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Controversial Daily Mail journalist addresses gay event

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  1. Phillips is a total humbug. – (I hope she’s cool with that, bearing in mind her defence of the right to give offence).

    The irony is that she’s the real moral relativist. She seems to think that heterosexual relationships can be defended only by undermining gay ones.

    Not only does gay marriage not undermine heterosexual marriage; it actually strengthens it. Intelligent conservatives recognise this – the whole idea, pre Thatcher, that we were all part of one society. It’s just that Phillips seems determined to prove that the idea is oxymoronic.

    If her deeply unattractive and contradictory snarlings are the best that the anti gay brigade can come up with, then there may be hope for us yet.

  2. People with dogma should not be allowed to have a place of power.

  3. .

    Oh, yeah!

    Then what about the domga of Summerskill?

    .

  4. Despite all her comments about Christians, it is important to remember that Phillips is Jewish and a Zionist. The latter attempts to deny the rights of Palestinians to live in the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem. Are her attempts to deny equal rights to Gay people really any different from a denial of rights to Palestinians?

  5. Zionists will always have irrational fascist beliefs.

  6. Harthacanute 14 Oct 2009, 2:55pm

    Who cares what that sour old bigot has to say about anything?

    She is so past her sell-by date that she isn’t even fit for a run as an afternoon repeat on daytime TV on a bank holiday Monday.

    Are her attempts to deny equal rights to Gay people really any different from a denial of rights to Palestinians?

    Or indeed her attempts to silence those of us who are Jewish and don’t agree her.

  7. Bravo on the audience for giving Phillips freedom to speak unfettered. Whichever way you look at it, New Labour has tried its damnest to demoralise and weaken the family structure, particularly with its systematically ludicrous benefits system that rewards unmarried girls with council homes, and there is no denying that the violent, feral underclass that is on the rise in the UK is a direct result of this. Of course the family unit comprising a mother and father is the norm because it provides the child with a polarity of genders from which to learn about life, but then certain situations do lend themselves for a child to be brought up in a same-sex family. I think we are in danger of banging the drum too hard in demanding we have everything on a level footing with heteros because the nature of our identity doesn’t put us on a level footing in terms of procreating with the person we are going to spend the rest of our lives with. I am sorry, but I am grateful to have been conceived by two people who already loved and cared for each other rather than be unnaturally ejaculated into a test tube and passed onto a go-between to be artificially inseminated, no matter how much those waiting in the wings may be lusting after a little bundle of joy to fawn over. Nature made us the way we are, but in demanding babies on tap and to order we are also interfering with Nature’s natural order.
    As for Angela Eagle, couldn’t they have chosen someone more credible to speak against Phillips? Anyone who has passed through the revolving door from Stonewall to Whitehall in one fell swoop does not earn my respect, frankly. Lest we forget, it is New Labour that has made George Orwell’s 1984 a reality, so we should be asking what hymnsheet she really sings from these days. Clearly Stonewall is key to implementing New Labour’s thought-speak agenda.

  8. Unfortunately, Rob is tarred with the same bigoted brush as the Zionist Phillips. One wonders if, like her, he is a racist.
    Not everyone is smugly able to assert that he is a product of the 2.4 average family. Like the Jewish Zionist, he obviously has no thought for equality nor for those who are different from himself.

  9. Simon Murphy 14 Oct 2009, 3:38pm

    Village Drinks should be ashamed of themselves for giving a platform to a deranged fascist like Phillips.

    And for Angela Eagle and Ben Summerskill to attend an event thereby legitiming Phillips’ extremism is beyond sick. I’d expect it from Summerskill mind.

  10. If Rob is correct, then people not born of hetero parents will (presumably) be loudly wailing that they wish they had never been born. If have yet to hear this wail, perhaps surprisingly.

    Having parents of the opposite sex may have its advantages but it is ludicrous to suggest that these should trump all others.

    In an ideal world, parents would be intelligent, altruistic, patient faithful, in rude health, and reasonably well off, yet none of these are “show stoppers” when it comes to parenthood, unlike being gay apparently.

    And to add insult to injury the same people who are dead against our breeding also attack us for helping to lead humanity towards extinction.

    And even leaving children aside gay couples in marriage or civil partnerships are entitled to the same respect, no more and no less, than straight couples.

