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Comment: We should be exposing and ridiculing the BNP, not banning it

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  1. Sister Mary Clarence 17 Sep 2009, 5:16pm

    I don’t think anyone is pretending they are ‘not there’ , its mope about saything they are ‘not welcome’, and the arguments are all well and good about letting them speak and everyone will realise they are idiots, but, it assumes that everyone has the intelligence to realise it.

    Society should protect the vulnerable (and that includes the stupid). We are periodically graced with some gay person posting on here about supporting the BNP. We should as a society be protecting from harm those to stupid to realise what the BNP really is.

  2. John (Derbyshire) 17 Sep 2009, 6:00pm

    Can`t help thinking is a huge mistake to give them publicity. It only provides them with the opportunity to spread their message of hate to a wider audience- some of which will take it on board.

  3. Oh Jessica. I wish everyone in the world was as articulate and thoughtful as you.

    Sadly, I worry that they’re not – look how many people voted for the Sarah Palin-John McCain combo in the last American election.

    The problem with the BNP is that they use emotional messages – based on fear and anger. Such messages can sometimes be quite strong, and not everyone is able to recognise that emotional messages are often dangerous and factually incorrect.

    I would ban the BNP from any sort of public platform – because people need to be protected from themselves. We are just not sophisticated enough as a society yet to properly debate this.

  4. If we ban them then the idiotic views they hold stay in the shadows. Our best weapon against the BNP is the mouth and rants of Nick Griffin himself. Lets give the BNP enough rope to hang themselves in public.

  5. Also Pinknews, the family of Winston Churchill have stated time after time that the BNP should stop using Winston’s image in association with Nick Griffin and the BNP.

  6. Jessica is quite right. Reason, argument, holding the bnp to account are the only way to expose them. We should not be afraid of their views, when they are based on prejudice rather than evidence.

  7. Absolutely right, Jessica… I agree with you completely.

  8. Jean-Paul Bentham 18 Sep 2009, 7:35am

    Jessica concludes:

    ‘Instead of pretending they’re not there and allowing them a kind of perverse matyrdom, seek them out, challenge them and drown out their voices in a sea of reasoned, logical debate.’

    I don’t have any problem with that because that is the way we handle our stupid politicians in Canada…works every time! Sooner or later, they will hang themselves in public.

  9. Stifling the BNP means that the only information people know about them is that they are anti-immigration and will put native (whatever that means) Britons first.

    This sounds good to a lot of people so they vote for them.

    Get Nick Griffin on Question Time and ask him on national television what his plans are for ending the recession and clearing up Labour’s car crash and he hasn’t got the foggiest idea.

    Once it becomes obvious that they couldn’t run the proverbial in a brewery they will simply fade away. Calling them thugs and banning them just gives them electoral kudos.

  10. John (Derbyshire) 18 Sep 2009, 8:06pm

    Sorry-I think you are being politically nieve. The BNP will only debate in public on their terms. They will just pander to mass prejudice- and their simple message will strike a note with many people who are “p*ssed off” with our usual politicians. Its basically pandering to the mass view. Their popularity will be massively enhanced by this retrogade step

  11. Jean-Paul Bentham 18 Sep 2009, 8:27pm

    John(Derbyshire):

    I don’t have a crystal ball, and neither do you.

    Sorry, but for the first time, I totally disagree with you.

    Canada’s own Prime Minister Stephen Harper, a reactionay cardboard idiot if ever there was one, has put both feet in his mouth so often because someone simply put a mike in front of him and asked a simple question.

    Harper has become a laughing stock even to his own followers. The same will…hopefully…happen to the BNP leader, cos people are not as stupid as they so often appear, and the options are becoming more and more interesting, innit.

  12. Yes, I agree with the TUC, BNP members should be banned from working in the public sector in UK.

    The public sector is now such a HUGE part of British society; some estimates even suggest a ratio of 1 public sector worker to every 18 people in the population.

    In the Republic of Ireland the ratio is 1 public section worker to every 324 head of population and even then it is riddled with so-called Knights of Columbanus and/or members of Opus Dei making life very difficult for any government to implement reforms, particularly in education.

  13. Now, when can we start black-listing religious groups who believe that non-believers, homosexuals and women are inferior?

    “I would ban the BNP from any sort of public platform – because people need to be protected from themselves.”
    No, Tom. People need protecting from arrogant, patronising, and insulting individuals like you.

    The BNP’s take on history is far more realistic than those who pretend that the WW2 veterans were somehow fighting for mass immigration and multiculturalism. Enoch Powell received overwhelming support from that generation and Winston Churchill wanted the Tories to adopt a “Keep Britain White” campaign in the 1950s. Was Churchill a Nazi?

