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  1. Your poll could be better thought out. A Trans person can be either Lesbian, Gay or Hetero, you should be able to click more than one button on that question. I also don’t see why charities and political pressure groups should lumped into one question And why does Pink News need a postcode?Apart from that, I’m not sure I’m happy with any political party advertising on here. If they want to convince folk they need to get out and talk to people.I think the poll is flawed anyway. I’ve just voted twice.

  2. Phil Martin 7 Sep 2007, 12:14pm

    I’m not bothered that the Tories can advertise here. You have not, however, made it totally clear that Labour could do likewise if they approached you. If you are happy to advertise any or all of the parties equally, then I have no problem with it. You have not quite gone so far as to say this in your editorial. Your “comment “vote” system does not ask the question, and simply mentions the Tories, which makes me wonder……………………….

  3. I think it is important to note that the Conservatives can’t even bother to address GLBT issues in their ad on a GLBT website.I’m disgusted by Pink News’ accepting ads from this historically rabidly homophobic party which, even as late as last week, had one of their LEADERS railing against gay equality.As a Jewish man I also visit sites that deal with issues of concern to jewish people. Maybe they’ll surprise me with some ads from a neo-Nazi party. Why not? Nazi money spends just as well as anyone else’s, right?I’m totally disgusted by this.When will we learn to stop feeding the beasts that seek to destroy us?

  4. Sister Mary Clarance 7 Sep 2007, 3:20pm

    Zeke – I find your comments extremely offensive and I strongly object to scurrilous comments likened me to a Nazi.The Tory party and the Nazi party have nothing whatsoever in common and I’m sure those who died at the hands of the Nazi’s, Jewish or otherwise, would be sickened by your trivialisation of the suffering they endured.

  5. I couldn’t believe my eyes when I clicked onto the site today and saw paid-for political propaganda on the main banner heading of the site, especially from such an openly homophobic organisation. It is an insult to pinknews readers’ intelligence to suggest that Conservatives do not wish to harm the gay community. How much more evidence of their relentless institutional homophobia do they need to provide? Taking their money was a very bad decision which will lose you many readers. I had nothing but the highest opinion of the site up until now. By all means publish balanced comments, interviews, an apology from Michael Ancram for his insulting remarks, but not blatant propaganda.

  6. paul cowling 7 Sep 2007, 5:16pm

    I the Fabric of society homosexuals are and have always been part of the stitching! without us there would be gaping holes, what legislation could ever alter that?

  7. Zeke, Cameron’s change of heart is all about political expediency, both parties play that game except in the U.S., the republican party (read tory for UK readers) doesn’t support any form of equality for gay members and citizens alike. However, the Labour government did bow to pressure by the Church of England when allowing gays to marry became a hot topic. It didn’t want to go that far so it chose the cowards way out by backing civil partnerships, discrimination by another name, a delusion that it is equal to marriage, it isn’t and it never will be, we’ve already seen that in Vermont and New Jersey. Even having passed civil partnership legislation, the Labour government didn’t do it of its own volition. No matter who is in power in the UK, our government only acts when its compelled to by a higher authority, i.e. the EU Commission. The ban on gays serving openly in the UK military is another classic example of that. That’s why we’ll never be a leader in Europe on social issues, that belongs to Holland, Belgium and Spain, the true leaders and the true democracies all of which weren’t compelled by any EU directive, unlike our own. They have far more freedom and equality than we’ll ever have. Our leaders believe that pseudo equality ends at civil partnerships and we won’t be getting any more than that.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  8. Sister Hairy Valance 7 Sep 2007, 5:47pm

    A flip-flop trying to control of a load of blue rinsed, purple faced Nazis and failing. Monty Python couldn’t have written anything as strange as that!

  9. “We would never run an advert from anyone that seeks to harm the gay community.”You just have.Good-bye.

  10. Why does that disgusting party have an advertising banner on this site, it’s making me feel sick!

  11. Now, if the banner had an apology for their history, voting records, vile comments and section 28 – it may be okay.Get stuffed Pink News, I’m off too.

  12. Ian Hislop 7 Sep 2007, 6:50pm

    Its great that the Conservative party wants to advertise on your website and it shows how society is changing. Is sad reading some of the Tory-bashers comments above – but then they are mearly trying to score points. There is homophobia on both sides of the political spectrum

  13. Sister Mary Clarance 7 Sep 2007, 7:09pm

    I see we don’t all have to trot down to the local Conservative Association to find prejudice and small-minded bigotry.The amount of utter ignorance being shown in response to this story is unbelievable. Some people’s understanding of politics is …. well, nil – particularly those tos**rs who keep calling Tories Nazis. Do you even know what a Nazi is? clearly you don’t know what a Tory is.The Tories control well over half the local authorities in this country, if you check out the Audit Commissions key performance indicators (KPIs), you’ll find that top performing local authorities are generally have Tories making the decisions. Top performing equates to those providing the best care and services (to gay as well as straight people).Almost all of the local authorities with the best education (for gays and straights) are Tory controlled.I don’t think anyone every changed the world by slagging off a news site for taking an advert from a political party they didn’t support. If you don’t like the world you live in get off your arse and try and change it. Instead of bitching from your laptop.

