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Government accused of U-turn over faith schools’ teaching on homosexuality

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  1. So this is Labours idea of equality eh? I don’t see what difference we’d have under the other lot! Labour have become weak, they do not deserve to be in power.

    An absolute disgrace!

  2. Let them teach what they please; but they must not have a penny of public money.

  3. Keith Bradley-Wilson 19 Feb 2010, 12:57pm

    Hmmmmmm…didn’t see THIS one coming, now did we?

  4. Now you die hard Labour Lovies – talk me through this one

  5. Are we really surprised – phoney sects who brainwash children into believing that a old whiteman created everything – are now getting government support to spread lies and bigotry – Equality my a** – It’s time we started listening to Mr Tatchell – he’s been banging on about the inequality of this whole farce for months – years in fact!

  6. I wouldn’t say “let them teach what they please”, simply because it is the children and teenagers who will suffer as a result. They will be the victims of this, and some will be the bigots of tomorrow.

  7. Yes George i agree but not only will some of these children “become the bigots of tomorrow” but others will be gay, or do christian parents not have gay children!!!!! These young gay children/adults will not only have to cope with possible rejection from their parents but they’ll have grown up in a school environment where honosexuality is seen as totally unacceptable. WHAT A DISGRACE.

  8. First they sold our children to the pope and nobody stopped them
    then the gays and the transgenders nobody moved a muscle
    when the pope marched triumphantly through the streets of London
    Nobody was left to stop him.

    NuLabour selling out the UK to the catholic church since 1997

    Vote Lib Dem 2010

  9. douglas in canada 19 Feb 2010, 2:58pm

    Science teaches that a person’s sexuality is already determined at or before birth. It is not learned.

    Science teaches that the earth is millions or billions of years old, and that evolution is at least a possibility.

    If these faith schools choose to “sign off” on this information, please, will they sign off on medical research and treatments? If they wish to accept their faith’s teachings, LET THEIR FAITH HEAL THEM. Maybe then, natural selection will allow these groups to die off when their superstitions fail to keep them alive and healthy.

  10. Rob Hedley 19 Feb 2010, 2:59pm

    Here’s an idea, how’s about we all band together including the humanist and secularist socities to create anti-faith schools that teach in all probability there is no god. Given that this would be in line with our faith we should surely be entitled state funding. Do all parents who send their children to ‘faith’ schools send them their for the religious aspect or simply because they perceive that they will receive a better education? If anti-faith schools provided an outstanding education for children then ‘faith’ schools would soon start to disappear.

    It’s easy for religious organisation to lobby and manipulate the government when they are to some extent gaining a monopoly on childrens education.

  11. Afraid my minds made up thanks to this story. Don’t like it but will be voting Tory. It can’t get any worse to be honest, though it might just well with this lot.

  12. If you think this is bad, wait until the Roman Catholic bigot Iain Duncan Smith gets a position of influence in a Tory Government. His family policy group has already recommended the downgrading of rights for gay parents. I have several times attempted to get Cameron to distance himself from this recommendation but he has failed to do so.

  13. But which out of the two leaders is Dumb and Dumber? We desperately need a change. I can vote against the Tories next time if they do a crap job? Hears hoping Labour dig deep and actually find someone worth voting for, for then.

  14. Mr. Howard Berar 19 Feb 2010, 3:34pm

    Sodomy shall be confronted in every school in order to understand what is the best.

  15. theotherone 19 Feb 2010, 3:53pm

    neville: IDS is odious but this story is about LABOUR selling us short yet again in an undignified attempt to win back the Religious vote.

    How long would Queer Rights have lived if Labour would have had another term in power? We already have Creationism in Schools, Religious Schools teaching about the evils of Homosexuality, opt outs of Equality Legislation for Religious Groups, ‘Faith-Based’ Policy and on and on and on.

