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David Cameron says World Cup could make Qatar more gay-friendly

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  1. Helen Wilson 23 Feb 2011, 3:22pm

    “We can’t go on like this. I’ll cut the deficit, not the NHS” – David Cameron’s election promise and poster campaign.

    A freedom of information request has revealed in fact David Cameron is cutting 50,000 jobs from the NHS (including doctors and nurses) to save 20 billion pounds.

    If David Cameron can so fundamentally deceive the electorate about the NHS, I’m sure he would also deceive us about how safe it would be for gay people to travel to Qatar.

    Get back to flogging guns and bombs to despot Middle Eastern dictators ‘Dave’, I’m sure they will appreciate the lies and will see a fellow despot.

  2. OH SHUT UP CAMERON YOU NAIVE PUBLIC SCHOOL TWAT!

  3. “no place for homophobia in football”

    No place for homosexuals in Qatar. So how does that work then?

    You can’t be gay at passport control but you can be when you get to the match?

  4. Wishful thinking, Dave. As long as Islam reigns in Quatar, no amount of football is going to affect change in attitudes. We don’t even have the problem sorted out in our own country when it comes to homophobia in sports. Better concentrate on matters at home first starting with enacting civil marriage equality for gays.

  5. Oh dear what is this sorry pastiche of a man on about now!

  6. Shameron talks out of his hoop.

  7. Dan Littauer 23 Feb 2011, 5:21pm

    Interestingly, at the same, the Qatari Prime Minister, Hamad bin Jassim bin Jabr al Thani, said that he was glad the question had been directed at his British counterpart as that was “less embarrassing to me”.

    Article 201 of the 1971 Qatari Penal Code punishes sodomy between consenting adults (irrespective of sex) with up to five years imprisonment and lashes. The Qatari Constitution of 2003 establishes Islam as the official religion. Shari’a law shall be the main source of all legislation which potentially has even further complications for LGBT people in Qatar.

    In addition, Qatar does not allow individuals with HIV/AIDS to enter the country. Medical exams are required for all long-term visitors and residents. Individuals who have HIV/AIDS may be subject to deportation!

    See: http://bit.ly/GME0230

  8. Any country which still criminalises homosexuality should not play a part in things like the world cup. And football is a breeding ground for homophobia, so I don’t know what that’s all about. Just the other month Max Clifford was unapologetic for advising gay players to not come out, as it would effect their careers – and this in the UK! I don’t see football driving any social change towards homophobia any time soon.

  9. FIFA could resolve it all, but it won’t. Unless it gets involved, Cameron’s posturing in Quatar won’t have any impact. Homophobia will NEVER be stamped out as long as the managers of the clubs are not pro-active in this effort. That’s not happened and unlikely to.

  10. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 7:38pm

    > If David Cameron can so fundamentally deceive the electorate about the NHS, I’m sure he would also deceive us about how safe it would be for gay people to travel to Qatar. Get back to flogging guns and bombs to despot Middle Eastern dictators ‘Dave’, I’m sure they will appreciate the lies and will see a fellow despot.

    I note nowhere where Cameron has said it is safe for gay people to travel to Qatar.

    The NHS point is completely irrelevant here and purely political and not gay at all. What you have done in your post is to suggest that anyone who agrees in reforming the disgusting and mediaeval NHS with its mixed wards and disregard of the elderly to a system more like the continent is a vicious dictator.

    The guns and bombs to which you refer were sold by the government under Tony Blair who, in addition to the high number of export guarantees issued for arms sellers, released the Libyan bomber who murdered an entire aeroplane of people in exchange for oil and entered into an illegal war in Iraq.

    Then to suggest that David Cameron is a “fellow despot” borders on the embarrassing. Middle Eastern dictators hang gays, stone women for adultery, allow the practice of female circumcision, prohibit freedom of the press, torture citizens and make opponents disappear. None of that can apply to David Cameron.

  11. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 7:39pm

    One might add that the Prime Minister has spoken openly at how discrimination against gay people is unacceptable and the people here have responded with criticism.

  12. @ de villiers – “One might add that the Prime Minister has spoken openly at how discrimination against gay people is unacceptable and the people here have responded with criticism.”

    ……….because everyone here knows he is talking a load of shlte. that he doesn’t mean what he says. that the tory government have made it hell for LGBT over the last 50 yrs. that he’s trying to make qatar being chosen as the world cup hosts as acceptable – when it is not. that……. oh why go on to a right wing noob who would probably vote for le pen if he didn’t lived in his home country.

  13. To be fair, he might have a point. Football has an incredibly western atmosphere to it. It will, if nothing else, provoke some liberal discussion. You never know. A year ago, I would never have believed that Egypt, Tunisia and Libya could have had revolutions in the spate of a few weeks.

  14. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 8:15pm

    > .because everyone here knows he is talking a load of shlte. that he doesn’t mean what he says. that the tory government have made it hell for LGBT over the last 50 yrs.

