Reader comments · Eight-year-old trans girl barred from Catholic school · PinkNews

Enter your email address to receive our daily LGBT news roundup

You're free to unsubscribe at any time.


Eight-year-old trans girl barred from Catholic school

Post your comment

Comments on this article are now closed.

Reader comments

  1. “One night, she said, ‘Every night when I go to bed, I pray my inside will match my outside. But it never happens,'”

    That broke my heart.

  2. Clearly a sad case for treatment.


  3. Pure hypocrisy. Up to now I never heard about pedophile catholic preast being jailed.

  4. Idiotic. What the f*ck does the school know about it? How cruel to the little girl. At least she has supportive parents though.

  5. The reaction of the school is disappointing, but not surprising.

    However the support of the “devout Catholic” mother is heartwarming and bodes well for the child’s future.

  6. “Taphorn added that… her new appearance as a girl would not help foster a good learning environment for other pupils.”

    Unless, of course, you make this a life lesson about the tolerance of differences and/or the myths surrounding the ‘naturalness’ of the sex/gender links imparted by the Church…

  7. Too many people only see things in black and white (Boy or Girl) I was born infused with a mix of both. It has taken a long time to come to terms with what has and is happening to my body. I ask theses reading this post to consider a few things.
    1. Gender is not always male or female
    2. Sexual orientation (Gay, Bi, etc.)
    Both have nothing to do with the other. If is because so many would see this as wrong that I would like to use the cliché walk a mile in our shoes.
    ME I was born intersexes, changed and decided upon by the doctors, not told, reinforced constantly about being a boy, but often told that I was supposed to have been a girl. I married, and life went on. Then things started changing body items etc. lots of test, and research later I was diagnosed Intersex. That was tough on me also because I believed in black and white. The times in testing, doctors visits, and counseling helped me to see there are shades of gray.
    It is sad the harassment I have had to deal with since my body started changing and I could do nothing about it. I accepted I was different and that it would not impact my job but it has. It has almost cost me my marriage, and definitely my intimacy portion. It has cost me relations with my step children, and hateful and harassing comments have ensued.
    I have tried to be myself, and accepted that I was different. I find it as disheartening as a Christian that so many people can only see the reality of born a boy a boy, born a girl a girl…
    Then there is me; if you’re intersexes, the doctors, parents, make a decision and wham you are a boy or a girl.
    Well I am intersexed I’m a boy/girl a man/woman. Yet the hurt condemnation and items I have heard since things have happened I am still told that I must choose. Enough with the Stereotypes. If a patient has a bad lung they can get a transplant.
    I say if the body got it wrong and the boy is a girl there is a defect fix it.
    Hooray for the mom to let her childe do it so early and horary for the doctor who counseled them.
    and yet another reason I am no longer a member of the archaic catholic church.

  8. Yet another child’s life ruined by the effing Catholic Church.

    I hate it!

    “Suffer little children…?

    My arse!

    They have enough to worry about with the on-going, and far from finished, saga of kiddie-fiddlin’ by its clerics, stretching back decades, especially with that perpetrated by the Irish Christian Brothers.
    I use the term ‘Christian’ VERY their regard and from first-hand knowledge.

    It’s no different with this little girl than it is with the hundreds of girls who were put into religious mental institutions in Ireland for having borne children out of wedlock; some of these have only recently left these intitutions, now fully institutionalised and well into their 70’s & 80’s, and not really able to cope.
    What is the Catholic Church doing pontificating about matters sexual and matters ‘gender’, anyway; making ad hoc statements without any knowledge of the areas of science concerned?

    ‘Galileo’ repeats itself.

    They have vowed celibacy; fine; so why do they harp on about sex, homosexuality and gender dysphoria, ad nauseam?

    It’s like giving up cakes and going to work in a manufacturing baker’s & confectioner’s and telling the baker that the recipe should be this and not that.

    It should be of no concern; age quod agis; mind your own biz.

    Similarly with this little child; the sexuality should be of no concern.
    It is a child.
    It should be “Suffer(ed)..” as JC said.
    These twats would not know Christianity if it hit them in the mush, and as usual, the sodding RCC is more concerned with outward appearances than it is with anything that JC taught.

    It is more interested in swirling gold brocade cloaks and quietly bussing kiddie-fidlin’ clerics to other parishes, where they are thus, not only NOT brought to book for the outrages that they have perpetrated in one parish but are free to resume their activities on a wholly new set of unsuspecting parishioners and their children.
    You have other things to concern you, Taphorn.