    And much as I am in agreement with Abi regarding how the Lib Dems are better on Queer Rights than the Tory or Labour Parties a vote for Lib Dems is, effectively, a vote to keep Labour in.

  16. theotherone 19 Feb 2010, 3:56pm

    oh Mr. howerd I don’t think we need hard-core in schools do you? I know being Queer is infinitely better (at least more fun and with far closer and loving relationships) than Heterosexuality but let the children decide for themselves – I’m sure they’ll see the light

  17. BrazilBoysBlog 19 Feb 2010, 3:57pm

    @ Mr. Howard Berar. “Sodomy shall be confronted in every school in order to understand what is the best.”

    How do you mean dear? The best position?
    I must confess to being a great fan of the doggy myself! :-)

    Seriously dear, ´sodomy´? ´confronted´? Get with the times and the curriculum my friend… Mind you, you do seem to be defying all modern teaching… Clearly the dinosaurs are NOT dead! :-)

  18. theotherone 19 Feb 2010, 4:06pm

    yes Brazilboys, dogs are nice though I’m more a fan of Cats myself but then I AM a Lesbian.

    ..

    .

    Oh you mean Doggie Style. Oh right.

  19. Oh, Mr. Howard Berar, I do hope it is bottoms up, but it is also enjoyable in the missionary position which is what you seem to mean by confronted. Tell me, Mr. Howard Berar, do you prefer it bottoms up, or do you have a predilection for the missionary position, that is confronting it. Do tell us what your male partners prefer. Have you done a survey; do you keep records?

    g itbg it

  20. Section 28 lives again

    A faith school will only teach one thing about GBLT people – hatred. Just as they have for centuries and just as they desperately do today.

    And another generation will be indoctrinated in homophobia and another generation of kids forced into the closet, hating and fearing themselves

  21. The nature of granting rights, ensuring decent and pervasive semantic equality to all citizens of this country is slowly eroding into a spun, non-sensical and tawdry end to this Government. This end is just but let’s look at what the Tory cabal will offer… And this fill me with equal dread. If our rights are reduced before we have full semantic equality, then it provides of a well greased pole for strong faith-based state-supported ‘purveyors of choice’ to f**k with the past 30 years of hard work. Then we will truly have a fight on our hands. Am gonna vote Lib Dem. We need to face off not just the faith based initiatives but also fight the erosion of secular education in a society that has benefitted so enormously from it in the past.

  22. Robert, ex pat Brit 19 Feb 2010, 5:56pm

    Hmmm, Labour now seems to be adopting Tory policies, this is exactly what Cameron believes in. I’ve no objection faith based schools teaching whatever they want in regard to “homosxuality”, good or bad…but…if they’re going to do that, how about removing state aid to them since they don’t have to comply with equality laws? Why should our tax pounds support their institutions, the very institutions that discriminate against us. We should demand that portion of our taxes that go towards supporting discrimination. Lets get rid of the state cult and the House of Lords once and for all and get it over with. The country would be far better off without them, nothing more than a bunch of parasites who don’t have real jobs.

  23. theotherone 19 Feb 2010, 6:00pm

    get rid of the lords robert? The Lords offer a check to the Executive and sometimes it’s a good thing, sometimes not.

    I’d prefer them to stay.

  24. Labour are bad and homophobic so vote Tory? Er no. Either way if you vote for Tory or Labour you’re making a vote for the status quo. We should demand more than the choice between the slightly lesser of two evils… It is rather short sighted thinking to say that we must always vote for one of the two main parties. We must do it now and in 4 years time and in 8 years time and in 12 years time ad infinitum?! Then what will change? Nothing.

  25. Mumbo Jumbo 19 Feb 2010, 8:46pm

    I despair.

    What is it about religion that makes politicians go totally mental and just give them what they want. And Ed Balls of all people. Speaking from experience, I dislike the man but if a non-believer with a previously creditable record on equality can do something this spineless one wonders what hope there is.

