011, 6:57pm

            Although you can be a gaga fan and a total moron evendently.

        2. Jock S. Trap 1 Apr 2011, 12:25pm

          Charming as ever!

      2. Patrick Lilley 22 Mar 2011, 2:34am

        @ GaGa

        Of course you can be muslim and gay!

        How stupid is that! Imaan is a popular and respectable gay muslim group…its like saying you can be christian and gay or CofE and gay (half the vicars are queer) or cant be black and gay.

        Jesus wept!

        1. I am in the sad position of having to agree with Lilley. There are gay muslims. But according to muslim fundamentalists, they are bad muslims. And in 7 of the countries of the world they would be executed — all of those countries would do so under sharia law.

          Imaan have stated publicly they welcome the Caliphate. Exactly the same policy as Hizb ut Tahrir, a party banned in many muslim countries and in Germany, and which is to be banned here. Imaan put the Ummah above all else, including their fellow homos. We know precisely where their loyalty lies.

          Erdogan (the prime minister of Turkey says) “there is no moderate islam”.

          http://www.thememriblog.org/turkey/blog_personal/en/2595.htm

      3. WHo are you to say? Try reading about Irshad Manji.

    2. Helen Wilson 21 Mar 2011, 7:18pm

      Faith Matters has no experience in dealing with issues of sexuality its a faith organisation FFS

      Maybe if you put down the race card and looked at the website of this organisation you might see its not just a Muslim org. The only issue I have is a faith organisation setting the agenda of the debate that will follow this. Its wholly inappropriate for them to do that given the religious nature of the homophobic attacks in Tower Hamlets.

      Local LGBT groups should be setting the agenda and then faith groups brought in to respond and collaborate.

      1. Spot on.

        1. Patrick Lilley 22 Mar 2011, 2:40am

          Helen – the number of homophobic incidents in the boroughs of East London with most muslims went down last year by nearly 10% but rose in areas of London with fewer muslims. Didnt anyone tell you?

          Please can you specify one attack that was identifiably religious in nature?

          ALL homophobic murders in London were committed by NON MUSLIMS. So shall we have a campaign against non muslim homophobic murders! LMAO.

          I suggest that all LGBT, LGBT FAITH GROUPS and FAITH GROUPS and non Faith groups join with the mayor in condemning homophobia. Any incidents I am aware of are simply the same kind of attacks you get in Vauxhall late at night – nasty youths who need to be locked in and punished. Its not religion based in any way. It more petty gang violence.

          If not shut up!

          1. Meanwhile, East London Mosque runs “Spot the Fag” training, The Troxy hosts Hizb ut Tahrir several years running, the council permits homophobic abuse in the council meetings, and the police and gay leaders cover up the most sustained homophobic campaign in 20 years or more.

            Here’s proof of the Spot The Fag training day:
            http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=201338976550546&set=a.201338773217233.52308.132236756794102

            Muslims demand tolerance, and they preach intolerance. The violence in east London might well be coming from muslim gangs, but their homophobia is being informed (and legitimised) by their religious and political leaders.

            There should be no tolerance for intolerance.

          2. Paid shill of Lutfur Rahman — can you show us where he condemned his homophobic supporters and their campaign of homophobic abuse in the council chamber.

            I seriously would hope he did that. He might not have any control over gang violence or ELM. But there is nothing stopping him from saying “how dare you, you savages”.

          3. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 12:58pm

            Actually Most, not all but most homophobia is religion based. Regardless of weither people are religious or not it spans from centuries of hatred by religion.

            It is why the LGBT community is opening up and why religions like Christianity are getting resentful, because finally they have to take the blame for the centuries of misery they have caused all in the name of their idea of humanity. Very cruel.

            I again would like to remind, esp Patrick that 30 – 40% of people in Tower Hamlets are actually Muslim, therefore I can’t see why it is classed a Muslim area. The society is mixed and should be treated as such but I guess people like you prefer to marginalize.

            Ironic since people like you tell us that to marginalze is wrong, yet here you are…

          4. Jock, whilst only 30-40% of the population of Tower Hamlets is muslim, 60% of the councillors are muslim.

            http://sps2ksrv.towerhamlets.gov.uk/meetyourcouncillor/

            So much for islamophobia and discrimination against muslims.

