And lets all try for a quote that isn’t 20 years old….

Dr. Michael Ward, Is the ‘deadly AIDS virus’ Government Fraud?, New York Native, 4, February, 1991.

Meanwhile, as you say, Will, they appear unfortunately to be like those basket-cases who stand at motorway intersections screeching at passing cars about the end of the world.

Such is the diversity of humanity!

Hope you rescued your toast, Jean-Paul, and had a lovely breakfast!

Sepkowitz KA (June 2001). “AIDS–the first 20 years”. N. Engl. J. Med. 344 (23): 1764–72. doi:10.1056/NEJM200106073442306. PMID 11396444.

Weiss RA (May 1993). “How does HIV cause AIDS?”. Science (journal) 260 (5112): 1273–9. PMID 8493571.

Divisions of HIV/AIDS Prevention (2003). “HIV and Its Transmission”. Centers for Disease Control & Prevention. http://www.cdc.gov/HIV/pubs/facts/transmission.htm. Retrieved 2006-05-23.

Garbage. This is a magazine run by AIDS denialist. All the editors died of AIDS…. it would be funny if it wasn’t so bloody tragic.

Dr. Stefan Lanka produced no proof scientifically of their so called “theory”, and based on an interview with him in 1995…. right. Time stopped in 1995, did it? You’re worse than Daz with his 1984 cut off point! This is also garbage quote, means nothing.

As for the rest are just quotes!!!! This is your proof???? A few quotes???

Last time I checked Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, and Mahatma Gandhi weren’t credited scientists on AIDS…. so a few random quotes is supposed to be your proof? LOL! Your a idiot, Bob…. so basically I can PROVE the earth is flat, simply if I throw a few quotes at you from, ohhhh, lets say Socrates, and that’s my point proven??? You’re a farce, Bob.

Where are the controlled verifiable studies that ewe asked for?

Where are the scientific papers we asked for?

You have nothing.

Not one shred of verifiable proof. Is it so hard to find one study that is controlled, that proves your case?

Clearly not.

Your inability to proven any proof is clear validation of the PROVEN scientific consensus that HIV causes AIDS.

And until then, you’re nothing but another internet nutter with a crackpot theory on something you can’t prove…. rather like one of those basket cases who stands at the motorway intersection shouting at cars about the end of the world.

You are a complete joke Bob. And to think you childish insults are suppose to offend us….!

Eleni Papadopulos-Eleopulos, Is HIV the cause of AIDS?, Continuum, Autumn 1997

“The HIV hypothesis ranks with the ‘bad air’ theory for malaria and the ‘bacterial infection’ theory of beriberi and pellagra [caused by nutritional deficiencies]. It is a hoax that became a scam.”

Dr. Bernard Forscher, Conspiracy of Silence, The Sunday Times, 3 April 1994.

“It is a dire example of how a distinguished scholar who has contributed much to the advancement of science, now impedes further progress by his stubborn adherence to a dogma of his own creation.”

Johann Wolfgang von Goethe, Maximen und Reflexionen, Texstelle 586. (1749–1832).

“I found that when they are speaking about HIV they are not speaking about a virus. They are speaking about cellular characteristics and activities of cells under very special conditions…I realized that the whole group of viruses to which HIV is said to belong, the retroviruses, in fact do not exist at all.”

Dr. Stefan Lanka, Virologist, Zenger’s, December, 1998.

“The HIV-causes-AIDS dogma represents the grandest and perhaps the most morally destructive fraud that has ever been perpetrated on the young men and women of the Western world.”

Dr. Charles Thomas, Conspiracy of Silence, The Sunday Times, April 1994.

“An error can never become true however many times you repeat it. The truth can never be wrong, even if no one ever hears about it. Truth alone will endure; all the rest will be swept away before the tide of time.”

Mahatma Gandhi (1869 – 1948).

Then there was a guy names Jones…something about grape-flavored cool-aid and cyanide.

Did you her about about those guys who believed they had to commit ritual suicide in order for their their identities (?) be transferred to a space vessel hiding behind the moon?

Oh yeah, and then there was this one that appeared in PinkNews not too long ago:

“A film about HIV and what causes AIDS has been attacked for being misleading and even dangerous. HIV charities and health experts have told PinkNews.co.uk that the ideas the film promotes are “pseudo-science” and could damage the public health.”