  14. Don’t dare pontificate to me Sister Mary Clarence. I don’t have to go very far at all to know the faces of those killed by the Nazis. All I have to do is reach for the nearest family photo album. You may have your arrogant ass up the bum of the Conservative Party but I don’t.What say you about the love letter from Mr. Ancram last week? Do you deny that he is a leader in the Conservative Party? Is this the kind of politician you support?Save your insulting and ignorant rant for someone as delusional as yourself.

  15. Sister Placenta 7 Sep 2007, 8:18pm

    ZEKE is correct, there are plenty of Tories who would happily send us off to the gas chambers, that makes them Nazis in all but name. If the Nazi party had switched their leader from Hitler to the Tooth Fairy, they would still have been the Nazi party. Evil leopards don’t change their spots.Will it be a BNP banner next week? How about Christian Voice?Okay Tories, if you’ve really changed, let’s have a public apology from Lord Tebbit, Ian Duncan Smith, Thatcher, Widdecombe, Davies, Leigh et al.Attach it to the next pig that flies past, if you haven’t already sent a hunting party out after it.You’re a disgusting bunch of Nazi liars until you prove otherwise.

  16. Lets never forget that it was the Tories who authored that fascist, vile piece of legislation called Section 28, the kind of things the Nazis did in Germany by burning books written by Jewish authors, disenfranchising an entire group of people. The Tory party wholehheartedely supported that law and it was only recently that Cameron admitted it was wrong when he realised that it would be politically expedient to support some semblance of equality when the civil partnership law was up for debate. To date, none of them have apologised to us for the harm and suffering they have caused and they never will. If Cameron et al are so supportive of equality, let them support passage of hate crimes legislation against the LGBTQ community; let them support marriage equality to prove they’re truly inclusive and supportive of full equality. The fact is, they won’t!Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  17. It is entirely possible that the conservative party has changed and would support gay rights if they got in to power let’s face it we won’t know any time soon because they wont win the next election if the PM has any sense he should call an election pretty quick, but if they wish to try and prove their sincerity by advertising in places that might gain them a few votes then they should, but they should make more of an effort it’s not difficult to advertise on the internet, I would like to think it is a different party with different ideals to it’s past but people should be wary of believing Cameron’s rhetoric straight off.

  18. Sister Mary Clarance 7 Sep 2007, 10:33pm

    As I said “I see we don’t all have to trot down to the local Conservative Association to find prejudice and small-minded bigotry”Are all you morons that keep banging on about the Nazis actually aware that Winston Churchill (who lead us to victor over the f**king Nazis) was a Conservative? Modern history would seem therefore to suggest that there are some significant differences.Zeke – if in fact you are Jewish, you dishonour the memory of everyone that perished at the hands of the Nazis but trivialising the inhumanity they suffered. You should be ashamed of yourself. You’re a bigot and your ignorance overwhelms meAs a community that has long suffered stereotyping, how quick some of us to do it to others.

  19. There seems to be a great misunderstanding of what the Conservative Party stands for. It is a very broad church, and you must not compare the whole party to the socially right-wing traditional members like Ann Widdecombe and Norman Tebbit. I am gay and I vote blue, I believe in small government and freedom with responsibility. There are many, many supporters of gay freedom within the Conservative party. To be gay-friendly, it is not necessary to enforce positive rights and outlaw discrimination. Legislation will not foster respect for gay people, it can only do so much. We can do it ourselves as we show ourselves to be decent, law-abiding members of society and banish the prejudice and ignorance against us by showing who we really are.By the way, I think the Conservative party’s record may not be perfect regarding the issue but at least they do not associate with and pander to Muslim clerics that think that homosexuals should be executed. Labour’s pandering to political Islam is the most harmful thing for us.

  20. By the way, branding somebody or a legitimate political organisation as ‘nazi’ is not clever or an argument, it just makes you look ridiculous.

  21. 7 Sep 2007, 11:01pm

    Just to clarify, Editor Tony Grew has made it clear that our current policy is to allow advertising from any of the main political parties- Conservatives, Labour, Liberal Democrats, Green et al.Our survey asks if in future we should continue to allow any political advertising.We would of course under our current policy allow the Labour Party to advertise if they so wish, it just so happens that the Conservative Party were the first to

  22. Sister Mary Clarance 7 Sep 2007, 11:41pm

    Thank you anonymous. A bit of reason at last.

