When Silverton asked his views on whether early experiences can shape sexuality, he replied“If my sexuality has been shaped by events earlier in my life then I couldn’t be more grateful
This is what anti gay people say about us. The guy is a muppet
I feel that its rather insensitive to call him a muppet in the context of his story of child abuse.
Well you are entitled to your opinion even though I think its a load of bollocks
@ James….Please read the story properly and dont make your own story out of it. He clearly said he knew he was gay when he was 7. He then went on to relate the incident in the docks and clearly said he waqs 8 when that happen. Once again James you throw abuse and vitriol where it isn’t warranted. Cashman has and i’m sure will continue to be a huge asset to the GLB community and doesn’t deserve abuse from the likes of you. What have you done for the GLB community lately, if ever other than sling you nasty abuse, that is???
Yeah Paddy I do want to apologise I did misread that Galliano quote Cashman did say he wasnt gay on the front page of the SUn when he joined eastenders I felt let down at the time so hes no hero of mine you can have him
… ah the Sun, that bastion of Truth and Learning.. Any who reads the Sun never mind believes what is printed in it, has no right to throw brickbats.
I am at a loss as to what you meant about a Galianno quote…….There was no mention of Galianno in this story or the comments attached thereto…… enlighten me please……Mystified in Seven Oaks.
Paddy Michael CAshman did an interview with the SUN in his words where he said he aint gay. And now this comment he’s either unlucky or a dumbass who should keep his mouth shut.
I don’t believe abuse shapes sexuality, I do believe however that abusers take advantage of sexuality, not in all cases but in most. I know my own experience was because I was gay.
I feel Michael Cashmans comment is unhelpful knowing how religious nutters seem convined that Gay people have all been tampered with. Not matter how old we are it’s as if Gay people have no mind of their own.
Eugh I can just imagine people saying though, that that’s why he’s gay – as he got abused as a child. Plenty of ignorant homophobes already think this and will take this as evidence; hardly Cashman’s intention in telling this I doubt, but annoying for us LBGTs. Glad he’s had someone who he loves though for 27 years! Brilliant! Lucky him eh.
Why did Silverton even ask that question?! How grossly awful
This is why so many gay men are leery about speaking of any kind of abuse because then clueless fools turn round and sayt “oh, is thyat why you’re gay then?”
Yeah, because having someone base your love life, your relationship and your long term partnership (oph but never marriage oh no) on being abused is in no way insulting, right?
Well there must be a reason right?
Offensive to say the least.
Yep and those ‘clueless fools’ usually/mostly religious nutters, the likes of Melanie Phillips don’t see how disgustingly they treat victims of child abuse. They wrongly think all Gay/Lesbians have been abused and then spend their lifes discriminating and abusing us themselves.
It was a loaded question, suggesting that corrleation implies causation which is obviously a fallacy. Stand back for a load of half baked theories to go with it!
Can’t fault his answer though, he’s saying he’s happy with who he is regardless of why he is who he is.
So let get this straight. If a straight girl of 8 is sexually molested by a straight adult male, does that make her straight? I was sexually molested at 9 by a 15 year old girl but it didn’t make me straight. I knew I was gay as young as 7.
“If my sexuality has been shaped by events earlier in my life then I couldn’t be more grateful.”
I can just hear Melanie Phillips, Stephen Green, Edward Leigh and the rest of the homophobes making hay out of that one. Doesn’t he realise he’s playing right into their hands as well as those other religious nutters in the ex-gay ministries.
I doubt it though because they will read the story properly. 7….realises he’s gay
8 abused by teenager in docks.. get the chronology right people ……are you all illiterate or what??
Your right, those people though just don’t want to see being Gay/Lesbian as natural and will go to all lengths to prove otherwise. The ironic thing is they don’t see the damage they do especially to children that are abused.
Good for him, but what about when the Daily Mail hears about this and Melanie Philips starts some big homophobic rant about us all being abused as usual?
The only people who abused me were homophobes of Melanie Philips ilk.
An excellent point Pavlos. It usually is religious people who are guilty of these crimes then spend the rest of their lifes blaming the victims.
Look, I don`t know why so many people are distressed about the different theories on homosexuality. Not that I am assuming sexual orientation could be changed or that you become gay.