          5. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 4:49pm

            James

            Yes and particularly when you think that most Lutfar supports Don’t believe in democracy and don’t believe in voting.

      2. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:29am

        Thanks Helen,

        Faith Matters was not trying to set any agenda. The whole purpose of our article was to say that attacks against LGBT groups cannot be excused, particularly when there are people of faith who continue to believe that people are somewhat ‘of a lesser status’ because of their lifetsyle.

        Our purpose was and will never be to set any agenda. Our ethos as an organisation is about respecting difference, indeed all of the work is about that and for those who took the time to read our publications, this comes through strongly.

    3. “Lets hope Lutfur and his acolytes take notice.”

      It would be curious to find out their exact, unfettered and off the record views on this issue.

    4. What does ‘moderate’ mean? By what standard?

      The important question, is it a ‘liberal’ organisation. And as for the probability of Lutfur taking notice? An illiterate tradesman being visited by an archangel in the Arabian peninsula and told the meaning of life would be a more likely scenario.

    5. E3, The point is — he is saying precisely nothing. It is hand-waving and flim-flam.

      We now know why ELM made any statement about the stickers — because there is evidence that the people who plastered London with them were filmed coming out of ELM!

      “Faith Matters” are nothing but another layer of the defence of islam. I don’t want another charter that muslims just ignore to continue their homophobia and anti-semitism. I want to see the existing offenders prosecuted. What was the point in voting Labour and getting gay-hatred legislation passed if we then give homophobes a Get Out of Jail Free card, just because they have brown skin?

      Clearly Cameron’s defense of “muscular liberalism” didn’t appeal to your intellect, your morality, or your libido.

      1. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:31am

        No James, again we are not a ‘layer of defence’ for Islam. Seems you have a real issue with that. Read what we say – that ALL people matter!

    6. Some of us are not as naive as you though.

  6. The Koran hasn’t been misquoted. It has 123 separate edicts to maim or kill non-believers and other undesirables. In a book of 1000 pages, that’s over 10 per cent of its content.

    Don’t vote for Muslim MPs or mayors (their heart is never in the right place unless it’s cut out and dumped in a toilet), and make an effort to rent or buy in Asian neighbourhoods, because it dilutes the ghetto mentality and raises property values again.

    Make it illegal for anyone with a thick Urdo-engendered accent to have opinions on other people’s genital conduct.

    1. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 7:22pm

      you patently don’t know a blinking thing you are talking about. I have read the Quran and do not recognise any of your garbled islamophobic opinions as reflective of its content. If anything it was not very different from the Bible as a document.

      And, matey, Urdu doesn’t have an “accent”. It is a literary language and formerly the language of the Indian army so few speak it as a first language. But don’t let that get in the way of your obvious potent racism. You are beneath contempt.

      1. I don’t like liars. And I don’t like you.

        You’ve read the Koran as much as I’ve read War and Peace.

        As in… you haven’t.

        And Urdu is the second of two national languages of Pakistan. Are you on drugs?

        1. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 9:06pm

          it was chosen as a national language though it is only spoken as a first language in a very small part of Sind (and a larger part of modern day India) but as a literray language it was known to the intelligentsia of Punjab, NWFP, Sind, Kashmir and Baluchistan. Unlike you I have lived in pakistan and know what I am talking about

          1. What ARE you talking about? Pakistanis in England don’t speak Urdo? And if you lived in Pakistan, you would know how free and easy the homosexual lifestyle is. Not. Maybe you enjoy being closeted. The thrill of being ‘dirty’ in secret, huh? Get your dress – your time’s up with me.

    2. You go girl. You are making me seem as radical as Simon Hughes ;-)

      1. XX

      2. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:33am

        Ah James – you support the EDL. Makes sense. Very sad indeed – I think that you need to look at yourself actually

      3. Jock S. Trap 1 Apr 2011, 12:26pm

        Surely not that bad!!

        ;)

  7. The author claims the “Qur’anic script was misquoted.”

    I plead ignorance on this, does anyone know what it said, and what it should have said?