  23. All political parties have a history of homophobia. Labour changed their position first, quite rightly, the Tories are changing now, which should be appreciated by all people that want to see full equality.You might also be interested to know that the Tories have signed an agreement with Stonewall to be amodel gay friendly employer.Francis Maude, the Conservative Party chairman, has been in talks with Stonewall since early in the year and Conservatives will now become part of its Diversity Champions programme. Stonewall staff will give seminars to workers at party headquarters onhow to treat gay and lesbian employees fairly, and Stonewall will be consulted over policies that affect gays. Ben Summerskill, chief executive of Stonewall, described the move as”courageous” and a sign of how far the party had changed. He said, “Theywant to demonstrate publicly they are taking this issue seriously,” said Summerskill. “I think with Cameron it is not just an issue of trying to win gay votes. He genuinely believes it’s the right thing to do.” Labour declined an approach by Stonewall to join the diversityprogramme.

  24. “To be gay-friendly, it is not necessary to enforce positive rights and outlaw discrimination”How exactly do you figure that anonymous?It’s clear why you’re a Tory. Most gay people who are too chicken sh*t to be themselves seem to gravitate to the social conservative (Tory, Republican) parties.It’s not “clever” or creative to post anonymously.

  25. So, what you’re saying is that the only way that gay people can live in peace is if the government enforces their rights using positive discrimination and left wing statism? Aren’t you therefore the one who doesn’t have the confidence to be who you are?

  26. Oh, and I do not support the Republican party, only the libertarian members such as Ron Paul. I’m a Democrat and a Tory if you must know.

  27. You can all postulate as you wish, but until either party commits to full equality, I will not support either side. True equality means just that, the SAME rights for all people. Civil Partnerships are NOT about equality. Let Cameron prove he he believes in full equality by abolishing these absurd relationships and recognising like five other countries did by opening marriage to everyone. Until then, no Labour or Conservartive party will ever convince me that they believe in equality. Wake up!Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  28. Puleeeeeeeeeeeeez, Tories believing in full equality? Now what do you mean by that? Full equality means marriage equality. If Holland, Belgium, Spain, Canada and South Africa achieved it, voluntarily I might add, then what do you mean? There is NO equality in the UK and if you think civil partnerships represent that, then you are very mistaken. You’ve accepted second class citizenship and discrimination as acceptable. You fools!Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  29. Sister Mary Clarance 8 Sep 2007, 4:42am

    Robert, not sure how you work out that there is no equality in this country. I can’t say I feel discriminated towards in any aspect of my life whatsoever. I am treated equally in relation to the goods and services I receive, I am treated equally in the workplace. My partner and I shave no wish to either marry or enter into a civil partnership, so we continue to ‘live in sin’ treated no differently to others that do so.Quite possibly not the same for everyone, but I’m sure I’m not the only one.

  30. Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi 8 Sep 2007, 7:58am

    Dear Sister Mary Clarence, Technically, you’re right about the fascism thing, but politics isn’t about semantics, it’s about fluidity, flux, and change. But technically, you’re right’; they don’t wear brown shirts in the Conservative Party, the US Republican Party and the Canadian Conservative Party and doubtless couldn’t goose step if their lives depended on it, obesity being so common in the overstuffed class. Their program doesn’t call for exterminating trade unionists, gays, lesbians, trans people, bisexuals, or national minorities etc, but they have tried to hurt us, endanger us and deny our rights and privileges. If you’ve never felt the sting of antigay bigotry during your life then you situation is… unique. But I hope you can understand the rage and passion of most of us who have been stung. I’m speaking about the owners and leaders of the Republican and Conservative parties, not people who unwitting get suckered in. If they see what’s going on and don’t take a hike, that’s different, because they often become shills who put the movement on the wrong track. Of the three parties the Republicans are most likely to step over the line into despotism. They’re dominated by a coalition of christian totalitarians (who know precisely what ‘up the chimney’ means) and oil pirates like Bush and Cheney (with a little help from the a lapdog named Tony). They’ve gutted the Bill of Rights (with Democratic help), attacked GLBT communities (using Democratic precedents like DOMA and DADT) and their open bigotry has placed us in extreme jeopardy. There are about 20-25 lynchings of gays and lesbians and over two thousand documented beatings in the US annually. Not as bad as Iraq or Iran but plenty bad enough. It’ll be worse for the next year or so because of the 2008 presidential election. The Republicans may not be fascists yet but it wouldn’t be a long journey for them. The Republicans and the two Conservative parties have programs and mind sets that could easily move them to the authoritarian right, and Zeke and the rest of us don’t need a magnifying glass to see that. It scares most of us to death. The NDP and Labour have a trade union background but they are both well on the way to becoming sellout parties whose timidity and cowardice legitimizes the right. They roll over on questions like marriage and full equality for gays and lesbians. The Democrats are much, much worse. They can’t sell out because they weren’t our side to begin with. You’ve been around long enough to know overstatement for what it is and not engage in tit for tat hyperbole and accusations. Zeke, Robert, ex-pat Brit. (the one who’s not quite up to speed on Irish history), Sister Placenta (wonderful name) and the others have a lot to contribute (as do you) but their ideas contain more than grain of truth, maybe a couple of bushels full, and a suitable sense of rage at some of the actions of the Conservatives, like section 28. Politics should never be about the personal, but about history, facts, trends, programs and all that has to be filtered through the lens of ‘who rules and get rich and who doesn’t’. A scientific perspective is called and that doesn’t allow for personal resentment and anger.