    As I understand it, Phillips is against Civil Partnerships, full stop. So if you want to pay extra tax when your partner dies, if you want to run the risk of being denied access to his sickbed, or if you want to be physically separated if you happen to fall in love with a foreigner, if you want to live in a society that tells you that your deepest relationships are morally and socially worthless, then go ahead, support her.

    I suspect, however, that you will be in the minority.

  11. Pumpkin Pie 14 Oct 2009, 3:56pm

    Hate speech is a mockery of freedom of speech, whether or not it advocates violence, and it needs to be stamped out entirely. Freedom of speech is about the free exchange of ideas, not about slagging other people off and telling vicious lies.

    As for Rob’s comment, this whole “two genders” thing is bull****. Same-sex parents provide just as good an upbringing as mixed-sex parents. I’d like people to actually start posting some real scientific evidence that mixed-sex parenting has better results than same-sex parenting.

  12. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 4:00pm

    Simon M.
    As a Gay Christian I have to constantly read on these threads your anti-Christian sentiments and I would not dream of calling you a ‘deranged atheist’ so, Phillips’ should be given a platform as you are able to enjoy on these threads.

  13. vulpus_rex 14 Oct 2009, 4:17pm

    The level of dishonest cant in here is staggering.

    Melanie Phillips might have opinions that don’t accord with your own, but she is at least able to deliver them in a measured way and state why she thinks thus.

    Contrast that with the general hysteria here – “WHAT! You don’t agree with me on EVERYTHING – you must be a FASCIST PIG, BURN in Hell you B8tich” seems to be the standard response – all a bit student union juvenalia.

    I remain deeply suspiscious of people who want to silence others
    for daring to have minds of their own.

  14. Vulpus Regina is screaming again! Perhaps medication on a regular basis is necessary.

  15. @Vulpus_Rex

    I think that very few people here are saying that Phillips should be silenced, however odious her opinions.

    That said, given the contempt that she has repeated shown towards gay people and gay relationships, she can’t exactly be surprised to be given very short shrift and that her contempt is richly returned.

    And there is a genuine moral problem that, if you repeatedly denigrate a group (be they gay people, jews, or anyone else) you may give encouragement (whether intentionally or not) to people who want to go further.

    I think Stonewall were right to invite her, but I hope that she got a rough ride (intellectually).

  16. Melanie Philips might be articulate and able to argue her point, but she is coming from a position which is morally wrong. Her arguments are based on irrational hatreds and she cannot be debated rationally. I wouldn’t waste my time on and those like her. The only way they should be dealt with is through marginalisation in the same way that they have attempted to marginalise those who they oppose for decades.

  17. vulpus_rex 14 Oct 2009, 4:46pm

    Neville – You are the very epitome of the childish, immature, play ground bully whose only response to an opinion you don’t like is to mock and call names.

    Grow up is my advice to you.

    Psephos – you might have a point but we would never know from the pink news article would we?

    We don’t really know what Melanie Phillips said at this debate about gay relationships at all.

    Note how we get Angela Eagle’s assertion about MP’s words but the only two actual quotes from MP are about thought crime and the vested interest of the state – neither of which are controversial.

    This piece of writing is a cynical attempt at mis-reporting in order to give its known audience what they think already.

    If Melanie Phillips had actually said anything really homophobic at this meeting it would be in BIG, BOLD CAPITAL LETTERS, at the start of the aritcle. Which makes me think she probably just didn’t.

  18. Tom is right. Unfortunately, as she is a columnist for a homophobic newspaper which has a large circulation, she can give comfort, as Psephos suggests, to those who would indeed ‘want to go further’.

  19. Harthacanute 14 Oct 2009, 5:07pm

    (i>The level of dishonest cant in here is staggering.

    Melanie Phillips may well be able to deliver her views clearly; but you can’t, vulpus ;)

  20. What Vulpus perhaps does not realise is that Melanie Phillips has made clear in her frequent, bigoted articles her wish to deny equality to gay people. This is not dissimilar to her wish to deny equality to the Palestinian peoples in the West Bank, Gaza and East Jerusalem

  21. In response to Rob’s Gender argument, that is rubbish, what about if you have a feminine guy or masculine women in the equation (though I guess if you have both they cancel), not to mention you may have a feminine and a masculine guy taking care of a kid, wouldn’t that be reasonable? surely if we are going to screen people we should look at the ones more likely to abuse the kids rather than ones that would bring up the kids in a loving environment different from the norm.

    And I don’t know about you Rob, if I was suddenly told I came from a test tube it wouldn’t make a blink of difference, I was still brought up in the same loving family.