    I do know one thing, Muslims are devoutly strict about the word of the Prophet, (unlike the Bible, it has never been translated), and any genuine Muslims would NEVER misquote their book.

    1. If the Qur’an has never been translated how come the quotes on the sticker were in English not Arabic?

      1. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 7:24pm

        it has been translated, several times, otherwise I wouldn’t have been able to read it

        1. … that day when you were asleep, and dreamt you could read a big old ‘holy’ book written by a paedo.

    2. The quotes are:
      “Arise and warn” [EMQ 74:2] and
      “and fear Allah: verily Allah is severe in punishment” [EMQ 59:7]. EMQ = English Maariful Quran
      Qur’an reading friends tell me that the second quote is a about Allah’s anger over people who do not give to charity as required by his teachings. It has nothing whatsoever to do with sexuaity

      1. Whether those koranic phrases have anything to do with islam is beside the point. The “no entry” embargo sign over a rainbow flag, and the words Gay, Free and Zone should mean you do not need to be hit by a clue by four.

        Of course, if the names or CCTV (or even the “race” of those arrested) was released, we’d have some clue if we were dealing with agents provateurs or just really thick muslims.

        That some clueless muslim from “Faith Matters” is on the case blaming rabbis and vicars should be a very strong indication that we are dealing with the Religion of Peace.

        1. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:35am

          No – we have never blamed Rabbis and Vicars. You are on your EDL rant again.

          What have rabbis and vicars got to do with anything? I think I have clarified the points, though looks like the problem is your EDL position.

  8. Clark Downes 21 Mar 2011, 7:06pm

    So the equality act 2010 ect are just for fun ??? – no they should be REINFORCED by police and governing bodies. But, as with Catholics, dont muslims fund alot of their religious buildings themselves ( from the BBC show on preaching hate in muslim schools, alot of it was funded by muslims from abroad ).

    Softly softly works when the issues are arrising, but it has been left and now Tower Hamlets has a repuatation for being homophobic, not gay friendly or multicultural JUST homophobic – to outsiders of London it is now seen as a no go zone.

    Make it clear that gays are EQUAL – in terms of the law and socially – open new gay clubs and pubs ect, fly the flag, and cover the place in gay friendly posters. All this ‘can we be friends?’ veiw on life isnt a reality , people may think differently and not get on but they should be shown that regardless we all have to co-incide no matter beliefs!

    1. Thank you.

      My comments on here have been tongue-in-cheek (as anyone with a brain could tell), but the evil nonsense in this book is all too real, and a genuine threat to all civilised nations across the globe. We don’t need to import this stuff… we have our own zealous, unpleasant weirdos, both atheist and religious.

      1. Amen to that, brother.

  9. Why is the Council and Police giving control of the community to faith groups? If anything it’s faith groups that are crating the problems. We need less faith groups, not more and the Council/Police can start by banning the Tower Hamlets Street Pastors
    http://tinyurl.com/6hjkpyk These Christian evangelical Street Pastors have targeted and discriminated against us gays and how don’t we know they have not also targeted and discriminated against Muslims in the community.

    What we do know is the EDL are friendly with Christian evangelical’s like Stephen Green of Christian Voice: http://tinyurl.com/65l925s

    1. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 9:08pm

      no one is giving them ‘control’. They are merely contributing to the debate and it is a welcome contribution IMHO

    2. Cleggy, What utter rubbish. As far as I know, there was one demo where Stephen Green was on as well as the EDL Pakistani Christian Division. And that demo was to save the life of Asia Bibi, a christian woman in Pakistan who is on death row for the crime of (supposedly) saying “jesus died for me, what has Mohammed done for you”.

      But thank you for demonstrating your utter lack of concern for freedom of conscience. And, yes folks, that kind of intolerance and vicious punishment is what our very own muslims want. The Pakistani Christian Association invited British muslims to go to the demo — none of them accepted the offer.

      Whilst you may be too ignorant (or evil) to have taken any notice of the plight of Asia Bibi (and others), surely you heard about the assassination of Pakistan’s Minister for Minorities over this case.

      http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/pakistan/8356278/Pakistans-only-Christian-minister-assassinated-over-blasphemy-row.html

      1. wait so you condemn some muslims for the company they keep but you will not condemn the edl?