  31. Aodhán Williams 8 Sep 2007, 10:19am

    Oh dear PinkNews, in plastering David Cameron’s face across your website you have significantly jeopordised your status as a news source of integrity.It is not only insulting to your readers to expect them to not see right through Cameron’s pathetically transparent attempt to pander to homosexuals (just take a look at his own political U turn on the matter – vote scrownging perhaps?) but also to think that we require the assistance of a tacky banner to get engaged in the political process is an outright insult to the readers which you yourselves are always boasting as being an intelligent/ professional group.As for the Tories, anyone who is really willing to swallow Cameron’s embaressing attempt to ‘prove’ he has changed the Conservative Party merely needs to pop down to their local Conservative Club, or look at their Tory controlled council (one of which I happen to be within – and no, we’re not better off – Labour did do a better job) to see the real state of a party that is not going to become an ally of the homosexual community any time soon.I advise that PinkNews remove ALL political advertisments swiftly, and attempt to recover from this depressing moment of their history.

  32. While readers are right in saying that the anti-gay legacy of the Conservative Party should never be forgotten, the Conservative Party should also be applauded for how far it’s come in even wanting to advertise on a gay website.That this party is even trying to court the gay vote shows how far Britain has come in the past decade.Compare that to the US or Australia where our conservative parties, the Republicans and so-called “Liberals” are yet to have a single openly gay politician anywhere in the country at any level and openly pander to the worst kind of homophobic voter.There’s always more work to be done, but you don’t know how good you’ve got it.

  33. Most of these comments covering fascism are paradoxical. It seems as though you imagine that moral acts are right or wrong because the ‘Vatican’ or ‘Church’ or other express the view that they are wrong. Acts are moral or immoral prior to any body or collection of individuals expressing them as such. Of course, any ideology would be fascist if real moral truths didnt exist–that’s not just merely obvious, it’s absurd to think otherwise. If you dont believe in a moral criterior which is objectively true, quite naturally, only the majority can make rules. But the Church has never said anything so ridiculous–the sheer size of secularism and relativism in the world is convincing everyone that all acts are equal–but that is false. You do not determine moral acts, they determine you. Morals are not oppressive, they are objective; do you argue against the multiplication table because it is ‘oppressive’ to your calculation? Before you attack the ‘church,’ it may help to know what the church teaches, and more importantly, why.

  34. Sister Mary, with respect, admittedly there is some degree of equality in the UK, more so than currently in the U.S., but lets face it, there is no full equality for LGBTQ people in our country. Yes, civil partnerships do offer some protections and equality, its a step in the right direction, but everyone in a true democracy should have the right to a full civil marriage with the recognition that comes with it It matters not whether one wishes to marry, enter into a civil partnership, whatever, what does matter is that everybody is treated equally. We’re NOT. What concerns me is that many in the LGBTQ community have become complacent, lazy thinkers, believing that they don’t need any more equality or protections than they already have, that the battle is over, it isn’t. Its a dangerous path to travel. The very enactment of civil partnerships though well intended are what they are, second class citizenship, legislated by the government which means that ALL of us have been discriminated against because we’re considered unequal and unworthy to receive the same recognition that heterosexual couples do. Its wrong, very wrong. Why do you think Holland, Belgium, Spain, Canada and South Africa chose marriage rather than civil unions/partnerships? Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  35. Sister Mary Clarance 8 Sep 2007, 2:27pm

