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Obama ‘still wrestling’ with gay marriage question

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  1. So it’s okay to fight and potentially die for your country but heaven forbid you should expect the same rights as straight married couples? it stinks of hypocrisy. What is there to wrestle with? He’s worried about losing voters so it’s a purely selfish issue rather than thinking about what is right!! Not impressed!

  2. He’s still a step up from every other President in US History. He’s not a miracle worker, and he can’t just say ‘Screw you, you hateful bastards’ to all the people who oppose gay marriage without suffering serious consequences.

    Someone should probably inform him that the Military of Ancient Rome was the finest Military the world has ever known though…

  3. ANY SENSIBLE PERSON would wrestle with the nonsense of calling homosexual partnership (where two confused people agreed to “unite” legally) a marriage. Obama is just realising that he has already gone too far in following the liberal folly and that history will not honour him for that.

  4. Tim Hopkins 23 Dec 2010, 12:04pm

    Hmm I think it’s clear already which way history is headed on this. As Martin Luther King said, “The arc of history is long but it bends towwards justice”.

    Equal marriage is justice. It is coming, and people will look back on opposition to it with incredulity.

  5. Rather tired trolling, and a poor choice of username, ‘cleva’.

  6. Unfortunately the UK government is now using our civil partnership legislation as a kind of DOMA (Defense of Marriage Act)

  7. The tide of marriage equality is unstoppable and it will happen. Does Obama want to go down in history as someone who addressed a terrible wrong that people will look back on with horror, or does he want to be the ditherer who didn’t manage to seize the moment?

  8. Another comment- I also feel that his race is relevant. He should have an insight into the unfair discrimination of people whose marriages are given no recognition or are prevented. He should be the first to understand the lesson to be learnt from the history of America’s past racist marriage bans.

  9. “(where two confused people agreed to “unite” legally) ” – Cleva

    I think you are the one who is confused.

    What’s wrong.

    Can’t your small brain deal with new concepts.

    Unable to cope with things that are different from you.

    Get back under the stone you crawled from, you backward idiot.

  10. @cleva – two people wanting to marry aren’t confused! are you confused by your sexual orientation? is that why you are here?

  11. Article, Joan Smith: Even the ancient Romans had different forms of marriage

    In retrospect, Blair’s eagerness to reduce (but not eradicate) discrimination against gay people created a situation that is unfair and unsatisfactory all round

    Full article here:
    http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/commentators/joan-smith/joan-smith-even-the-ancient-romans-had-different-forms-of-marriage-2166364.html

  12. Yes, it’s indefensible that same sex couples still don’t have the right to honour their love and commitment the same way a straight couple could. Having Obama in office and the Democrats strong is our best hope of righting that in the US. No other party is going to do as much as they have done.

    However, we have to recognise that if this is to happen, it needs to happen in a way which will not leave the Democrats unelectable for decades and I think that this is one of the key things Obama is wrestling with.

    Knowing US politics, we will see a swing back to the right for the next presidency, but if Obama does this the wrong way, that swing back could be a lot more damaging to LGBT people in the US for a lot longer period.

    I’d rather have a cautious Obama do things the right way than end up with him antagonising the right to an extent that will leave the US in a worse state than even Bush left it.

  13. amazing. back in 1996 he was FOR gay marriage.

  14. Maria, Cleva is probably a right wing religious bigot shill. The ones who protest too much are the most suspect with nothing else better to do than troll a gay website. It must be awfully dark in his or her closet.

  15. “What I know is that at minimum, a baseline is that there has to be a strong, robust civil union available to all gay and lesbian couples.”

    That to me is an inadvertent admission that civil unions are not equal when he says…”at minimum”. I don’t think he realises what he said.

    Dave, you’re absolutely right, CPs are our own form of DOMA. The fact that we are barred from marrying is proof they are not equal. Its nothing more than legal segregation under a different name. We’re viewed differently, treated differently as also our relationships are. How can any reasonably intelligent person not understand that? Ten countries with civil marriage equality and only two with CP’s one of which has slightly fewer rights than the British version, and some of us delude ourselves that we’re equal to heterosexuals? NOT! CPs will NEVER be the universal standard for legal gay unions, never, which translates into non-portability outside the country.

  16. in other words…not a chance! if he had balls he would at least put the bill on his upcoming election manifesto (case he decides to run for office)…but I doubt it.
    These would follow in the footstepes of Zapatero & Socrates (Spain’s and Portugal’s PMs respectively ).

  17. Interesting points, Emily. I see where you’re coming from there. What concerns me is that reading Obama’s comments, I don’t always get the feeling that his caution is just strategic.

    “wrestle” is a strange word to use and, to me, suggests he has PERSONAL issues with equal marriage. That’s what I find disappointing.

  18. An Cat Dubh 23 Dec 2010, 2:47pm

    The UCC (the church Obama is a member of) supports same-sex marriage. If Obama objects same-sex marriage, he is a SINNER AND WILL BE SENT TO HELL.

  19. I’m sure some memebers of the KKK ‘wrestle’ with interracial marriages.

    Sorry about my thoughts above, I’ve changed my mind. Any sensible person wouldn’t wrestle with equality. OBAMA IS A BIGOT.

