Enter your email address to receive our daily LGBT news roundup

You're free to unsubscribe at any time.

Religious groups planning to derail gay protections in Equality Bill

Post your comment

Comments on this article are now closed.

Reader comments

  1. Mormons? I always assumed they’re only really interested in the US.

    This news doesn’t surprise me, but I still can’t comprehend why such people seem to be obsessively carrying out a vendetta against LGBT people.

    “The email cites the successful campaign of 2005 when the religious lobby obtained exemptions under the Gender Recognition Act.”

    I don’t know why some religious groups are so proud of that either. Why is being able to discriminate against women a thing to aim for? I just get the impression that religion is run by white heterosexual males who want to retain their power by keeping everyone else down.

    If the Government makes concessions for religious groups because of their beliefs, then why not make concessions for racists too? The Law should set an example. If it’s against the law to discriminate, that should apply to everyone otherwise what’s the point?

    It’s not LGBT people who want special rights, it’s some religious groups.

  2. The so called Church of Jesus Christ and Later day Saints, the Mormon Church is not a Christian Church; its a strange, sex obsessed sect based on a total fairy tale (even more unbelievable than the bible!) According to Canon Law of the main christian churches they are Heretics of the 1st Degree! If they had appeared in Europe in the middle ages they would have been hunted down by the Inquisition! HOW DARE they pick on gay people; at least we KNOW who we are!!!

  3. What is wrong with them????

  4. I think I would be happy for religious groups to be exempted…providing the law making process was exempted from listening to religious groups. Too much damage has been done by religious interference in secular issues.

  5. AND another thing (whilst on my soap box!) How dare these Morons (sorry Mormons; well perhaps I was right in the first spelling) muscle in on the realm of His Nastyness the Arch Homophobe of Rome! He’s public enemy Numero Uno to LGBT people not a lot of mixed up obsessive Yanks(!)

  6. I am starting to investigate the law firm will report back.

    You don’t need millions when you have right on your side.

  7. Are the Alliance Defense Fund and CCfoN behind this?

  8. Simon Murphy 14 Aug 2009, 3:23pm

    Evil scumbags.

    If they succeed then I want there to be an exemption to allow people to discriminate against the Mor(m)on church as well.

  9. frankly, the sooner the lgbtqi community realises that what the religious want is a (metaphorical) fight the sooner we will get closer to anything like equality. they will do anything to keep us in our place, we need to be willing to do the same back to them. sure they have god on their side, we have somehting much better- right.

  10. Thomas, Florida, USA 14 Aug 2009, 4:44pm

    Be greatful you all live in a more enlightened nation than the USA. I trust such ignorance and hateful won’t get far in the UK. Sadly, here in America the same cannot be said.

  11. It seems Devonshires Solicitors have a very soft underbelly. Lots of banks, charities, corporates, government, local authorities, NHS Trusts and housing associations as its clients.

    A fair few of these will not take too kindly of a organisation that deny equality and diversity. I would suggest contacting public sector unions who all have LGBT section. I am sure they will not want to work with a company that is willing to support basic rights to the LGBT.

  12. I think it’s unwise for the Mormon Church to interfere with our struggle for
    human rights. I think the government should think long and hard about what
    "could happen" if they decide to side with these religions! 
    Click here to see what
    "could" happen if they decided to start discriminating!

     

  13. My mum is a member of this church.. it is christian, and she does give 10% of everything she earns (through work, benefit or gift) to the church. if this is true, then money from my household is going towards this.. and i have no idea how to approach this topic with her. My mum’s faith makes her extremely happy, but i cant leave it be and say nothing if this story is true.. Urgh… tough situation.. :o(

  14. Devonshires Solicitors
    Salisbury House
    London Wall
    London EC2M 5QY
    (0)20 7628 7576

    Chair/Senior Partner – Allan Hudson
    Chief Executive – Andrew Cowan

  15. Haven’t these bigoted idiots got anything better to do with their time? You would have thought with all the problems we have in society, they could find something more constructive to focus on. They seem to have an obsession with gay people, why can’t they learn to live and let live. Maybe we should all turn on them and go out of our way to obstruct their lives. Seems to me, religion causes nothing but trouble.

  16. Pete & Michael 14 Aug 2009, 5:18pm

    We had the Mormons at our front door recently, whilst we told them that we are a homosexual household, they said ‘join our church, we can help you’. ‘In what way’, we suggested, ‘we could help you to change your ways and lead more fruitful lives’ was the reply.

    We answered, ‘we do not believe in a god and the door was shut upon them’.

  17. “Some evangelical groups have already expressed disappointment with the protections it gives to gay people.”

    Oh, yes, of course, of course… protection for all the citizens of a country would be a bad thing…. so, does this mean we don’t need to pay taxes either?

  18. I don’t understand it when they say they’re not homophobic. It says in the bible not to commit adultery, have sex before marriage, lie, steal etc etc. Do you see Religious groups asking for the right not to work with people with children out of wedlock. Isn’t all sin sin? Why focus on homosexuals (even if you do see that as sin it’s a drop in the ocean!)

  19. Brian Burton 14 Aug 2009, 5:29pm

    MORMONS,
    Complete weardos, They used to knock on my door and then the canvasing stopped abruptly because of a MORMON SEX SCANDAL!
    I understand A Morman woman fancied a male coleague. He rejected her advances (I suspect he was Gay) so, she got a male friend to help her chain him to the bed in the Hotel. The hadline in the local Press was ‘MORMON SEX IN CHAINS CASE!’ The Mormons should be asked about this case!

  20. All human beings have a need to feel valued and important. There are many different ways of going about it though. And one very strange and twisted method is to adopt a pose whereby you declare to the world that you are being persecuted for following the words of some (non-existent) entity, some god.

    This is what these people are about. They are getting off on the persecution-complex.

    We are TRULY persecuted for being gay or lesbian. We get given bad treatement, we get sniggered at, we get passed over, we get ignored, or we get abused verbally, or we get abused physically, even murdered.

    The persecution these religious characters say they are suffering is persecution entirely of their own making. They invent a god, or decide to follow any one of the numerous gods invented by man, and then claim that that are being stopped from following that god’s homophobia! (Not their homophobia, the god’s homophobia!)

    It’s sick, twisted, and pathetic.

    And we HAVE TO fight it.

    Because, by hell, it’s clever and it’s pernicious!

    If the Tories get into power and if the religious right get their roller-coaster going, as they are clearly trying to do, then we are in for a bad time.

    Look out everybody who is now on the registered homosexual list (i.e. the civil-partnership list)!

    Are you 100% sure these loonies who HATE us won’t come a-knocking on our doors?

  21. Mihangel apYrs 14 Aug 2009, 5:47pm

    why is it that these organisations that have such a political and lobbying arm are excused taxation?

    Hell, one of the cults have its bishops (ie directors) in the HoL as a right, and lots of others get in as a favour just becausr the do the right grovelling

  22. You can contact the main public sector union UNISON and seek its support for a pubic service boycott of Devonshires Solicitors while it retains the mormon church as a client on this issue.

    Carola Towle.
    UNISON
    1 Mabledon Place
    London WC1H 9AJ
    out@unison.co.uk

  23. Robert, ex-pat Brit 14 Aug 2009, 5:58pm

    Its time we started a movement to remove all the tax breaks and other exemptions that religious cults enjoy. In my opinion none of them are religions but cults. Nobody should be above the law, not even them, and we call this democracy? NOT! Tax the bastards I say. How about disestablishing the C of E for starters?

    In the U.S., they not only get to pay no taxes while meddling in the political process and fomenting hate legislation to be passed as we saw in California, but they get away with not paying property taxes (rates in the UK).

  24. REPORT COMMENT TO THE MODERATOR…

    Is it still…”SAY IT..!”

    Or is it, now, ‘Watch it!’…?

    Can you actually HAVE both..?

    Keith.
    SALFORD.

  25. If the Mormons wish to be classed as a Christian Church, isn’t it about time they started to follow Christ’s teachings?
    “ALL are equal in the sight of God…” no if’s, but’s or some being more equal than others.
    You can not have EQUALITY – with exemptions! That’s just a moronic contradiction!!!

  26. Don’t forget the Mormon Church was set up by a convicted con-man, whose wife accused him of having “convenient visions / revelations” to suit his purposes.
    He certainly conned the mormons.

    Of course the “heterosexual men want to retain their power” haven’t they always.

    Gays and women are the biggest challenges to organised religions and they know it, which is why they are fighting so hard to maintain the status quo.

    In the end the biggest and simplest challenge to these religious philosophies is the fact that they were “all man made” – god had almost no part in them.

  27. My post no 11 correction

    I am sure they will not want to work with a company that is not willing to support basic rights to the LGBT.

  28. it seems i was beaten to the “Morons/Mormons” pun. gahhh.

    if religious groups are able to discriminate against others, i want to be able to discriminate against them (by feeding them to the lions). they don’t know what persecution is.

  29. I live in the countryside and religion runs everything! The local council is called a “Parish” council. They have Community centers and Youth Centers and Sunday Schools “all” paid for by the Tax payer and when I confront the council I get ignored. I have even proved they are Homophobic and they arrogantly warn “ME” of the dangers of discrimination that will ensue if I continue along this path of exposing their homophobia!

    It’s easy to prove if your council is discriminating, google search key words like : { “gay” site:yourcouncil.gov.uk } Also try words like : Black, Ethnic, LGBT, Homosexual and so on. To find out how many pages the council website has simply delete the key word and search.

    This technique has been giving my council a “HUGE” headache!!!!

  30. Keith, maybe this new “Report comment to moderator” option is there to help us be free of the homophobic trolls who visit this site. The same people have been revisiting under different names I reckon it’s because PinkNews has been blacklisting them, hence their need to change names. I certainly have been urging PinkNews to blacklist them.

    As for how much we dare say, let’s just keep being as frank as we ever have been like good gay liberationists . . . and see, eh?

    Love,
    Eddy.

  31. Well, thanks for that Eddy; I was just wondering in case it woz me wot had stood on one or two toeses wiv me endless nonsense…

    I was just trying to ‘make mock’ of all those Beelzebubs/Tiggle-splatherers and the rest of the Legion of Pseudos and keep it light because the weightiness of the tomes wot they wrote just did me ‘ead in.

    I try not to comment except when riled; ex-gayism riles me no end; “repent and be changed-ism”….does the ckuffing same.

    So I shall reserve my bile for that, banishing whimsy to the bin in the meantime.

    Thanks again.

    Keith.

  32. Dear Mormon types.

    please come visit me at my home. Get a fist in the face.

    Is it not time we gay people started calling religion for what it is. Christians, mormons and muslims and jews spout nothing but hatred for gay people.

    Is it not time we literally stopped taking this sh*t and fought back.

    I am sick and fed up hearing mindless hatred disguised as ‘religion’. It is time it was stopped.

    Let’s stop being nice about it. See how they like it. See how they like public vilification.

    As for Mormons- an eminently stooopid bunch of people. They believe this guy -fred smith – or whatever – a convicted conman had a divine revelation, and he created mormonism. These people are stupid beyond belief.

