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Push to recognise British civil partnerships across Europe

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  1. Vincent Poffley 25 Feb 2010, 8:27pm

    yes, I suppose you could spend large amounts of money and diplomatic effort trying to get civil partnerships recognised in other EU countries. Or you could, oh I don’t know, just allow gay people to get married, because British marriages are ALREADY recognised by JUST ABOUT EVERY COUNTRY ON THE SODDING PLANET!

  2. Brenda Lana Smith R af D 25 Feb 2010, 8:29pm

    The British Foreign Office first needs to have British Overseas Territories get their present gay and gender-variant omissive Human Rights laws in order first… which now need include recognising UK gender certificated persons and civil partnerships performed in the UK…

  3. Why have all this crap about getting Civil Partnerships recognised abroad when if you allowed gays to marry there’d be no problem?

    It’s more smoke and mirrors by the lying government who don’t really give a damn about you. It’s all spin.

  4. “Speaking at a Foreign Office event this afternoon, the minister for Europe (Chris Bryant) said that it was “utterly bonkers” that in some cases, gay couples were forced to divorce and then re-register their relationships in their new countries if they move abroad in order to retain their rights and benefits.”

    This coming from a minister who’s government forces transsexual people in the UK, who are already legally married, to get divorced and then ‘re marry’ the same partner, in a civil partnership. – in order to retain their human rights and benefits.

    Now, that’s Nulabour bonkers!

  5. Jose Madrid 25 Feb 2010, 9:44pm

    Sorry, I can’t understand how is possible that a government that refuses to recognises married couples from countries where is possible to celebrate a same sex wedding, now is asking to the governments of this countries to recogniser a discriminatory partnership created only for avoiding to give the gay a lesbian couples full marriage equity. I think this is very unfair.

  6. I Need something clarified. If we had Gay Marriage, would we still need to divorce our partner as the article doesn’t say it’s across the board. That no matter where you get Married or CP’d you would be expected to divorce then re-marry in your adopted country.

    I may have a new set of questions once this is answered.

  7. First, UK should recognise as a m-a-r-r-i-a-g-e (eight letters in English) the marriages celebrated in Netherland, Belgium, Spain, Sweden or Norway, for example.

    After that, we could discuss.

  8. “Foreign minister Chris Bryant said …”

    Chris Bryant – one of the traitors –
    http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm200910/cmhansrd/cm100223/debtext/100223-0019.htm#1002244001716

  9. Simon Murphy 26 Feb 2010, 12:40am

    How revolting that the government is trying to have 2nd class civil partnerships recognised. This would not be an issue if gay couples could marry in the UK. UK marriages are recognised everywhere.

    As for aid to places like Uganda. Well by all means it is wrong to let people starve. But to continue aid as it stands at present is unacceptable. Unless the government can offer cast iron guarantees that British money is not being used to persecute gay people. ALL aid to Uganda and Malawi and Kenya should ONLY go to groups which recognise gay human rights.

    Chris Bryant and Stonewall are stuck in their 1996 frame of mind. If they think that discriminatory CP’s are adequate then they are clearly out of touch.

    Stonewall either needs to change. They need to start supporting LGBT equality. At the moment they do not. As the self-proclaimed leading LGB rights group in Britain, Stonewall’s reptilian behaviour is an embarrassment.

    Chris Bryant may not get re-elected which is fine by me while he opposes marriage equality.

  10. Perhaps the FCO should first provide us with a list of countries which currently recognise the Britsh civil partnership as the equivalent of their own ,this is what some foreign embassies think

    Belgian embassy
    “Until legal proof of the contrary, a British civil partnership is regarded as the equivalent of the Belgian civil union/marriage”

    Dutch
    “A civil partnership concluded on the basis of the provisions of the Civil Partnership Act 2004 is recognized by the Dutch authorities. ”

    German
    “According to our experience, British civil partnerships are recognized by German authorities and institutions as an equivalent of the German ‘Eingetragene Lebenspartnerschaft’.However, depending on the case an individual decision would normally be
    made by the authority dealing with your particular question. Therefore, if you plan to move to Germany it might be helpful to take your certificate of civil partnership with you, ideally one that bears an Apostille (legalisation stamp, issued by the Foreign and Commonwealth Office: http://www.fco.gov.uk).

    If one of you is a German citizen, you can also apply to the competent register office in Germany to register you UK civil partnership with them and to receive a German certificate.”

    Finland
    “Thank you for contacting the Embassy of Finland. Your British civil partnership will be valid in Finland; you will, however, need to be able to produce the original, signed and stamped copy of your civil partnership certificate when you register at your relevant local Register Office (“Maistraatti”).”