  20. gay friendly 23 Dec 2010, 5:12pm

    how wonderful that DADT has been overuled but its a shame gay marriage is still a funny one, but it will come. Why can’t people just have a sense of pride? http://davidhatton1987.blogspot.com/2010/08/pride-festival-2010.html

  21. Obama’s an idiot.

  22. Really, he’s still wresting over the difference between partial equality and actual equality for gay men and lesbian women?

    It’s true that in 1996 he was for gay marriage equality as Xaria says

    Yes Robert, the most strong & robust form of civil union amounts to only the minimum provision, Obama making a clear admission that the best of civil unions fall well short of equality.

  23. David in Indy 23 Dec 2010, 7:43pm

    Would he still be wrestling about it if it were black people that couldn’t get married?

    I didn’t think so.

  24. Many social conservatives, such as Eagle Forum president Phyllis Schlafly, refuse to believe that a majority of Americans would support gay marriage.

    Obama’s shifting position, she said, “is the story of politics: An aggressive well-funded pressure group can achieve goals contrary to what the majority of people want. I think same sex marriage would be a terrible mistake. I don’t think there are any good arguments for it.”

    Gays, she said, are already free to live together. “Nobody’s stopping them from shacking up,” she said. “The problem is they are trying to make us respect them, and that’s an interference with what we believe.”

    http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/wire/sc-dc-1224-obama-gay-marriage-20101223,0,1767965.story

  25. Hodge Podge 24 Dec 2010, 12:48am

    Oh ouch

  26. Still wrestling with it? Sounds like an excuse to me. Just like Bill Clinton he’ll “wrestle with it” until he’s out of office and then magically, when he no longer has the power to help, he’ll have a miraculous conversion. I’m sorry, but the shenanigans of politicians has left me cynical.

  27. It’s unfortunate that some people’s religious beliefs are muddying the water and blocking other people’s civil rights.

  28. “The problem is they are trying to make us respect them, and that’s an interference with what we believe.”

    Thanks for that, Pavlos. Shocking. The language theer really reminds me of the language used when slavery was abolished – the implication that one group is less than human. Disgusting.

    And the US Constitution specifically puts a ‘wall of separation’ between the state and relgion, so religious people can believe what they like, but they should keep the hell out of civil matters.

    I’d like Obama to expand on exactly what aspect of marriage equality he’s ‘wrestling’ with.

  29. Iris, the problem with Obama is his definition of marriage (one man one woman)is based on his religious beliefs. He even believes that civil marriage has a connection to religious marriage when pushed on the subject not so long ago. All American presidents kow-tow to their religious constituents. From what I know of the American political system, most candidates running for the highest office in the land almost always declare a religious belief system to attract the religious vote. A non-believer and non-”christian” wouldn’t stand a chance of winning the presidency. Religious cults in the U.S. are allowed to meddle in the political process while enjoying tax-exempt status and American gays are subject to taxation without full representation. Thank goodness we don’t have that system in the UK.

  30. Thanks for that, Robert. I admit to not knowing much about Obama’s religious beliefs at all. I can’t believe he tried to connect civil and religious marriage!

    What you say about the ‘god obsession’ in US politics is correct. That shows the difference between the UK and the US – remember how Blair’s advisers rsuhed into say that he didn’t ‘do God’? Here blathering on about religion would ring alarm bells amongst many voters, but in the US it seems to be something that’s seen as necessary to get elected. That’s why I often don’t know what US presidents really think – because they’d all label themselves as religious even if they’re not particularly.

    I do wish some group would come forward in the US and stop the interference of religion in politics. Maybe there is already a group? Of course, the same could be said about the UK to a lesser extent…

  31. Speaking as a US citizen who is damned (%$%^&*() tired of paying the Xtian head tax, this year over 10,000.00 more than a straight couple would have paid in a similar situation would paid, well, I have nothing nice to say to people like “cleve”. As a person with a background in religion and religious history I can say without any shadow of a doubt that Jesus would be upset with them and not me. As for Obama he is nothing but the weak kneed opportunist that most of us who knew his actions in Illinois expected of him. We voted for Hilary and abstained in the General election, unable to vote for either of the candidates they were just too awful, and they have not proved us wrong yet.

  32. Gay Activist Paul Mitchell 25 Dec 2010, 12:34am

    Remember Obama made a promise in 2008 with these:

    (1) To implement ENDA

    (2) To implement federal domestic partnership benefits

    (3) To repeal the recent declared unconsititional DOMA

    Now what have we missed:

    * What about ENDA Obama?????

    * What about repealing the bigoted and unconsitutional DOMA Obama?????

    * What about domestic partner federal benefits?????

    Updated December report card on Obama’s gay rights record:

    (a) Hate crime law – IMPLEMENTED, tick

    (b) Repeal of DADT – “NOT FULLY IMPLEMENTED”, tick for signing into law though.

    (c) Repeal of DOMA – NO ACTION, cross

    (d) Implement ENDA – NO ACTION, cross

    (e) Implement federal domestic partner benefits – NO ACTION, cross

    TOTAL SCORE: 2/5

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