Oh-oh, toasts are burning…bye. Don’t take any wooden nickels, whatever that means!

Now, on queue, Rob magical appears to pick up the reigns. How convenient.

And still the same cyclical nonsense of insult, followed by an unproven statement, then followed by an insult. Why bother to go through all this, if they want to believe not taking antiviral drugs will save them, go for it, I say…. its a democracy, kill yourself is you want. Bully for them. Might take their defective genes and mental instability out of society, it can only be of benifit. But why the pathological insistence that other kill themselves too? Is it the whole David Koresh mentality, me die for my beliefs, so me make you die too? And the attack on science begin some kind of conspiracy…. now THATS disturbing!!!! Its has to be a form of schizophrenia they have (Bob is well beyond that, I’m afraid, he’s a dribbling lunatic)

Again, very selfish mentality.

And STILL no proof from Daz or Rob. What a pair of uneducated degenerates.

Then do you research, Rob, it tends to educate better than infantile comments like yours. You’ll feel less stupid around us, and you might be able to join in on the conversation without resorting to behaviour more suitable to that of a 14 year old pubescent teenage. There’s a good chap.

“The fact is that the opportunity for sexual promiscuity in the west among straights far outweighs that in Africa.”

What proof do you have of this? Oh, sorry, you have none. My mistake.

“Not to mention the fact that anal intercourse between men and women in the West has been on a steady rise for the past couple of decades and is practiced as an alternative to contraception.”

What proof do you have of this? Oh, sorry, you have none. My mistake.

Never any proof, just made up statements of belief. Welcome to the “god channel” folks.

Yeah, if we’re the Hinge and Brackett Show, you must Rain Man.

If that last comment is the best you can come up with, denialists like you have f*** all chance of convincing anyone but yourselves of your nonsense.

Be sure to shout it from the rooftops when you find out. But for now, gu fvck yourself….and be gentle, you may like it.

Fvck off!

I still want to know why there is not a heterosexual epidemic of HIV in the West at least on a par with that of Africa. The fact is that the opportunity for sexual promiscuity in the west among straights far outweighs that in Africa. Not to mention the fact that anal intercourse between men and women in the West has been on a steady rise for the past couple of decades and is practiced as an alternative to contraception. Strange that!

As you say, unless they quickly get back on course and hope to hell their immune systems are now not too far gone, then Daz, Charles, bob, et all, are indeed destined to be added to the above list.

It’s a kind of suicide. And, when you think about it, not so different really from going on an all-out drugs-spree for three years!

Eddy, fantastic post. The sad and tragic reality is that these people, Daz, Rob et all, are destined to be added to this list, and all because they believe a “few vitamins and clean water” will cure them, rather than established and proven science.

The real tragedy, of course, is that they try to encourage others to risk their lives to do the same…. which I’m sure will make their eventual demise and death all the easier for them to swallow. Rather selfish, don’t you think?

Ken Anderlini

Ken Anderlini was a co-moderator of the “AIDS Myth Exposed” message board on MSN. Anderlini died in April of 2007. Denialist David Crowe from the “Alberta Reappraising AIDS Society” wrote an announcement of his death, saying: “Over the past couple of years his health had declined rapidly with a strange neurological disease for which nobody could pinpoint the cause (except doctors who claimed it was HIV related, of course).”

Fela Anikulapo-Kuti

Fela Anikulapo-Kuti, the great Nigerian music star, “died in 1997 of a disease he claimed didn’t exist, and certainly not in Africa: AIDS. No matter that Fela’s older brother, Professor Olikoye Ransome-Kuti, had served as the country’s health minister and launched Nigeria’s much-lauded early AIDS program. . . . There was hardly an illness African herbs couldn’t cure, Fela maintained, and he dismissed condoms as unnatural, unpleasurable, and a white plot to reduce the black birthrate. He believed, says Olikoye, that “all doctors were fabricating AIDS, including myself.” Fela was 58.

(Mark Schoofs, “A Tale of Two Brothers Part 2: Fela Didn’t Believe AIDS Existed. But then he died of the disease. His brother is still trying to convince Fela’s fans that HIV is real.” Village Voice, November 10 – 16, 1999.)