        1. If the EDL were to form an alliance with the BNP, I would condemn them. If the EDL were to form an alliance with Christian Voice, I would condemn it.

          I’ve spoken to some of the EDL people who were on that demo for Asia Bibi, and they told me they gave Stephen Green a bollocking for his attitude towards gay people.

          They did not know who Stephen Green was, and when he volunteered his opinions on homosexuality, they put him right. That there have been gay people at many EDL demos, that there is a gay division of EDL, that the EDL has condemned all homophobia should make you realise that people like Cleggy are involved in a pathetic smear campaign.

          Damn right I condemn some muslims for the company they keep. In 2002 and 2003, 10,000 muslims attended the fascist Hizb ut Tahrir conferences.

          http://www.newstatesman.com/200601300006

          I condemn Searchlight for never drawing attention to the fascist Hizb ut Tahrir.

  10. Perhaps faith groups can participate in fighting homophobia. If they do then that is to be welcomed.

    But bitter experience tells us that faith groups are completely unfit for purpose in leading anti-homophobia campaigns.

    1. concerned resident of E3 21 Mar 2011, 9:10pm

      really, all of them? Even the Quakers who were at the forefront of the gay rights movement in the Uk from the 1950s onwards?

      1. http://hurryupharry.org/2011/03/10/another-friendly-welcome-for-hizb-ut-tahrir/

        Perhaps you need to get out of the 1950s. Dior might never go out of fashion, but trust me, politics has moved on since the cold war.

        Hizb ut Tahrir are seriously nasty – Cameron has promised to ban them, just like they are banned in many countries.

        I suggest you have a look at the kind of pan-national, militaristic company your Quakers are keeping:

        http://www.pickledpolitics.com/pictures/documents/Hizb%20ut%20Tahrir%20Constitution.html

        And believe me, it’s not as if jews havn’t been trying to stop the Quakers from hosting these fascists. I guess the Quakers need a little frisson…

        Apologies if I make two posts on this — my last one seems to have been devoured by this sites NSDAP filter.

      2. The Quakers and some other minority religions are the exception that proves the rule. Religious groups are bigotted more often than they are not, May I present catholicism; islam; church of England, evangelical christianity; orthodox judaism; hinduism; scientology; mormonism.
        Belief in a sky fairy seems to require a large quantities of hatred and bigotry.

    2. I can confirm that I have met a homophobic Quaker intact 2. And they were starting a faith based organisation with an openly homophobic Pentecostal African

      1. if you are talking about African Quakers then you should know that Quakerism in Africa, such that it exists, was introduced there by an evangelical American sect that split from orthodox Quakers more than a century ago. It is not in any way representative of Britain Yearly meeting (the UK Quakers) or Philadelphia Yearly Meeting (the orthodox US equivalent of BYM)

  11. Paulo Silva 21 Mar 2011, 10:37pm

    The pinko lefties aren’t making any noise now, idiots! This article is just offensive i feel like rioting in East London!
    The spirit of Stonewall anyone?

    1. This pinko leftie is making a teensy bit of noise.

  12. No mentoin of a call for an apology, or recognition that the East London Mosque has hosted some of the most grotesque preachers? To hell with cohesion until these self appointed community leaders RECOGNIZE AND REPENT FOR the hate they have stirred up. Actually, an apology from hate enablers cannot be taken seriously.

    Another step is for the police to make public CCTV footage of the perpetrators of the sticker campaign, caught outside the East London Mosque. We all know about it.

    Stop promoting the lie that the EDL are reponsible. The debate about that is over.

    Let’s see plain clothes policemen posing as gay couples to attract the vermin responsible and have them taken out of society. And defund Rainbow Hamlets, who represent no-one but themselves.

    1. Patrick Lilley 22 Mar 2011, 2:28am

      Adrian you are a hate preacher too! I wish we could defund you!
      Mayor Lutfur Rahman, Chair of Tower Hamlets Partnership said: “Tower Hamlets has a proud history of challenging prejudice and promoting equality. There is no place for hate in Tower Hamlets and we take a zero-tolerance approach to homophobia. Across all religions, partner organisations and community groups there is unanimity in the belief that by working together we can build a strong and cohesive community. There are many shared values that we can unite behind and all attempts by those at the fringes to sow the seeds of division and hatred will be rebuffed.