    But this stuff in the article sickens me, some of these people say we shouldn’t fight so much for rights and we shouldn’t, that is we shouldn’t have to, by law we are still second class citazens, that’s disgusting, they say civil partnerships undermine marriage, it doesn’t it undermines us, it undermines out relationships, our ideals, makes us basically “against God” not able to have a relationship. Non-Christain murders can get married and yet we can’t because we are just a bit different from these “saints”. And religion is no basis for hate, you can’t kill for your religion and so you can’t make threats, ect because of it. If anything these people need a slap round the face for even thinking about this, religion is about love, isn’t it? so their arguments are just utter nonesense.

  22. Vulpus for PM!! (or should that be King?)

    As usual it’s “My human rights are more right than your rights”
    What happens when two genuinely held beliefs conflict? This is where this whole Human rights thing falls down, and why we can’t evict foreign criminals or post ‘wanted’ signs of known felons on lamposts. The rights have to be for the majority of the people, for the majority of the time. To quote some odd-looking bloke off the telly: “The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few, or the one.”

  23. Vincent Poffley 14 Oct 2009, 5:34pm

    Melanie Phillips is religious. Therefore she has demonstrated that she is unable to assess evidence properly and come to rational, sensible views on the world. Therefore she should be paid no heed.

    This is all that anyone needs to know about the woman. I feel a mild sense of pity for her clear mental inadequacies, but that is all. Until religion is universally derided as the facile, nauseating mind-cancer it most demonstrably is, progress in the field of ethical debate will not be made. We do not need bronze-age harridans with no intellectual capacities at all pretending they deserve a platform for their irrational, unevidenced views.

  24. vulpus_rex 14 Oct 2009, 5:35pm

    Harthacanute – I am not sure what you mean but if you don’t understand the word “cant” in this context then can I suggest you look it up in a dictionary.

    And you are correct Neville I don’t necessarily know what Melanie Phillips has made clear in her “bigoted articles” but that is my point.

    She doesn’t appear to have said anything homophobic at this event yet the likes of you are baying for her blood, so why would I trust your opinion of her?

  25. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 7:23pm

    Vulpus,
    The only dishonest cant around here is conservative dogma. Phillips is a self-opinionated bull terrier, Vulpus, still saying what you were taught to say from the age of five I have no doubt. By the by, Vulpus dear, there is no such word as “cant” but still, words, words. I prefer Shakspeares words, the words of the poet. Political words are so inconsequential dull, booring and usually tinged with philistinism. There is always tyrannies of one kind or another in poitics. Ones capacity to love is the only saviour as I see it in the great scheme of things.

  26. Brian: “There is no such word as “cant” but still, words, words.”

    Cant (Noun)
    [uncountable] insincere talk about moral or religious principles by someone who is pretending to be better than they really are.

    Brian, we already know you can’t spell. Now you accuse people of non-existent words. Might I suggest you buy yourself a dictionary for Christmas?

  27. Pumpkin wrote: As for Rob’s comment, this whole “two genders” thing is bull****. Same-sex parents provide just as good an upbringing as mixed-sex parents.

    Show me the scientific evidence to proof this! I am gay, but to claim that the best home for a kid is with a loving mother and father apparently makes me a racist and bigot, according to Neville? Well his intolerence of others’ right to express hones opinions makes him a fascist. It is ludicrous that this forum is only accepting of views that are rigidly PC, and that anyone who dares express an honest viewpoint are branded with insults. The whole point about PC is that it turns truth on its head and stymies free and open speech and expression. Well I for one won’t be silenced and will continue to say open and loud until the thought police have the powers to legitimately incarcerate me: THE MOST NURTURING AND NATIURAL UPBRINGING FOR A KID IS WITH LOVING PARENTS OF OPPOSITE SEXES.

  28. I see your column has again given sanctuary to rabid and bigoted anti-semites like Neville. It bears repeating that the right of Israel to exist is based on over 3,000 years of continuous Jewish settlement in that part of the Middle East. Jews were living in ‘Palestine’ centuries before ‘Palestinians’ or for that matter Arabs arrived on the scene.

  29. Brian – for someone who claims to love the words of Shakespeare you show a shocking ignorance of the english Language.

    I know you are too old to have suffered a new labour sink school education but clearly not to senile to make use of the internet – even a rudimentary check on line would have revealed the same information that the lovely RobN managed to dig up.

