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Gay MP and blogger in Twitter spat

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  1. Dave Wilson 29 Jan 2010, 7:13pm

    So unseemly, gentlemen. Iain Dale is gay too, of course. Not that it is an issue but simply of interest because of the subject of their, er, debate.

  2. Whose idea was it to post this trivial rubbish? May we have NEWS STORIES please?

  3. the.kitty.channel 29 Jan 2010, 7:50pm

    Who cares?

  4. Hmmm people of opposing political views disagree on the internet so what’s new or remotely interesting about that!

  5. Brian Burton 29 Jan 2010, 9:17pm

    This crazy ‘Con’servative Blogger is a total prat and dose his political master cameron a diservice but the silly sod has no idea he’s damaging Camaron’s image.

    As for you others who gave negative comment here: Remember that imagination is the quality that enables us to see things and people in their real as in their ideal relations.

  6. Jeez! Blair’s appearance at Chilcot descends into a bit of a gay slap. They both should’ve known better.

  7. Blimey, I thought I was reading the comments section on Pink News for a moment…

  8. The Halcyon 29 Jan 2010, 11:48pm

    And Mr Dale wants to be an MP candidate? Think you might have blown it there.

  9. Hurhur hur… He said “Prick”. hurhurhur.

  10. Patrick James 30 Jan 2010, 2:29am

    LGBT Conservatives like Iain Dale must know very well that they are being used by Cameron. For Cameron they present an apparently liberal front while Cameron actually pursues a very right wing social agenda.

    That might explain why Iain Dale resorts to name calling as a response to the observation that Cameron is a “fake opportunist”, because Iain Dale knows very well this statement is true.

  11. Jonny Roland 30 Jan 2010, 4:23am

    I agree, not exactly news is it? Bit like when tonight’s 10 O’Clock News put John Terry before Haiti.

    Shame the article couldn’t have been a bit more neutral, get a quote from LGBTory as well as the Labour group.

    Oh and Patrick, can we stop the the whole ‘being used by Cameron’ thing now. You and I both know that LGBTory was set up and is run completely independently from David Cameron. It works with him and advises him on gay issues, but neither side takes instruction or is bound by the other.

  12. Patrick James 30 Jan 2010, 6:17am

    Jonny Roland:

    Oh and Patrick, can we stop the the whole ‘being used by Cameron’ thing now. You and I both know that LGBTory was set up and is run completely independently from David Cameron. It works with him and advises him on gay issues, but neither side takes instruction or is bound by the other.

    To me it is obvious that the out LGBT Conservatives are being used by Cameron so I will continue to make this point.

    Cameron’s strategy is to say socially progressive sounding things but advance socially very right wing causes, or alternatively to dress up right wing ideas in the language of being socially progressive.

    The saddest example has been the massive boost given to the Polish Law and Justice Party by the Conservative party’s creation of its small ECR European parliamentary grouping.

    I write that this is the saddest example because LGBT Conservatives have been actively whitewashing the activities of the Polish Law and Justice Party and are attempting to muddy the argument by saying the the PES or ALDE also have homophobic parties and so Labour or Lib Dems share their groups with homophobes. But there is no comparison as PES and ALDE are huge. It is the small size of the ECR and that it contains three parties only, the second largest being the Polish Law and Justice Party. The Conservative party has made the chairman of their ECR group Michal Kaminski who is an appalling homophobe.

    I have had a great interest in LGBT issues for many years, I grew up in Northern Ireland so I know a bit about how homophobes can operate when they have a bit of power. I have seen and experienced for real what they can do, and I know, as do many, that the Polish Law and Justice Party gives a licence to monstrous homophobia in Poland.

    The LGBT people in Poland desperately need the assistance of countries in which homophobia has been properly challenged such as it has been in the UK by progressive political movements such as the Labour party or the Liberal Democrats. The Conservative party is advancing the cause of homophobia in Poland. It is giving the Law and Justice party a massive political boost. The Conservative party is also putting out a strong signal to all homophobic parties in Europe that the Conservative party will deal with them without any hesitancy and that their behaviour is acceptable.

    I think that this issue with the Polish Law and Justice party is very much more significant for LGBT people even than Clause 28. Whereas Clause 28 was, if you like, an insult to the LGBT identity, the alliance in Europe with the Polish Law and Justice party represents and actual attack on LGBT people in a much more concrete manner.

    I have written about the Polish Law and Justice party but in the UK we can also see that the Conservative party is following a right wing social agenda. David Cameron told us that he will facilitate a massive increase in “faith” schools a fe days ago. The next day he tells us that he thinks that children should be taught about LGBT relationships, but, of course, he wouldn’t like to see those faith schools being made to do this. So really this is nonsense, his personal view, he claims, are to educate children about LGBT relationships, but his actions contradict this.

    For me to write that the LGBT Conservatives are being used by the right wing of the Conservative party is very charitable to those LGBT Conservatives. They must be fooling themselves, or working very hard to look the other way. How can they be at ease with themselves when their party behaves so appallingly in the European Union towards the most vulnerable LGBT people?