      I have personally met with the co-chairs of Rainbow Hamlets (Tower Hamlets Lesbian Gay Bisexual and Transgender Community Forum) and am committed to working with them and the wider community to promote equality.” Unlike East End Pride the front to EDL in East London!

      1. So, now we know why Patrick Lilley is supporting the paid shill from “Faith Matters”. Lilley is a paid shill for Lutfur Rahman. You are a traitor to gay rights.

        When the council-funded local newspaper reported on the homophobic stickers, not once did they mention the words “muslim”, “islamic”, or “koran”, the people who had been arrested, or which building those people came from. The entire implication of the article was that muslims had nothing to do with the stickers.

        http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=195265173824593&set=a.133777043306740.19688.132236756794102

        Let’s not forget we have both Tories and Labour pointing out that Lutfur’s army shout homophobic abuse in the council chamber, and Lutfur says nothing.

        http://www.socialistunity.com/?p=7790

      2. Well when you open your eyes and switch your brain on, you will see there is plenty of room for hate in Tower Hamlets. Muslim women councillors facing death threats and intimidation for not wearing islamic head dress; Gary Smith, the RE teacher, with face slashed for teaching muslim girls about other religions; yelloy Islam4UK stickers calling for total submission to Taliban style rule along Vallance road ; CCTV evidence of Asian youths collecting homophobic ‘gay free zone’ stickers from a man in islamic dress outside the East London Mosque;

        The Mosque has hosted and promoted hate preachers who have called for the death of gays and Jews and non muslims. And Rainbow Hamlets do not even ask for an apology, happy to make joint statements with them. Patrick – get your head out of the sand. The feeling of anger against RH collaborators with islamofasticts is massive, from people who know where the intimidation is coming from.. Get rid of that idiot organisation.

        1. musclelad23 22 Mar 2011, 7:55am

          Adrian is not a hate preacher, he has by far posted the most common sense balanced arguments on this board so far. Unlike James who posts every second of every day ridiculous rubbish like quotes from the quran to “proove” that all muslims are inherintly evil as is islam. I can find quotes in the bible promoting genocide of men women and babies, I can find quotes in the jewish talmad promoting sex with female children as young as 3 and incest. All abrahamic religions have dark twisted parts to them, one is not worse or more violent than the other.
          The bottom line is east London mosque has alot to answer for, inviting these kind of hate preachers is like a terrible poison in the minds of people who go see them, there needs to be direct action against the organisers of such events.. as suprising as this may be to some of you, I agree islamofascism is a real threat to our freedoms. Other muslims agree.

          1. musclelad23 22 Mar 2011, 8:11am

            I just want to add that I won’t be posting anymore of these muslim related threads. There seems to be a very real influx of edl supporters, most likely organized over at that facebook group of theirs. Anything reasonable I have to say is persistently drowned out by a droning of “us and them” mentality. The problem with people who use the “us and them” mentality is they effectively without realising it try to dehumanize the perceived enemy, until any remnants of empathy they have vanish and that person becomes evil encarnate. Hitler did it to the jews in ww2, and al-qaida do it to people they perceive as “kufr”.
            Please try to see the world as it really is – shades of grey not black and white.

            As for me, I have a job and life to get on with.. I wont be wasting my breath here any longer. James – I wish you all the best and I hope what you find what you are looking for. I will continue to proudly identify myself as gay and muslim, no matter what hate I receive from any side. Salam :)

          2. musclelad I congratulate you on your statement. It is exactly the kind of thing people in EDL want to see, and they want to see muslims saying these things.

            I apologise for being harsh with you. I have no interest in religion, but have spent two years reading the koran, hadiths, sira, and the history of islam. It is two years I would have preferred to use in other ways. I react badly to being called racist or ignorant.

            I have a lot of sympathy for gay people (or bisexuals) who grow up in any religious family, including muslims. I have a meeting today with a prominent christian, and I will challenge his attitudes.