    Vulpus_rex, does your ‘confusion’ regarding native Britons extend to identifying native Americans, native Palestinians and native Tibetans, too? Native Britons are the people left over when we hear about ethnic communities. You know – the people blamed when multiculturalism goes wrong.

    Nick Eriksen was promptly sacked, by the way, after his appalling comments were known. Unlike, say, the gang of war criminals and thieves still sitting in parliament.

    Let Griffin on Question Time. I hope he starts by asking a ‘mainstream’ politician to produce a single empirical report or study proving the benefits of multiculturalism or an ‘ethnically diverse’ society. Or perhaps he’ll ask why they invariably send their children to white, private schools and live in white enclaves. Maybe he’ll drag up the Communist activism of senior MPs for good measure, and their open support of the violent thugs in the UAF. Personally, I’d like to hear him ask whether they think the virtual annihilation of the East End’s Cockney culture because of mass immigration was a good or bad thing.

  14. Jean-Paul Bentham 19 Sep 2009, 9:27am

    Hm-m. So that’s why Obama removed the bust of Churchill from the White House and returned it to the UK.

  15. Is that why the Churchill family have threatened legal action against the BNP for the misuse of his image. Telling grotty little lies linking Churchill to your organisation is all you can do. But you forget it was Churchill as home secretary who used the police to put down Mosley and his black shirts. That how much he thought of you and your fellow fascists Roy.

  16. Abi1975, would you please identify specifically which ‘grotty little lies’ I’m supposedly telling about Churchill? Just because you don’t like the truth it doesn’t make it a lie. Unless you’re a fascist. Why do YOU think Churchill was anti-Moseley when he was clearly anti-coloured immigration at the same time? Doesn’t that prove you can express doubts as to the stability of the enforced multiracial society and still be anti-Nazi?

    And why am I ‘fascist’? Surely those on here who want to curtail the rights of the people to hear opposing opinions are the real fascists? Now please, Abi, expose the lies and reveal the truth.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Later_life_of_Winston_Churchill
    http://www.guardian.co.uk/politics/2007/aug/06/past.politics

  17. Pat Harrington 19 Sep 2009, 4:35pm

    I feel that ‘No Platform’ was always wrong in principal. The public don’t need protection from ideas. They are the arbiter in a democracy and that requires them to have full information. If information is censored or limited then so too is choice. We need to raise the level of public debate not stifle it. ‘No Platform’ now is merely gesture politics. We live in an age of many-to-many communication. The BNP have no need to go on Question Time to get their viewpoint over. They have their own websites, dvds and so on. I am sure that many people find the way that Labour has sold-out workers and involved us in Imperialist wars offensive. Yet we listen to them justifying the slaughter in Iraq and Afghanistan on a regular basis. Almost any political opinion will cause offence to someone.

    We should support open debate. The public is not as intolerant or stupid as some fear. People should be free to express themselves in all areas of their life, whether that is sexuality or politics.

    I am General Secretary of a Union that supports equal rights for all (including BNP members). We oppose any attempt to ban people from jobs on account of their politics. We are involved in cases already which will challenge political vetting in the Police service. Such discrimination is against the Human Rights of those affected. We fight these cases just as we would for someone denied work or bullied on accout of their sexuality. Freedom should be universal.

  18. I resent the remark from Tom etc that we are not sophisticated enough to either debate or make our own decisions about what the BNP or any other group has to say. I don’t need anyone protecting me from free choice under the guise that I might make an ignorant decision. I think this type of argument is patronising and a not so clever attempt to Big Brother us even more. Who do you think you are telling me that some of you are better equipped to make value or intellectual judgements for me. If I sound a bit angry, it is because I am tired of people telling me they can decide what is best for me. There are liars and propagandists on both the left and the right. I will do my own research, and make my own decisions.

  19. John (Derbyshire) 19 Sep 2009, 11:26pm

    Jean Paul- If you are in the UK-or can get our TV- hopefully you will be able to view the “Question Time” programme Nick Griffin will be on. I would be more than interested in hearing if your opinions have changed after we have both seen the programme. I hope you are right and I am wrong-but I fear the worse. I have just watched the DVD “A Love to Hide”- should be essential viewing for all.