  30. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 10:02pm

    RobN Darlig Boy,
    “The needs of the maney outweigh the needs of the few or even the one” eh? When were you interested in anyone but yourself? All your comments on these threads are of no value to anyone since you are regaurded as a total laghing stock on Pink…Log Stupid (Words words?) Total lacking of any kind of moral fibre, (words, words) A Faceless wonder since you are ashamed of your own image. (Words, words) But a sweet lovely Boy! And I Love You!

  31. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 10:05pm

    Vulpus, that’s not ‘TOO’ senile!

  32. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 10:17pm

    Vulpus, RobN,
    I still have £10 on Labour to win the next General Election. You Clowns who doubt my win, I will buy a large scotch and toast your loss!

  33. PLEASE SEE PAUL GRADY FOR MY COMMENT ON POOR MELANIA PHILLIPS. (WHAT IS GOING WRONG WITH PINKNEW BLOG THESE DAYS?).

  34. Brian Burton 14 Oct 2009, 10:47pm

    Dougie,
    You seem to be in a total mess. Perhaps Vulpus Rex or RobN will help you sort your Comments out since they think they are qualified to do so! They are both total crap but what the hell!

  35. andrew flynn 14 Oct 2009, 10:59pm

    Please dont be suckered in by this freedom of speech bull. If Melanie Phillips was really worried about this she’d also be protesting her right to racist speech or any other kind of speech for that matter.
    She wants to protect the rights of the religious right at our expense.
    Gay people need to stop pussying around and recognise an enemy of their rights when they see one!

  36. Brian: But what if you lose, will you invite Vulpus and I round to your local so we can gloat in our misbegotten victory? I’m sure you can spare us both a pint off your pension, before dear Mr Darling cranks it up yet again. (words, words) ;)

  37. Pumpkin Pie 15 Oct 2009, 12:56am

    RobN:-

    I am so very bored of all of this “PC” nonsense. Not only was it an annoying idea to begin with, the people who complain about it have become even more annoying. It doesn’t even mean anything anymore. It is a bogeyman that exists solely for people with poor arguments to claim they’re being victimised. Arguments these days just seem to boil down who can cry “political correctness GONE MAD” fastest. Why, I’ve even on occasion seen people on opposite sides of an argument claiming that their opponent is being PC. The term means whatever people want it to mean.

    By this definition, you yourself are completely “PC” (whatever that means). You mouth off any old gibberish you feel like without any compulsion to give any sort of argument or evidence. When someone takes you to task for it, “they’re being PC!”. Is “PC” just something you disagree with? As I touched on before, free speech is not about bull****, it is about well-reasoned dialogue and the exchanging of ideas.

    Following on from Blondie’s link, here is further evidence that same-sex parents can bring up children just as well as mixed-sex parents:-
    http://www.apa.org/pi/lgbc/policy/parents.html

    That link is to a page on the American Psychological Association’s official site, which outlines their stance on same-sex adoption. It cites its sources and also has a reference list if you feel like researching the issue further, or indeed in calling their bluff. If you’re wondering why I linked you to the APA instead of the British Psychological Society, it’s because the two organizations share viewpoints on this issue and the American site is just larger and easier to search.

    Now, my “PC” chum, it’s your turn to defend your viewpoint. “Put up or shut up”, as they say.

  38. A lot of hatred displayed towards “Zionists”.

    Zionism is as morally right as “gay rights” in that Zionism is a belief in a homeland for Jews (religious and secular).

    You anti-Zionists really should understand what it is you rail against, just like, oh I don’t know, old boney Phillips and her anti-gay agenda.

  39. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 7:27am

    Pumpkin Pie’
    I always though tha there was a touch of genius about you. You always have things in perspective!

  40. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 7:33am

    RobN,
    I’m glad you said ‘IF’ it shows you are not confident about your own warped views on things. As for Vulpus, He has never understood me because genius is always mis-understood!

  41. Oh she is a Zionist. The real question is whether she is orthodox or ultra orthodox Jewish.

    Our Rabbi who is very progressive and very pro Israel says that if the Ultra orthodox ever get to take over Israel, you’ll just see another Afghanistan. The only difference will be in their variation re the name of God.

    Fundamentalist, bible believers, be they Muslim, Jewish, Christian, or catholic, are the worlds greatest danger. For they all live in the stone age, and want to force use to follow their ignorance. To hell with them all.