    I have observed the Conservative party for some years. My own guess is that David Cameron is really just a front man for the right wing of the party. The prime shadow cabinet positions are occupied by the right and their policies are from the right of the party but dressed up in modern sounding language.

  13. Brian Burton 30 Jan 2010, 8:39am

    Patrick James,
    I’ve always said that the Concervatives are directed by the ‘Men in grey suits’ or the 1922 commitee. They removed Margret Thatcher when she had served their purpose.

  14. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 12:45pm

    Very comforting to know that Mr Bryant can take time off from his £150,401 per year (incl. expenses job) to spend the afternoon arguing on twitter with Iain Dale.

    I can only assume he was completely up to date with all his constituency matters and government was running at optimum efficiency.

  15. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:02pm

    Patrick, let’s talk European grouping then shall we!!!!

    Spokesperson for the 9/11 Truth movement – Giulietto_Chiesa

    wikipedia.org/wiki/Giulietto_Chiesa

    Tarring everyone with the same brush as you do, I know you like I will be anticipating Labour’s denial of 911 with interest.

  16. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:07pm

    Romania’s Social Democratic party – whose members include Radu Mazare (mayor of Constanta) who dressed up as a Nazi at a fashion show.

  17. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:08pm

    Moving on to Poland – Self Defence of the Republic party, Bogdan Golik and Wieslaw Kuc, although Kuc left, leaving Golik behind. This party is led by Andrzej Lepper, recipient of two honorary degrees from the antisemitic Interregional Academy of Personnel Management – an outfit that counts the American white supremacist David Duke as an honorary professor.

  18. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:12pm

    Ever heard of Proinsias De Rossa? If not ask the families of the six policemen he killed. I’m think you may find that feel the death’s of their loved ones have been dishonoured. Not the sort of person Labour should be chumming up with and allowing to help draft the European Constitution surely?

  19. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:14pm

    Bulgarian Socialist Party – Its leader, Sergei Stanishev, condemned Bulgaria’s first gay pride march, declaring his disapproval of “the manifestations and demonstrations of such orientations”.

  20. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 1:27pm

    Could we maybe be clear exactly how or why the Polish Law and Justice Party is so homophobic? I tripped over a rather enlightening article on that very subject:

    “Rather more effort has gone into denouncing Michal Kaminski, the Polish MEP from the Law and Justice party who is leader of the new group. There has been some effort to brand him homophobic. This is because he used the term pedaly, a slang term for homosexuals that is, or at any rate was when he used it in 2000, in common usage including among Polish politicians. There is some dispute over whether it is equivalent to saying “fags” or “queers” or something rather less derogatory, but Kaminiski has agreed not to use the term in future as he does not wish to give offence. By the way, I used to sometimes use the term “Polacks”, under the impression it was equivalent to “Aussies” or “Kiwis”. When I was gently told that Polack was an offensive term I stopped using it. Kaminski says he is proud that Poland was the first European country to decriminalise homosexuality, in 1928, that he has gay friends and that he has “nothing against” civil partnerships. “
    “But the main thrust has been to accuse him of antisemitism. This has been based on two pieces of evidence. First, that he opposed an apology on behalf of the Polish people for the massacre of Jews by Poles as well as Germans which took place at Jedwabne. But this opposition was based on his view that those individuals involved in the massacre were guilty, rather than it being a matter of collective guilt. He regards the massacre as shameful.”
    “Second, when Kaminski was 14 years old, a time when there was no open opposition, he joined the first anti-communist group he came across, the National Revival of Poland (NOP). This subsequently became an antisemitic party, but he had left by the age of 17. So this involvement doesn’t even prove that was an antisemitic teenager, let alone that he is antisemitic now.”
    Harry Phibbs, Guardian
    Blimey, it would appear Gengis Khan reborn he is not after all.

  21. Brian Burton 30 Jan 2010, 6:59pm

    Sister Mary Clarence,
    You can prattle on till doomsday and you still will never justify the Homophbic Polish right or any other anti Gay organisation. I would have prefered it if Cameron had really laid his cards on the table instead of his smoothie endorment of these polish thugs.
    I pity you S.M.C. You are either sick or easily mis-lead.

  22. When Sister Mary, I’ve got a nice job, nice car, nice house, Clarence attacks Bryant for his position and income, I am sure many of us will remember his/her defence of her working-class Tory lifestyle. She does well to emulate her betters! Having left her left-wing sympathies behind, we can well sum her up in the following:
    The working class can kiss my arse,
    I’ve got my house and car at last.
    As always she is prepared to defend the indefensible.

  23. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 10:06pm

    Brian, you seem very well informed on the subject, so,please tell me the difference between the Tory allies in Europe the Polish Law and Justice Party and the Labour allies the Self Defence of the Republic party.

    Perhaps you consider the overt racism of its members to be acceptable – talk us through that please.

    Actually mate – could you explain the basis for your opposition to the Polish Law and Justice Party, and please don’t just trot out that they are racism. If you could cite actual evidence to suport your views, rather than just regurgitating the fact that they are homophobic without the slightest knowledge of what you are talking about, I’d be grateful (and surprised)!!