  20. I have never been a supporter of the BNP but when push comes to shove as a gay man I’d rather be living in a city under their administration than one under the jack-boot of islamic fundamentalists. The BNP say they have no problem with gay people if they keep their ‘lifestyles’ to themselves in private – this is narrow minded and they need to catch up with social progress and get over it. But their views of us are positively mild compared with islamic activists who would root us out one by one and have us stoned and beaten in the street. I do fear that in a few years time Britian and other western nations will be facing a stark choice of right-wing nationalism versus islamic fundamentalism – we may not like many of the views of the BNP but they do reflect many of the concerns of voters and do have the guts to challenge the head-in-the-sand blinkered refusal of the left and the centre doctrines to talk about what is really happening let alone begin to challenge the cancer of militant islam within our society. Our liberal democracy is under attack and these fundamentalists will not rest until western nations have succumbed, one by one.

  21. Roy, you’re opinions, and they mostly are that, don’t follow. You say that mainstream politicians should be asked to produce a single empirical report or study which might support ethnic diversity or multiculturalism. Why don’t you produce some evidence for you’re ignorant comments? Let’s start with the overwhelming support for Ennoch Powell? How do you support that assertation? Some old woman or man saying ‘Ennoch was right’ doesn’t translate into ‘overwhelming support’. That translate into that one person offering their support, not everyone.

    Or take when you say ‘the gang of war criminals and thieves still sitting in parliament’ If you don’t like our elected politicians, you, like me, can vote them out. Besides the fact that as with most of what you say, there’s plenty of emotion, but not so much evidence to support it. Which one of our MPs have been convicted by a war crimes court? I think you’ll find it’s none. Theives? Report it to the police or launch your own private prosecution, otherwise you’re just another complainer, who just complains about problems but doesn’t want to be part of a solution.

    Another incorrect point (one of many you make) that all public schools are somehow white havens? Oh? Which ones are you thinking of? I went to one and they certainly arn’t, certainly not Eton, Harrow or any of the famous public schools. Believe it or not, there are many rich foreigners who like to pay £25, 000 or more to send their kids to our top public schools.

    What’s even more bizzare about what you say is you start by talking about how intolerant some Muslims are, and you’re solution? We should be just as intolerant as they are? It’s not quite clear. Ever heard of the expression two wrongs don’t make a right? I think it’s great the BNP might be on question time and we should get able politicians to debate with him and show up how ridiculous he (and the BNP) is, just as you’re opinions are. You can keep you’re opinions, Roy, but don’t fool yourself into thinking you are somehow ‘informed’ or ‘educated’ on what you’ve said, it’s mostly emotional tittle tattle. Best left for Daily Star to cover, not serious people concerned about this country.

  22. Jean-Paul Bentham 20 Sep 2009, 12:51am

    John (Derbyshire) (19):

    Thank you for the courteous reply.

    No, I am in Canada. You do have the advantage, and I do like your attitude.

  23. Brian Burton 20 Sep 2009, 2:24pm

    Children Of Pink, lend me your ears!!!
    To all commentors on this thread: I have seen these extream Political Parties come and go over the years (I recon I’m older than most of you!) So, The extreamests have talked their empty-vessel heads off year in and year out. So what, if they win a protest vote now and again. People know what side of their bread is buttered. In their lives, the mist of words passing too and fro mean tiddley-squat. There is a cultivated idleness in most people where Politics are concerned, there certainly is no sentiment. The trouble is, the public have an insatiable curiosity to know everything except what is worth knowing. With the BNP, they prefer to be talked about by people like us and others. They would feel it was worse not to be talked about. The BNP will tell you the price of everything and the value of nothing. All Polititions lie, for the aim of the liar is to first get you on their side then make you feel at ease and comfortable, then comes their incomprehencable philosophy and nothing succeeds like excess. There is no sign of humanity in the BNP philosophy from what they say. They petend to be cultured but are really corrupt. They wallow in their corrupt ways because it actually makes them vain. I for one refuse to make a fuss about this BNP. I have seen the ‘National Front’ come and go. The BNP will fizzel out too.

  24. I’m gay, and married to an asian man. And we will both be voting for the BNP. They are the only party who are going to do anything about the islamisation of Britain. If you think the BNP’s racism is a problem, wait until this country has a muslim population of 40%. Shahid Malik was predicting a muslim prime minister by 2030. Where’s the greatest concentration of muslims in the UK? The east end of London. Where are homophobic attacks rising fastest? The east end of London. The mainstream media are systematically lying to us about what muslims in europe are doing. Muslims are 3% of the UK population, yet 12% of the prison population. And it’s the same ratio in the US, India, and much of western europe.

    Read Bruce Bawer’s book “While Europe Slept” (he’s openly gay). Why do you think that gay men in the Netherlands are voting for Geert Wilders Freedom party?

    Please read the Koran. See how much hatred there is in that book to non-muslims.

  25. Andy Mulcahy 14 Dec 2009, 11:34pm

    The title of this article encourages me to ask why no one seems to have come up with jokes about homophobes. let’s get a little creative here

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