Michael Bellefountaine

A member of the denialist ACT UP/San Francisco, Michael Bellafontaine died on May 10, 2007. He was 41. His Bay Area Reporter obituary said that “According to Andrea Lindsay, a friend and fellow activist, Mr. Bellefountaine died of a sudden systemic infection, though the exact cause has not been determined.”

Sophie Brassard

Sophie Brassard, a Canadian, was the HIV-positive mother of two HIV-positive, perinatally-infected sons. Citing the influence of HEAL, Alive and Well, Duesberg and Mullis, she refused to allow her children access to medical care when the became ill and fled the country with them. She consequently lost custody and parental rights. She died of AIDS on September 16, 2002, at age 37.

Ronnie Burk

Ronnie Burke was a member of the dissident group ACT UP/San Francisco (which has been denounced by other legitimate ACT UP groups). He died from AIDS in March of 2003 at the age of 47.

Jerry Colinard

Jerry Colinard, a board member of San Diego HEAL, died on July 4, 2009, at the age of 55, of AIDS. His webpage recalls that “Jerry supported the HIV community and was honored by a San Diego agency, ‘Being Alive,’ for his commitment. However by 2001 he had rejected traditional Western drug centered HIV medicine. He referred to himself as an ‘AIDS dissident’ thereafter.”

Sylvie Cousseau

Sylvie Cousseau contributed to a list of testimonials from people who tested HIV positive but embraced AIDS denial and rejected HIV treatment. This list of testimonials features on several different websites, including HEAL Toronto and the personal web pages of Rudolf Werner, Professor of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology at the University of Miami:

Sylvie Cousseau was the partner of Mark Griffiths. Sylvie died in 2001 at age 41. Cousseau’s death was reported in postings to AIDS denial message boards in France.

Boyd Ed Graves

Boyd Graves was an HIV-positive lawyer who promoted the false view that HIV was developed by the US National Cancer Institute as part of a military programme to develop biological warfare agents for use against targeted communities. He found an NCI “flowchart” which he misinterpreted as demonstrating the existence of this programme, and initiated several unsuccessful lawsuits against the US government. While he believed that this manufactured HIV causes AIDS, he questioned the science of antiretroviral therapy and instead promoted as an “AIDS cure” a substance called “Tetracyl” or “Tetrasil” — a silver compound with no known medical benefits and no evidence to support its use in HIV. According to an email circulated by his supporters he died in June 2009, apparently of AIDS, after several “Tetracyl” injections failed to reverse his illness. As far what we are aware he never took antiretrovirals.

Mark Griffiths

Mark Griffiths ran a denialist website called Altheal (along with a French version, Sidasante), until he died in October 2004. In the article linked below, the AIDS denialist Liam Scheff ponders the cause of his death, suggesting Griffiths may still have been using heroin (because he seemed a “bit groggy” sometimes); this is despite the fact that Griffiths had undergone successful recovery in the late 1980s. Scheff ultimately concluded that Griffiths died because he was abusing alcohol.

Another associate, Emma Hollister, suggests Griffiths’ death was related to a course of antibiotics taken several months before for dental work.

Robert Johnston

Robert Johnston was a co-founder of HEAL Toronto and a co-author of the self-described “rebuttal” of the Durban Declaration that was posted to HEAL Toronto’s website in 2000. At the time, he wrote: “Robert Johnston is a co-founder of HEAL Toronto, and has been HIV-positive since 1985 yet has suffered no unusual illness since that time. He attributes his good health to not taking any anti-HIV medications and to not believing that his positive antibody test has much significance.”

Johnston died three years later on April 3, 2003. As with all other similar cases, Johnston’s colleagues claim his death was not caused by HIV infection. David Crowe wrote that he died of “liver failure completely unrelated to AIDS.”

John Kirkham

John Kirkham, an HIV+ denialist who managed the altheal website, died of pneumonia in 2008. His friends attribute his death to having survived lymphoma, a difficult personal relationship, and a chilly, damp house.

Kelly Jon Landis

We regret to report that Kelly Jon Landis died December 3, 2007 in Santa Monica, CA, at age 39 after suffering for several months with lymphoma and other AIDS symptoms. Self-described as the “dissident saint,” he was a health food fanatic and avid bicycle rider who avoided standard medical care and sought alternative therapies. He felt that simply leading a drug-free healthy lifestyle would protect him from disease.