  33. The romans had the right idea. Feed the christians to the lions.

  34. This is a good time to take on the mormons with all the anti American sentiment at the moment in this country, after the attacks on the NHS by American fundies. We need to capitalise on this mood, bring people onside with us against the American fundamentalist mormon religion. We need to take this into the mass media and be evangelical in the message of the American imperialistic mormon agenda that’s being imposed on us.

    We can not take on the mormons head on as the prop8 campaign proved. After all they have the resources of a whole US state at available to them. However they do have a weakness and that’s the instruments like solicitors and lobbyists they will employ.

    We must be clear any company or individual that takes money from this religious group to campaign against our equality will be the legitimate target for protest and campaigning against by the LGBT.

  35. It seems that the next few decades in the West are going to be spent trying to come to terms with conflicing “rights” (whatever happened to the real rights which we seem to be losing, i.e. the right to life, the right to a fair trial, right to speak freely, right to clean water and healthy food, and the right to remain silent!?).

    The comment made by a poster above that the Pope is the biggest anti-gay person is just non-sense. I’m sure he isn’t all that keen on gay marriage, etc, but there was a story in the Times a few weeks ago about how 100% of British Muslims polled were against gay rights. I know this can’t be true as I’m sure there are a few gay rights activists who identify as Muslim in the UK. I would guess, though, that it’s not too far off the mark. Outside the UK the biggest Catholic country (Brazil) has a vibrant LGBT community and, although there are problems, most gay men have a good life in the bigger cities. About 7 Islamic countries execute people for sodomy (and many more imprison people)…So I think Islam has a bit more to answer than Christianity when it comes to gay rights, etc. The atheistic regimes of North Korea and Cuba haven’t got good gay rights records, and neither have China, or the old Soviet Union, (Marxist) Zimbabwe, or many other Left-wing / communist countries (who think homosexuality is decadent and middle-class). Having been a Catholic most of my life I have never once heard an anti-gay sermon, or felt any homophobia within the church (I have never met anyone who believes in Creationism either). In fact many of the priests I know tend to be gay (and if not totally “out”) are comfortable with their sexuality…There are a few (small in number) amount of people who have problems for whatever reason (but that’s them, not “the Church” – whatever that, or “the State” is). What appears to be “homophobia” when it comes to official Church teaching is in fact a question of ideology. The Christian faith (along with most, if not all others) believe (rationally, most people would say) that a man and a woman compliment each other and that because of biology, physical needs, the need to survive as a species, and the needs of society (based on the family unit), etc the ideal state to be in as an adult human is married (male and female) – and if not, celibate or in close friendships, etc. IT is based on Aristotle’s theories and the idea of Natural Law. The need to protect and nuture the species is a deeply ingrained one within humanity, and in this regard religion has provided humanity with a successful evolutionary tool (safe-guarding against sexually transmitted diseases and protecting the base unit of “the family”). It also (believe it or not) promoted the ideas of peace, brotherhood, mutual aid, health care, and education – and in most of the world these basic human needs are met by parishes, churches, synagogues or mosques (The Catholic Church is the one biggest provider of health care and education globally). Unfortunately, many people (outisde the LGBT community)think that the “gay agenda” (as some see it) is self-serving, and is only for the benefit of the few, at the possible risk of the many (i.e. the watering down of the idea that men and women are meant to be together, and that anything outside this model is “defective” in some way). So states / governmentns listen to religious groups as they do tend to provide stability, volunteers, people who feel driven to serve the community, educators, doctors and nurses, social services, poor relief, homelessness aid, ethically concerned people, etc, where the state would be bankrupt if it had to provide all these services. Living in London I notice that most of the aid for the homeless comes not from government or from campaigning charities (or a mass drive from the gay community), but from churches and religious organisations. If I were a politician who would I want to reward for these tyes of social actions?

    The religious right / conservative elements on World Religions merely want to secure the human right to hold onto beliefs, rational or not, and not to have to be forced to comprimise their consciences. Many fear that the Equality Bill will mean that it will no longer merely be a crime to incite hatred (a good law), but to think or speak anything which is contrary to left-leaning, Western, liberal ideology! I think that most right-minded people want to protect the right to free speech / thought? The EU seems hell-bent to destroy this, and is becoming more and more Orwellian by the day!

    The most worrying aspect of the belief that I have noticed amongst people who add comments on this site is that gay / lesbian = secular, anti-religous, liberal. In fact, lots (if not most) LGBT people don’t conform to that stereotype at all, and are usually very conservative, and can detach their sexual preference from their beliefs or traditionalist ideology. I read a few comments the other day which were horrific…Some poor man / woman who had been posting was bullied in an horrific way – a way that Stalin would have been proud of! Because this person showed some signs of mental ill health (nearly every human being shows similar symptoms) and didn’t agree with the majority in favour of unrestriced gay rights / liberal agenda s/he was branded “insane”! This is exactly what the Soviets used to do to political / ideological enemies – send them to the mental hospitals, as anyone who didn’t agree with the regime must have been “insane”! Some very profound “diagnoses” were made about this person by quacks and / or lay people (who probably has similar issues) during the discussion – purely on the basis of comments made on this site! No psychiatrist worth his / her salt would dare pronounce someone to have a personality disorder without studying the person in great detail for at least 12 months…yet, when it suits some commentators on this site seem very happy to diagonse an opponent with a severe mental illness! Shame on you…And a further shame on some of the negative reactions (bordering on the hysterical) concerning mental illness and those who suffer from mental illnesses which were posted by some on that particular thread! Another poster actually called Hitler a Christian…he might have been born a Catholic, but he hated the very notion of Christianity (turn the other cheek, love your enemies, etc) and far more priests and Catholic laity were killed in the camps (for opposing Nazism) than those who had been imprisoned for homosexual sex.

    Anyway, I’ve said my piece! I am probably a, according to some, a “troll” in that I only visit sites like this now and again. I am gay, but also feel strong attachments to my faith and conservative world-view. This might or might not make me a nutter…but that’s a matter of opinion! All I wanted to say was that life isn’t as “balck and white” as Gay = EU supporting liberal; and homophobe = anyone who doesn’t support every aspect of radical LGBT politics. Democratically speaking most people in the world would be pretty much anti-gay full stop…so we’re not doing too badly here in the English-speaking world.

  36. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 7:11am

    “Terry Sanderson, president of the National Secular Society, expressed concern that the gay community was not organised enough to fight attempts to derail protections.”

    I agree with this statement 100%. Even the giy ahd cals on this thread don’t really know each other. Too bad. We can and we should form a cyberspace Rainbow community to define who we are and our objectives.

    We really are not organized and in today’s world, that means we are divided and an easy target for homophobes.

  37. Reality Check,

    a) “I still can’t comprehend why the gaystapo seemed so obsessive carrying out a vendetta against people who disagree with them.”

    You mean the “gaystapo” who object to being hated for being born gay?

    b) “outlawing racism.”

    Outlawing homophobia is just as important.

    c) “the homonazi interfering in secular issues”

    I think you meant the “homonazi” interfering with religious issues.

    Newsflash dumbo – religion is a manmade falsehood and deserves to be meddled in, updated or defenestrated as is fit.

    d) “How DARE you pick on Christians!!!!”

    Oooh don’t tempt me Jesusfreak!!!!

    e) “Do you need millions because you have wrong on your side?”

    You’re entering dangerous waters Godboy – 75% of Britain is secular.

    f) “Is this an example of homonazi tolerance and diversity?”

    Tolerating intimdatory hatefilled discrimination is tantamount to tolerating evil, something against laws of the land od god’s law!

    g) “And if they don’t succeed, I want the law to force the homonazi to employ Christians who oppose homosexuality.”

    THAT would be hilarious!

    h) “All you have to do is stop the bigoted homonazi from interfering in other people’s lives.”

    You admit you don’t like to encounter gays – yet come to a gay site. Quite the conundrum and dilemma not unusual for religionists. Nevertheless, your affiliates seek to discriminate against others by imposing your warped book of lies on others.

    You cannot win.

    i) “you don’t want the hospitals to help you when you have AIDS”

    You do know that Jesus was gay?

    j) “Prove God doesn’t exist !!”

    That sums up the level of your intelligence.

    k) “Your mangled minds develop unsustainable arguements and then you expect people to listen to you.”

    AHEM.

    l) “what relevance has Christ’s teachings?”

    like love thy neighbour… do unto others… etc

    You don’t follow Christ’s teachings, who was a nice, pleasent (but slightly deluded) young gay Jewish man.

    m) “The church is one of the few organisations that are reaching out in love to those who do not want to be homosexual”

    Sweet jesus. Do you outreach to blacks who want to bleach their skin to become white too? Perpetuating their mental problems doesn’t bode well for your supposed “love”.

    n) “Discrimination happens every day. I discriminate when I am choosing between two products to purchase……[etc]”

    I think you’ll find you discern, select or decide between two (or more) inanimate objects, not human beings.

    o) “I have even proved they are Homophobic”
    “How have you proved that they are afraid of you?”

    The problem when you attempt to make points based on orthographic nuances is that the resulting opinion is devoid of verity, and instead made solely on interpretations of books. Oh right…

    p) “Is it not time we started calling homosexuality for what it is. A deception perpetrated by Satan to get people to believe they can be happy sticking their thing up another guy’s bum.”

    SATAN IS MY LORD

    q) “Christians, mormons and muslims and jews spout nothing but hatred for gay people.”
    “I would like some evidence for this sweeping statement that has no credibility. ”

    You proved the point. Additionally, I should point out the distinction between Judaists and Jews.

    r) “Evidence please!! (not opinion).”

    Every assertion you make is not evidence-based.

    That was quite fun!

    Got any more baseless, mindless junk Reality Check?!

    Please!

  38. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 7:17am

    ..er…I mean, even the guys and gals on this thread…but you knew that, innit.

  39. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 7:18am

    Q: What did the United Nations do to protect human rights?

    A: The United Nations published the Declaration of Human Rights, a document to promote world equality and peace for everybody!

  40. It is time to gather our LGBT forces to fight the Mormon invaders from across the seas.

  41. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 8:07am

    Rich:

    We have been quietly building a group, a team. You are welcome to join and to bring friends with you.

    Just go to the front page, click on ‘My’ in the upper left hand corner at the end of the greay bar. That will bring you to the registration area. Register any way you want. you should know that any info you give out at this oint will be seen bu the fundies who haunt this site like vampires. Personally, I ain’t got nothing to hide.

    Once you’re in, click on Forum and say hello to us at a palce called ‘How do deal with crackpots…’ This comment too is public. You will find friends there.

    If you prefer privacy, look up my profile and send me a message. That will be private and I will be in touch soon.

    We gotta organize, pal, that’s all there is to it.

  42. Reality Check said: “Discrimination happens every day. I discriminate when I am choosing between two products to purchase. I discriminate when I am choosing an item from a menu. I discriminate when I choose which church to attend. I discriminate when I choose who to vote for. I discriminate when I choose which footie team to support. I discriminate when I decide who I will employ. Everyone discriminates every day. You have made it into a war zone.”

    True RealityCheck, but when it comes to gay people, it is clear you CANNOT discriminate!

  43. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 1:40pm

    Spot on, Adrian, and why??