    This is the church secretary’s e-mail for the St Wenceslaus’ Church, Omaha, Nebraska.
    I have e-mailed and asked that my letter be forwarded to the appropriate ‘official’ responsible for this disgrace….

    The St. Wenceslaus Church ‘Welcome’ on its website, through its priest-in-charge, says that,

    “It is my sincere hope that you will find our parish to be a place of holiness, comfort and support.
    St. Wenceslaus, our beloved patron saint, intercede for us, and may our parish continue to grow in God’s grace and reflect God’s love to all.”


    LOVE TO ALL..?


    Bombard the hypocritical bastards!


  10. Vee wrote:
    “Clearly a sad case for treatment.”

    . . . . . . .

    Vee, not sure what you meant be that?. . . could you say more

  11. Sad though this story is, I don’t see why it’s on PinkNews – it’s not a gay issue: we have no idea of the sexuality of this boy.

  12. Ummm, John the child is a GIRL or did you not read the article?

  13. #11

    It is a sexuality issue.
    It is an issue wherein the human being, in this case a small child, does not fit into the rigid understanding of human sexuality, is not seen as A or B, black or white.

    And it is not so seen by a bunch of men who, having taken a vow of celibacy, expect everybody else to be hung up about it as well.

    The Catholic Church is absolutely OBSESSED with sex; virginity, and celibacy jump up at you at every turn.
    If you are a Catholic, you will conform to its teachings.
    It is a church for bean-counters and paper-shufflers; there is no room for inexplicable deviations from what IT perceives to be the Creator’s norm.
    You were born with a willy?
    You are a male and will dress accordingly.
    You are inclined emotionally and sexually to those of your own sex?
    Then you are ‘objectively disordered’ and while such an ‘objective disorder’ is in itself not sinful, that same ‘objective disorder’ leads to an ‘intrinsically moral evil’
    It is a wider sexuality issue, John.
    It is not being treated by the Omaha diocese with any compassion or understanding. It is an issue which will lead to disruption in this child’s life, this child is alreay being made to feel less than his peers and as we all know, children can be most cruel when they detect difference.
    Fortunately, his devoutly Catholic parents are not that devout that they swallow totally all the gubbage that this bunch of hypocrites spouts and will remove him to a school where his dress matters less than the care he receives.


  14. theotherone 20 May 2009, 2:02am

    i’d also like vee to clarify their point and to john: f–k off john, we don’t need your reactionary tupe round here

  15. I think, Leilah, with respect, that biologically the child is a boy but feels himself to be a girl.
    He has ‘been a girl since the beginning’, says mum, ‘the way (he) skips and dances’.
    He hopes that ‘one day what (he) feels on the inside, one day will match what is on the outside;’ he is male to female transgender; that is my understanding of it.

    Furthermore the Archbishop (PINKNEWS article) says, “The child is welcomed to come, but it would not be acceptable to change the child’s gender and present as a girl,” said Omaha Archdiocese’s Chancellor, the Rev Joseph Taphorn.
    In other words, ‘you are male and we cannot allow you to come and pass yourself off as a girl by dressing in female attire’.

    They don’t of course, dress up like big soft tarts!

    All that acres of lace and crimson satin and gold brocade.
    Not bloody much, they don’t!


  16. @ Keith – I’d say also that it is more than just “feels himself to be a girl” as brain-scans as well as psychological studies of transgendered people show that you can have someone who is physiologically male, but their brain anatomy is female. Literally, a female brain trapped in a male body, or vice-versa.

  17. Er, no Keith, it’s about gender, not sexuality – sexuality is about attraction, not about gender identity, and we have no idea about which gender this boy is attracted to. And he IS a boy until he has a gender reassignment, and even then will be genetically male – though of course that shouldn’t stop him calling himself a girl. But us gays can’t just change so easily, remember. This story belongs on a gender news site, not one about sexuality.

  18. #17
    Yes, JOHN I take all that on board.

    I am not so much concerned about the technicalities of it all and labels… and of course sexual attraction for the child will not come into it for another few years yet, anyway.
    I am concerned that this is yet another example of a bunch of celibate men (and that is celibate ‘out of choice’) putting their nebs into that which should not concern them and pontificating about it.
    It is the same mentality which suggests electric shock therapy for Dorothy’s friends.

    The website of the St. Wenceslaus Catholic Church in Omaha welcomes the visitor and burbles on in ecclesia-speak that their “hope is that your parish may be found to be a place of….support….and may your parish continue to reflect God’s love to all.”

    Love to ALL.?
    Singling this child out when he/she already is most singularly different?

    ‘Kicking a man when he is down’… I calls it.