My point is – even if homosexuality could be changed, what difference would that make? Why depriving people of their rights, assuming sexuality could be changed? I wouldn`t deprive people of their rights in any case. Never. Religion can be changed, yet religious people are protected, rightfully so. So why some religious people use the argument “it is a choice / disease / sin / insert the next insulting adjective”… If I were intolerant, I could campaign for burning down all the churches, “because religion is a choice”. But I don`t because I know religion is a personal matter and religious preference does not harm others (some people do use their religion to harm others).
As a straight woman, I am tolerant of homosexuality, regardless what causes it.
Because if homosexuality is seen as nothing more than a personal choice, it will be regarded as no more deserving of recognition than people who choose to do any number of peculiar things. That then undermines the campaign for equality, because if people think that we are purposefully choosing to be different to everyone else, then they will question why the law should look out for people who randomly decide to go against the grain.
The point is, the religious already have all their rights but this illogical theorising will damage our fight to get (and hold onto) them. It’s like if I decided I wanted to live without wearing clothes, no one would listen to my pleas of discrimination when I got thrown out of restaurants or into jail for indecency, because it’s an arbitrary choice that other people find distasteful and I pretty much had it coming.
I can see your point. But jumping around naked at the public places it`s not the same as two men / women holding hands. How can the public be hurt by same-sex couple holding hands, marrying? It`s a personal matter of each individual couple. It does not hurt me. Who gives me the right to judge personal lives of others? I know religious people chose to be religious or better, were raised that way, but why are they using different standards, in order to harm others? In my opinion, Bible is a hatred spewing book. Nothing short of it. People choose or are encouraged to read it. I could say, ban that book, and gather followers around me. And then I could lobby to achieve a Bible-ban. I won`t. Because religious people have their rights. And their personal lives. I just wish they would recognize rights of other people.
Darling you tolerate a fart in a lift or a cold sore I’m not here to be tolerated accept me or fcuk off
I meant the same. It was a wrong word then.
James, what on earth do you gain by being so aggressive?
Ignore him Oscar, there’s something wrong with him. He reacts to just about everyone that way. A kind of autopilot of aggression, I don’t think he even reads the other comments just reacts.
Oscar. I agree James comment is rather aggressive, but I do think that he has a point.
How big of her to tolerated us damn cheek
Oscar and Stephen seeing Justin Bieber get 400+ comments while issues that matter get hardly any pissed me off. I’ll clam down eventually but I’m happy if you ignore me
He does, it’s just that all of his postings seem unnecessarily aggressive and I think in this case Liza simply misworded what she intended to convey; there’s no need to swear at her for it.
James, you do definitely have a point with the 400+ comments on the Justin Bieber story. I mean I know he’s famous but that was ridiculous.
“As a straight woman, I am tolerant of homosexuality, regardless what causes it.”
Lisa. What do you think caused your heterosexuality?
Lisa. As a Gay man I am intolerant of your patronising comments, regardless of what it is about your heterosexuality which leads you to behaviour in this way.
“as a straight woman , i am tolerant of homosexuality, regardless what causesit” how big of you to tolerate and endure us.. Let me educate you out of your ignorance, homosexuality is inate as race there is no cause just because one mep had an abusive childhood , it is not a reflection on an entire community. I find your choice of language pertaining to gay people offensive, so you tolerate us , you put up with us until the day will come when you can drop the facade. you either accept us or not? which is it?
It’s ironic that much abuse and rape carried out in certain countries to men and women are usually by religious people trying to ‘cure’ of being Gay or Lesbian.
Actually, Liza, islamic leaders in the UK believe its chosen along with many in the other religious cults. Who in their right mind would choose to be gay knowing how much discrimination, harassment, gay bashing, inequality and stigma that exists out there? Unlike religious beliefs, ours isn’t learned behaviour, determined in the womb. It chooses us rather than us choosing it, a sort of natural selection.
I know. Religious right-wingers believe it is a choice / sin / disease. But why they hate and harm people, even if it isn`t inborn. (Again, I believe it is inborn). It makes no difference to me whether it is inborn, caused by eating chocolate (I am making that up :) ) or by whatever.
All I can see is two people, loving each other, not harming others. That is all that matters.
So, objections to the legal rights, based on the possible theories about homosexuality, are ill-minded. Perverted.
> Well you are entitled to your opinion even though I think its a load of bollocks
I do not know if homosexuality is as a result of genetics or if it is from societal factors. Philosophies on both the religious right and the deconstructionist left maintain that it is, if not chosen, shaped by societal factors. Either way, it is difficult for any of us to know for sure because we are unaware of what influences us either when unborn or in the first two years after birth.