    And the Conservatives? Are they rushing to condemn this? No. Silence. What a shock. And I’ll bet my Kensington flat on the way they’ll vote on this amendment.

    At least the LibDem spokesman shows some at least some sign of standing up to Catholics who think that a decades long history of mass international child rape followed by a bare-faced cover up gives them the right to mentally abuse LGBT children in the classroom.

    Having said that, it’s not as if they propose to get rid of these loopy-loo so-called faith schools either.

    Finally, just what kind of adult thinks that their right to preach hate superceeds the right of a child to feel safe and valued in school? One poisoned by religion.

    I could fart.

    Whilst I build up a head of gas, click on the link below and use the British Humanist Association facility to protest against this outrage:

    http://www.humanism.org.uk/campaigns/what-you-can-do-to-help/sre

    Rant over.

  26. Maybe the thought of a ‘dreaded’ Tory government would be good for some of you Labour supporters. Stop ya whinging about everything you ain’t got and start appreciating everything we have for a change.

  27. “I could fart”

    You could m8y but Gordy B will tax ya for doing so! ;)

  28. If anyone has the knowledge of how to petition parliament, please let us know how.
    This is much more serious than section 28. Rather than not being allowed to teach about homosexuality, this amendment seems to support homophobic teachings. This has to stop!

  29. Absolutely right, Angus; this new legislation is a Sec. 28Rose by any other name. All the inroads made by Labour regarding Gay Rights are in danger of rapidly diminishing whilst thousands of new, young impressionable young men and women will leave Faith (invariably R C ) schools, with no knowledge about gay lifestyle and love and many will have the horrendous task of wallowing in their own homoexuality rather than rejoicing in it and acknowledging it as a part of their personal God-given personalities.
    I’m afraid I’m tending to lean more and more towards Mr Cameron…..

  30. Mumbo Jumbo 20 Feb 2010, 12:06pm

    @Angus
    @Barry

    As a start, use the link I posted above:

    http://www.humanism.org.uk/campaigns/what-you-can-do-to-help/sre

    Actually, I think this could turn out worse than Section 28.

    Section 28 prohibited the promotion of homosexuality. This amendment would allow the actual condemnation of homosexuality.

  31. Wim in Holland 20 Feb 2010, 1:08pm

    @barry. Do you hear mr Cameron about this ? Will you hear mr Cameron about this ? No, no, no. Promises enough (“We should….”), deeds none.

  32. So now lots of you who have commentated on here,now want to give up the game and vote Tory! Well perhaps you should ask your tory party leader what exaxtly HE intends to do with this amendment once elected? I don’t exactly here the tory rank and file calling foul play!! Do you? The tory party back benchers will soak this up as the first of many chinks at putting equality reform well and truly into reverse gear! Yes, it is a fundemental mistake for Labour to make, but one that needs to be fought against from within the ranks, not a give up the whole party game! Have some backbone please!!

  33. How is it Labour bring in a law worse than Section 28 and yet it’s Still the Tories who still get it in the neck? mmm I s’pose next you’ll be saying Ed Balls is really a Tory.

    Last time I checked the United Kingdom was still a democracy. I don’t necessarily support the Tories but we need to get rid of this useless lot. That is why Dude Dave Will be getting my vote. I always used to vote Lib Dem (Except when I voted for Boris, of course) I’ll do anything to get Labour out. If that means a Tory government, well so be it.

    My country, My choice!

  34. Disheartened 20 Feb 2010, 3:13pm

    The pendulum swings back towards endorsed teaching of prejudice & homophobia but with government approval and with the Conservative leader talking of yet more faith schools…I think we are facing a serious regression on lgbt equality in the near future in the UK.

  35. Labour is demonstrating once again it is pandering to the religious right. It has been said before, but the people who bash labour usually bash him, so it bears saying again; Peter Tatchell was right!