    This is why:

    Q: What did the United Nations do to protect human rights?

    A: The United Nations published the Declaration of Human Rights, a document to promote world equality and peace for everybody!

    I will repeat it as often as I have to. Reality Check deserves to know what the real world is doing,innit.

  44. Robert, ex-pat Brit 15 Aug 2009, 1:44pm

    Abi1975, the recent attacks on our NHS system in America have been helped primarily by British arch TORY Daniel Hannan who spends a lot of time in America consorting with republicans to help derail the health care reform plan that President Obama wants to legislate. Hannen uses the worst inadequacies of the NHS and there are some, we have to admit, but he’s villifying the country by his grossly irresponsible and what I call unpatriotic actions. No country has a perfect health care system, least of all America….except perhaps for France that the WHO rates number one year after year.

    David Cameron of course remains silent.

  45. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 15 Aug 2009, 1:59pm

    Robert, ex-pat Brit:

    Why don’t you read my post 42 and come and join us. You know what an asset you’d be. We needs ya!

  46. Well as a gay man I pleased this is going to happen. The gay community at large needs a good kick uyp the arse when it comes to fighting for our rights. Only 46, ( so far ) comments on here. There should be 40,000 condeming this. But you try and bring this sort of thing up in conversation to the gay community, they just mubble then the change the topic to the tightest t shirt they can find and where they are going to get there next shag. The TORIES are coming, gay rights will go out the window. We need to have some things taken away from us , then perhaps we will realise what little progrees we have made and that little we do have needs to be defended and treated with more respect.

  47. Reality Check: “Is this an example of homo tolerance?”

    Are you an example of christian tolerance….?!?

  48. Eagle Ashcroft 15 Aug 2009, 10:22pm

    I used to belong to the Mormon church about 50 years ago. Its a cult who practices secret witchcraft rituals in their temples. It was started by some con artist in 1846 for the sole purpose of taking over the United States government and turning it into a religious dictatorship. After I had advanced to the high priesthood and found out their secrets I denounce them and was excommunicated.There are more gays in the Mormon and Catholic church than any other religion. The only reason the various religions speak out against gays is because most are gay themselves and they believe others will think they are “straight” if they speak out against gays. Another reasons is because if they supported gays the gays would not marry and produce children preventing the children from growing up and supporting the church. Churches are about money and control. Gays are a threat to them because of this, so they put gays on the front burner and over play it by making it a number one issue. Any church that makes being gay a big issue is usually a cult. The most supportive church toward gays is the United Methodist Church, the Unity Church, the United Church of Christ, the Unitarians and the Reformed Jews. Also the Holy Hitteon Faith Church (they even exalt gay persons saying they’ve chosen by God)and the pagan churches.Many atheist groups are just as bad as homophobic religious groups.There are some all gay churches as well.

  49. Julian Morrison 15 Aug 2009, 11:11pm

    The UK LGBTQ community often strikes me as complacent. Fuck it, we don’t even have equal marriage here yet. The law is still discriminatory, even the equality bill is explicitly discriminatory in failing to protect LGBTQ folks from harassment. So I say it’s time to pick up the burning torches and pitchforks. I declare war!

  50. 36 i think you need a reality check.
    i discriminate when i choose what film to watch.
    i discriminate when i choose what religious busybody to beat up in the street.

    as a human being i deserve not to be persecuted & told how to live my life. leave us alone and go back to your closeted self-hating indoctrination.

  51. Reality Check 16 Aug 2009, 4:05am

    38-You mean the “gaystapo” who object to being hated for being born gay?
    No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know.

    38-Outlawing homophobia is just as important.
    And how do you propose to pass a law that says you are not allowed to be afraid of homos?

    38-I think you meant the “homonazi” interfering with religious issues.
    Both

    38-Newsflash dumbo – religion is a manmade falsehood and deserves to be meddled in, updated or defenestrated as is fit.
    Newsflash dumb and dumber. Evidence please !!

    38-Oooh don’t tempt me Jesusfreak!!!!
    I don’t have to homofreak. You are already well down that track.

    38-You’re entering dangerous waters Godboy – 75% of Britain is secular.
    You’re entering dangerous waters homoboy. 75% of Britain is Christian.

    38-Tolerating intimdatory hatefilled discrimination is tantamount to tolerating evil, something against laws of the land od god’s law!
    What does “od god’s law” mean?

    38-THAT would be hilarious!
    Just like your stupid idea that Christians should employ god hating homos.

    38-You admit you don’t like to encounter gays – yet come to a gay site.
    I spent two years working with homos who didn’t want to be.

    38-Nevertheless, your affiliates seek to discriminate against others by imposing your warped book of lies on others.
    But you don’t believe in our warped book of lies so why are you so worked up about it?

    38-You do know that Jesus was gay?
    And I know that the King of Siam was the Queen of England.

    38-That sums up the level of your intelligence.
    I don’t have to sum yours up as you don’t have any or else you wouldn’t be a homo.

    38-like love thy neighbour… do unto others… etc
    But you don’t believe he existed so how can we follow the teachings of someone who doesn’t exist? Basis logic my boy, basic logic.

    38-You don’t follow Christ’s teachings, who was a nice, pleasent (but slightly deluded) young gay Jewish man.
    How can I? He doesn’t exist according to you. You can’t say that and then expect people to follow what he didn’t say. Logic my dear boy, logic.

    38-Do you outreach to blacks who want to bleach their skin to become white too?
    Don’t need to. No one has asked for that service apart from the fact that would be a medical matter. And quite frankly the simile is quite boring and disingenuous.

    38-Perpetuating their mental problems doesn’t bode well for your supposed “love”.
    They don’t have any when they are free from the bondage of homosexuality.

    38-The problem when you attempt to make points based on orthographic nuances is that the resulting opinion is devoid of verity, and instead made solely on interpretations of books.
    Big words. Have you suddenly developed a brain? One does not need to interpret dictionaries. One only needs to read them.

    38-SATAN IS MY LORD
    Tell me something I don’t know.

    38-q) “Christians, mormons and muslims and jews spout nothing but hatred for gay people.”
    “I would like some evidence for this sweeping statement that has no credibility. ”
    I am still waiting for some evidence, not opinion.

    38-Every assertion you make is not evidence-based.
    That is not evidence that is opinion.

    38-Got any more baseless, mindless junk Reality Check?!
    No, you have a monopoly on it.

  52. Reality Check 16 Aug 2009, 4:25am

    43-True RealityCheck, but when it comes to gay people, it is clear you CANNOT discriminate!
    Why not. I discriminate when employing people between young and old, male or female, 5 years experience or 10 years, quiet personality or up front personality. If I want an evangelist to work with young people of course I am going to choose someone who is a Christian but you are determined to stop us having that right

    44-I will repeat it as often as I have to. Reality Check deserves to know what the real world is doing,innit.
    And what is the so called “real world”. It is definitely not yours.

    47-But you try and bring this sort of thing up in conversation to the gay community, they just mubble then the change the topic to the tightest t shirt they can find and where they are going to get there next shag.
    At last. Someone who is not afraid of the truth. Definitely a sex addled brain.

    48-Are you an example of christian tolerance….?!?
    Yes. I tolerate all your stupid name calling, foul language, inept comments, lies, heterophobic responses, and down right stupid remarks.

    49-There are more gays in the Mormon and Catholic church than any other religion.
    Evidence please.

    49-The only reason the various religions speak out against gays is because most are gay themselves and they believe others will think they are “straight” if they speak out against gays.
    Evidence please.

    49-Churches are about money and control.
    Evidence please.

    49- Any church that makes being gay a big issue is usually a cult.
    Evidence please.

    50-even the equality bill is explicitly discriminatory in failing to protect LGBTQ folks from harassment.
    We are precious little babies aren’t we?

    51-leave us alone and go back to your closeted self-hating indoctrination.
    Ditto.

  53. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 5:30am

    Reality Check:

    By talking that way about the Declaration of Human Rights, you are proving to all our readers throughout the world that you are not only homophobic, but also anti-social.

    Do yourself a favor and rise up to the challenge: just go to the nearest hospital, go into the emergency and ask to see a psychologist.

    There’s no shame in having a mental health issue; things are going to be OK, you’ll see.

    There are good people, professional people, waiting to see you and they will treat you with kindness and understanding.

    Please, try to stop yourself from doing further harm to yourself.

    Please.

  54. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 6:55am

    Reality Check:

    On Christmas morning, a cop on horseback was sitting at a traffic light. Next to him was a kid on his shiny new bike.

    The cop said to the kid:

    “Nice bike you’ve got there. Did Santa bring that to you?”

    The kid said:

    “Yeah.”

    The cop said:

    “Well, next year tell Santa to put a taillight on that bike.”

    The cop then proceeded to issue the kid a $20 bicycle safety violation ticket.

    The kid took the ticket, but before he rode off he said:

    “By the way, that’s a nice horse you got there. Did Santa bring that to you?”

    Humoring the kid, the cop said:

    “Yeah, he sure did.”

    The kid said:

    “Well, next year tell Santa to put the dick underneath the horse, instead of on top.”

    **********************

    Lighten up, wiilya!

  55. It is all about power and absolute control, not terribly different in mentality than that of the major tyrants of the world. They are people who live by strict rules, in some ways rules from ancient superstitious history. Same for the current pope, who will prove to be the disaster of the century for the cAtholic church. Which, according to an AP news item a couple mos ago said that “insiders in the vatican say the papacy of Benedict is a disaster”

    The common thread thru all of the conservative churches, be they CAtholic, Mormon, right wing christian (the Anglicans are really not that bad, more stuck to old ways then being filled with what is real hate for gays. Add Jewish Ultra-orthodox (I am Jewish and these freaks should be traded to the Taliban – they’d fit right in), and the US Christian right wing, the people who gave us slavery and segregation.

    The whole biz is about brainwashing, theyv’e had a thousand years to hone their message, it is going to be hard to break it, except for gay people to come out no matter what, and be seen as good people worthy of respect like anyone else. And that does mean that near nakedness in city streets and parks at gay pride events has to end. You want the “people in the middle” to realize that gay people are good people, and they should have no qualms about being with them with their children.

    All the words mean nothing compared to actions, and people seeing gay people as good people.

    I would suggest that someone hit the nail on the head – if they discriminate, we all run a discrimination campaign against them. Eg job advs like “Mormons need not apply”.

  56. Jean-Paul a.k.a. Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 8:13am

    reality Check:

    If you could have anyone locked in a room so that you could torment them for a day, whom would you choose, and how would you torment them?

  57. 52 Reality Check

    38-You’re entering dangerous waters homoboy. 75% of Britain is Christian.

    Part of the reason that you can make this claim is because organisation like the Roman Catholic church declare that anybody born to an RC family, anybody who went to an RC school is a Roman Catholic, despite the fact that the majority, myself included, have never been inside a Roman Catholic church since we were forced to as children.

    Some of us, myself included, have spent three years trying to get ourselves removed from this figure and yet they will not let us go. So whilst your 75% may be close to accurate, depending on the accounting used, it is in no way representative of people who actually BELIEVE the nonsense these organisations espouse.