Regardless as to whether it is organic or societal, many gay males suggest that their sexuality is unchosen and formed by factors beyond their control. That is not, however, maintained by all men who may consider themselves to be bisexual and is even less common amongst bisexual or gay women.
Since when do philosophers actually know anything.They debate religious fantasy ffs. General concensus amongst scientists who have studied the matter in great detail and at great length is that it is genetic, or at the very least due to conditions in the womb in the last 10 weeks of gestation. The pixie in the sky crowd would of course prefer that the “choice” lie were to be proven, as that would fit in with that written by illiterate fearful tribesmen in the deserts of Palestine and Egypt 4 or 5 thousand years ago and propagated by illiterate bigots to this day.. Homosexuality is endemic across the animal world and as such cannot be attributed to nurture. A gay swan can hardly claim to have been sexually abused in the formative years of it’s life nor can gay dolphins, bovines, equines, simians and numerous others of the lower animal species , who have been widely observed to be gay or prefer gay male/ female sexual activity to hetrosexual activity………
…..but , while i include females above , i’m sorry to say dear sisters, that lesbian activity is rarely observed amongst the lower animals with the exception of the lower apes, such as simians ie chimps and bonobosamongst whom homosexuality is common.
…..bonobos amongst ..**
Kate Silverton interview with Michael Cashman – http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b00z64sq/Kate_Silverton_Michael_Cashman_joins_Kate/?t=35m53s
READ THE STORY PROPERLY….. HE SAID HE REALISED HE WAS GAY WHEN HE WAS 7
THE INCIDENT IN THE DOCKS WITH THE TEENAGER HAPPENED WHEN HE WAS 8.
STOP TWISTING THE STORY TO FIT THE CHIPS ON YOUR BLOODY SHOULDERS.
de Villiers, in my situation, I was raised with two brothers and one sister. I was the last to be born. Each of my siblings were raised the same way, there was no favouritism or dominance by either parent. I’m convinced its about genetics. I don’t really buy the environmental/societal theory one iota.
Since British neuroscientist Simon LeVay reported a difference in the brain structure between gay and straight men in 1991, an entire scientific discipline has sprung up around the quest for a biological explanation of sexual orientation. Dr. LeVay, author of “Gay, Straight, and the Reason Why,” explains where the science stands today. Although many details remain unresolved, he says, the general conclusion is quite clear: A person’s sexual orientation arises in large part from biological processes that are already under way before birth which leaves one to deduce that sexual orientation is determined in the womb, at least the science seems to be pointing in that direction.
I am appalled by the Question and appalled by the answer. Is Michael Cashman trying to feed homophobia?
I’m a lesbian who was abused at a similar age by older boys/young men, presumably that’s why I am heterosexual.
This is a complete lack of judgement by a very good and brave man. Michael, Michael what on earth were you thinking of? The Journalist is a disgrace to ask it in this way.
@ Tasha …did you really read the article. I doubt it Go back and read it again slowly and completely. I know it’s badly written but this is Pink News…..
Dear Pink News Readers
We are a young gay couple and after seeing the surge of gay related suicides last year and i ourselves having have entertained such thoughts preciously due to religious hatred and indocrination,we decided to invest in our skills to create a high quality video to inspire positivechange amongst LGBT youth and hopefully help in creating more positive self reflection.I would sincerely like to apologize for the spam.send suggestion to firstname.lastname@example.org.We are who we are.
A couple of misconstrued comments on the nature of someone’s homosexuality, and yet again the masses descend to justify their existence as gay men.
Please stop. It’s degrading.
We shouldn’t have to list the factors of our evolution. The right to exist is not the sole preserve of heterosexuals. Gay people are a FACT. It’s not up for debate, or changeable according to whoever can shout the loudest in a crowded room. We won’t pop out of existence or be turned off like a light bulb to appease whichever latent homophobe has the most acceptable “theory” this month. Time and again I read these comment boards and find otherwise rational, intelligent people clamouring to unravel their gay DNA to make a point. It’s fine to have an opinion, but let’s just accept our humanity and leave the flustered noisemaking to the real bigots, eh?
agreed Paolo…..and what annoys me is that no one actually read the story as posted by Pink News. He did say he was gay before he was abused by the teenager. He said he realised he was gay age 7. Later on he ralated the story of being abused by the teenager in the docks and that he was 8, but absolutely everyone chose to ignore that because it left them nothing to whine about. I really do despair of the mantality of a lot of the posters on this site. Are there any gay news sites where there are level headed non whineing nellies posting, ’cause i’m absolutely fed up with the crowd of chip on the shoulder creeps on here. The reaction to the Fosters ad was the last straw.