    Bill, I am quite open to a bit of reasoned debate on the subject of homosexuality, and the Tory party, so glad you’ve chipped in with a bit (at last).The Tory party has in recent times been colonised by the older generation, not a party of young, dynamic forward thinkers to be fair. Many members were themselves gay, but had/have been serving members of parliament before the decriminalisation of homosexuality. Their power base of support came from a generation that did not embrace many of the new freedoms enjoyed during the sixties (gay or otherwise). Many of them had married and had children. Decriminalisation still did not offer an (easy) opportunity to come out and be open about their sexuality.Having such a strong base of older people in the party has ensured that the party has remained a bastion of homophobia. In order to remain above suspicion, old gay MPs have supported anti-gay legislation though the years for fear of being identified themselves as gay. I don’t support their actions, but I am aware a relatively recent attempt by a pressure group (not a gay one) to blackmail a number of these elderly (closet) into voting for a particular bill, so can understand their fears. It could be argued that they should have come out of the closet years ago, but in so doing they could potentially have lost partners they had taken when they though they was no other option for love and companionship and children they loved dearly.These people are moving on/dying out now. Ancram has no influence in the party anymore, his time has gone. He is being replaced by younger blood. There is a gay member of the shadow cabinet, one of the Conservative hopefuls for London Mayor is gay (not much hope admittedly, but still hopeful). Younger people who have grown up in a different world are coming into positions of power within the party, they are the movers and shakers now. As a fall back of course, the same EU legislation that has forced Labour’s hand to introduce equality will bind the Conservatives too.I live in Southwark where we have a Tory/Lib Dem administration, voted one of the most gay-friendly boroughs in Britain. The Conservative association I am a member of is so gay its untrue. Key positions within the association are held by gay people. Councillors are gay. They are elected by people who know they are gay. It doesn’t matter any more, so the fear is gone.It has taken longer with the Conservative Party, but the party has changed. There are still a few die hard associations, but they will be deal with. They are still a few of the old dinosaurs, but they have no power and they will all be dead soon anyway.I full accept that it is going to take some time for people to actually trust that there is a change, which is fair enough, but having worked for the Labour Party and its spin doctors for a number of years their commitment to many things is not as it seems.

  36. Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi 9 Sep 2007, 1:27am

    Sister Mary Clarence, Please don’t misunderstand. I do’nt excuse or forgive conservatives and Republicans. They are our enemy. People who shill for them and try mislead us and will end up writing themselves out of our movement. It’s bad enough that we have to put up with bigotry but to embrace organizations that promote it is unforgivable. Nor would I trust them any further than I could throw them. In the US when Mitt Romney ran for governor of Massachusetts he toured bay bars in Boston sucking up to gays for votes. Now he needs the votes or totalitarian christians to become President and he’s leapt so far to the right that he accessorizes with swastikas. Politicians in capitalist parties can only be trusted to engage in criminality, deceit, and opportunism. That includes The Democrats here, the NDP in Canada, and probably Labour(I may be correctable for Labour.I’m told that the question is still open.)

  37. Steve_of_Brighton 9 Sep 2007, 2:13am

    As far as I can see, the only groups who activley oppose gay equality in Britain are some, but by no means all, religious people. The three political parties (and the Greens where they get votes) now have equality as party policy, have openly gay MPs and loads of out gay coucillors, e.g. the leader of the city council where I live is a tory and an openly gay man. It now depends to what degree whichever party is in government stands up to the (in my opinion) extremist religious nuts.The current Labour government has done a good job when enacting the Equality Bill this year… and not giving in to some religious people who oopposed the Sexual Orientation Regulations.Right now, life is getting better and better for homos in Britain.Let’ make sure it stays that way.

  38. Sister Mary Clarance 9 Sep 2007, 12:09pm

    In quite agree Steve_of_Brighton. You also had a good example of an old dinosaur spouting anti-gay retoric who has rounded on by his own party, ostracised, and if I remember correctly forced to issue a groveling apology.Bill, I think the comparions with the Conservatives and the Republicans may not be quite as relevant/accurate as possibly they used to be. New Labour has taken an enormous shift to the right and the Conversatives have policies that arguably set them a little to the left of Labour.This has left those who would like to see a socialist government in this country, high and dry I’m afraid.

  39. Putting that advert on here, at the top of the page, is as bad as the Tories thumbing their noses at us. Instead of an advert, if they genuinely cared about us, it would be an apology – and not just on here, but on all the national media.People died in the 1980’s because of them and they have never said sorry.

  40. Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi 9 Sep 2007, 2:03pm

    Sister Mary Clarence, “New Labour has taken an enormous shift to the right and the Conversatives have policies that arguably set them a little to the left of Labour.”Come on now. Sister. Fess up. What is it? LSD, Thai stick, Maui wowie, california gold leaf. Whatever it is, it pooootent stuff.