Although a “dissident” himself, Kelly Jon Landis vocally opposed the homophobia rampant among HIV/AIDS denialists.

Sandi Lenfestey

Sandi Lenfestey, a member of HEAL San Diego, died on January 11, 2009. She was 47, and had two children. To understand the real cost of denialism, see her young son’s shattering message to his mother.

Jack Levine

Jack Levine was a regular poster to the “Virusmyth” message board. When he became sick and began to question denialism, the other board members turned on him, which eventually led to the Virusmyth message board being taken permanently offline in order to hide the appalling record of what happened. Levine died from AIDS in March of 2002 at the age of 47.

Raphael Lombardo

Raphael Lombardo was a gay man who believed Peter Duesberg’s claims that HIV was harmless. Lombardo wrote to Duesberg on May 30, 1995, noting that he had never used any recreational drugs or pharmaceuticals and was not sick, despite testing HIV positive (the letter was titled “Life without AZT !”). Duesberg published the entire letter in his book “Inventing the AIDS Virus” and wrote of Lombardo: “His letter proves that true science does not depend on institutional authority.”

Raphael Lombardo died of AIDS a little over a year later, on June 11, 1996. When asked about Lombardo’s death, Duesberg wrote: “In hindsight, I think his letter was almost too good to be true. I am afraid now, he described the man he wanted to be [e.g. that he did not use recreational drugs] and his Italian family expected him to be, but not the one he really was. I think he died from Kaposi’s.” (Source: Email to Richard Jefferys from Peter Duesberg, Wednesday, April 05, 2006) When this correspondence was published on the internet, Duesberg was contacted by Raphael Lombardo’s sister, Regina, who was incensed by Duesberg’s claim that her brother had covertly used poppers or other recreational drugs (as Duesberg was implying). Duesberg wrote back to her and told her that she was wrong, too.

Peter Mokaba

Peter Makoba, a senior politician in South Africa’s ruling party, the African National Congress, and a prominent denialist, died in 2002 at the age of 43 from AIDS-related pneumonia after a “long illness.” He denied that he had AIDS and rejected antiretroviral drugs as poison.

Christine Maggiore

Christine Maggiore was an HIV-positive denialist who founded the “Alive&Well AIDS Alternatives” denialist organisation. She wrote and self-published the book What If Everything You Thought You Knew about AIDS Was Wrong? Her 3-year old daughter Eliza Jane Scovill died of AIDS-related pneumonia after Maggiore had refused to take medication to prevent mother-to-child transmission of HIV or to have the child tested for HIV. Christine Maggiore died at the age of 52 in December 2008. She died of AIDS. Read AIDSTruth’s editorial on her death: Christine Maggiore’s Death: Lessons from a Tragedy.

These articles provide further details on Maggiore and the death of her daughter:

* The HIV Disbelievers: Christine Maggiore is a different kind of AIDS activist—one who tells people to forget safe sex and stop taking their lifesaving drugs.
* A Mother’s Denial, a Daughter’s Death:”The HIV-positive mother of two laid out matter-of-factly why, even while pregnant, she hadn’t taken HIV medications, and why she had never tested her children for the virus… Seven weeks later, Eliza Jane was dead.”
* A report on Eliza-Jane Scovill’s death, in rebuttal to that of Mohammed Al-Bayati
* Coroner’s Report regarding Eliza-Jane Scovill’s death

Marietta Ndziba

Marietta Ndziba was used by the vitamin salesman Matthias Rath to market multivitamins as an alternative to antiretroviral treatment. In a pamphlet distributed by Rath and his agents in Cape Town, South Africa in September 2005, she was quoted as saying that her CD4 count rose from 365 to 841 due to Rath’s vitamins. She implied that these vitamins treated boils on her arm, her grey skin, diarrhoea and vomiting. She said “I just thank God that he brings vitamins here to South Africa to help our lives.” As far as the South African AIDS activist organisation Treatment Action Campaign could ascertain Ndziba never took antiretrovirals. She died in about October 2005. One family member reportedly claimed that she died of a stress headache. Rath’s vitamins clearly did not help Ndziba. She should have been treated by qualified doctors in the public health system, not Rath or his agents.