    I’ve often wondered why it is that no church has ever published accurate figures of a count of people who turn up, regularly, for services. Could it be because it would cause much embarrassment? The true figure would be well below your claimed 75%, quite possibly well below even 25%.

    As for religions being man made, wasn’t Jesus born a man, or is that yet another part of your good book that you conveniently ignore?

  58. Reality Check –

    A) “No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know.”
    Thus the fallacy for which all your idiocy is borne.

    B) “And how do you propose to pass a law that says you are not allowed to be afraid of homos?”
    “Homophobia”, to which you refer, could perhaps be better described as “gay hate”, “hate crimes” or “discrimination”; actual acts of intolerance, violence, hatred and discrimination perpetrated against an individual based on your wholly voluntary religious beliefs.

    C) “One does not need to interpret dictionaries. One only needs to read them.”
    Perhaps you should read the Oxford English dictionary, which describes “homophobia” as “an extreme and irrational aversion to homosexuality and homosexuals.” You seek to exempt yourself from the crime of discriminating against another human being for the way they were born. Not very Christian of you is it.

    D) “Big words. Have you suddenly developed a brain?”
    LOL!!!!

    E) “Evidence please !!”
    You want evidence that the bible is manmade and not god’s word?

    LOL!!!! It’s self-explanatory.

    F) “I spent two years working with homos who didn’t want to be (“homos”)”
    Doing the lord’s good work eh?
    Your organisation is next on the list of banned practices, my poor deluded idiot, for causing great suffering.

    G) “But you don’t believe in our warped book of lies so why are you so worked up about it?”
    It’s hard to get animated with such a moron as yourself, but unfortunately your spiteful and horrid interpretation of the bible has led you to cause immense suffering to innocent people.

    You are a devil-filled freak of (Darwinian) nature, spawning pure evil, breathing vile fumes of noxious speech, destroying lives and ruining people’s emotional and mental wellbeing.

    You should be ashamed of yourself and renounce any connection with Christianity, for you are nothing more than a disturbingly cruel idol-worshiping child of hate!

    H) “you don’t have any (intelligence) or else you wouldn’t be a homo.”
    No response is required to that.

    I) “But you don’t believe he existed so how can we follow the teachings of someone who doesn’t exist? Basis logic my boy, basic logic.”
    LOL! I never said Jesus didn’t exist! Just that you don’t follow Jesus’ teachings in the slightest, dear fruitcake. Unfortunately for you, you now lead a life of devil-filled hatred. The Demons have infected your soul and you will rot in hell. Sucks to be you.

    J) “They don’t have any (mental, problems) when they are free from the bondage of homosexuality.”
    Herein lies this fool’s belief – that gays are mentally ill, defected and in need of their version of Christianity.

    I think describing homosexuality as a mental illness should be outlawed as discriminatory hate speech, it would go a long way to preventing these nutcases from tormenting innocent individuals and children, and abate a lot of bigotry.

    K) “I am still waiting for some evidence, not opinion.”
    You mean you want evidence your false god exists?

    You’ll be waiting a long time child of the devil!

    L) Me: “Every assertion you make is not evidence-based.”
    You: “That is not evidence that is opinion.”

    LOL! I am of the opinion that you lack evidence; your total lack of evidence (and proof of anything you say) is an undeniable fact, true, verifiable and unquestionable!

    LOL!

    Seriously this person is screwed in the head. Like those crazies you see muttering to themselves.

    I find him/her funny but unfortunately they can cause a lot of disquiet and anguish to people who fall under their spell, as with the unfortunates who sought “de-gayifying” with this creep.

    You, Reality Check, should be locked up in a nut house.\

  59. Mormons? When was the last time you met a Mormon in the UK who was not an American teenager?
    What weight do they have to throw behind anything? NONE!
    Do we have to be following conspiracy theories?

  60. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 12:23pm

    You guys all have to check out John M.J.’s post 160 on the thread ‘Tory MEP answers back over homophobia comments’, and bring yo’ best vocabulary to stamp the devil, David Skinner, into the ground, or back into HELL, whichever comes first!

    YA-HOO-O-O-O!

  61. Robert, ex-pat Brit 16 Aug 2009, 2:19pm

    John S, just because the roman cult doesn’t necessarily state that it is anti-gay, much of his actions are clearly anti-gay. Take for example the recent ruling that gay seminarians and priests have to be rooted out and banished, as if paedophilia were solely the domain of gay men. In the United States, government statistics overall state that paedophilia is higher among the heterosexual population per capita, go figure.

    What about the straight paedophiles in the seminaries, there are many of them and many priest philanderers too, especially in the latin countries some of whom father children. When the rottweiler in the Vatican issues statements that our “behaviour” is intrinsically evil, isn’t that tantamount to fomenting intolerance, hatred towards us that is exhibited in gay bashing and gay killings across the globe? If that’s not anti-gay, I don’t know what is, and when he condemns and tries to influence the banning of same-sex marriage, that is also another example of hate. Religion is at the root of it all. These religious cultists keep on using the Leviticus mantra to justify discrimination against us, yet slavery for example was permitted in the old testament yet western societies abolished it as they did stoning women for adultery. The bible is wrong about homosexuality too and there is NO evidence or proof that some deity actually uttered that verse in Leviticus either. My opionion is it was all an invention of imperfect, unsophisticated old jewish men who hadn’t a clue about same-sex orientation.

    If you want to continue acting as an apologist for the roman cult, be my guest, that is your right, but don’t ever lose sight of the fact that its one of the chief instigators of government sanctioned discrimination against us.

  62. John S; I am aware that the Pope aka the Arch Homophobe of Rome does not have the monopoly on being homophobic and as you say Islam promotes killing our fellow gays in many of their countries. HOWEVER, Old Ratzinger has declared a war against us in his many ravings, even before he accended the Papal Throne. The proof of this is written in 2003 from the congregation of the Doctrine of Faith (This Vatican Department was once called The Inquisition by the way!)’CONSIDERATIONS REGARDING PROPOSALS
    TO GIVE LEGAL RECOGNITION TO UNIONS BETWEEN HOMOSEXUAL PERSONS’ This was issued in the name of John Paul II but old Ratzy knew the Pope was going gaga and would probably have signed and agree to anything put under his nose! I took the Archbishop of Birmingham to task on this one on behalf of an LGBT group, telling him that the document was blatently homophobic and encourged “gay bashing”. The Archbishop, Vincent Nichols, now Archbishop of Westminster is a clever man but all he came up with was to say that Gay People are neither good nor bad(??? PARDON????) but the Papal edict said ‘evil’. This from the man who was only obeying orders when he was drafted into the Hitler Youth! Need I say more? Please read the above and you change your mind on the Catholic Chuch (and yes I was a Catholic for the first 18 years of my life!)

  63. sorry, you MAY chnage your mind on the RC Church

  64. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 2:52pm

    Robert,ex-pat Brit; Mike:

    Agreed 100%. I am also a lapsed catholic and I could write chapters to support every word you say.

    Please read my post 42 above and consider joining our team. Some of your friends are already there.

    Just go in and say hello, and I’ll be in touch soon. We really do need the two of you, and it’s really no big deal, not too demanding, I mean.

    United, we stand.

  65. REALITYCHECK..

    And to think….!

    TO THINKKK…!!!!

    A contributor, was it young Andy, recently, actually had ‘da noive’, da god-darned-est ‘noive’ …the unmitigated gall…to take ME…MOI…to task about my and JEAN-PAUL’s (a.k.a.Bentham) nonsensical ramblings and jokes and suggested that JEAN-PAUL, et moi, set up a private forum in which to conduct our fooleries, our inanities and tell our silly jokes.

    Gladckuffinglee…!!!!

    Because all this is from YOU is worse than the M.P.’s at P.M.Q’s and the ‘YABOO SUCKS’ shite we hear on a daily basis from the H.P. (the buildings, not the sauce)…

    Yours is only better than theirs because we don’t pay you…

    Your one-liners, far from being witty or pithy are like watching paint dry; it’s like watching boxing…one blow to you…another to him…one to you…another to hi..zzzzzz.

    Or tennis or pingckuffingpon….zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

    Jesus..!
    Get one..!

    You are neither informative, educative; nowt..!

    Just borin’ …zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz..!

    And your guff?!

    Jesus… that takes some wading thro’…like wading through molasses!

    Line after line after li..zzzzzzzzzzzzzzz.

    By the living God it does!

    AND YOURS AT # 52..

    “38-That sums up the level of your intelligence.
    I don’t have to sum yours up as you don’t have any or else you wouldn’t be a homo….”

    Well, me and J-P – from Acadie – just hope to bring a wee bit of mirth to it all; as he, J-P, says “Lighten up, willya..?!”

    You actually think you’re good; that at # 38 just shows everybody what you are…eminently avoidable…unengagewithable…

    I know I am talking crap and am probably dying on my feet but you actually write as if you MEAN it; as if you actually believe in the crud you spout; actually think you are erudite.

    Yours, on screen, is just a dead ringer for junior kids’ playgound…ya ya ya ya yaaa…/ sounds like /..mare mare mare mare maaaare…

    Knob off..!

    JEAN PAUL….PEEING MESEN’ ABOUT THE COP ON HORSEBACK…!
    REALITY CHECK… BURNT ME FACE IN ME PLATE OF SOUP, COS I DOZED OFF SLAP INTO ME BOWL O HEINZ’s.. MID WAY THRO’ ONE OF YOUR CONTRIB…zzzzzzzz…PLONK..!

    MORE JP from ACADIE…!

    LESS RC – LESS MIZZZERRREEEEEE…

    GAWDEN BENNET..!

    In fact ‘NO’ RC…?
    YEAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH…!
    Too much to ‘ope fo’.

    Keith.
    SALFORD
    MAD CHESTER…

  66. No..!!!

    It wasn’t ANDY as described above soorrrry, ANDY luv…boo hoo..

    It was TONY, young TOE-KNEE..!!

    You is there, TONE…?

    You took me to task recently and quite rightly too…

    I am a sillllly boring old faaaaart…and know it.!

    BUT…

    Next time you want to complain about me and J-P (a.k.a.Bentham) and our sillllleee-ness, I shall fully understand; I certainly do tend to over-step the boundaweez of sense, ‘common’ or otherwise.

    But do moi a favour..?

    Point the finger -in that same complaint- at the everlastin’ ping-pong/tennis/shuttlecock&battledore/paint-dryin’/feather-pluckin’/snow-flake countin’ EXPERIENCE which is REALITY CHECK and all his ckuffin’cuttin’an’pastin’.

    He cuts and pastes for Britain…nay, for the EU..!
    You said that this was a site for ‘serious’….whatever.
    RealityCheck is, like me, not for anything ‘serious’…

    The diffrunts is I know it; he don’t.

    ‘Kinell!!

    Keith
    x
    Fondests….
    MAD CHESTER.

  67. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 3:30pm

    Keith:

    Where you bin? Bin lookin’ all ova fo’ ya.

    The invitation on my post 42 is for you and Eddy too. C’mon, it’ll be fun, and it won’t be the same without you.

    Besides, you get to see me photos!!! Just go to the ‘Crackpots’ Forum and say hello, I’ll be in touch soon.

  68. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 3:53pm

    Keith:

    What do they call a French kiss in France?