I think that 7 years old is an incredibly young age to have any sexuality.
I can not remember a single thing from that age; let alone something as complicated as sexuality.
I was aware of my sexuality from as early as I can remember and that is what my abuser focused on.
The bigots won’t read 7 or 8 years….. worse this story reinforces the myth of gay=paedophile. The man’s obviously so used to talking to sane people that he’s out of touch with bigotry.
As a child I was locked in the cellar and occasionally beaten with a belt.
Such things were par for the course for the time. We were brought up by a generation of parents who had survived the depression, and many, had seen loved ones killed, maimed, injured or just missing in the war.
They were a tough bunch they had to be.
Were we/I abused – well I don’t think so. I think we were less abused than by the physcological head games present day parents seem to inflict on their children.
Our world was black and white, either correct or wrong.
IMHO the fuzzy logic used by some of todays parents may be more damaging in the long run.
Either way no parent gets it 100 right and most are a long way off that.
I think Mr Cashman is simply seeking publicity; nothing more or less.
…….making excuses for abusive parents, because they’ve been through this or that is a cowardly cop out. I was horrendously physically abused by my mother as were my 3 siblings and am still living with the pain to this day. I believe she beat me because she knew i was gay from a very early age, I actually overheard her discuss with a neighbour whether or not i was going to be a “nancy boy” when i grew up….i was only 9 at the time. it is one thing to be as you said “a tough bunch” but to carry that through to abusing ones own flesh and blood is inexcuseable and to excuse that behavior leaves it open to being repeated by ourselves if we are lucky enough to have children. I have been through years of therapy in an attempt to rid myself of the pain of knowing that my own mother hated me so much that she would beat me to within an inch of my life aand will go to my grave hating for that and she has been dead for eight years.
Perahps I phrased it badly. What I mean is that they were of their time and what happened to me would having been practiced widely.
I cert ainly do not hate my parents for it, never have.
My parents died when I/we were young so much of what has formed me as a person has been beyond their control.
It may seem strange to say but losing ones parents at an early age does in later life sadly, have some advantages.
The sudden death in my 40s of a partner I had adored for 25 years left a far larger impact on me than any action by my parents.
I can see the religious extremists/fanatics having a field day with his admission. And why now ? has he got a book coming out like jordan had similar abuse revelation just before hers. same pr team perhaps? Either way ,can see this abuse story will be used to support theories on why people are gay.
come on, who really takes notice of religious extremists / fanatics? they’re regarded as a bit of a laughing stock and are by definition a very small group who are not representative of broader public opinion. I doubt very much that more than a few ppl will have even heard or read this interview. Cashman is hardly a household name with major political clout.. Best to ignore and move on.
THIS IS WHERE HIS HOMOSEXUALITY COMES FROM!!! GET IT, AFTER ALL! There is always something wrong in the past of the homosexual person. Honesty will always reveal it.
Yeah, because that makes so much sense. Be a little boy abused by a man and like men for the rest of your life…..er….that would make you more likely to like women, wouldn’t it? But don’t let logic get in your way – or countless studies that show sexual abuse has nothing to do with one’s sexual orientation. Carry on with your sad little life by making otehrs out to be bad/evil/inferior so that youi don’t have to face up to what you hate in yourself.
@ honest……Honesy is missing from your comment, or else you didnnt read the story. Cashman clearly said he was gay before being abused by the teenager. He actually said early on that he realised he was gay at age seven. In the story about being abused in the docks he also clearly said this happened when he was eight or nine.. So by your twisted homophobic logic he had a premonition before seven about what would happen to him when he was eight or nine and so became gay because of this premonition.
WHAT HAPPENED YOU WHEN YOU WERE SEVEN THAT MADE YOU A TWISTED HOMOPHOBIC BIGOT I WONDER..???
“There is always something wrong in the past of the homosexual person.