  36. A ‘christian’ once told me that black people were cursed by god. Presumably, with this news, the Race Laws won’t apply to faith schools and they’ll be able to spout cr*p like this as ‘facts’ in public once again?

    I’m disgusted with this opt-out. Religion has a lot to answer for with regard to homophobia. How can a school be allowed to opt out just because of some belief? Will misogynists and racists be allowed to set up schools according to their beliefs?

    Get rid of ALL faith schools and keep religion in churches, etc, and – most importantly – out of secular life.

  37. P. Tatchell was right? Really no-one else thinks that maybe, just maybe it was people like him and his embarrassing ways that caused the problems like section 28 in the first place? Get a grip people!

  38. These schools should be shut down as per the requirements of the EU human rights laws.

    How else do we protect the children from the hate of the church, and the sex starved penises of the priests of the catholic church

    And re the Pope cuming to england – just declare his passport invalid, per the EU human rights laws. Or ship him in under the laws which govern animals for the zoos.

  39. Squidgy – I can’t believe you are blaming LBG people for what the homophobes do

  40. “And much as I am in agreement with Abi regarding how the Lib Dems are better on Queer Rights than the Tory or Labour Parties a vote for Lib Dems is, effectively, a vote to keep Labour in.”

    Well there’s a self-fulfilling prophecy if ever I heard one. It’s that kind of attitude that keeps the Lib Dems (or indeed any other non-Labour/Tory party) from being a serious political force in this country. Don’t just vote for the lesser of two evils to keep the greater of said evils out. Vote for the party you actually want in power. Otherwise nothing will ever change.

  41. You read into it as you will Chester but I firmly believe Peter Tatchell and his Outrage Mob Actions cost gay people a lot of support and yes maybe even have contributed to others homophobia against us. It seems we do better when his like are absent from the media circus.

  42. 2hats – if this coming election was just about politics I would agree with you, but as in 1997 we are in a situation where most people aren’t voting on politics but simply on getting this dreadful lot out.

  43. Robert, ex pat Brit 21 Feb 2010, 4:30pm

    A brilliant example of cowardice by any government, Labour or Tory, both afraid to confront the state cult for fear of upsetting their beliefs and those of their fellow cultist followers. Both parties need to grow a pair of balls, big ones. Expect nothing from the next government either, more of the same.

    For those who bash Peter Tatchell, what exactly have YOU done lately to advance equality? Have you put your life on the line as Peter has? You’re probably the same bunch who poo poo drag queens and effiminate types who were in the vanguard of the original Stonewall movement which put equality on the map, a form on internalised homophobia. So don’t be so smug and condemnatory of the true activists and leaders in the struggle for full equality. Without them, we’d be nowhere. Its what brought about full equality in Holland (the first), Belgium, Spain, Canada, Norway, Sweden, South Africa and we don’t even have full equality by being politically correct, all we achieved is second class citizenship and we like to think that’s all about being equal?

  44. Sister Mary clarence 21 Feb 2010, 4:49pm

    Well, I admit it, I’m confused. Labour were the best thing since sliced bread on the Nick Herbert thread, and yet here, the penny seems to have dropped that they aren’t quite as committed to our salvation as the Labour trolls would have us believe. I note also that there seem to be a few notable absences on the Labour troll front here as well.

    Funny how some of them seem to stay away from any Labour bad news stories.

  45. Mumbo Jumbo 21 Feb 2010, 8:22pm

    @Sister Mary Clarence

    So which way will the Consevatives vote when this amendment is debated on Tuesaday? Post the figures for us.

    @Robert, ex pat Brit

    Quite so.

  46. theotherone 21 Feb 2010, 10:28pm

    2hats: I’ve said before I would like a Tory/ Lib Dem coalition government but…I can’t see it now.

    Reported swings in the Key Marginals are 11% giving a huge Tory majority.