  69. REALITY CHECK

    You win…..YOU WIN..!!

    NO MORE POSTS…PLEASE; NO MORE POSTS…

    Just show me where to sign…
    I recant..!
    No victim of the ‘Enery’s rack ever had to suffer what I suffer, reading your posts!

    No more, REALITYCHECK, I beg you no MORE..!

    I’ll do anything you say….!
    Show mw where to sign…

    I will go to Rome on my knees, like the pilgrims of yore, and kiss Ratzinger’s ring (did I say that?)

    I will go to SALFORD CATHEDRAL, not to burn it to ash, but to beg four-giveness ..no. wait..more than that…five-giveness…(ok…to you…fiveandahalfgiveness.. oy vay..) for my lapsed Catholic state of 50 years.
    I’ll don a cassock and surplice and serve on the altar….always did look rather fetching in a little black dress and a lace top.

    “Allah u-akbar.”..5 times a day, on me knees, me arse skyward, if you want, over in the central mosque in Rusholme

    Go back to my Jewish grandfather’s father’s roots, (he was a Hassidic Rabbit from Lvov/Lwow).

    I’ll grow my beard, buy a big daft black hat, a metzlah, too and grow hlenkas and hold shabbas in Shudehill

    Sikh you want me..?

    All praise to the Heffalump!

    Worreveryawant…

    Buddha.?

    I speak Thai fluently… so I am half way there…AND I look sassy in saffron…

    BUT NO… MORE..PING-PONG.. NO MORE POSTS….!!!!

    Keith….
    (….really grovelling..! HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A GROWN MAN CRY…!)

  70. #68
    J-P……………!!

    Well, J-P…we were taken to task by A.N. Other for our nonsense and advised to eff orrfff, this being a serious 4um…!

    I have held off as long as I could but REALITY CHECK’s “posts..?”
    ..have left me gasping.

    I have been trying to be seruousousousious and read and inwardly digest everything wot has been wroted but REALITY leaves me reelin’ and I had to interjecteth…

    I shall go back to sleepeth again now…and twubble no-one…

    I saw your pics of your car and your cute little princess.

    You are so lucky.

    Keith.
    x

  71. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 4:37pm

    Keith:

    I don’t think it was really Tony who posted that; probably Skinner pulling a fast one.

    You are welcome to join the team anytime, pal.

    Oh, and Hugo is not a Princess; just an ordinary guy.

    Why can’t a bike stand alone?

    A bicycle can’t stand alone because it’s two tired.

    Yuk yuk!

  72. REALITY CHECK.

    “…no intelligence; otherwise you wouldn’t be a homo…”

    ???????…!!!

    Alan Turing.
    Kenny Williams.
    Most of the “Carry-on” cast.
    Hattie Jacques.
    Dusty Springfield.
    Freddie Mercury.
    Frankie Howard.
    Tchaikovsky…tormented greatly by his orientation.
    Stephen Fry…just heard him today on ‘Just-a-minute’ brilliant.!
    -And a very worthy successor to dear Clement Freud he is too..!
    Kenny Everett.
    Sandi Toksvig….one lesbian lady I could really fall for.
    Michaelangelo, I am told, altho’ I never knew the man; I am not THAT old…! Certainly, he ‘knew’ the male form. So did his boss..!

    Any more ‘dumbos’?
    Come on peeps, show the man; show our REALITYCHECK..!

    Can we add any more ‘clods’ to this list..?

    YOU would certainly look out of place listed up there, Reality Check, for all your posturings, ‘straightness’ and splather and I definitely would; but I know it.

    Keith.
    SALFORD

  73. J-P
    Hugo..?
    Qui ca..?
    I was talking about the little grand niece..?
    In the piccy; in your arms; about 3 y.o.?

    And I’m still waiting for what the French call a french kiss….
    but be qwick…cos I’ll get shouted at agenn…

    Moi.
    SALFORD.

  74. And please, REALITY CHECK…no demands for “Evidence please..!” like some broken 78 or Cap’n Birdseye’s demented parrot.

    “Evidence please! Evidence please! Evidence please!
    Evidencepleaseevidencepleaseevidenceplease…!”

    I couldn’t afford to buy all the bio’s in WATERSTONE’s…

    K
    Con amor.

  75. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 5:00pm

    Keith:

    Oh, you mean Anya! Look, she is so-o adorable; priceless.

    As for the car, all I know about it is that I ‘insert’ the key in the ignition, turn it, and something goes VR-O-O-O-O-O-M-M-M-M, and scares the kids next door!! Ha ha!

    You can call it luck if you want; we’se calling it ‘hard work & budgeting'; or are you saying I’m lucky to have Anya. I had nothing to do with that, honest!

  76. Jean-Paul Bentham 16 Aug 2009, 5:10pm

    Speaking of Reality Check:

    What happened in the middle of the twentieth century that will not happen again for 4,000 years?

    The year 1961.

    It reads the same upside down.

    This will not happen again until the year 6009.

    yuk yuk!

  77. 53: i am trying to live my life. YOU (and people like you) are trying to destroy my life. why can’t you see there is a difference?

    are you telling me that if it weren’t for religion, you would have no problem with gay people?

    of course, i’m assuming you don’t wear mixed fibers, don’t work on sunday, don’t eat seafood, throw flies/ spiders etc out the window instead of squishing them, don’t clean your house as that would involve killing microbes, don’t take paracetamol as that would be the same, keep black people as slaves, demean women, burn everything a woman having her period touches, don’t have sex outside marriage and never wear a condom, treat ALL others with compassion, dignity, respect… oh f*** waitaminute.

    what is there to prove ‘god’ says you cannot be born gay, even if it is ‘god’ that creates you? do you have a hotline to god? thought not.

  78. #78.
    STEVIE C

    Stevie!
    Save your breath to cool your custard; the man is a prize bigot.

    What’s the betting that he will ask you for “evidence please” that he has NOT got a direct line to God; it’s like a dog chasin’ its own tail…like watching an uncollected bag on the carousel at the airport goin’ round and round and rrrounddddd.. while wonderin’ where the ckuff yours is, so that you can go home.

    A COMPLETE WASTE OF TIME.

    Keith.

  79. “No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know.”

    No, we didn’t know that, because it’s not true it seems. We don;t have much of an appetite for made up fiction. Did you know you weren’t born stupid, but through lack of exercise of he mind, you became that way by choice. I am surprised you didn’t know.

    “Basis logic my boy, basic logic.”

    YOU should try logic then, its enlightening. Most of your posts are rehashed lies, half truths, and rantings.

  80. Reality Check 17 Aug 2009, 7:20am

    54-By talking that way about the Declaration of Human Rights, you are proving to all our readers throughout the world that you are not only homophobic, but also anti-social.
    Evidence please.

    54-Do yourself a favor and rise up to the challenge: just go to the nearest hospital, go into the emergency and ask to see a psychologist.
    Why?

    54-There are good people, professional people, waiting to see you and they will treat you with kindness and understanding.
    How do you know?

    54-Please, try to stop yourself from doing further harm to yourself.
    Haven’t done any yet.

    54-Please.
    Thankyou.

  81. Reality Check 17 Aug 2009, 7:22am

    56-The whole biz is about brainwashing,
    Yes, you have done a good job at that with your repetitious cry of “homophobia”, we are born this way, its all about civil rights not immorality, why should Christians be made to employ people they don’t want etc. All of it is obfuscation and lies.

    57-If you could have anyone locked in a room so that you could torment them for a day, whom would you choose, and how would you torment them?
    I don’t torment people. I leave that to you.

  82. Reality Check 17 Aug 2009, 7:24am

    59-As for religions being man made, wasn’t Jesus born a man, or is that yet another part of your good book that you conveniently ignore?
    You don’t believe he existed or the book that wrote about him so it is a non issue.

    59-A) “No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know.”
    Thus the fallacy for which all your idiocy is borne.
    Please explain as it is poor English.

    59- “And how do you propose to pass a law that says you are not allowed to be afraid of homos?”
    “Homophobia”, to which you refer, could perhaps be better described as “gay hate”, “hate crimes” or “discrimination”; actual acts of intolerance, violence, hatred and discrimination perpetrated against an individual based on your wholly voluntary religious beliefs.
    That is what you have made it because it suits your fairy story but the dictionaries tell a different story.

    59-C) “One does not need to interpret dictionaries. One only needs to read them.”
    Perhaps you should read the Oxford English dictionary, which describes “homophobia” as “an extreme and irrational aversion to homosexuality and homosexuals.”
    You have yet to notice the word ‘hate’ is not there, so that’s blown your theory out of the water.

    59-You seek to exempt yourself from the crime of discriminating against another human being for the way they were born. Not very Christian of you is it.
    I have never discriminated against another person because of their birth. I have good friends amongst the Blacks, Asians, Hispanics, and Jews.

    59-You want evidence that the bible is manmade and not god’s word?
    LOL!!!! It’s self-explanatory.
    If that is the case, why can’t you explain it? Must mean that you are brain dead.

    59-Your organisation is next on the list of banned practices, my poor deluded idiot, for causing great suffering.
    Are you good at ESP? Must be because you have never met any of the happy ex-homos that came to me for help.

    59-G) but unfortunately your spiteful and horrid interpretation of the bible has led you to cause immense suffering to innocent people.
    And just what is my interpretation of the bible?

    59-You are a devil-filled freak of (Darwinian) nature, spawning pure evil, breathing vile fumes of noxious speech, destroying lives and ruining people’s emotional and mental wellbeing.
    Anything you say satan.

    59-You should be ashamed of yourself and renounce any connection with Christianity, for you are nothing more than a disturbingly cruel idol-worshiping child of hate!
    Evidence please

    59-LOL! I never said Jesus didn’t exist!
    But many of your friends do so you can’t have it both ways. Either he does or he doesn’t.

    59-Just that you don’t follow Jesus’ teachings in the slightest, dear fruitcake.
    As he does not exist according to your friends, it is very hard to do so dear fairy cake.

    59-Unfortunately for you, you now lead a life of devil-filled hatred. The Demons have infected your soul and you will rot in hell. Sucks to be you.
    See you there.

    59-J) “They don’t have any (mental, problems) when they are free from the bondage of homosexuality” Herein lies this fool’s belief – that gays are mentally ill,
    That appears to be the case according to the all the books I have read on the subject, but then I wouldn’t expect you to understand being mentally ill.

    59-I think describing homosexuality as a mental illness should be outlawed as discriminatory hate speech,
    Now, taking this to its logical conclusion, any psychotherapist that says anyone with a mental illness has a mental illness is hate speech. Now where did you come up with such a spurious and ludicrous idea?

    59-it would go a long way to preventing these nutcases from tormenting innocent individuals and children, and abate a lot of bigotry.
    I am afraid you have cornered the market on bigotry.

    59-K) “I am still waiting for some evidence, not opinion.”
    You mean you want evidence your false god exists?
    Yes because you said that didn’t say Jesus didn’t exist.

    59-You’ll be waiting a long time child of the devil!
    As I thought – no evidence just meaningless rhetoric parroted like all the other slash and burn statements.