  42. Blondie, I prefer the evidence of self-evidence, and I can resolutely state, as a gay man, that had I ever had a choice in the matter I would still have wanted to be brought up by two people of opposite sexes. You select one study that obviously found favour on this site but many others conflict its findings. The only evidence I need, however, is my innate knowing that loving parents of opposite sexes provide the best possible balance for a child. I am not saying that same sex parents are not loving or do not try their best, but it is simply not on a par with parents of opposite sexes, which whether we like it or not – and hush my mouth for daring to say it! – is the natural order of things.

  43. I think we should also look at more creative ways of ensuring that children of gay parents have role models from both sexes.

    The most obvious way to do this is for gay men and lesbians to have children together as friends, with both acknowledged as parents.

    In some ways this could be the ideal solution, as it would be based on frioendship – rather more reliable than romantic love when it comes to maintaining a stable family background.

    As as for THE NATURAL ORDER OF THINGS. The “natural order” is that most of humanity should be dead of disease or injury, by the time we are 30. The unnatural has much to commend it, as is what nearly all of covilisation is based on.

  44. I don’t know why Angela Eagles bothers, Phillips-Rosenburg criticises everyone who disagrees with her. What must it be hell for her poor husband? He must be living in abject misery. Friends or family reading this should have a quiet word.

  45. Completely agree Dougie, poor Joshua!

    She and Sarah Palin are like two turds in a wc; they both think the world was created four thousand years ago and dismiss Darwin as “just a theory”.

    If she is so critical of everything in the UK why doesn’t she emigrate?

  46. Presumably, that is a wig she wears in accordance with her jewish religion.

  47. For those who aren’t familiar, this is a flavour of Phillips’ “argument”:

    http://www.melaniephillips.com/diary/archives/000164.html

    Notice how, like the more sophisticated bigot, she appears to argue coolly and rationally, but subtly distorts or ignores any arguments or facts that don’t fit in with her own rather limited world view.

  48. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 10:31am

    The politically correct on this thread are no more than pedantic boors who need to be sent away with a flea in their ear. I see on the BBC News a concervative MP funneled £100,000 of public money into his own company. Now, if that is not a ‘Criminal Act’ I don’t know what is….Alright Vulpus? and friend RobN? What Scumbags you two bramers support!!!

  49. Er… Pimpkin, Either you don’t read what I say, or you are mistaking me for someone else. Where in this thread have I mentioned political correctness? I rarely do, and NEVER say “gone mad”.
    I avoid clichés like the plague. ;)

    I suspect you are referring to “Rob”.

  50. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 10:42am

    Why all this idiotic talk of Zionist Phillips and Jew bating to boot. Enough of it I say. You are all probably talking out of your backsides anyway.
    My Married Jewish friends Rachael and Bernard won the Lottery and Rachael said to her husband: “But Bernard, what about all the begging letters?” and Bernard said, “Keep sending them dear, keep sending them.”

  51. Once poor Rob mentions the natural order of things he is opening the door to the view that homosexuality is not the natural order of things. He clearly cannot see what the implications of his arrant bias are

  52. “still have £10 on Labour to win the next General Election.”

    Brian – if Labour win this next election I will tap dance butt naked round the house of commons before throwing myself in the Thames. If they lose then I will gladly accept a pint (as long as I don’t have to go anywhere ghastly like Liverpool).

  53. “is the natural order of things.”

    “Natural order”? Please, what would you know about natural order, Rob? Is it natural to deprive yourself of sex? No, but you seem to bander that around like you should get a medal for it. Is taking artificial antibiotics natural? Are pacemakers natural? Or Is IVF natural? Should all these things be banned? Are the children of IVF parents less “natural” and therefore not as loved? The “natural” argument is usually given by people who are quite frankly intellectually retarded.

    Lets be honest, you’re just a right wing muppet with issues about your sexuality who thinks he has an opinion, and when you spout “natural order” stuff, it only proves you don’t know what you’re talking about or haven’t taken the time to actually read the sh!te that comes out of that mouth of yours. You have the humanity of an afterbirth, Rob.

  54. Pumpkin Pie 15 Oct 2009, 2:57pm

    Er… Pimpkin, Either you don’t read what I say, or you are mistaking me for someone else. Where in this thread have I mentioned political correctness? I rarely do, and NEVER say “gone mad”.
    I avoid clichés like the plague.

    I suspect you are referring to “Rob”.