  47. Omar Kuddus 22 Feb 2010, 1:04am

    Again Religion is being allowed to govern Politics.
    Equality will never be achived by LGBT’s untill religion is taken out of the equation and it recognised that all humans are equal as we are all born equal, despite their sexual orientation.

  48. Ed Balls in today’s Guardian [http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2010/feb/22/no-opt-out-sex-education-classes]:

    Faith schools will not be able to opt out of statutory lessons on sex and relationship education when the legislation comes into effect in September 2011 (Change to bill ‘will deny right to balanced sex education’, 19 February). This includes education about contraception and the importance of stable relationships, including marriage and civil partnerships. It will not allow the teaching of homophobia.

    All maintained schools and academies will be required to teach the full programmes of study. This includes promoting equality and encouraging acceptance of diversity. All schools must have a zero-tolerance approach to bully­ing and we have issued specific guidance on tackling homophobic bullying.

    While schools with a religious character will be free, as now, to express the views of their faith, what they cannot do is suggest that their views are the only ones. All schools will be required to cover in their teaching of personal, social and health education the full range of content prescribed in the statutory programme of study for secondary schools and in the relevant parts of the new primary curriculum.

    The bottom line is that all young people should receive accurate and ­balanced information and discrimination is prevented in all schools.

    Ed Balls MP

    Secretary of state for children, schools and families”

    This seems a lot more reasonable than the way it’s been portrayed before. I understand Balls’s letter to mean, though, that if they’re getting government funds they have to err on the side of a liberal, inclusive way of teaching or risk having their funding yanked, whereas if they were entirely private they could say any damn thing at all. As a deeply religious person, I am very wary of faith schools, as I’m convinced that it’s by mixing with a diverse crowd that kids become more able to think critically about their core beliefs, which can only be a good thing. On one hand, I’d like to see an end to faith schools; on the other hand, I’m wary of them becoming entirely private and so escape any form of moderation through having to conform to more liberal teaching in order to retain funding.

    I do find myself wondering just how accurately this bill is being portrayed by government or by the news media.

  49. Sister Mary clarence 22 Feb 2010, 9:39am

    In light of that Anon, the response from the Catholic Education Service seems bizarre:

    “The Catholic Education Service claims to have successfully lobbied for the amendment on its website.”

    Always helpful though it keep these things a bit muddy if you’re trying to win voted from both sides of an argument. I wonder what Mt Balls decides to say in the Daily Mail for example?

  50. theotherone 22 Feb 2010, 12:11pm

    ‘While schools with a religious character will be free, as now, to express the views of their faith, what they cannot do is suggest that their views are the only ones.’

    Says Mr Bollocks.

    Well within a Religious School where the Word of THE LORD is all the teachings of The Church will, obviously, be given more weight. They may not be allowed to teach ONLY the ‘religious’ view but the way other views is taught is not dictated; either the way they are taught or the weighting (in terms of time) given

  51. The deranged Zionist Jewess, Melanie Phillips, has a most appalling article in the Jewish section of ‘The Spectator’- http://www.spectator.co.uk/melaniephillips/5796016/mr-ballss-secular-inquisition.thtml – about this aspect of the Equality Bill. She thinks that it will force unacceptable views on sex education and relationships on the mentally ill i.e. religious people. Do read it to see just how foul and deranged this dreadful woman really is. She is convinced that the Bill will not become law because of the time available before a general election.

  52. theotherone 25 Feb 2010, 12:33pm

    my partner has Jewish heritage so fvck off you Fascist fvck

  53. Jewish heritage has nothing to do with it – I have Jewish friends- but Zionism certainly has! I wonder if theotherone is as vulgar to her partner as she is to others. It is only recently, on another blog ,that she referred to a ‘black arse’. This made some of us wonder if she had had a glimpse of Sister Mary’s buttocks!

  54. theotherone 25 Feb 2010, 3:06pm

    ‘The deranged Zionist Jewess’ to use your term.