  24. Sister Mary clarence 30 Jan 2010, 10:09pm

    Oh and welcome back Neville, I’ve missed you. I particularly missed you condemning those Labour MPs who had rinsed every last cent out of the public by way of expenses for years. Whilst I was happy to lay into the Tory MPs who did, you were a very noticeable Labour troll missing from the condemnation of the Labour crooks.

    Double standards … I think so.

  25. Sister Mary clarence 31 Jan 2010, 8:50am

    I’ll correct my last but one posting before someone else does – racist, not racism

  26. Brian Burton 31 Jan 2010, 9:39am

    Sister Mary Clarence,
    In echoing most sensable voices on these threads…GET STUFFED you cretin!!

  27. I am surprised at this non-news event. Usually its Labour that bitches everyone who doesn’t agree with them!

  28. Brian Burton 31 Jan 2010, 1:14pm

    Squidgy, Nay, Nay and thrice Nay, It’s SMC who’s the Bitch!!

  29. Sister Mary clarence 31 Jan 2010, 8:32pm

    You feeling a bit chilly there Brian …. you seem to have been exposed.

  30. Brian Burton 1 Feb 2010, 8:16am

    Nay, nay and thrice nay SMC, I’ve always been hot stuff!

  31. Brian Burton 1 Feb 2010, 11:01am

    I really thought Goorge Osbourne’s Brocken-Brittain speach was Rich when It is Expence-hungry MPs and Crooked Bankers who have brought this Country to it’s knees! And SMC and her Ilk support Osborne.

  32. I am going to put my oar in here and say that Sisiter Mary Clarence and Brian Burton are both correct. The Polish Law and Justice party has been accused of being homophobic, anti-semetic and xenophobic. The fact that a certain amount of international pressure has softened their stance somewhat – the facts still remain that the present president of Poland Lech kazinski (there are new presdential elections coming up this year and hopefully he will be replaced) is homophobic is a well known practical fact. He stopped Pride parades in Krakow by going on an ‘official visit’ to the city at exactly the time of the Pride which had to be cabcelled as a result. He uses perfidious methods to stop gay events. There are other instances that are too many to go into here. He has four court cases against him at the moment in the human rights courts brought about by LGBT groups. He and his brother were voted into power with the help of the Roman Catholic Church manipulating the older population via the homophobic, anti-semetic, xenophobia Radio Station, Radio Maria and the same radia station is at it again manipulating their old generation audience who have voting power by using very clever psychology. There are a few instances where some postive reports are being published at the moment. The fact that the Law and Order party joined forces with the Tories is not good for the Tories and this is a well worn and well known fact. The Tories have a history of homophobia and so have the Law and Justice party so birds of a feather flock together. The Law and Justice party was voted out after only two years in power because of their policies generally. Poland is divided in half – those that support Radio Maria and the Law and Justice party and those that support Tusk and the Civil Platform party in power at the moment. The fact that homophobia still exists in this country is as a direct result of the teachings of RCC, and thus the tradions of the country have been linked with this. Fortunately the situation here is improving but homophobia is still almost tangible in the streets where I get laughed at and rumours spread about me (and I am just a very small example) One gay guy I know has a lesbian girlfriend (good for both of them as a cover) his immediate family know that he is gay but his extended family and his ‘friends’ do not and it is kept very secret from them. The Law and Justice part are not in power but neither they nor the Civil platform party are doing another visually constructive to stop homophobia here. There is a lot of LGBT work going on behind he scenes to change the situation here. I have hope for the future as I belisve that Poland will be a great nation in its own right but there are still many changes to be made and these are taking a long, long time to do.
    Let us not fight amoung ourselves. I hope in someway this helps to balance the act.

  33. Apologies for the typos I wrote it in a abit of a hurry but I hope you get the jist of it.

  34. I do hope the minister was engaging in this playground squabble in his own time and on his own computer!

  35. “please tell me the difference between the Tory allies in Europe the Polish Law and Justice Party and the Labour allies the Self Defence of the Republic party.”

    Surely the important difference isn’t between the two parties (which I know little about, so I will simply accept your account for now) but between the situations with relation to the UK parties? The Labour party are part of a very large and long-standing grouping in the European parliament; they didn’t seek out the individual members of it – I don’t doubt that there are people in the group they would prefer not to be in with, but the UK Labour party is only a small part of the larger grouping, and were they to leave it they would be sacrificing a lot of UK influence in Europe by marginalizing themselves.

    The Conservatives are part of a small grouping which they founded themselves, and which is led by a member of the Law and Justice party. Somewhat more worrying.

  36. In the article, iaindale says:
    “I really don’t think anyone has laid a glove on Blair so far.”

    … although many would most ardently like to!

  37. Iain Dale blocked me on Twitter when, after a discussion about the oddity that is a gay Tory, I provided a link to the Conservative party’s voting record on gay issues.

    The man’s an ignorant irrelevance.

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