  41. 9 Sep 2007, 2:19pm

    Andrew- perhaps you should read this article

  42. Sister Mary Clarance 9 Sep 2007, 3:15pm

    Bill – attempting to remove the right to trial by jury; attempting to introduce laws permitting unlimited detention of terror suspects; most monitored state on the entire planet; the new ID ‘super’ card …. not even to mention little gems like removal of access to social housing if you’re not borne in the UK. Clearly New Labour failed to notice, last time they used an NHS hospital for example, the emormous number of people doing key, but poorly paid, jobs that probably would be unable to do so without access to social housing.One of the problems that the Tories have at the moment is that on a number of issues its not actually possible you get any further to the right that New Labour.

  43. Robert, it was “the Tories who authored that fascist, vile piece of legislation called Section 28”, but let’s be fair here – Labour backed it in those early days, the Lib Dems were the only people apart from CHE who stood against it. And most of Labour’s reforms in the last eight years have come grudgingly from the EU pushing change (things like s28 repeal were blocked time and again by Labour in the Commons in the 97-01 parliament).At the 2001 general election the Lib Dems mopped up the pink vote while their opponents made it clear they didn’t want it. Little wonder that with the next election looking a tighter contest, the two conservative parties have started scrapping over our support.

  44. Jen, thank you, I was aware of that. What amazes me in Europe is that Holland was the first country ever to provide full equality, and then Catholic countries like Belgium and Spain just blew me away, especially Spain where the church was the most powerful, just stunning. Canada was another big surprise, a commonwealth country. How is it they could do it and we couldn’t? We should have been the leaders, but I guess our politicians don’t have the guts or the courage to do the right thing, never have, never will, let alone the common decency if they truly believed in equality for all, which they don’t. Its going to be interesting to see Sweden (mulling an upgrade to full marriage equality) and possibly Norway and Denmark get ahead of us. France will eventually get there as well as Germany since marriage equality receives far more public support than it ever has in the UK and they’ve had civil unions/pacs far longer than we’ve ever had. We’re going to be left behind again, always the last to be dragged kicking and sreaming, its sad when you think about it. At least in the U.S. there is a collective effort for marriage equality because civil unions in several states aren’t working. Thanks again.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  45. One hundred MPs recently voted to try and stop the new laws preventing discrimination on the grounds of sexual orientation. Remind me, 85 of those (about 40% of their total in the House of Commons) were from which party? Errrrr….oh! yes! the Conservatives. Nuff said.

  46. Robert, ex pat Brit 9 Sep 2007, 9:40pm

    Ivan, 85 or 40% of them, that’s almost half the conservative party? That’s a lot but it does tell you something, they can’t be trusted. What was the ratio for Labour?Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  47. Bill Perdue, RainbowRED Organi 9 Sep 2007, 10:56pm

    Sister Clarence, I read from a number of sources including left socialist and labour groups plus the Guardian, UK Watch, Socialist Worker, Morning Star, Labour Left Briefing, etc. So I believe you and innumerable others who say that that Labour is moving to the right. It’s shameful that they’ve become impossible to tell apart from Conservatives, just as the Deceitocrats are indistinguishable from Repugnants in the US. Labour, for now, is the party of imperial war; Blair was Bush’s lapdog. New Labours support for GLBT rights was grudging at best and was based on the growth of a GLBT movement and nudgeing by the EU. Blair dug in his heels when it came to repealing section (article?) 26, and etc. The difference between you and most of us is that you’ve chosen to go to the right and that will inexorably cut you off from our legitimate struggle for full equality. There is no middle ground here. Our movement needs alliances with unions, women’s organizations, and people who get dumped on because of skin color and national origin. We need to adopt a sensible, comprehensive program to cut through the bullshit of politics as usual and spur developments towards a solution. A program that doesn’t adapt to Conservatives or to right leaning Labour would include, among others, variations of the following:Disestablishment of religion;Establishment of a democratic republic, ruled by the majority, working people;Arrest of Blair and his MoD, etc. and surrendering them to be codefendants with Bush, Cheney, et al, in an International War Crimes Tribunal for Crimes against Humanity;Withdrawal of English military, security and police forces from Ireland, Los Malvinas, Gibraltar, etc.; Confiscation of the assets of the landed nobility, the established church and the royals and others including political and religious figures and groups who have a history of antigay bigotry and using the funds recovered to pay damages for losses incurred by beatings, murders, lost or low wages, unjust detention and imprisonment, drug and alcohol issues etc., etc., etc.; Immediate firing and arrest of teachers and school administrators who harass gay and lesbians youth or who permit others to do so and a similar approach to workplace harassment:Use of police and military forces to prevent scabbing and management hooliganism and extra taxes on the rich to pay full salaries and benefits for strikers;Severe individual and institutional punishment for hate crimes based on skin color, sexuality, national origin including those by religious groups. If a cult archbishop says gays are evil, etc., and punks beat or kill one of our own, that cultist should be tried and punished with the thugs;Etc.