    59-LOL! I am of the opinion that you lack evidence; your total lack of evidence (and proof of anything you say) is an undeniable fact, true, verifiable and unquestionable!
    Just like you.

    59-You, Reality Check, should be locked up in a nut house.
    I look forward to meeting you there.

  83. Reality Check 17 Aug 2009, 7:26am

    62-In the United States, government statistics overall state that paedophilia is higher among the heterosexual population per capita, go figure.
    Evidence please or is it a case of just your opinion to make you look good and ease your conscience. At least we don’t have an organisation called NAMBLA, which stands for the National Association of Men Boy Love of America who are dedicated to making it legal for men to have sex with children.

    62-hatred towards us that is exhibited in gay bashing and gay killings across the globe?
    Of course we won’t mention the homos who are killed by their homo mates because they can’t control their anger.

    62-If that’s not anti-gay, I don’t know what is, and when he condemns and 62-tries to influence the banning of same-sex marriage, that is also another example of hate.
    And when I try to stop a person killing himself I suppose that is hate as well.

    62-Religion is at the root of it all.
    Evidence please.

    62-These religious cultists keep on using the Leviticus mantra to justify discrimination against us,
    What religious cults?

    62- yet slavery for example was permitted in the old testament yet western societies abolished it as they did stoning women for adultery.
    Yawn. So boring.

    62-The bible is wrong about homosexuality too and there is NO evidence or proof that some deity actually uttered that verse in Leviticus either.
    Evidence please. You know, that stuff that you haven’t got.

    62- My opionion is it was all an invention of imperfect, unsophisticated old jewish men who hadn’t a clue about same-sex orientation.
    Evidence please. You know that stuff that you haven’t got.

    62-don’t ever lose sight of the fact that its one of the chief instigators of government sanctioned discrimination against us.
    Evidence please. You know that stuff you haven’t got.

  84. Reality Check 17 Aug 2009, 7:27am

    75-And please, REALITY CHECK…no demands for “Evidence please..!” like some broken 78 or Cap’n Birdseye’s demented parrot.
    But I thought that you like broken 78s and parrots with all your ‘homophobic’ every other sentence and ‘Fed Phelps’ every other post.

    78-what is there to prove ‘god’ says you cannot be born gay, even if it is ‘god’ that creates you? do you have a hotline to god? thought not.
    As you don’t believe that God exists, what is the point of your question?

  85. “No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know. Thus the fallacy for which all your idiocy is borne. Please explain as it is poor English.”

    We already have. Numerous times. If you didn’t line you kennel with books, you’d be able to read better.

    “You have yet to notice the word ‘hate’ is not there, so that’s blown your theory out of the water.”

    You have yet to notice the word “irrational” and “extreme” in this definition. You are quite the paragon of both.

    “Just like you.”

    WOW! What a simply fantastic comeback! Brava! Everyone, did you all see the strong sense of wit and intelligence in such a clever, clever comeback! A comeback that is akin to the taunt and retort of a 5 year old child who doesn’t know anything but a tantrum. Well done. Very indicative of your mental state and your IQ, or lack of.

    The rest of your comments were predictably tiresome and insipid, so I didn’t eve bother. Its just the same thing, over, and over, and over, and over, and over again. Do you have OCD?

    So, do tell us about your wife, and your “brilliant” straight lifestyle that you chose somewhere after birth. What mental illness is she suffering from? I assume she is, given she let you knock her up. Does she have NO taste at all?

  86. To the idiotic troll ‘reality check’.

    This god person/deity/thing you devote yourself to.

    Prove he exists.

    Evidence Please.

  87. Reality check….. “That appears to be the case according to the all the books I have read on the subject, but then I wouldn’t expect you to understand being mentally ill.”

    Is this guy for real? What books are you reading? Please, elaborate on their titles. You sound like you have some serious and unfortunate issues, mate. Very, very few Christians believe like you do, thankfully. We already had one set of nazi’s this century causing untold damage because of religiously superior beliefs like yours, we don’t need another, cheers. What you have is a condition that needs medical treatment. But as you said, “but then I wouldn’t expect you to understand being mentally ill”

  88. Anyway, back to the topic, now the religious freaks from Utah are in bed.

    It is time for the gay people who live in the ‘soho gay bubble’ to wake up to what is really happening in the UK.

    These moronic religious freaks will happily lie, decieve, manipulate, fraudulently post under assumed names, secretly lobby politicians, secretly pay for legal cases to destroy gay rights, and so on.

    They are as insidious and evil and manipulative as were the Nazis or the fascists under Franco in Spain.

    When I was growing up, christianity was about care and compassion, looking after others less fortunate than yourself. Now thanks to american religious cultists like the Mormons and uncaring ‘evangelical’ christian fascists, christianity is all about the pursuit of power, regardless of the harm it causes.

    Google ‘operation clambake’ ,and you will find where the logical conclusion lies with all such religious groups. It’s just that the fraudeulent science fiction story creator, and the man who invented scientology L.Ron Hubbard was about forty years ahead of them.

    In reality there is no difference between the freakery of Scientology or the freakery of Mormonism. They are all in pursuit of one thing. Power.

    Gay people need to wise up – just as we have won freedom, there are those such as the freaks who post here from Utah, who devote their time to removing those rights, in order that they can be free once more to persecute all of us.

    Stop being nice to ANY religious freaks, as they would happily stab you in the back given half a chance.

    Religion hates me, so I HATE religion. Period.

  89. AIRPORT BAGGAGE-CAROUSELS AND ALZHEIMER’s DISEASE.

    Lads!
    Lads!!
    Lads!!!

    LEAVE it…’snot worth it…!
    It’s not your lonely, lonely bag going round on the airport carousel; you’ve got your’n; you’re sorted; go home..!

    I’ve got mine and I’m sorted; goin’ home; you lot do the same…

    The loo-loo that has lost his bag?
    Well, that’s his look out.

    I can handle my bag.
    You can handle your’n, I am sure.
    He can’t handle his’n…so leave it lie where it is, goin’ round and round and round..

    Otherwise, yer’ll all end end up as ‘kin daft as he is, with his one-line, sometimes one-word, answers; it’s like talking to a child.

    Reminds me of me mam at 82 in her last days with Alzheimer’s.

    Didn’t know who I was; who she was; where she was; what time it was; what day it was; whether it was daylight, Terry’s Moonlight or Fanny by gaslight.

    Clueless she was – and glad when she went, I was, for her.

    Keith.
    XXX.

  90. “At least we don’t have an organisation called NAMBLA, which stands for the National Association of Men Boy Love of America who are dedicated to making it legal for men to have sex with children.”

    Really? Is NAMBLA any where the size of the Catholic Church? The catholic church is christian, and seem to spend most of their time abusing children in one form or another.

    An estimated 4,392 priests (as Church’s estimate that no more than 5000 priests worldwide) have been accused of paedophilia in the US alone. Of the 11,000 allegations reported by bishops in the John Jay study, 3300 were not investigated because the allegations were made after the accused priest had died. 6700 allegations were substantiated, leaving 1000 which could not be substantiated. Talk about not upholding the law or the rights of children!

    Wow. A lot of christians chasing children to have sex with, isn’t it?

    And it doesn;’t stop there…. to name one instance in Ireland alone, the Magdalene Asylums, otherwise known as the ‘Magdalen Laundries’ were homes for women who were labelled as “fallen” by their families or society which were maintained by individual religious orders in the Roman Catholic Church in Ireland. The abuses in here were sickening, and beyond what a normal human being could conceivably inflict on a child, all outlined in the 2009, Irish government Commission to Inquire into Child Abuse Report. The abusers were “devoted christians” following gods laws, were they not?

    By your logic, I can conclude all straight christian are evil child abusers, with are hell bent on forcing children to have sex with them, or at least torturer and abusing them. I fact, the more Christian they are, the more likely they are to want to defile children.

    Disgusting, you christians. By “reality-checks” own logic, and own examples, this is irrefutable proof of christians all being child abusers.

  91. 43-True RealityCheck, but when it comes to gay people, it is clear you CANNOT discriminate!
    “Why not. I discriminate when employing people between young and old, male or female, 5 years experience or 10 years, quiet personality or up front personality. If I want an evangelist to work with young people of course I am going to choose someone who is a Christian but you are determined to stop us having that right”

    Logic seems to go completely over your head. But I’ll try to spell it out simply for you. You are clearly incapable of discriminating – as far as gay people ar concerned, they are all the same.

    If you want an evangelist to work with young people – well, young people should not be brainwashed with nonsense in the first place. Of course, the only way for you to spead your nonsense is to get them while they are young.

    If that evangelist is a preacher, fine, discriminate all you like. But if you are a youth club, available to all people, then you abide by the rules like everyone else. You aren’t going to ge special treatment for your backward beliefs – simple as that.

    You clearly get all your information about the UK frmo morons like sean hannity. Britain is christian in name only. Churches are closing every day, with church attendance under 8% and plummeting. The same thing is happening in the USA – young people are leaving religion in their droves, and thanks to bigoted hate fuelled nutters like you. So, keep on preaching nonsense.

    It doesn’t surprise me to hear you work trying to program people to hate the fact they are gay. An Exodus boot camp, perhaps, like the one Zach Stark went to, sent against his will?

    Interesting that the exgay survivor network is massive – see Beyondexgay.com. After all, they almost always have ‘relapses': moments of binging on sex because they need relief from being sexually repressed. Real straight people do not have ‘relapses’.

    The studies show ‘success’ rates for people who attend Exodus programs to be BELOW 15 PERCENT. For all the rhetoric, and the books you have wasted your time reading, you have no evidence you can make people straight. By the way, saying ‘a book says so’ is not evidence. Though you have no idea what science is and no idea what evidence is, as we can all see with your inane postings, asking people to prove negatives.

    Stop living in fantasy land.

  92. “yet slavery for example was permitted in the old testament yet western societies abolished it as they did stoning women for adultery.”
    Interesting when presented with the facts, like a five year old putting his fingers in his ears, he should reply ‘Yawn. So boring’.

    the confederates turned to passages like Ephesians 6:5, Leviticus, what jesus said about how slaves should be treated, to justify thei position. No surprise the confederate area represents the current american bible belt, as religiosity there took off as a result of the polarisation on the issue.

    Still: if we take the point where christianity became supreme state religion in Europe, 381AD – well, it took till 1865 to outlaw it. Nearly 1500 years of christian rule before people finally realised slavery was wrong. no use as a moral guide really is it?

  93. Well said Adrian.

    TYou are quite right, theism is losing prevalence in Europe in favour of atheism, and religion losing prevalence in favour of secularism. European countries have experienced a decline in church attendance, as well as a decline in the number of people professing a belief in a god. Proof? Well, the Eurobarometer Poll 2005 found that, on average, 52% of the citizens of EU member states state that they believe in a god, 27% believe there is some sort of spirit or life force while 18% do not believe there is any sort of spirit, god or life force. 3% declined to answer. According to a recent study (Dogan, Mattei, Religious Beliefs in Europe: Factors of Accelerated Decline), 47% of Frenchmen declared themselves as agnostic in 2003. This situation is often called “Post-Christian Europe”. A decrease in religiousness and church attendance in western Europe (especially Belgium, France, Germany, the Netherlands and Sweden) has been noted.