    ‘It would not be in the best interests of the other pupils to allow the child to present (him/herself) as a girl now, according to the Archbishop?
    It would if it were put across to the children in the appropriate way.
    And what a wonderful way to explain to children and educate them that we are not all the same.
    It could be done sensitively and geared up to the ages of the children.
    A wonderful opportunity to explain about real life, tolerance and the ‘love to all’ which they proclaim in their church ‘welcome’.

    They would rather spout on about the ‘Virgin’ Mary and the ‘virgin’ birth, all of which twaddle goes quite over kids’ heads anyway.

    They say one thing and do another, the RCC.

  19. theotherone 20 May 2009, 10:27pm

    f–k off john. You’re a f–king Genderphobic little prick or, to use more academic language, a fachist little, mysoginistic, genderphobic poof. You’re the type that only want liberation for yourself and people you want to fuck.

    piss off back under the dank rock you clambered out from under.

  20. theotherone 20 May 2009, 10:32pm

    and keith (don’t worry mate, it’s a nicer post than the ones to john):

    Allowing John to slip his reactionary retoric between your obvious concern for this child and the use of corect Gender pronouns will end up making you look like a hopelessly comprimised individual.

    ‘he/ she’ or ever ‘she/ he’ is an offensive way to speak about a Gender Varient person.

    Just letting you know…

  21. Ironically, there was a big palaver in a council meeting recently when the assembled public were asked to press a button to indicate whether they were male or female. Someone with a trans partner piped up ‘what if you’re trans’ and was offended when someone quipped ‘press both!’, and made a complaint. But clearly by asking that question they were implying that their partner WAS neither male nor female – they got the answer they were asking for. I’m not saying this is representative of trans people, but it’s a cautionary tale for people who are hypersensitive about things like ‘he/she’ – it seems some trans people aren’t so sure either.

    Theotherone, I certainly am not opposed to trans rights – I just think it has more to do with feminism and gender rights than gay rights: I don’t understand why the T is tagged on the end of our acronym – can you explain? I’m not saying I wouldn’t help them fight for their rights, but I don’t understand why it’s associated with gays. I don’t see how one can be ‘genderphobic’ either…although I’m not a big fan of women, I admit.

  22. Yes, thanks for that, peeps, and for the comments.

    #17 John.
    I must admit that you lost me in your #17.

    My fault, not yours; it went over my head; anyway thanks for it.

    I AM a bit thick, you know!
    I couldn’t hold an argument on most things; prob. because I am not that interested and ‘not interested’ because other sexuality issues do not affect me, although I sympathise totally.

    But stick a point in front of my nose on RCC hypocrisy/RCC homosexuality pronouncements, its sinfulness, lekky shock treatment, exclusion and..banggg!
    -I’ll wade in there like a Jack Russell with a trouser leg; I HATE the Tom HUNTS, from that camp-as-arseholes, hypocrite Ratzinger, down.

    I am interested only in reducing to ‘nil’ the pain and the confusion engendered in these small children’s likkle ‘eads by their (ahum! ahum!!) betters (?) (my arse!)

    I am not interested in these hi-falutin’ labels – with the greatest of respect to those to whom it does matter, of course.
    My point is that if kids of 7/8/9 are old enough to be made to kneel down and pray to the Blessed ‘Virgin’ and told that JC was born of a ‘virgin’ (taught about ‘difference’) -then they are QUITE OLD ENOUGH TO BE TAUGHT ABOUT TRANSGENDER with all its daughter labels, if you need to; its ‘-isms’ and its ‘-ologies’, its ‘-ics’, and its ‘-obias’….taught gently and simply -but taught nonetheless.

    The Pharisees did that, count beans/go through the motions/observe the rituals/power-dress/wear the right colours on the appropriate day and all that shite; just like the Catholic Church down the centuries really, when you scan it.
    Very good at liturgy; not much good at love, with a few exceptions.

    And never mind scanning centuries past; the current Irish Catholic Church abuse scandal sez it all.


  23. theotherone 21 May 2009, 11:22am

    ok then john: I take it that if a Gay man ends up on the streets then no Queer rights orginisation could help him because he was suffering because of poverty rather than his sexuality? What about if an efeminate gay man got beeten up for being efeminate? You’d not help him because he got a kicking because he was a bit girly?

    The idea that Homophobia has anything to do with Sexuality is laughable. Why do homophobes hate Queers? Is it becaue you’ve got your penis in the mouth of another man or is it because ‘Men’ have sex with women not men? Is it bacuase you’re acting like a woman and upseting their idea of Gender? Why would someone walking past you in the street know your sexiality? Is it because they think you’re not a ‘real man?’