    I don’t think anyone disagrees that the history of the Conservative Party has been hostile to gay people. Today, however, David Cameron has on a number of occasions publicly denounced discrimination against gay people.

    I cannot see the sense in criticising a government minister or Prime Minister when they denounce discrimination against gay people. Short of David Cameron coming out himself, it is difficult to see what more you want.

  15. De villiers –
    The NHS point made by helen is relevant as it shows a pattern of behaviour emerging in which Cameron’s actions in no way match up to his rhetoric.

    Its all well and good “call me dave” giving a speech bemoaning discrimination, however without action this is just hollow rhetoric.

    Lets have a look at Cameron’s actions: Creation of Free schools and more faith schools – In which homophobic bullying and homophobia in general are endemic. We also have no way of challenging this as these schools are free from national curriculum control. Also such moves are basically back door government subsidies of religion and indeed oftentimes subsidies of extreme religion. So when we see the resurgence of evangelism we can be sure to thank “call me dave” (also tony blair).

  16. What more we want De villiers – ok Ill give you a list.
    - Inclusion of lgbt people and issues in the curriculum.
    - Zero tolerance of homophobic bullying.
    - Full marriage equality.
    Deletion of homophobic sex crime convictions.
    - National campaign based around sexual health.
    - No public money to be given to groups which claim gay people are innately bad or evil people.

    That is what he could do. If he did that I would vote tory! however he wont. Because he is a devious little sh*t.

  17. Helen Wilson 23 Feb 2011, 8:49pm

    @ de Villiers

    Cameron’s NHS lie, is just as big as the Tony Blair justification for war lie. It brings his reputation into question.

    From this point onwards till the day he dies his believability will will be questioned because of it.

    The man is a proven fibber, the public need to be reminded of that deception. How can we believe anything the man says after this?

    And the world will be reminded of the Cameron lies via the mass demo’s in London on Cameron’s big day on 29th April. Some may call it Cameron’s Egypt moment!

    It will be hard for Cameron to convince the world all is fine while thousands occupy parliament and Whitehall!

  18. @ de villiers – “Short of David Cameron coming out himself, it is difficult to see what more you want.”

    erm, ‘more’? what exactly has he done?

    but just so you know what ‘more’ I want, it’s quite simple – equality – instead of empty words.

  19. and btw, the person who really thought up that line was his new press secretary – not david cameron.

  20. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 9:27pm

    It does not bother me who crafts Cameron’s lines if he is happy for overtly liberal statements to be attributed to him. I have never seen a Prime Minister on either the left or the right make such supportive comments, publicly and openly.

    As for equality, I am not sure what type people want other than to say that we have equality pursuant to the Equality Act 2010. The present government has announced that it is considering opening up marriage to gay couples. Not a single gay-rights measure has been rolled back. Elsewhere on this board, a Conservative MEP has said no money should go to Uganda on account of their dreadful treatment of their gay citizens. We all want more but it is worth remembering la trahison n’est qu’une question de date.

    Insofar as you ask what more has Cameron done, I think it is not realised just how liberal the Right is in England. Not one Prime Minister in France, Italy or Germany (I have lived in all three) has ever made such open statements about how wrong it is to discriminate against gay people – on the left or the right. Compared to most of (Catholic) Europe, England is a haven of liberal openness.

    The stuff about the NHS is just political. It’s not a gay issue at all. I find the NHS shocking. Really shocking. Frankly, it’s disgusting. An appointment with a doctor lasts no more than five minutes. Hospitals are dirty. Appointments are at inconvenient times. The present government has not cut any money to the NHS – it is ring-fenced. In any event, it badly needs to be transformed radically. Not a single European country uses the same system as here. And when I look at the health system here, I know why. Of all the things I have kept from France, I retain my French health insurance.

  21. It would be nice if homosexuality were decriminalised before the event.

  22. Dan Littauer 23 Feb 2011, 11:01pm

    I agree with de Villiers. Westerwelle was last week in Iran, he is the German FM and is gay, openly marrying his husband in Germany but leaving him in the closet and any comments when he travels to the middle east. Not one word was uttered by him during his visit to Iran while just last month 3 men, at least, were executed for “sodomy”. All the more then for David Cameron, who said what he said in Qatar. I think he could have even said it differently but he put it in the spotlight and now the pressure is on Qatar. That is good, it can be an engine to demand change. Surely he the timing is right with reforms being called for throughout the arab world.

    Of course the world is not all black and white, so, while I commend Cameron’s remark it does not mean that I agree with the other policies he champions – which indeed to me are repulsive.

    Namely, the dismantling of the welfare state and throwing the responsibility to the population to fend for themsleves under the guide of “big society.”

    That however does not prevent me from appreciating what he did today, which no other head of state did during a visit to the Arab world before, always anxious to please to get better oil and trade deals and the hell with Human Rights let alone even mentioning the word homophobia.

    Dan

  23. Im sorry but I don’t see how conservative led attempts to provide subsidies to right wing religious groups should be ignored due to the fact Cameron has said some nice words. All the Evidence shows that it is these right wing religious groups that lead the fight against equal treatment for LGBT people.