            I’ve had long-term relationships with muslims, and tried to help them deal with their shame. They asked me to pretend to be straight so their friends & family would not know they were gay, so I did.

            I will not stand for people being racist – whether it is white people against black or asian people, or muslims against white.

            I wish you happiness and peace.

          3. Chokran, musclelad x

            we need a bit more ‘ijtihad’ around here.

      3. “Mayor Lutfur Rahman, Chair of Tower Hamlets Partnership said Tower Hamlets has a proud history of challenging prejudice and promoting equality.”

        No. Not equality. Just more-than-equal rights for backward, hate-filled Pakistanis.

        He needs removal from office. Hopefully on a stretcher.

        1. really? There are actually very few Pakistanis in Tower Hamlets. There are however quite a few Bengali and Sylhetti people whose ancestors came from Bangladesh.

      4. Patrick Lilley wrote

        “Mayor Lutfur Rahman, Chair of Tower Hamlets Partnership saidTower Hamlets has a proud history of challenging prejudice and promoting equality. There is no place for hate in Tower Hamlets and we take a zero-tolerance approach to homophobia”

        So how do you explain the stickers which appeared plastered to walls around the borough, claiming it to be a “Gay Free Zone”

      5. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 2:35pm

        “I have personally met with the co-chairs of Rainbow Hamlets (Tower Hamlets Lesbian Gay Bisexual and Transgender Community Forum) and am committed to working with them”

        Oh well, thats a bit like handing the lambs to the lions. Can’t you talk to a LGBT group that actually represents us not makes excuses for homophobia?

        Your creditibilty has just gone out the window.

  13. Can somebody explain what this cnut is here?

  14. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 9:01am

    I feel this response is weak at best, insulting at worst.

    These posters are just the tip of the iceberg. Homophobia in the area has been slowly increasing and this response is only because some in the area wished to show a presence against homophobia.

    It’s all very well saying Tower Hamlets can lead the way but lets not forget until one leaders question of involvement to the EDL both Tower Hamlets council and the local police supported the protest that was being organised. It was Rainbow Hamlets and Out East that opposed such action, something I think was a big error in judgement.

    We don’t need the EDL to be blamed in whatever way, this protest was by the LGBT community with family and friends for the LGBT community and the community as a whole. I agree it was wrong to have this assoicated with the EDL but then This really should have been those very groups, that oppose, that had sponsored out right to show homophobia is wrong.

    1. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 9:09am

      I’m all for Tower Hamlets council leading the way but how it that possible when we have so many homophobic groups attached to it. We have heard already about how homophobic language is used in the offices of the Major of Tower Hamlets. We have all heard about the actions of the East London Mosque.

      It may sound good to put out statements that condemn these posters but then don’t go and invite homophobic preachers that have a ‘Spot The Fag’ contest in the next breathe.

      How can Tower Hamlets lead the way when there are clearly problems so close to them in the area.

      What Tower Hamlets council does Has got to be visible for us to see or like I said before resentment will get worse. It is already building for those particular LGBT groups who Really should be helping us but chose not to.

    2. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 9:12am

      Those groups that were opposed to the march really should be on tenderhooks because I think they underestimate the high level of feelings about homophobia in the area. They should be aware that I don’t we’ll put up with being silenced for too much longer.

      If those two LGBT groups keep on trying to silence the LGBT community’s anger and their clear position of doing nothing, I would urge them to tread Very carefully. People will only ‘put up or shut up’ for so long.

    3. EDL did not want any association with East End Gay Pride; it would have been a distraction from a national demo on the same day that required much organisation.

      Raymond Berry was not a founder of EDL; he was someone the EDL leadership had never even heard of. Over a couple of months, he went to 2 or 3 demos, then dropped out because he did not think that an aggressive or confrontational approach was the way forward.

      We all have doubts about the situation we find ourselves in, so if people leave we respect their decision and carry on. Growth of EDL is huge – the gay division grows by 25% a month.

      EEGP was stabbed in the back by We-Want-The-Caliphate Imaan, and by the self-appointed “gay leaders”, colluding with the police/council in pretending muslims were not behind the most sustained campaign of gay-hatred.

