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Irish civil partnerships bill progresses through parliament

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  1. Simon Murphy 28 Jan 2010, 5:30pm

    As well as concerns about children, there’s also the critical gap that denies same sex couples the right to enter the contract of civil marriage because of their sexual orientation.

    However that isn’t going to be addressed until after gay couples’ relationships have been granted 2nd class legal status with CP’s.

    It’s inadequate of course but it’s progress.

    At least GLEN (who were instrumental in drafting this bill) are more advanced than Stonewall in that they accept that 2nd class civil partnerships are inadequate and that until the point is reached that gay couples can get married and straight couples can get CP’s then the fight for equality is not over.

    I look forward to GLEN’s plan of action to introduce civil marriage for same sex couples once the CP Bill becomes law.

    If they don’t then they are announcing that they have become as irrelevant as Stonewall. A gay rights group which opposes equality for gay people has no purpose after all.

  2. Christine Rourke 28 Jan 2010, 6:11pm

    I agree, Simon.

    This in itself is a huge step forward for Eire.

    My old dear (staunch Irish catholic) must be beside herself and spitting storm und drang over this!

    I am sure GLEN will not let this lie. Their leadership, unlike Stonewall’s, are not still stuck in the 1980′s, and neither are they stooges of any political party.

    Chrissie
    xx

  3. Simon, introducing civil marriage would not bring equality; it would effectively bar gay couples with religious faith from having their marriages recognised. If we want equality we need to have the same opportunities as straight people. Creating a hierarchy within the gay community in which atheists are acceptable but people of faith are second class citizens would be totally unacceptable. There should be equal access to marriage in all its forms, not the full range of marriage for straights and a limited range for gays.

  4. Simon Murphy 28 Jan 2010, 10:45pm

    “Simon, introducing civil marriage would not bring equality; it would effectively bar gay couples with religious faith from having their marriages recognised.”

    Well perhaps but seeing as Ireland is a predominantly catholic country I don’t think there’s any chance of those THAT church ever performing same sex marriage.

    A church wedding has no legal status until the couple sign the state register anyway. And a church is under no obligation to perform ANY wedding. Let’s see a straight divorcee try to get married in a catholic church. It simply is not going to happen.

    Civil marriage has no religious component. I personally would favour marriage equality AND civil partnership equality for gay and straight but the Irish government has absolutely no intention of introducing CP’s for straight couples, so civil marriage equality should be the focus.

  5. Gay activist Paul Mitchell 29 Jan 2010, 2:16am

    * What a shame the Irish civil partnership model is not based on the UK version – that includes the recognition of children on IVF parentage and access, adoption rights, altristic surrogacy access and parentage, etc.

    * Does the Irish CP version include opposite sex couples – which the UK version does not???????

  6. Gay activist Paul Mitchell 29 Jan 2010, 2:19am

    * Ireland is the only western European country that does not formally recognise same sex relationships!!!!!!!

    * Monaco is not actually a country – but a principality.

    * It is time that Ireland stepped into the year 2010 and not slip back into 2000!!!!!!

  7. What annoys me the most and what I don’t think many people have picked up upon is that Ireland is one of the most tolerant countries in Western Europe with regards to homosexuality. (Actually more than people care to believe). A survey suggested that over 80% of people support the right of gays and lesbians to MARRY. What annoys me is that the government is in a situation to introduce full gay marriage and adoption, with very little opposition in the country in the form of political parties, yet it fails to do so because it doesn’t want to be seen to be acting too quickly.

  8. Patrick James 29 Jan 2010, 7:01am

    What annoys me the most and what I don’t think many people have picked up upon is that Ireland is one of the most tolerant countries in Western Europe with regards to homosexuality.

    Yes, I think this is quite believable. The problem is that the Catholic church has tremendous power.

    I don’t think the recent blasphemy legislation would have had widespread support amongst the actual people of the Republic of Ireland, and yet there it is just the same :(

  9. Patrick James 29 Jan 2010, 7:04am

    Looks like the “blockquote” HTML tags don’t work in these comments.

    Here is posting again with quote in italics and with attribution:

    Anon writes:

    What annoys me the most and what I don’t think many people have picked up upon is that Ireland is one of the most tolerant countries in Western Europe with regards to homosexuality.

    Yes, I think this is quite believable. The problem is that the Catholic church has tremendous power.

    I don’t think the recent blasphemy legislation would have had widespread support amongst the actual people of the Republic of Ireland, and yet there it is just the same :(

  10. Mihangel apYrs 29 Jan 2010, 8:13am

    Tony:
    all marriage is civil in that the register has to be signed before it is legal.

    THe sacrificing of an animal, or sprinkling with money, or whatever rituals are carried out by a sects witch doctor only makes that marriage “holy” in the sight of that sect’s deity: without the signatures, no marriage.

    So take up the “religious” marriage issue with your particular superstition’s heirarchy.

  11. “The problem is that the Catholic church has tremendous power.”

    But no where near as much as they had, and its falling month on month, thanks to judicial enquiries to their child abuse and cover ups. And there’s growing support to oust this child abusers from education. Anon is quite right, Ireland is very tolerant society, its her government that can’t keep up with her people.

    “So take up the “religious” marriage issue with your particular superstition’s heirarchy.”

    Precisely Mihangel apYrs… and Tony, why would anyone’s faith demand that a few child abusers in drag make your commitment to your partner more legally “valid”? If your into that sort of thing join the Unitarians, but in the mean time, I suggest you examine your faith, as your marriage will never be recognised by those who condemn you.

  12. Ireland is a tolerant country. Thats certainly not the experience of migrants who have settled there. Maybe its a case of saning national face.Will is a prime example of why Ireland is full of Island people with a village mentality.

  13. The bill would recognise straight and gay couples who cohabate. Civil partnerships, however, would only be for gay couples. This cicl partnership bill is probably the most conservative option for the Irish government to take. The opposition parties in the Oireachtas (Parliament) seem to support more recognition of gay couples. Opinion polls suggest that Irish people support gay marriage by over 60%. 84% seem to support civil partnerships. Ireland is Catholic but that doesn’t always lead to homophobia.

  14. Simon Murphy 30 Jan 2010, 1:29am

    The CP Bill is inadequate but it is what we are going to get in 2010.

    It’s not enough, but I am heartened by the fact that there is a well organised marriage equality movement in Ireland who are already campaigning for equality.

    CP’s this year. But the campaign for equality will continue (take a note Stonewall UK)

  15. Simon Murphy 30 Jan 2010, 1:38am

    It would probably be a good idea to start asking the Labour Party in Ireland to include marriage equality in their election campaign.

    Labour are very supportive of equality and will probably be in coalition with Fine Gael after the next election. Start putting the pressure on those Labour bodies is my suggestion.

  16. “Will is a prime example of why Ireland is full of Island people with a village mentality.”

    And you “faggot”, should try back up your bitchy little remarks with some facts…. otherwise, you just look like an offensive racist idiot.

  17. If you are interested you should just look up the back issues of the Irish Times.There are high levels of racism in Ireland compared to other parts of western Europe. The stigma attached to disability in that country is severe.Though there has been quite a lot of progress in the advancement of gay people.
    I guess if I criticise the treatment of gay people in Islamic societies that makes me an offensive islamophobe!

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