    Luxembourg
    “I would like to inform you that the British civil partnership is not regarded as the equivalent of the civil union in Luxembourg. Several enquiries on the matter have highlighted the fact that whereas the British civil partnership concerns same sex partners and is equivalent to a marriage, the Luxembourg civil union concerns same sex as well as different sex partnerships and is therefore not equivalent to marriage.

    Hungary
    “Yes, civil partnerships contracted according to UK law are recognised in Hungary on the same basis as the registered life partnership recently introduced in Hungary.”

    Norway
    “Reference is made to your email of 16.02.2010. British civil partnership is equivalent of the Norwegian civil union/marriage ”

    Switzerland
    “With regards to your inquiry I can inform you that a civil partnership that took place in the UK is recognised in Switzerland. If one of the two partners is Swiss, the partnership has to be registered with the Swiss authorities”

    Denmark
    “If you have a Civil Partnership Certificate your partnership will be recognized in Denmark.”

    Sweden
    “Thank you for your e mail. If you register your civil partnership in Sweden it will be is regarded as a Swedish marriage. You can register it once you have moved to Sweden with the local Swedish tax office. http://www.skatteverket.se/blanketterbr … 08017.html ”

    Iceland – not quite sure yet but the 1996 registered partnership act says Article 2 …..persons of Danish, Norwegian or Swedish nationality shall enjoy the same rights as Icelandic nationals. The Minister of Justice may decide by administrative provisions that nationals of other countries, where similar legislation on registered partnership is in effect, shall also enjoy the same rights as Icelandic nationals.]1)

    Czech Republic
    “In the Czech Republic exists “registrated partnership”, which is a recognition of same-sex couples relationships.
    Foreign equivalents of registrated partnership are recognized. ”

    France
    CPs recognised as PACS since May 2009

    Don’t know about Spain, Portugal, Austria, Slovenia or Croatia , the FCO won’t say nor will the foreign embassies or British ones – nice idea by Chirs Bryant and long overdue but when is he going to give us a list of where we are recognised, can’t be that hard!!!

  11. Chris Bryant voted for Edd no Balls amendment 70 allowing state funded religious schools to be homophobic and transphobic in the classroom.

    Chris Bryant along with Ben Summerskill are both part of the establishment machine who seek to keep us from full equality.

    To say Bryant is seeking to help us is a lie he is part of the problem not the solution.

  12. Do you think, David etc, that Iran would cheerily recognise two men in a gay relationship that was called marriage?

  13. “Do you think, David etc, that Iran would cheerily recognise two men in a gay relationship that was called marriage? ”

    Well of course not.

    That’s not the point though. The point is that Britain is part of the EU and Britain’s 2nd class, discriminatory civil partnerships are not recognised in many other EU states.

    So Chris Bryant and Stonewall are spending time and effort trying to get all other EU states to recognise Britiish discrimination against gay couples.

    They are fools. This would not be an issue if British gay couples were permitted to marry.

    Then again neither Stonewall nor Chris Bryant is in favour of LGBT equality. For that reason I hope Chris Bryant loses his seat at the next election.

    As for Stonewall – they really need to disband. They are a joke and an embarrassment to the LGBT population.

    The shame of it. Britain’s self-proclaimed leading LGB lobby group which in fact is opposed to LGBT equality. Have they no shame or standards?

  14. now their trying to force our second class wannabe marriages on the rest of the eu?

    screw you, govt. screw you.

  15. He doesn’t want to cut aid to countries that “fail to protect” gays and Lesbians?

    Is that a euphemism for persecute?

    Why should we give free money to countries that want to kill us?

  16. aid should be cut to homophobic states
    plus why not just have marriage instead of CP’s?

  17. There they go again, StonewallUK supporting recognition of British CPs across Europe. Hello……its NOT going to happen. Without every EU member state having identical rights for same-sex couples how on earth is that going to work? For example, a British same-sex couple with a CP can’t expect to enjoy the same rights that come with it if they lived in France where PACs offer minimal rights. Where’s the equality in that I ask? Similarly, a French gay couple residing in the UK would enjoy more rights than in their own country. There’s only one way to resolve it instead of this absurd mish-mash of member states having fewer or more rights than others and in some none at all, by allowing all of us to marry. I’m only hoping Stonewall Democrats in America, where the term Stonewall was coined and originated will sue StonewallUK for using its name when it doesn’t even support full marriage equality.