Astoundingly, a video recording of Ndziba claiming the benefits of Rath’s vitamins continued to be available on the front page of Rath’s South African website until January 2006. (Source: TAC)

David Pasquarelli

David Pasquarelli, a leader of the denialist group “ACT UP San Francisco” developed PCP, anemia, thrush, meningitis, mycobacterium and disseminated CMV before he died in March of 2004. He was 37.

Casper G. Schmidt

Casper G. Schmidt was a psychiatrist who published “The Group-Fantasy Origins of AIDS” in the Journal of Psychohistory in 1984. The article, which claimed that AIDS was not a real disease but a product of “epidemic hysteria,” is still regularly cited by AIDS denialists. Schmidt died from AIDS in 1994.

Tony Tompsett

Tony Tompsett wrote for the denialist newsletter Continuum from 1993 until just before his death in 1998 at age 39 from Kaposi’s sarcoma, toxoplasmosis and possible pneumonia.

Huw Christie Williams

Huw Christie (Huw Christie Harry Williams) was an editor of Continuum, a long-running AIDS denialist newsletter from the UK that folded when all the editors died. Huw Christie developed Kaposi’s sarcoma and died in August of 2001. He was 41.

In an email, Peter Duesberg described Christie’s death as follows: “Did you know Hugh* Christie? Also a gay friend of mine from London, filmmaker and editor of the very popular British gay-interested journal, Continuum. Christie campaigned actively against the health and AIDS hazards of poppers in Continuum. Like me, he was invited by Mbeki, to discuss the causes of AIDS in Africa in 2000. And a year or two later he passed away with Kaposi’s, from long-term over-use/addiction to poppers!”* (Source: Email to Richard Jeffreys from Peter Duesberg, Wednesday, April 05, 2006. *Name misspelled and exclamation point in the original.)

Jody Wells

Jody Wells was the founder of the U.K. denialist newsletter Continuum. He had multiple bouts of PCP before he died in August of 1995.

Scott Zanetti

Scott Zanetti, Morristown NJ, died October 6, 2002 at age 52. Scott Zanetti is another contributor to the list of testimonials mentioned in the entry on Sylvie Cousseau, above. Zanetti also wrote to POZ magazine about being inspired by the writings of Celia Farber, and contributed to the “personal stories” on the HEAL San Diego website.

Source:
http://www.aidstruth.org/denialism/dead_denialists

Does L. Ron Hubbard come to mind here?

It seems that Gary Leigh edited and published a science-fiction and fantasy magazine – a “fanzine!! (This would tie in with his often boasting that he sold his publishing company in order to pursue his LifeORMeth campaign.) And interestingly, the following Wiki article also tells us that “The fanzine also gained a reputation for being sometimes too willing to report rumour as fact.” Hmmm. He was a bit inclined towards the same problem that the AIDS-Denialists have, it seems.

Also we learn that the magazine “became well-known for taking a generally critical tone towards . . . the work of producer John Nathan-Turner, who was subjected to several personal attacks in its pages.”

And apparently “The original fanzine was founded and edited by Gary Levy, who later changed his name to Gary Leigh”!

Doesn’t inspire much confidence, does it.

I wonder what else one might dig up!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dreamwatch

Eddy, great site. Shows their lies beautifully. And yeah, such a “considence2 that these randomers pop up, like Kevin, to “defend” the right to a balanced “debate”. A debate needs evidence, and we’ve provided ours…. they have provided nothing other that stupid statements and emotive histrionics.

I’m tired of this, its time Daz produce some proof. One paper. Just one. I won’t hold my breath, Daz is clearly more damaged mentally then either of us probably realise.

Sepkowitz KA (June 2001). “AIDS–the first 20 years”. N. Engl. J. Med. 344 (23): 1764–72. doi:10.1056/NEJM200106073442306. PMID 11396444.

Weiss RA (May 1993). “How does HIV cause AIDS?”. Science (journal) 260 (5112): 1273–9. PMID 8493571.

Divisions of HIV/AIDS Prevention (2003). “HIV and Its Transmission”. Centers for Disease Control & Prevention. http://www.cdc.gov/HIV/pubs/facts/transmission.htm. Retrieved 2006-05-23.

Just three of thousands that prove our point.

As you cannot provide even one, this makes you a liar Daz (and you so called “friends” who sound exactly like you do…. hmmmm, Curious