      Those “leaders” were all prepared to demonise an innocent man to protect homophobic muslims. They are Kapo gays.

      1. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 2:42pm

        EEGP was stabbed in the back by the Very groups that should have organisated this protest in the first place then it would have never been in any way associated with any EDL member past, present or otherwise.

  15. The respomse by ‘Faith Matters’s is inadequate at best and offenive at worst.

    ‘Faith Matters’s is entitled to their opinion but it is absurd to expect gay people to trust the motives of a religious group, given religion’s shamelful history of bigotry and persecution.

    1. Fiyaz Mughal 28 Mar 2011, 12:41am

      Hi David,

      No-one is asking for anyone to ‘trust’ our motives. Our action was to make clear that those who hate have no role to play in communities and we should actively work to counter them. That is the ethos of our work which has been about trying to get dialogue going between communities.

      What I am seeing is a lot of distrust and that is something that no doubt has been fuelled by the actions of some within faith communities. But hate is not only the domain of faith communites and for those of us working to try and build bridges, there is much work to be done.

  16. Meanwhile the UK is bombarding yet another oil rich and predominantly muslim country, killing hundreds of people. It’s building up yet further resentment throughout the world.

    1. the people resisting asked for help this time

      1. There are millions of people resisting and asking for help throughout the whole world, but because they are not in an area considered economically important, they’re left to suffer the whims of local powers. “Humanitarian help” in many cases is only cover for economically driven military intervention.

    2. Jock S. Trap 22 Mar 2011, 4:53pm

      The UK with the coalition of Jordon, UAE, Qatar, the Arab League supported, also Canada, Spain, France, US. China and Russia abstained instead of using their usual vetos. Gaddafi forces had already slaughtered over 8,000 people. We are rightly their to stop a bloodbath.

      1. Are we there to stop a bloodbath? Really? …Please do tell us when your “tough love coalition” is going to bombard Zimbabwe, Gabon, Ivory Coast, the list goes on and on… do your maths, please do tell us why we don’t bomb all of them at the same time. The people of Zimbabwue have been suffering for many decades longer than the libyans. How do you justify it? Meanwhile, here the gov is telling us we don’t have money to support the disabled….. you need a little dose of your “tough love” medicine Jock, give it a little thought… as if you care at all…

        1. Jock S. Trap 1 Apr 2011, 12:28pm

          Tell you what Beberts, you like being told what to do, so you don’t have to think for yourself. Why don’t you pop over to Libya. Must more your scene I’m sure.

  17. “A number of groups could be responsible,”

    Well, we have an idea. An Asian man was caught red-handed with ‘No gay zone’ stickers, but the police patted him on the head and let him go. If he was an ‘EDL Black Ops’ activist do you really think he would have been let go?

    “…these include the public condemnation and ‘naming and shaming’ of any institution that invites openly anti-gay speakers”

    Agreed. It would be nice if local political parties, the government, charities, the police etc would clearly come out and do this. Did any of them turn out in solidarity to help remove the posters? No. The police even falsely denied any complaints had been made. The other bodies just congratulated themselves with the lie that communities had come together as a result of this. In fact three decent straight people helped three local gay people take stickers down. That was the real extent of non-LGBT ‘support’.

    But overall your article is right on the money, and a useful contribution. Thank you.

    1. In what way is it a useful contribution? He suggest Tower Hamlets has a no-place-for-hate charter, which they already have. Whenever muslims are caught calling for jews to be pigs or homos are to be killed, he appears covering up for them. Last time he was in the Jewish Chronicle with his soothing balm, this time its Pink News.

      He could have been really useful writing something else. And it would have been useful if it appeared on the ELM website, or the MCB wesbite, or the MPACUK website.

      If he was interested in reducing muslim homophobia, he wouldn’t be here soft-soaping the gays. He’d be out there addressing the homophobes.

      1. Yeah, he’s a bit like that odious two-faced creep, Tariq Ramadan, who would call for no more than a ‘moratorium’ on stoning, yet is lauded as a ‘moderate’ – a meaningless term if ever there was one

  18. monkey for sale 3 Jun 2011, 8:25am

    Islam is a menace and it’s high time that people, all people both straight and gay, got wise to this fact.

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