    Oh, damn it. Sorry about that, I was indeed referring to Rob (comment 27), I just saw your post directly above mine and that “N” slipped in without me thinking. Hopefully Rob realised I was talking to him. I know you two are different people because I remember how confusing it was last time the two of you were commenting on the same issue. ;)

  55. Simon Murphy 15 Oct 2009, 3:25pm

    No 39: Voidal: “Zionism is as morally right as “gay rights” in that Zionism is a belief in a homeland for Jews (religious and secular).”

    Indeed no-one can deny that jewish people deserve a homeland and that homeland is Israel. However their right to a homeland does not supersede the right of Palestinians to have their own fully functioning state. Unfortunately Israel has perverted the original meaning of zionism into a statewide campaign of land-theft and apartheid that their spurious claims of ‘security’ do not justify.

    The whole idea of a ‘jewish state’ is as sinister as an ‘islamic state’ when you think about it – especially when you see how the religious jews in Israel are growing in influence and are now trying to impose their religious rules on everybody in the country regardless of whether they follow these rules or not – companies and supermarkets being forced to close on sabbath; civil marriage being illegal for both straight and gay people etc.

    Israel is a country with religious roots. Therefore it is blatantly obvious that it behaves irrationally and without respect for people of different beliefs. That is the cancerous influence of any religion which is not kept firmly within its box and allowing the religion to pervert the secular democracy. Look at the US for furher evidence of the cancerous influence of religion in the Prop 8 campaign.
    Melanie Phillips is a vicious racist and homophobe.

  56. I entirely agree with Simon Murphy!

  57. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 4:55pm

    Vulpus_Rex,
    Butt Naked? how common, surely you would wear your Eton top hat? It may be a hung parliament you know. Liverpool is not where I reside. Netley Abbey in Hampshire rather. We do have an Abbey that Cromwell knocked about a bit. My MP is a Liberal Democrat Chris Hune and I vote for him at every election. While we have this horendous two party system dogging the nation, people like you and me will always be indulging in political fistycuffs. Still Vulpus, I don’t dislike you, only your political party!

  58. Yes, Dave, her head is more than likely shaved and she has a Brazilian down below. She probably also insists on Joshua having the latter.

  59. Brian Burton 15 Oct 2009, 5:47pm

    Since 1948, fortress Isreal has now become agressive Isreal. Attack seems to be at the forfront of their defence programme. In the six day war for instance, Isreal devistated Ejypt’s Air Force on the ground before the enemy had a chance to gather all their resorces. So, since Isreal had air superiority and a weapon the size of a suitcase that could be opperated by two men to destroy emeny Tanks. Isreal will never become a passive nation and everyone has had to learn to live with them. We in the UK had a similar problem !939 to 1945, we got over it with a little help from our friends and we have been agressive towards quite a few other countries ever since. This has left us open to internal attacks from Islamic terror units living and working here in our supposedly secure homeland. This Melanie Phillips is not a nice person but I feel safer with her than I would with an Islamic person.

  60. Rob, first off mine was a quick search on Pink News for that article I remember reading, that’s why my comment was that short, to point out how easy it was, you want more or better evidence look at Pumpkin’s comment.

    Re-red the comments after yours, couldn’t find one that told you to hush, please say if I missed one but from what I could see, nope. So stop with PC, freedom of speech card, it’s rubbish now if you want to discuss this like intelligent adults:

    The problem with your point is the fact you say same sex couple shouldn’t be able to adopt which is just completely discrimative, straight couples can without screening to make sure they are 100% ideal with the “perfect balance”, the dad didn’t cry at Titanic and the mother never watches sports and yet you want to stop a same sex couple for not being this “balance”.

    And what about a single pregnant women, her husband dies, what should we do? forced abortion, forced adoption? the poor baby wont have a balance so it’s only fair to take the baby away from the grieving widow, or according to you it would be.

    And then you ignored my comment earlier, what about the feminine guy thing? I am a feminine guy, what if I met a “normal” guy, wouldn’t we be entitled to looking after a kid? with your logic we would be more than the single mother from the above paragraph, we could have her kid.

    Please reply, I am quick sick of the delusional arrogant idiots who completely skip past my arguments, if you truely believe what you say then you would have no problem replying to the problems I brought up about it, if you don’t reply your good as saying your wrong.

