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Benefits victory for British gay couples in France

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  1. Simon Murphy 4 Feb 2010, 1:56pm

    Just shows how wasteful and ridiculous CP’s are.

    If same sex marriage was legalised in France and the UK then there would be no need to waste time and money on trying to synchronise their discriminatory CP laws.

    (Although I have read that in France, their PACS system is damaging the institution of marriage as more and more straight couples are choosing to enter a PACS instead of getting married)

  2. My boyfriend and I are PACS’d in France, married in California and CP’d in the UK. And we still don’t have equal rights in any of those places.

  3. Robert, ex pat Brit 4 Feb 2010, 2:37pm

    At least French straights can form a PACs but their British counterparts can’t form a CP. Where’s the equality in that?

  4. Simon Murphy: “Just shows how wasteful and ridiculous CP’s are.”

    More to the point, it just shows how wasteful and ridiculous that chocolate teapot of an organisation, the European Union is.

  5. @ RobN:

    How exactly does the EU relate to this story?

    And, more importantly, why is your name hyperlinked to Godwin’s law?

  6. Simon Murphy 4 Feb 2010, 2:54pm

    “More to the point, it just shows how wasteful and ridiculous that chocolate teapot of an organisation, the European Union is. ”

    What has the EU got to do with marriage equality? Or are you just taking advantage of the fact that the discussion is about another country to engage in your typical, reflexive, lazy xenophobia?

    The EU refuse to instruct member states to synchronise their marriage laws.

    Are you – Robert of N – actually suggesting that the EU instruct the member states to synchronise their marriage laws?

  7. Lucius / Simon: Well one would assume that as we are in some supposed outfit that allows its members to walk entirely unhindered from country to country, claiming whatever benefits the state they happen to be in may have to offer, this would also include some kind of parity regarding marital status, be it marriage, CP or whatever they happen to be doing in Romania at the time.

    You are the people that are so f_cking pro-Europe, yet you seem to lack notice any of the supposed advantages of aforesaid union, so either level the playing field, or preferably, f_ck off back across the channel and you don’t bother us, and we won’t bother you.

    And as for the Godwin’s law, I like it there. As they say, ‘if the cap fits, wear it.’

  8. I’m surprised you can do a CP and a PACS at the same time, I don’t think that was strictly possible, are you sure you haven’t invalidated both, you must have said you were single, wasn’t that one of the problems you couldn’t do a PACS if you were already in a CP

    Sarah Teather MP raised this problem of non recognition in the house of commons but got a rather disappointing answer
    “23 Feb 2009 : Column 341W

    Sarah Teather: To ask the Secretary of State for Justice in which overseas countries civil partnerships entered into in the UK are recognised. [255826]
    Maria Eagle: The Government do not hold definitive information on which overseas countries recognise UK civil partnerships, or under what terms. The laws of other countries are subject to change without notice, and in some cases can be ambiguous.
    We are aware of the difficulties UK civil partners living in countries where their legal relationship status is not recognised can face, and where appropriate, we are working with those countries to achieve recognition.”

    If the govt/EU doesn’t know where the next problem for non recognition of a gay partnership is then I don’t know how the individual is going to – risky business moving around the EU for a couple couple, better stay in the UK!

  9. Simon Murphy 5 Feb 2010, 2:05am

    “so either level the playing field, or preferably, f_ck off back across the channel and you don’t bother us, and we won’t bother you.”

    OK let’s level the playing field.

    Do you want to be required to get a visa if you want to visit Paris or Amsterdam or Barcelona for the weekend? You voted for UKIP? The party that wants to leave the EU? Yet you are the one arguing for Europe wide regulation of marriage laws.

    Sweet Satan! RobN is more left wing than me on the subject of Europe.

  10. The article should have said France now gives tax rights to all foriegn civil partners and not just British or EU. It’s listed up to 12 countries it automatically recognises so far and it’s an ongoing job for the French tax office to add more ……

    What on earth are you lot arguing about…. surely the point of the argument is that we’ve set up a load of different types of civil unions and there is no mutual recognition of them… keeping your civil status with you , in particular when moving around Europe, is fundamental. The person who got CPed, PACSed and married all at the same time is a nonsense and probably not legal.. You can’t do a CP and a PACS at the same time in France it’s not legal… you need somekind of mutual recognition of eachother’s civil status otherwise it’s impossible to work or live in another country very easily. At least we need to know when our CP won’t be recognised, I have no idea what my status would be in Germany, Holland, Portugal. Am I married if I go to Portugal or Spain. I can’t dissolve my CP, I have no reason to so if I’m not recognised outside of Britain then I can’t go to that country to live or work. Can’t the British govt not give us details on where our British CP would be recognised as the equivalent of another country’s gay married or civil union, it can’t be that hard for them to find out…

  11. Simon Murphy: Given the option, I would close all doors with Europe. We have never had visa’s with the main European countries, so I see no reason why we would have to now, but if so, then so be it. It works both ways. I would like to go back to the old “Common Market” situation with free trade between us, but that’s it. No dictating laws, rights, demands, agricultural and fishing agreements, human rights dictates or imposing their bloody pony economy on us.

    I just find it amazing that those wankers in Brussels can virtually run our parliament under remote control, (and we aren’t even IN the EU!) – yet they can’t sort out a simple, common factor like a civil partnership across it’s member states.

  12. “(and we aren’t even IN the EU!)”

    Sorry, where do you live again? I always thought you were British. Perhaps you meant “IN the continental Europe”?

    There’s nothing dictatorial about the EU. Though it does have a scapegoat quality to it, I admit. It’s so easy to blame someone else far, far away for your own mess.

  13. If the EU recognised marriage equality these ridiculous problems would end.

  14. Lucius: The UK is a limited member of the EU, even though that snide little f_cker brown promised us a referendum, and then backslid all the way to Lisbon, so we are supposedly European whether we like it or not, we still don’t have the Euro thank God, and we can still apparently just about wriggle out of it.

    “It’s so easy to blame someone else far, far away for your own mess.”

    Well, it’s not entirely the EU’s fault, it was this incumbent government that as continually handed over more and more power to these faceless wonders, and we pay those people FOUR MILLION POUNDS A DAY to tell us what to do.

    If you think our MPs are wasteful, just imagine what they are blowing in Brussels.

  15. Oh, I don’t need to imagine, here’s the link:

    http://euobserver.com/9/29421

    The EP spent €1.4 billion (with a B!) in 2008 alone. I’d laugh if that wasn’t my money as well.

  16. Good news is that France seems to have been an exeption and not the norm, most EU countries appear to recognise the British CP
    – see http://www.uklgig.org.uk/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2213

  17. Despite the hijacking of this issue into personal politics, I am just so relieved to have had this article forwarded to me by a friend. My French partner and I are in the process of moving to France, once our baby is born and we’re settled enough to move. I have been tearing my hair out over the issue of having to dissolve our CP, the financial repurcussions of not having a PACS, the risks of forming one anyhow and it being invalid, not wanting to enter the stats of a “failed CP” just because we have relatives in France we happen to need to be near right now. Trust me, NONE of this crossed our minds when we met, but life happens. Of COURSE it would be easier to have full equal rights in every country, but people, we have to fight for that, unfortunately. And the meantime, I am happy to take up the rights that people, including myself, have been fighting for for some time. I’d braced myself to get involved in the fight for parity between PACS and other civil unions. Luckily now I can put my energy towards pushing towards full gay marriage. What are you lot doing besides moaning??

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