So what you appear to be saying is that Heterosexuals have perfect childhoods, how odd. So what went wrong in your childhood that turned you into a homophobic bigot.
Ding Dong, next stop loonie city centre!
Even if you were right, which your not, do you think that treating people of abuse gives you the right to discriminate. Particularly when the abuser usually tend to be someone religious?
What a message. Do you really need to see why you are hated? Look in a mirror. Gay people are abused Because of it, because they see the vunerable as easy targets. Abuse is not the cause of it, only a brainless moron would think such a think.
Sexual abuse as a child can have short term and long term psychological effects but changing a person sexual orientation is not one of them.
The reality is that there is wide scale sexual abuse of children in all societies – both male and female. Children’s whose orientation will develop to be gay are just as likely to be abused as children whose identity will develop to be heterosexual. Statistically because there is just less gay people in society there is likely to be less attention discussed about what it is to have been gay and also to have been sexually abused.
For some gay males who were sexually abused as a child by a male adult this can add a complication to the coming out process as some wrongly attribute that the sexual abuse made them gay. They can internalise anger and resentment particularly if they are having a hard time accepting their sexual orientation. Others don’t have such a degree of problem – every one is different.
“Sexual abuse as a child can have short term and long term psychological effects but changing a person sexual orientation is not one of them”
Absolutely right, Doug! It may sometimes cause problems related to physical relationships but it does NOT change the gender that you want those physical relationships to be with.
Beautifully put, Doug. Especially the last paragraph.
(and if anyone wants help with this kind of thing, I’d recommend the book “victims no longer” by Mike Lew)
Many straight males sexually abused as boys grow up believing they were sexually abused by gay men. This type of belief is widely supported in society. For example the Catholic church continues to link and blame sexual abuse of male children onto the gay community. The reality is that a person with paedophilia is not sexually attracted to adult males or adult females. They are more often than not found more in the heterosexual communities (or the priesthood) as that is where most of the children are.
In my view it is time the gay community stood up to those organisations who blame us for the abuse of children.
….A study undertaken several years ago by the British Government, found that over 80% of paedophilia was carried out by hetrosexual men and women. It found that the vast majority of paedophilic abuse was carried out by parents, siblings or close relatives of the abused and by people trusted by the abused such as priests, nuns, teachers, sports coaches and others who were in positions of trust.
actually when i was studying sociology , all the evidence i encountered concerning criminology and sexual assault/crime, was 95% of paedophiles were straight men.
@ rapture…even better……
I guess that explains how he came to be an MEP then…
Surely it shouldn’t make any difference how your sexuality came to be? What has been proved is that some people are gay and others aren’t. Regardless of how and when those feelings originated no one can deny that someone truly is gay. Neurological science has proved that people can be gay, straight or bisexual.
The only thing that really matters is that people feel comfortable with their own sexuality and feel happy with who they are.
Well said, Ed!
…..What i wonder makes one a hetro or a breeder. If one were to follow through with the false hypothesis that one becomes gay because of some trauma in young years then surely this must be the case for hetros/breeders too…, what caused them to make the “choice” to be hetro??….just a thought.
A good thought. This is what makes these religion abuse arguements invaild. They just don’t think about the consequences of their comments and actions. So long as they’re own discriminating beliefs are securely in place they choose not to see the damage they do and the ridiculous comments they make.
Honest…..your devolved brain proves that something bad happened in your past to make you the bigot and the idiot that you are today. What is it exactly that you are afraid of? Admitting that you too are gay or just a boring self-loather? Explain why you are trolling gay sites. Come out, come out, whoever you are.
*sigh* Experience does not shame “sexual orientation”. It is innate. Scientists have clearly demonstrated this in research done within the last 10 years. Abuse does not cause homosexuality.
Paedophilia is a separate, but also biology related phenomenon. I am sorry to hear that he was abused and hope that he one day meets his abuser so that he can beat him.
*shape (not shame)
There is one way in which being molested as a child affects you as you grow up. Then or later you read (or hear about in snatches of conversation overheard) about child molesters in the woods (or wherever, you know your home area). You realise that the dirty old men in macs are possibly you grown older. What you don’t realise is that being a child molester is quite quite different from being gay and attracted to people of your own age. But having the thought in your head could put you off sex, and off coming out as gay, and that could be a great shame.
I suspect more people are molested by adults than ever let on. And most – if it does not go far – get over it. But the memory lingers.
Oh dear love.