  48. Steve_of_Brighton 10 Sep 2007, 12:33am

    Robert, you write very interesting and often very well informed comments that contirbute to the debate and I personally appreciate. However, there is a bit of a mix and match going on with regard to some comments on UK legislation and the reasons why such legislation was passed. You talk about the civil partnership act and immediately talk about the EU… in fact the two are entirely unconnected. Check out much of the EU and see how legally equal homo partners are. Not a personal criticism… just making a comment matey

  49. Sister Mary Clarance 10 Sep 2007, 12:41am

    Still some work to do then, Robert and Ivan. Might I suggest you join your local association and help to change it. Might be harder for you as an ex-pat though.I did mention in a previous posting that they are still dinosaurs left. There are but they are losing their control of the party. These people no longer have control of policy and their days are numbered. They will either change or they will go, willingly or otherwise.Have a troll through the pages of Peter Tatchell’s website to see Labour’s record on gay equality. Particularly useful for those among us that have som much trouble seeing through all the spin.

  50. The tories sure have my vote! and no that is not sarcasm.

  51. Oh and screw the Jewish people. Too bad half the world has their fingers up Israel.

  52. “The tories sure have my vote!”That’s no surprise when you see the other comment by the same person, “Oh and screw the Jewish people”. Outstanding.And people who vote Tory aren’t racist. Of course they aren’t.

  53. I hope any revenues raised from this insult are donated to a suitable charity. The Terrence Higgins Trust or The Albert Kennedy Trust perhaps. The Tories did untold damage to young people struggling with their sexuality (which led to suicide in a number of cases) and to people with HIV/AIDS. They won’t say sorry but at least let their money (which is the only thing they do care about) go to a good cause.End this insult now!

  54. Robert, ex pat Brit 10 Sep 2007, 1:23pm

    Steven thank you, I will check that out. However, what I do know is that only three countries in Europe provide full equality, the UK isn’t one of them, not yet but slowly getting there.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  55. Robert, ex pat Brit 10 Sep 2007, 1:27pm

    Sister Mary, yes, I agree. A huge amount of work still to be done. I try to be as effective and helpful as I can living on the other side of the pond by contacting MPs and sharing my views on what needs to be done. The EU in general is dragging its feet on equality issues. Only three countries of the 25 member states have full equality, its shameful and a disgrace. I will keep on fighting and so too must all of us in the LGBTQ community in the UK in particular, just hope nobody becomes complacent with the current status quo. The battle is far from over.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  56. oh dear oh dear how disappointing! who needs rabidly mad christians ( no offense to those christians who are neither rabid nor mad!) attacking the gay community when we can insult each other so well. Rather disturbing. I have not and hopefully never will vote Tory. But to compare the conservative party to Nazis is absurd and offensive, and from Zeke – who makes much of being Jewish – particularly distressing.

  57. An advert for the Conservative Party on the pink news website is a welcome sign that the gay community is growing up at last. The rabid comments of dinosaurs still churning out the same tired, irelevent 1980’s class-war politics are sad to see – the world has moved on leaving them stuck in this socialist-worker rut. But in our democracy they have every right to believe what they believe and to express their belief – just as the very large numbers of conservative supporting gay Britons do too. The Conservative party has changed enornmously since the ’80’s and is now an inclusive andprogressive force. Gay conservatives are making major contributions in government – occupying key roles in conservative administrations that run the majority of councils in this country. It is only a matter of time before we have an out gay conservative prime minister.Eddy

  58. Eddy is talking shit. You only have to look at the Tory voting record to unveil the truth, or the front bench. Okay, many of the older members are dead or in the Lords but there are plenty of evil doers in the commons. I.D.S., Fox, Davies, Leigh…. for starters!You don’t have to be a Socialist to spot a bunch of evil bastards lurking behind a flimsy leader.As for the advert, it did what it intended to do; it stirred up controversy and leaked over into the national papers – Pink News was used.

  59. Nick Weeks 13 Sep 2007, 2:24pm

    There are still a large number of us around who were very adversely affected by Section 28. I don’t think that mutterings that the Conservatives have changed, followed by mutterings from other conservative that they haven’t, are going to make them acceptable.A good start would be a full public formal apology for Section 28, from all current Shadow Cabinet Members, on behalf of the party. This would not make up for the numerous blighted lives … but might at least suggest that the Tories wanted to move forward.I do not believe that PinkNews should have accepted the advert without such a public apology – in fact, it would have been nice if the first ad. in gay media had consisted of such an apology.