    Fairly obvious to me.

    As for the ex gays, well, lets hear from a British “ex-gay” leader admits he’s never been able to change himself let alone anyone else, and announces an exodus from Exodus. Jeremy Marks’ High Wycombe-based group Courage has been granted a two-year “sabbatical leave” by the umbrella group Exodus International “to explore its new direction and practice” and then report back. Courage had been pursuing a mission to help “those caught between homosexuality and Christianity” by supporting them to take “the road out of homosexuality” through prayer, and in Exodus’ words to attain “sexual purity” through its renunciation. But now Marks, a gay minister, is quoted as saying, “We are definitely wanting to be separated from the ‘ex-gay’ label and be more focused on supporting Christians who are gay.” After fourteen years, he said, “None of the people we’ve counseled have converted no matter how much effort and prayer they’ve put into it. There is much more benefit to the honest view.”

    Wow. This is from the horses mouth, so to speak. Sounds like even the ex-gays know this is a fraud.

  94. PS another point about science, is that a theory has to explain all phenomena. So when someone says gay people are more likely to be child abusers, by using the example of NAMBLA, which had about 200 members – then you have to explain also, all the people who are not a member of NAMBLA. So, the theory is dead in the water. But like I said, Reality Check cannot discriminate between gay people, as his starting point is that they are all mentally ill, with no evidence to back it up.

  95. “Homosexuality and homosexual pedophilia are not synonymous. In fact, it may be that these two orientations are mutually exclusive, the reason being that the homosexual male is sexually attracted to masculine qualities whereas the heterosexual male is sexually attracted to feminine characteristics, and the sexually immature child’s qualities are more feminine than masculine …
    In any case, in over 12 years of clinical experience working with child molesters, we have yet to see any example of a regression from an adult homosexual orientation. The child offender who is also attracted to and engaged in adult sexual relationships is heterosexual. It appears, therefore, that the adult heterosexual male constitutes a greater sexual risk to underage children than does the adult homosexual male.”
    (Groth and Birnbaum, 1978, pp. 180-181)

    Read that last sentence again, reality check. Let me re-state it for you: paedophiles are most likely to be heterosexual males. But go right on and ignore the evidence to suit your own prejudices. Why let facts get in the way, eh?

  96. Reality Check must be American, I don’t believe anyone in Britain could actually believe these things.

    I take as additional proof,

    Reality Check: “No one is born gay. I am surprised you didn’t know.”
    Me: “Thus the fallacy for which all your idiocy is borne.”
    Reality Check: “Please explain as it is poor English.”

    LOL!

    I assume the word that causes you most confusion is “borne”. My dictionary explains hence:

    “Carried, sustained, endured”.

    If you require further clarification of English words, consult your local madhouse.

    I find it particularly amusing how you seek to pepper your prose with purportedly effete language, camouflaged as idioms, in some disasterous attempt to insult gay people:

    “it suits your fairy story”

    Your trying to define homophobia in such a way as to allow you to hate and deride gay people, while allowing you to be seen as a rational, kind human, is absurd and impossible. Creating your own definition of “homophobia” to mean “fear of gay people” is laughable; your attempt to equate it with arachnophobia or coulrophobia is disingenuous.

    You’re like those Arabic/Islamist Jew-haters who attempt to justify their hatred by saying anti-Semitism actually means anti-Arab; thus giving them a prerogative on Jew-hating since some Arabs are Semites, or some other nonsense.

    Accepted usage in English is that anti-Semitism refers solely to “theory, action, or practice directed against the Jews”; the same can be said of anti-gay bias – or “homophobia”, as it is commonly known.

    You also deny that gay people are born gay, instead choosing to believe that homosexuality is a free choice:

    “I have never discriminated against another person because of their birth.”

    Shucks!

    You’re not the sharpest nail in the box either: When told that the bible is inalienably manmade, and is logically so; id est, it is of homo sapien creation; its mere existance a product of human hands; this fact self-explanatory; you simply say:

    “If that is the case, why can’t you explain it? Must mean that you are brain dead.”

    LOL!

    You should stop damaging already hurt innocent gay people:

    “you have never met any of the happy ex-homos that came to me for help.”

    None exist. You, for example, don’t appear particularly happy with your ex-gayness.

    Continuing with your pleas for “evidence” of god’s non-existance – just open your eyes and see no deity in the sky – and calling gay people “bigots” is a severe contortion of truth and justice.

    I would continue but it’s not worth it. Nothing can assuage the religious zealot, for whom belief is greater than truth.

    You seem like a sad, depreseed gay man who has fallen under the spell of your particular cult of Christ.

    I find it hard to detest you.

    You are pitiable. Escape your Hell and join a pro-gay church where you’ll feel happier.

  97. The solicitors firm have an anti discrimination policy which reads as follows:

    This firm is committed to eliminating discrimination and promoting equality and diversity in its own policies, practices and procedures and in those areas in which it has influence.
    This applies to the firm’s professional dealings with staff and partners, consultants, other solicitors, barristers, clients and third parties.

    The firm intends to treat everyone equally and with the same attention, courtesy and respect regardless of their disability, age, gender, marital status, race, racial group, colour, ethnic or national origin, nationality, religion or belief or sexual orientation.

    Maybe we should be debating with them, not the troll. Much more productive.

  98. Ladles And Jellyspoons!

    Your attention, please..!

    Breath is for cooling custard.
    Walls are not for banging yer ‘eads agin’..

    Let dogs chase their own tails…

    He is NOT listeningeth.

    You are conducting monologues; you’d be better doing it in frunt of a mirrer and practising your declamation and stage presence – not sat bashing away at a keyboard….’cos he ain’t reading the results of your labours.

    ‘Kinell..!

    We are all wasting, we have all wasted…OUR TIME….!

    He doesn’t want to know.

    He should consider changing his moniker; RealityCheck is a complete misnomer.

    WindUpMerchant, maybe…?

    K.

  99. Charlene, forgive me if I’m getting muddled, but didn’t you say something about contacting or researching this firm before? I seem to remember you were very quick to find out info.

    I apologise if I’m wrong about that – blame a Monday-addled brain!

  100. 21stCenturySpirituality 17 Aug 2009, 12:46pm

    RealityCheck, the sentiments you’ve expressed here seem somewhat at odds with your response to my questions of you in the ‘God Hates Fags’ church to picket Michael Jacksons Funeral’ thread. There you spoke of being involved in education in faith schools for over 40 years and when I asked you to allay concerns I had about faith schools you spoke of not being aware of any faith schools promoting hatred towards gay people and of a gay pupil being treated no differently. Now your being very abusive and rude. Is this kind of behaviour representative or becoming of a teacher and someone who professes to be a person of God?

    “homofreak, homonazi, gaystapo,” is that the language of someone who treats gay people no differently and who doesnt express or promote hate towards gay people?

    “And the homos should be asked about the propensity for violence in homosexual relationships”

    What? Where did you get this gem from? Ive been in a stable gay relationship for 12 years and theres no element of violence in it whatsoever. I have friends who have been in long term relationships with the same partner and there is no question of violence in their relationship. Part of my working life has involved assisting victims of domestic violence and I have done extensive training about abuse and signs of it. Most domestic violence seems to be perpetuated against women by heterosexual men. Im not saying that abuse and domestic violence does not occur in same sex couplings because I know it does but to say that there is an automatic, predisposed ‘propensity’ for it is ridiculous.

    “One book I have that followed the lives of 200 homosexuals for two years said the overall impression that they were definitely not gay.”

    Could you provide the title and author of this book please. I want to get a copy of it and read it myself.

    “And according to the information on my files, you seem to spend a lot of time murdering your own kind.”

    Could you provide details of this information that would enable me to get copies of it and read it for myself please.

    “I have not seen one position statement of any of these schools that say they hate fags. I have not seen one that has said they will not enrol fags.”

    “you seem to spend a lot of time murdering your own kind.”

    “homos should be asked about the propensity for violence in homosexual relationships”

    “Is it not time we started calling homosexuality for what it is. A deception perpetrated by Satan”

    Is this a reflection of your policy on sex education as a faith school teacher? Because I have to say it does nothing to allay the prior concerns I expressed about faith schools in the “‘God hates fags’ church to picket michael jacksons funeral” thread.

  101. Jean-Paul Benthem 17 Aug 2009, 2:29pm

    21stCenturySpirituality:

    Agreed 100%.

    My partner and I will be celebrating our 20th Anniverary next year. We have never, NEVER, been violent towards one another; we have never gone to bed without ironing out petty spats which normally occur in any relationship. We are more in love than ever.

    Furthermore, my partner, a University graduate, is a volunteer on the Board of Directors of a government sponsored safety house for abused women.

    These women are physically, emotionally and spiritually abused by heterosexual men. How many times has my partner come home after a meeting of the Board in tears because of family situations brought to his attention, complete with coloured photos of bruised and bleeding faces of lovely young and not-so-young women?

    Then there are the depressed and despondant women who have been brought into the safety house by a caring relative.

    There are also the completely disorientated women who were forced to read hate-filled passages from the Bible to their children to brainwash them into the hateful ways of fundamentalist, homophobic, and sadistic cults of self-righteous heterosexual men who do not even belong to any church because no self-respecting church would have them.

    While we are on the subject, what church does Reality Check belong to, if any church would have him/her?

    And, is he abusing his wife…?

  102. James Lees 17 Aug 2009, 3:58pm

    I seem to keep saying this, these days – the Christian establishment is most vicious when it knows most clearly that it is most wrong. Think Gallileo. Think also about David and Jonathan (Jewish), Saints Sergius and Bacchus (Christian) Rumi and Shams (Muslim) and cardinal Newman and his lover whose name I can never remember, who was a monk (Christian again). we have to keep fighting, yes, and we have to keep loving too. “Reality Check” is not worth replying to, he reallmoccasiy isn’t.

  103. James Lees 17 Aug 2009, 4:00pm

    sorry, mocasilly should be reallhy – jumping cursor syndrome!

  104. Jean-Paul Benthem 17 Aug 2009, 5:03pm

    James Lees:

    John Henry Cardinal Newman & Ambrose St. John, I believe.

  105. James Lees 17 Aug 2009, 5:22pm

    Yes, Jean-Paul, that’s the very man. Thankyou.

  106. It’s all just propoganda masquerading as faith that will cause tremendous damage to christianity in the 21st century. The UN should not forget how it formed originally, didn’t propoganda lead to the worst scenario in human history. The UN has to take a strong stand. Freedom of speech is being used as a loophole by these cunning and nasty groups that cannot exist by their own good character and too dull to make a positive impression on the world. Freedom of speech does not equate to any form of freedom when it oppresses the freedoms of others.

  107. Another vile religiouys group. DEFEND THE FAMILY INTERNATIONAL
    Look at the signatures……lol, can’t say it’s too international. http://www.defendthefamily.com/intl/
    You should also read the RIGA DECLARATION ON RELIGIOUS FREEDOM, FAMILY VALUES AND HUMAN RIGHTS. Reads like Hitlers journals?

  108. Jean-Paul Benthem 17 Aug 2009, 9:34pm

    “Freedom of speech does not equate to any form of freedom when it oppresses the freedoms of others.”