  61. Yes, she’s a lovely lass with a lovely bald head. She should join the BNP now. They would love to have her.

  62. One of the arguments put forward when having a go at us is that we are too promiscuious. So those of us who live in a monogomous relationship want to marry each other and set up a stable, formal and legal relationship just like anyone else. That is not undermining society, it is showing a clear sign to the rest of society that being gay is not all about rampant sex lives and hedonism!

  63. Brian Burton 16 Oct 2009, 12:51pm

    Mike,
    Promiscuity in my long experiance from 1960, has been on the mind of an awful lot of Gay cruises. Mind you, that is alright in itself as long as the promiscuios realize there is usually a price to pay. HIV/AIDS is once terrible price. Cruising for Gay sex is nothing to do with Gay romance and most are never sexually satified anyway. We all learn just a little in the passage of time, a lot of Gays lean nothing though.

  64. Simon Murphy: “Unfortunately Israel has perverted the original meaning of zionism into a statewide campaign of land-theft and apartheid that their spurious claims of ‘security’ do not justify.”

    I just don’t agree. Bandying around words such as “apartheid” and “land-theft” clearly have no bearing in reality – unless one subscribes to the Marxist views of the Guardian and its far-left ilk – and just spur on idiotic views like that of Brian Burton, who portray Israel as a menacing warstate (probably along with America LOL) and lead people like him to hold and proclaim racist views such as his “joke”:

    “My Married Jewish friends Rachael and Bernard won the Lottery and Rachael said to her husband: “But Bernard, what about all the begging letters?” and Bernard said, “Keep sending them dear, keep sending them.””

    Brian Burton is quite disgusting.

  65. Simon Murphy – I agree that any religion is a “cancer” on both individuals and a nation, but one must be careful to not confuse religion with ethnicity. You say that “The whole idea of a ‘jewish state’ is as sinister as an ‘islamic state’ when you think about it”, which of course it is – if you are referring to Judaism and Judaists rather than Jews. A Jewish State can be secular. I imagine that the prolonged adherence of Jews to Judaism probably accounts for the Judaistic influence in the affairs of the ‘secular-democracy’; but no more than the Christian influences in Europe or particularly America.

    A Jewish State can have no religious affiliation, thus making it diametrically opposed to an Islamic State based wholly on religion.

  66. Stewart Cowan 17 Oct 2009, 7:07am

    Andy Q: “People with dogma should not be allowed to have a place of power.”

    Then nobody would have a position of power. Suits me!

    Brian – Please stop trying to convince yourself you can be a ‘gay Christian’. It’s an oxymoron. Put spirituality before the carnal.

    Rob – re. “the natural order of things,”

    “Sodomy, n. A crime against nature.” –American Dictionary of the English language, Noah Webster 1828.

    Oxytocin: one good reason for outlawing same-sex adoption.

    Peace and love.

  67. Jean-Paul Bentham 17 Oct 2009, 10:34am

    Village Drinks founder Neil Spring told PinkNews.co.uk: “I’m really very proud to host this lively debate about the issue of equality.

    “I think that Melanie is a force to be reckoned with. It’s really good for gay people to have the chance to question her; even though I’m sure that her answers won’t satisfy everyone.”

    Really? What profound insight. How inspirational!

    Hello Stewart Cowan. Please share your wisdom and help ud straighten out this mess, sugar.

  68. O dear . . . Post 67

    Over run with “Fundamentalist Christian Crackpots” again

    . . . curious how they flock to, and spend large amounts of they time on gay websites!!!

  69. Jean-Paul Bentham 17 Oct 2009, 3:33pm

    Stewart Cowan:

    Spirituality and the carnal are the same thing, honey. You should trying seeing God this way…sure to bring a smile to your face.

    You can buy really good lub now at affordable prices, and a box of damp tissues now that help clean up before falling into a heavenly sleep.

  70. Stewart Cowan 17 Oct 2009, 4:36pm

    Jean-Paul – when you have surrendered to lusts of the flesh, you can’t expect to know what others understand on mightier matters.

  71. “you can’t expect to know what others understand on mightier matters.”

    Yes, we will seek the council of reformed alcoholics scribbling on a second-rate blog as a paragon of wisdom…. not.

  72. You should read the comments at the bottom of that “oxytocin” link. Funniest thing I’ve read all day – the original poster is getting crucified and doesn’t even recognise it!

  73. I had a look Leijah, what a laugh!

    I love Mr. Cowans line about evolution “Why should I believe it; I can think for myself”

    Talk about a contradiction in terms! What a buffoon.

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