    Now you have Jewish friends, you have no problems with Jews so why do you insist on highlighting someone’s Race yet again AND manage to get in a comment about SMC being Black.

    Oh and the Anti-Semitism pricks at me too as I seriously considered converting a few years ago but, ofcorse, my Agnosticism got in the way.

    Go home and vote BNP you idiot.

  55. Poor, deluded, theotherone, the reason why Phillips’ religion as a Jew is highlighted is that she is an arrant, extreme Jew. You need to look at some of her opinions which are quite appalling and are clearly at odds with such civilised Jews as Jonathan Freedland. Do look at her paranoid attacks on him and you will see what I mean. It is important to highlight the fact that she is both Jewish and a Zionist to understand her extreme, distasteful, paranoid views. You probably will not understand, but it is possible to be a Zionist without being Jewish by religion. George Eliot was a Zionist, but she was not Jewish. I don’t suppose you have ever heard of her! You are the kind of foolish person who would attack someone for his criticism of Roman Catholicism. But, unfortunately, it is very difficult to debate with the vulgar uneducated.

  56. Dear theotherone, do you not remember that it was you who referred to a ‘black arse’.

  57. Do look at Jonathan Freedland’s article:
    March 30, 2007
    The danger of Melanie Phillips

    Published in the Jewish Chronicle

  58. theotherone 25 Feb 2010, 8:34pm

    Actualy i used to work in a Jewish Nursing Home and had this debate with a group of the residents who almost daily debated Zionism. IO was, I’m afraid, the Uncircumcised one in agreement with the Anti-Zionists (I bet you didn’t know that you can also be a Jew and an Anti-Zionist.)

    Now my point is: why did you have to mention MP’s Race (I’m not sure if she comes from a Semitic Bloodline but I seem to remember that she does) when you mention her Political views. The two are not in any way linked: Zionism and Semitic Blood are not the same thing but for you JEW is an insult.

    Now let me deconstruct your other post (unless you find such things ‘vulgar’: you mention MP’s Race when it is not necessary and then SMC’s Race when it is not necessary. Only Racists think you have to mention Race when it is not necessary.

    Oh and 19th Century Fiction bores me incredibly. Big books lost their luster after I read Ulysses which was, amongst other things, a pastiche of the Dickinson ideal of ‘Social Realism’, a sort of ‘Social Surrealism.’ Where Dickens can take a page to describe a carving Joyce takes several pages to describe the pleasures of smelly cheese, excreting and masturbation.

  59. theotherone 25 Feb 2010, 8:51pm

    odd also, Neville, that in your stunted cosmoligy only Men debate:

    (‘You are the kind of foolish person who would attack someone for his criticism of Roman Catholicism.’)

  60. Does your comment about being the only uncircumcised one mean that your are alleging that Jewish females indulge in genital mutilation and that your clitoris, unlike theirs, is still intact? If you knew anything about English grammar you would know that the masculine form includes the feminine, but as you cannot even spell ‘lustre’ it seems unlikely that you would know very much about English Grammar. You also seem to know very little about Jewish matters.

  61. theotherone 26 Feb 2010, 12:33am

    *sigh* I am a Transwoman (as if you didn’t know) and I was alluding to the fact that I was, at that time, how shall I phrase it…known by a different name.

    I thought I wouldn’t have to spell that out to you but, like all Fascists, you have no intelligence, manners or sense of humor.

    ‘The Masculine form includes the feminine’ not since Feminists ripped apart Patriarchal language Neville my dear old diplodocus.

    I really see no need to keep feeding your Ego any further so goodbye old chap it was nice to have someone to laugh at.

    Thanks for sweet fvck all.

  62. Poor theotherone, ignorant and semi-literate as always, and I always thought that you were a lesbian with an intact clitoris. I now see why you have deep psychological problems. You have my deepest sympathy. English grammar has not been affected by a few foolish bra-burning females, unless, of course,it is in the way in which it makes you unable to spell!

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