    The idea that Queer rites in general has nothing to do with Gender is, itself, the misunderstanding my sweet.

  24. You make no attempt to explain why transgender individuals should be grouped with us – the issues are completely different. The point is surely that gay men are NOT acting like women, we are not transgressing gender boundaries in our general behaviour – and in sex, it is not as if we are mimicking the female role! Rightly, the spectrum of ‘gendered behaviour’ in gays runs from effeminate to masculine – but we all want to be men. That is not the case for trans people, so they face an entirely different set of difficulties which are only confused by grouping us together – to the detriment of both groups. Of course being gay is about ‘gender’ generally, but it’s not about ‘gender identity’ – we’re all men’s brains in men’s bodies – we just feel differently about men to normal people.

  25. Pumpkin Pie 21 May 2009, 2:34pm

    “One night, she said, ‘Every night when I go to bed, I pray my inside will match my outside. But it never happens,'” she added.

    That bit made me want to cry. ;_; How awful that she feels it’s her “inside” – the essence of who she is as a person – that should change, rather than her physical appearance. This is the sort of hurt and lack of self-worth that comes from all the gutter trash out there referring to you as “it”, or refusing to accept you for who you are. I’m so glad that her parents are so understanding! I know many trans folk who wish they could have had such a good start in life.

    Sad though this story is, I don’t see why it’s on PinkNews – it’s not a gay issue: we have no idea of the sexuality of this boy.

    This not a gay site, it is an LGBT site. Take a look at the diverse range of articles if you don’t believe me. Being gay is about more than who we’re attracted to. All the crap we get about who we should sleep with goes hand in hand with the crap about how we should act and what our relationships should be like. We’re fighting against cultural diktats which are based on a hetero-centric view of human gender and sexuality. Views such as man always being the dominant partner clearly don’t work in relationships with two men – and this is an issue of gender more than it is of sexuality. There’s more to homo/bisexuality than sexuality, and the transgender community is in pretty much the same boat as us, but for a slightly different reason and with a far smaller community. A lot of their problems are our problems, so it makes sense to band together and support each other.

    And he IS a boy until he has a gender reassignment, and even then will be genetically male – though of course that shouldn’t stop him calling himself a girl.

    If you put somebody’s brain in the head of an android, does it make that person a robot? What makes a person who they are is their brain. George (#16) described the situation very clearly for you – transsexuals have in effect been born with the wrong bodies. Your claim that only sex reassignment surgery will change your opinion just highlights how uncaring you are. Not all transsexuals even decide to go through with surgery, you know – I’m sure they would if it was a magic fix, but it’s a serious and imperfect surgical procedure. To expect somebody to be surgically altered before you’ll respect them is cruel.

    But us gays can’t just change so easily, remember. This story belongs on a gender news site, not one about sexuality.

    Change? Wait, so you deny that a transgirl is a girl until they’ve had their body surgically modified and then claim you should be allowed to continue just as you are despite the fact that you’re using your sex organs “incorrectly”? Double standards much? “If you have a penis, you’re a man. Men have sex with women. If you want it any differently, you’ll have to be surgically altered.” That’s where your logic leads.

    theotherone’s pretty much summed it all up, anyway.

  26. OK, so this boy can live as a girl just like that (sex aside, as he’s only little) whereas us gays might want to be straight, but we can’t just start being straight out of our own volition – that highlights the difference between the two groups. I have absolutely no problem with him living as a girl, and have a huge amount of sympathy for him. But I don’t accept that this has anything to do with gays – we have no gender identity issues at all. And since the website explicitly says gay news, not LGBT news, I think this news is not best placed on this site. I guess my point is that, whereas I can fully understand heterosexuality, I cannot conceive of transsexuality – because gender identity is so much more visceral than sexuality, and it’s impossible to imagine yourself feeling the disconnect which trans people feel. This lack of understanding is of course no excuse for prejudice, but it makes me baffled that we are grouped together when it seems to me that the psychology and problems are entirely different.

  27. @John, have you considered that this little girl might grow up to be bisexual or a lesbian? Most trans people I know are also LGB or Q.

    Oh and by the way, as has already been explained to you it is extremely rude to refer to a trans person by the pronoun they have rejected. The fact that you continue to do so shows what a stubborn, contrary and rude person you must be.

  28. Kudos to Pink News for respecting the child’s identity in how the story was reported :)

These comments are un-moderated and do not necessarily represent the views of PinkNews. If you believe that a comment is inappropriate or libellous, please contact us.