    I see what you mean, and it is a corker.

    Let’s say there is freedom of speecg to defend our rights, as expressed in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, and there is an abusive freedom of speech that attempts to remove these rights from the charter.

    A line has to be drawn somewhere to define the difference between freedom of speech and disruptive speech.

  109. Reality Check obviously does not read his bible. Jesus himself says that gays “are born thus from their mother’s womb” (Matthew)

  110. “Reality Check obviously does not read his bible”

    Reality check doesn’t read ANY books, period.

  111. Mihangel apYrs 18 Aug 2009, 8:03am

    RC is playing quite a clever game, and following the agenda set by the religious right against us.

    They know the majority are uneasy of religious rules being introduced into laws and regulations, so they attack us as being unhealthy, or dangerous to children, or violent to each other, or druggies, or having pretend relationships not real commitments (so they can stop gay marriage).

    And people who are uncedrtain, and fearful of little Johny or Jane growing “that way” will seek to protect their children by attacking us. They will also decide that taking little Johny to an “ex-gay” counselling agency is a good thing.

    QED for the religious right, slander, lies and distortions win out.

  112. Robert, ex-pat Brit 18 Aug 2009, 3:08pm

    “Reality Check” is nothing more than a right wing shill christo fascist, probably a deeply disturbed closet case. It matters not if he’s American or British or anything. The reason why you see them crawling out of the woodwork is that they’re desperate and need an audience because they know they’re losing the cultural war around the civilised world. Anti-gay vitriole that dehumanizes and denigrates us is clear evidence that these are a bunch of losers.

    Will…..the day that so-called ex-gay ministries can prove the opposite by converting a heterosexual to a gay orientation, then maybe they’ll get our attention, so far, they’ve not even done that, nor have they provided any overwhelming evidence (independent controlled studies) that aversion therapy and religious conversion work. They can’t even name one study that has been received by the legitimate scientific or medical journals either. Its nothing more than a sham to fleece vulnerable people of their money without any guarantees. These businesses should be shut down and the owners prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law.

    Jean-Paul, not sure what your forum is or how to access it. Do you have a blog site by chance?

  113. Robert, ex-pat Brit 18 Aug 2009, 3:12pm

    Julian…you are so right about that. I find it odd that there is no really active full equality LGBT movement in the UK, unlike most other western societies. Forget about Stonewall UK, they’re not even in the picture and totally out of touch with reality, nothing more than apologists and arse kissers for legal segregation, and they think that’s radical and progressive. They’re not even worthy of the name, Stonewall!

  114. Jean-Paul Benthem 18 Aug 2009, 5:18pm

    Robert, ex-pat Brit:

    You’ll have to go here:http://my dot pinknews dot co dot uk/

    Then sign in as a member, profile info you give will be seen by all members and browsers; poisonally, I like to show off!! ha ha.

    Then, click on ‘Forum’ on the black bar, and look for a Forum called ‘How to deal with religious crackpots…’. scroll to the bottom of the last page, enter a simple hello, How are ya! and I’ll be in touch a.s.a.p.

    Our dog is having miner surgery at the clinic today, and then there’s a family funeral…but I will get in touch, :7)

    If it doesn’t work, contact me again on the threads.

  115. Reality Check/

    You are, as usual, completely wrong.

    According to the American (USA) National Committee to Prevent Child Abuse, in 1997, the most recent year for which reliable statistics are available, neglect represented 54% of confirmed cases of child abuse, physical abuse 22%, sexual abuse 8%, emotional maltreatment 4%, and other forms of maltreatment 12%.

    The term ‘sexual abuse’ covers all forms of sexual contact including male on male, male on female, female on female and female on male and is calculated in such a way that Statutory Rape, i.e. situations in which one of the parties involved was under the legal age of consent but may, actually, have been mature enough to give informed consent – that is to say situations in which no force, emotional or physical, was actually employed by either party – is included in the statistics.

    According to the United States Centers for Disease Control and Prevention the vast majority of incidents of child sex abuse (97.3%) occur within the child’s home and is perpetrated upon these children by a close family member. Only 4% of such attacks are gay or lesbian – 96% are heterosexual. A child is far more likely, enormously more likely, to be attacked in a sexual manner in his or her own home by a close heterosexual family member than outside, or inside, the home by a gay or lesbian person.

    In Europe the prevalence of heterosexual sexual abuse of children by members of their own families is found to be even higher than in the USA – some 98.3% of abuse is heterosexual with only some 1.7% being gay or lesbian sexual abuse – and this despite Europe having a much higher proportion of out and visible gays and lesbians in the population than can be found in the USA with somewhere between 7% and 11% of the general population identifying publicly as gay or lesbian as opposed to the USA’s figure of 3% to 5%.

    For references see:
    Child sexual abuse by David P. H. Jones, Paul Ramchandani
    and:
    Children and young people who sexually abuse others by Marcus Erooga, Helen C. Masson, 1999.
    The child protection handbook by Kate Wilson, Adrian L. James, 2002.
    The APSAC handbook on child maltreatment by John E. B. Myers, American Professional Society on the Abuse of Children, 2002.

    The overwhelming bulk of the evidence emerging from the developed world, and the third world, for that matter, is that sexual attacks on children are disproportionably perpetrated by heterosexual people: by people such as you claim to be – so-called normal, heterosexual people. Gay and lesbian people are not represented in the statistics in the numbers and percentages that one might expect to find if the propensity to sexually abuse of young children were naturally distributed over the entire population of the planet. Instead, it seems that heterosexuals such as you are far more likely to sexually abuse young children than gay and lesbian people are, and that you are far more likely to abuse them in this way when they are close family members.

    Now, that is very interesting. What is it about your heterosexuality that makes you, not necessarily specifically ‘you’ but others of your sexual orientation – heterosexuals that is – many times more likely to sexually abuse children than gay and lesbian people are, and, what is more, to abuse family trust and the supposedly safe family home that all of you make such a noise about. Equally as interesting to my mind is precisely why you, and others like you, seek to project that type of behaviour onto us gay and lesbians (your hate group of choice) when the evidence simply does not support your wild assertions, deliberately evil mis-directions or the attempted propagation of your projected guilt onto us gays and lesbians on this issue. Rather, as the facts support, it is your sexual orientation that does the damage, not ours!

    As far as I can make out you are indulging in classic ‘projection’, ‘mis-direction’ and ‘displacement’ activity in order to justify your faux position of superiority on this issue. The fact remains – justified by survey and the statistics of Court, and Police, Records, and such facts backed up by the findings of Government Child Welfare Departments, and other reputable organisations, on both sides of the Atlantic and throughout the world – that heterosexuals are far more likely, in a statistically disproportionate way, to be the sexual abusers of young children than gay or lesbian people are. Pluck the beam from your own eye before addressing the mote in ours.

  116. I am reminded of ‘His DArk materials’. If the Church (whichever one) had access to a machine that could take pre pubecent kids and process them not to be Gay, I am sure they would use it!

  117. Jean-Paul Bentham 19 Aug 2009, 10:38am

    Reality Check:

    You are fighting a losing battle. Why not bow out gracefully now and spare yourself certain humliation?

  118. Mihangel apYrs 19 Aug 2009, 11:11am

    Jean-Paul
    RC is using classic tactics – he keeps whaffling his tripe, on and on, in the hope that his protagonists will give up and go home: he can then claim victory. It’s an old political tactic (used by Lenin and his crowd to good effect!), and when used in the political arena we must ensure that everybody “stays to the end” otherwise we could end up being outmanoeuvred and voted out. On a thread like this, it’s not always worth the effort!

  119. Jean-Paul Bentham 19 Aug 2009, 2:03pm

    Mihangel ap Yrs:

    Thanks for the feed back.

    Let me just remind you what an asset you would be to our group who simply wants to organize concerted tactics. Our biggest weakness here is that we barely know each other and we are often puling every which way except together to bring down these morons who talk circles around us.

    Please give it a second thought.

    Go to: http://my.pinknews.co.uk/

    Keep a low profile if you want, but once you have signed in, go to my profile ‘Jean-Paul’ and send me a message just to say hello. I will be in touch soon.

    It’s an adventure for all of us and things are still under construction. You would be so valuable to us.

    Still, no offense taken if you prefer to wing it on your own, pal.

  120. Hi, guys, Reality Check / David Skinner/ et al are clutching to the belief that they are earning a good life after death. They also belong to a cadre of other Xtians from whom they acquire feelings of importance and validation. You’ve seen the footage of the unthinking hysteria and contagion that goes on in their gatherings. That’s when they get charged up and resolve to come running back here to fight for the Lord Jesus! They sincerely BELIEVE that this is worthwhile activity – because they sincerely believe that the Lord Jesus was half-man half-god. It’s so painfully LAUGHABLE.

    The religious programming of human beings is HORRIFIC!

    Just confronting Skinner / Reality Check / et al with the fact that there are millions of other misinformed human-beings who believe in lots of other different gods, should be more than enough for him to stop and think and realize he and his lot have made a big mistake. But as he is so brainwashed he can’t accept this big-picture of the world’s many archaic old religions, he cannot accept any other truths.

  121. Eddy, “he cannot accept any other truths”, its because they are too weak of mind to do so.

    If you think you have the answers, you are less likely to search for the truth.

    Studies have found that a general “connectedness with god” is associated with lower levels of education [Schieman et al. (2006). Journal for the Scientific Study of Religion (2006) 45(4):529-549.]. Prof. Kyung reports the findings of many studies into religion and intelligence, and these 39 studies since 1927, have found that the more educated a person is, and the higher one’s intelligence, the less likely someone is to hold religious beliefs. It shows that those with a degree in science are less than half as likely to believe in God as the general populace, and eminent scientists are nine times less likely.

    Well, reading pringle/skinners remarks only backs up these studies.

  122. Jean-Paul Bentham 20 Aug 2009, 3:27pm

    Three cheers for Eddy and Will!

  123. JP, it appears to Reality Check has long since sloped off, sorely wounded, into the shadows. Let’s hope he does some THINKING while he sits there nursing his wounds!

  124. Eddy, the psychiatric ward attendants probably took his laptop away, because his screaming at the “spirit” was upsetting the other patients.

  125. Jean-Paul Bentham 21 Aug 2009, 11:58pm

    Will and Eddy,

    You two deserve a medal. You have outdone yourselves today.

    Yea, Reality Check surely knows enough not to drink the iodine, and not to imagine the psychiatric ward attendants are flirting with him when they tie him to the bed.

    I don’t mean to be unkind, I’m just following his example of doing for others…you know. z-z–z-z-z-z-z-z-z-z

  126. JP: “Yea, Reality Check surely knows enough not to . . . imagine the psychiatric ward attendants are flirting with him when they tie him to the bed.”

    Hee, hee, hee! “Oh, if only!” thinks Reality Check! “If only they were! Oh, such exquisite sweet agony. Harder boys, tie me down harder, I tell ya! For Jesus’ sake, harder! I beg you! F***ing crucify me!”

    :-)

These comments are un-moderated and do not necessarily represent the views of PinkNews. If you believe that a comment is inappropriate or libellous, please contact us.

Top commenters this week

Latest stories

See all