  60. Robert, ex pat Brit 13 Sep 2007, 4:30pm

    Nick, I have to agree with you. Odd how the mayor of London recently apologised for the country’s terrible involvement in slavery to the new world, yet we were persecuted, thrown in jail just for having sex in the privacy of our own homes, careers ruined, some often taking their lives for fear of being blackmailed. Its a disgrace and we should be demanding an apology. What we’ve gained in equality is nothing compared to the suffering we underwent which was a form of fascism anyway. The Tories should be apologising for Section 28, most definitely.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  61. Oh Annie – do grow up – if you wish to take part in adult debate – try and lift yourself out of the tabloid mire of profanities and argue a point with dignity and focus. I am proud to be gay and a conservative and working hard to improve the lives of my fellow Londoners. The political world has moved on from your old NUS days of Tory = evil, anarchy = good – join the real world. The conservatives are leading the green crusade leaving the 3 other parties far behind, forget 20 years ago – Cameron is an inclusive leader who supports gay equality and has a bold vision for a safer, more cohesive and happier Britain. So come join the winning team, we’ll be in power quicker than you know it, for the better of us all – gay and straight – you might even start enjoying life!

  62. Ciaran McMahon 14 Sep 2007, 8:23am

    Is it my imagination, or do most gay conservative/Tory supporters (on this site at least) have similar uber-defensive traits that one would normally see exhibited by a “gay christian”? What’s all that about?

  63. Ciaran McMahon 14 Sep 2007, 8:25am

    “So come join the winning team, we’ll be in power quicker than you know it, for the better of us all”This line just sounds scary… Hitler. Berlin. 1939.Fuckin’ hell! Lighten up there bit, Eddy!

  64. Robert, ex pat Brit 14 Sep 2007, 1:17pm

    If Cameron et al and his party are truly for equality, FULL equality, let him prove it by converting Civil Partnerships into marriage, then maybe I’ll believe them. Face facts, we DON’T yet have equality, just some semblance of it, nothing more. We’re still separate and unequal and certainly not inclusive.Robert, ex-pat Brit.

  65. That Mr Cameron might be sincere, and he might, is yet to be seen. The problem is that Cameron comes with lots of others, with statements like [insert most hateful/vulgar/moronic homophobic Tory comment here].With Labour still a little too friendly with the Bishop of Rome for my liking I think my vote goes to the Lib Dems… who probably should be advertising here, why are they not?

  66. Thank you Sister Mary for the Peter Tatchell link. Makes me think twice about voting for Labour in the future. Up untill now I have felt some sort of commitment to Labout because of the “equality” they have given us. Even though I have found them increasingly frustrating with the war in Iraq and their continual money wasting via benefits and funding iresposible breeders I still felt I owed them my vote… maybe not anymore!

  67. Sister Mary Clarance 14 Sep 2007, 9:34pm

    Gary – thank you for the feedback. I think no one main party is completely in the right, but I also think that no one main party is in the wrong.Labour embraced equality more quickly than the Conservatives without a doubt, but I am convinced that the Conservatives are embracing it now.The Conservative handling of Section 28 and the emerging HIV health crisis in the 80s was undoubtedly wrong, but we will never know (none of us) how Labour would have handled it. The politics of opposition is very strong, so one party will most often vote contrary to the other.Other current stories on pinknews, such as the Labour councillor currently being tried for the paedophilia smear and the deportation of the Iranian lesbian show that Labour are not always riding round on a white charger championing all things homosexual.I chose to join the Conservative party for reasons other than their policy on equality and attitudes towards homosexuality and I was surprised when I did by the numbers of gay people already involved.To me if every gay person in the country boycotts the Conservatives then change will be a much slower process. If anyone ways to support anything remotely anti-gay here they will have to argue the toss with me first. Hasn’t thus far it hasn’t been an issue.

  68. Sister Mary Clarance 15 Sep 2007, 12:21am

    Just read back my last posting and to clarify, the ‘here’ in my last posting is not ‘here – pinknews’, but ‘here – my local association’

  69. I suppose a green squiggle is easier to draw than a Swastika.

  70. What percentage of respondents were too young to vote and what percentage were too young to remember life under the previous Tory government?

  71. Matt Blewett 17 Mar 2008, 3:44pm

    Why are the pro-tories saying “forget twenty years ago”? Their policies were homophobic right up until they were kicked out of their smugness in 1997, that is only 11 years ago. I was hounded out of my school, I was harassed homophobically, and the police colluded with my abusers. All in 1997. Do not tell me to forget the eighties, the tories still have to apologise for the NINETIES too!You do not have to like Labour to despise the tories. Personally I think it would save a lot of time if we locked up every polictician as soon as they were elected.

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