    Without stupid and unnecessary public service reforms whereby religious wingnuts can receive government funding, there was a real possibility that religion would continue to decrease in importance until it was basically meaningless.

    Also while the NHS is not a gay only institution it is still something that many of us feel appropriate to discuss on a news site. Surprisingly as a gay man it is not only “gay issues” that I deem newsworthy.

    Also from purely a public policy point of view – hospital are increasingly dirty due to past conservative privatization policies whereby quality was sacrificed by an ideological desire to funnel public money into corporate hands. So it is ridiculous de villiers to highlight hospital cleanliness as a reason for increased privatization.

  24. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 11:37pm

    > oh why go on to a right wing noob who would probably vote for le pen if he didn’t lived in his home country.

    I have just understood what this sentence means, it not having been apparent to me.

    How dare you suggest that I would ever vote for the Front National or l’extrême droit. How dare you. You are a despicable person.

  25. Typical nonsense from a man from a man who knows nothing about football or gay rights.

    This doesn’t even make sense:

    “Football can be a great engine for social change and a change of attitudes – we saw in our own country how football drove racism out of the stands.”

    Er, that’s because football was behind the times and had to catch up with the rest of society. Same as it’s still behind the times in its attitude to gays (not ONE gay professional footballer? Yeah right).

    Cameron should be ashamed of himself hawking British arms around the middle east at a time like this and talking crap about gay rights at the same time.

  26. de Villiers 23 Feb 2011, 11:51pm

    Scott, this really was an article on David Cameron condemning homophobia whilst in an Arab state. I cannot see why there is any reason to criticise the Prime Minister speaking out against homophobia.

    The other issues are all off the point. I do not disagree with you on religious schooling. I am against religious schools – either new system or old system. It does appear, however, that the new system was brought in originally by the left under Blair.

    I also do not know the history of the NHS. All I do know is that it has been appalling for the whole time that I have lived here – which has been whilst the left has been in power. It is worse than any other European system that I have seen. It is so bad that I now go back to France for examinations and treatment.

    To use these two issues – education and health to attack the Prime Minister’s criticisme of homophobia makes no sense to me. You can disagree with all of his economic policies and still think it good that he criticises homophobia and discrimination.

  27. jamestoronto 24 Feb 2011, 12:44am

    At the rate things are going in the Middle East who even knows if Qatar will be around by 2022.

    FIFA start rethinking NOW!!

    It was a nuts idea to start off with and now is insane. Get the World Cup out that region!!

  28. He’s basically right , if we’re stuck with the world cup being in Qatar, the gay rights in Qatar will be under the spotlight not only there but the rest of the neighbouring countries..the decision to have it there wasn’t based on this at all or on foreing gay people protection when they go to the cup but since it’s going to be there , there’s a good opportunity for people to bring this to the open…let’s face it, no world cup in Qatar then no-one would give a bugger about gay rights there…it wasn’t Carmeron then said give the world cup to Qatar, he’d probably prefer it to have been in the UK!!

  29. I do wish the Extreme Left would stop using Pink News to spout their fundamentalist bile – trotting out the same tired old socialist worker rhetoric you no doubt chanted like sheep on student demos 30 years ago.

    British politics and society have moved on hugely since, and your tin-pot loony left class-war philosophies just sound hopelessly irelevent and quite comical to the Now Generation. It is 2011 not 1981 – Move with the Times!

    Cameron and Clegg speak for our generation and where we as a society are now – thats why so many people voted for them 9 months ago. Their commitment to gay equality is obvious to all but the deluded. Only last week the government announced moves towards full gay marriage and religious gay marriage ceremonies for any faith group that wants them.

    Of course every government should be open to scrutiny and criticism but it should be balanced, informed and constructive, not rabid rants or cheap schoolkid insults. Now grow up!

    1. Do you really think it’s the extreme left or just people who disagree with the opinions you represent ? Do you think people who’ve read your post will conclude you’re an activist for a particular political party ? Do you think you’re promoting or hinder that party as a result of your post ? Do you think that it would be better to contribute to the debate, or tell other people that their comments are immature and rabid ?

      1. de Villiers 24 Feb 2011, 12:45pm

        Harry, I might say the same myself on the other side, given that some despicable individual suggested that for my comments, I was likely to be a supporter of the Front National.

        1. Agreed. I wasn’t making a political point of any shade, but rather objecting to Thomas’ language.

  30. @Thomas – another ad hominem attack from the right is sadly predictable

    Cameron can claim anything he wants but that doesn’t mean that it’s true or that it’ll happen, besides what’s going to happen after the football has gone? Will cameron still be bothered or will it be another example of stuff getting swept under the carpet?

  31. Maybe he could clean up the Tory Party first, before he starts ‘lecturing’ a foreign country!!!! ????

  32. Jock S. Trap 25 Feb 2011, 8:36am

    Coming from a Tory PM I welcome this. He didn’t have to, he could of dismissed the question but instead he used an Arab homophobic country to make his point.

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