  18. Pete & Michael 26 Feb 2010, 4:06pm

    On our last holiday in Spain we were insulted by the staff in the hotel we stayed in, the door to our room was locked by the staff and every time we returned we had to go to hotel reception for a member of staff to open the door to our room. Because our passports had the same surname, we were questioned by the hotel manager whom later walked away shaking his head. As we have stated in previous post’s on this website give us Full Marriage Equality.

  19. I think Simon you are both naive and excessively sanguine. Do you really think that the term ‘marriage’ would instantly solve all of these problems? Of course it will not. For example try going to, say, Lithuania or Poland with a marriage certificate and then demanding a double-bedded room as a gay married couple. Similarly, Pete and Michael would not have their problem in Spain solved by a marriage certificate. In fact, it could well exacerbate the problem. They could well be laughed at for aping what many would see as an exclusively heterosexual contract. Despite their recognition of gay marriage, the European countries concerned are bursting with religious bigots, often, but not exclusively, Roman Catholic. Although gay marriage may be desirable, it is not the panacea!

  20. People who think it is as simple as allowing same-sex marriage are staggeringly naive; because it still wouldn’t give recognition in most countries that don’t already recognise civil partnerships.

    Nor, much as some would like it to be the case, is the fact that civil partnerships aren’t recognised anything to do with this hysterical nonsense about them being “2nd class, discriminatory” .. fools who enjoy playing the victim may like to believe that sort of sh*t, but then they will believe anything that validates their victim status.

  21. Getting gay marriages in the UK won’t mean that anther country will recognise this. The word marrigae won’t automatically give you the rights of a straight marriage in another country – how naive!!!. One of the reason that Luxembourg doesn’t give us the same rights as their civil unions is that the CP is too much like a marriage and they wouldn’t give you rights if it was called a gay marriage , gay marriages aren’t recognised there at the momemnt , only civil unions – France changed its PACS law to recognise civil unions, it does recognise gay marriages. It gives some rights to foreign gay marriages but when one of them is French you have no recognition – honestly why go on about marriage so much when it comes to recognition worldwide

  22. It doesn’t matter if homophobes continue hating married gays, that’s no reason to deny gay people equality!

  23. Yes, the marriage thing is a red-herring, though that doesn’t stop the portability card getting played everytime CPs are mentioned. The problem lies not with the name that we in the uk have given to same-sex unions, but the attitude of other jurisdictions, and if anyone thinks being able to call themselves married is going to solve that one, then they’re deluding themselves.

    That won’t stop the usual suspects airing their disatisfaction with CPs, however (oooh and let’s just lay into Stonewall while we’re at it). CPs give same-sex couples exactly the same rights and obligations as married couples and as some posts have pointed out, that goes beyond the situations prevailing in France. So what does it matter? I can see why people of faith are upset that they can’t enact a religious ceremony, but that’s the fault of their anachronistic churches. As far as a civil union is concerned, I just don’t get what people get so excited about.

    We’ve only had CPs for 4 years, and I can’t see either Labour or the Tories revisiting it soon. I wouldn’t mind if they did – I don’t really care about the name. But in the meantime, I think there are more important things to worry about, like homophobic hate-crime and bullying, the representation of gay people in the media, and the UK’s treatment of LGBT asylum seekers, for example. Those are the places where there are still real victims.

  24. Gay marriage is an important issue in the UK and we should have equality. It’s a noble and worthwhile fight but let’s not get it confused with the issue of the article. Getting a gay marriage in the UK will not necessarily mean that gay marriage ,as the previous person said , is portable to anther country. At the moment we need toget the British CP recognised abroad and to get the same rights as a same sex couple in another country, to expect more rights that someone else nationals in their own country is going to do down like a lead ballon in that country. You can’t get divorced in the UK to do another country’s CP , it’s not legal. You can’t generally do another country’s CP unless you are single. So when you get to that new country you don’t have any rights whatsoever if you are not treated the same as a same sex CP in that country, we’ve got to get recognition otherwsie we are in limbo in the new country. The good news I hope is that as I’ve pointed out above in a previous comment, most countries already recognise the British CP and give them the same rights as their own CPs. The only one so far I have found which doesn’t is Luxembourg and even they are planning to do a gay marriage soon which will also recognise foreign CPs. There has been a lot of debate on why a Canadian marriage was downgraded to a CP in the UK but does anybody know what rights we have in Canada? Do they recognise us at all and give us any rights? Why hasn’t the FCO supplied us with information on where our CP is recognised and what set of rights we have in each country? Perhaps there isn’t a major problem after all, lets get some real facts!!!!

  25. Recognition of Civil partnerships abroad 20 Mar 2010, 1:01am

    The British CP is recognised abroad, see link http://www.uklgig.org.uk/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2213&p=8359#p8359
    We need more clarification

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